Evolution vs. Creation

Evolution vs. Creation

There are 209548 comments on the Best of New Orleans story from Jan 6, 2011, titled Evolution vs. Creation. In it, Best of New Orleans reports that:

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Best of New Orleans.

Level 2

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#104696 Nov 5, 2013
woodtick57 wrote:
<quoted text>except, apparently, provide even a shred of evidence for his existence...
Not one single proven case of any god doing anything supernatural, is there, Chip?
Why is science unable to stop death, Chip?

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#104697 Nov 5, 2013
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> You are not above learning either. Are you now saying, science is lying? Something imagined can also be reality.
But are you up to learning, to seeing things differently?.

We all know there are not real longitude lines painted on the ground, and we all know any grid system of locating points on earth could be used.

You and Christine are not arguing about anything except the definition of real. Well, real means actually existing as a fact. In science that generally means having a physical presence of it own. Longitude lines do not have this, they are merely inferred by measurement of real quantities which like the position of the sun in the sky at a given moment in time. The position and the time are real facts, but longitude is an inferred result. If we had a completely different grid system the position of the sun and the moment in time would be the same but the result would give a different set of numbers on the imaginary grid.

Longitude is not real and existing independent of human minds, but the position of the sun and the time are.

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#104698 Nov 5, 2013
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> Why is science unable to stop death, Chip?
Science being unable to stop death is not evidence for God.

You have no evidence for God, so you are merely demanding that we accept God because we are not Gods ourselves. Of course we arent. That still does not mean there is one.

Level 2

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#104699 Nov 5, 2013
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
But are you up to learning, to seeing things differently?.
We all know there are not real longitude lines painted on the ground, and we all know any grid system of locating points on earth could be used.
You and Christine are not arguing about anything except the definition of real. Well, real means actually existing as a fact. In science that generally means having a physical presence of it own. Longitude lines do not have this, they are merely inferred by measurement of real quantities which like the position of the sun in the sky at a given moment in time. The position and the time are real facts, but longitude is an inferred result. If we had a completely different grid system the position of the sun and the moment in time would be the same but the result would give a different set of numbers on the imaginary grid.
Longitude is not real and existing independent of human minds, but the position of the sun and the time are.
It is real, because will have the gifts of God, to science it is imaginary, but to reality, it is invisible.

Level 2

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#104700 Nov 5, 2013
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Science being unable to stop death is not evidence for God.
You have no evidence for God, so you are merely demanding that we accept God because we are not Gods ourselves. Of course we arent. That still does not mean there is one.
I am indirectly telling you that, science is limited. It does not knows everything. In reality, no body wants to die?

Level 2

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#104701 Nov 5, 2013
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
But are you up to learning, to seeing things differently?.
We all know there are not real longitude lines painted on the ground, and we all know any grid system of locating points on earth could be used.
You and Christine are not arguing about anything except the definition of real. Well, real means actually existing as a fact. In science that generally means having a physical presence of it own. Longitude lines do not have this, they are merely inferred by measurement of real quantities which like the position of the sun in the sky at a given moment in time. The position and the time are real facts, but longitude is an inferred result. If we had a completely different grid system the position of the sun and the moment in time would be the same but the result would give a different set of numbers on the imaginary grid.
Longitude is not real and existing independent of human minds, but the position of the sun and the time are.
We humans, all have these God given talents, why i said God, are that, other animals can not do that, except humans.

“Proud Member”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

The Basket of Deplorables

#104702 Nov 5, 2013
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> It is real, because will have the gifts of God, to science it is imaginary, but to reality, it is invisible.

God is as abstract as those imaginary lines.
Those lines exist in our minds...exactly the same way god exists in yours. But it doesn't make either of them physically real, it only makes them real to the beholder. So god exists and god does not exist, are both correct answers. It exists in your mind, but can we attribute the things you think god did to the existence of the god in your mind?

No, only to you and the others that believe it's real is it so.
Just the same as state lines are only real, only to those who believe they're real.

Since: Mar 11

St. Croix valley

#104703 Nov 5, 2013
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> Why is science unable to stop death, Chip?
i don't know, Chaz. why is your proven false god not able to stop death? or make miracles happen? we hear lots of stories, but the proof is in the puddin' where is this god of yours, Chiperino?

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#104704 Nov 5, 2013
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> So, science is imaginary?
Adding to the above:

Distance, mass, time are real.

Metres, kilograms, and seconds are units we made up so that its possible for us to quantify and compare real distances, masses, and times. We can change the unit of measurement without changing how much distance, mass, or time is really there. If I say you have 454 grams or 1 pound of butter its still the same amount of butter. The units are imaginary, the quantity of butter is real.

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#104705 Nov 5, 2013
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> We humans, all have these God given talents, why i said God, are that, other animals can not do that, except humans.
We have certain talents but its pure conjecture whether they are God-given. And without any evidence. On the other hand we can see our talents and shortcomings in terms of our evolutionary history, and in that light they make sense.

I think your point is that we should be grateful we have these talents, and you cannot think of any way to express your gratitude for having them except imagining a consciousness behind the universe who might accept your gratitude. None of that means God is real, even though we are all grateful for existing anyway.

“Up with which, I will not put”

Since: Jul 08

Sao Paulo

#104706 Nov 5, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
I grew up in Minnesota. Hot and humid in the summer and cold and dry in the winter. Here people say "It is freezing" if it gets below 40 and it is unbearably hot to many if it gets above 80. In Minnesota it was only cold a couple of weeks each winter. We would have a week or so of -20 temps and then it would get to be an outright balmy 0 F. Then when our midwinter thaw hit and the temps reached 40 you would see people walking around in short sleeve shorts and sometimes shorts.
Here I think you would find winters similar to Ireland. Rainy and cloudy. We have a special term for "winter" days when the sun is shining somewhere, but not necessarily on you. They are called "sun breaks". You can see that the sun is breaking through the clouds on some people. It might not hit you, but even a little indirect sunlight is nice after a month of overcast.
Here in Brazil winter fell on a Thursday this year.

Since: Mar 11

St. Croix valley

#104707 Nov 5, 2013
JM_Brazil wrote:
<quoted text>
Here in Brazil winter fell on a Thursday this year.
so did our summer up here. wonder if it was the same day!?
CrimeaRiver

UK

#104708 Nov 5, 2013
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> We humans, all have these God given talents, why i said God, are that, other animals can not do that, except humans.
These gifts were given to us by ancient aliens who allowed us the power of rational thought and speech. How else did we learn these things than by a intelligent life from a celestail plain.

Does that sound stupid to you?

Now you know how we feel!
CrimeaRiver

UK

#104709 Nov 5, 2013
JM_Brazil wrote:
<quoted text>
Here in Brazil winter fell on a Thursday this year.
Here in the UK, Winter fell on an October

“When you treat people as they ”

Level 6

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#104710 Nov 5, 2013
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> No body is above learning. None. Now if you are going by that concepts, i will simply tell you that, you are wrong, because science use them in real, so that makes them real, or are you saying science is lying?
You are totally screwed when it comes to the concept of reality. Science uses the perception of imaginary lines, It does not actually use real imaginary lines because THEY ARE IMAGINARY lines. Why is it so difficult for you to comprehend the difference between real and imaginary? Oh I know, you whole goddidit by magic belief is based on the imagination that you believe to be real
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> You are not above learning either. Are you now saying, science is lying? Something imagined can also be reality.
You ignorant fool, of course people learn, well most people, it seems you stopped learning in Sunday school. No I am not saying science is lying, I am saying you are confused.
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> So, from your fatigued premises, science is imaginary. Good.
Nope, thatÂ’s your guess born of ignorance. Like all good christards you assume that you are good at guessing, after all you base a whole religion on it. However in real life what you are doing is guessing.
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> You are the stupid. So, science is imaginary?
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> So, science is imaginary?
Nope, you are just confused and ignorant.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#104711 Nov 5, 2013
bohart wrote:
Amazing! when faced with the truth , denial kicks in despite all the evidence against you! The meaning of your own theory is against you!
Pay no attention to the meaning of that word! it's what the Dude says it is!
But I DID pay attention. Now go back and tell me where it said "inanimate".
bohart wrote:
Either you don't have the brains to understand what spontaneous generation from inorganic matter means,a strong possibility, or you are just a lying evotard. I'll take that one
I haven't to support my position. You *have* lied to support yours.

My position does not violate its own axioms. Yours does. When do you plan to address this major discrepancy?

Carry on being a lying hypocrite, Bo. It's not like you know how to be anything else.(shrug)

“Proud Member”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

The Basket of Deplorables

#104712 Nov 5, 2013
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Adding to the above:
Distance, mass, time are real.
Metres, kilograms, and seconds are units we made up so that its possible for us to quantify and compare real distances, masses, and times. We can change the unit of measurement without changing how much distance, mass, or time is really there. If I say you have 454 grams or 1 pound of butter its still the same amount of butter. The units are imaginary, the quantity of butter is real.

Here is the quantitative difference between abstract measures and the abstract concept of god. We can measure out with real physical; devices and demonstrate using science the very thing that only exists physically in abstract thought. Such as Metres, kilograms, and seconds, state lines points on a compass.
Volts watts and all abstract units can be shown to physically exist. Because these things exist in reality but are understood in abstract in relation to the physical reality.

Unfortunately Charles, I nor anyone else can measure out to demonstrate the physical reality of god. With any known device tool or method and what makes it even more illusionary, is the fact it cant be demonstrated to be real by any effect that can be measured.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#104713 Nov 5, 2013
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
Excuse me for interupting your rant, but..... ranting does not change what the word 'observation' refers to.
What is observed is galaxies moving away from the milkyway as if it is central to the universe.
This is wrong. What we observe is an expansion with the property that *every* galaxy would see other galaxies moving away from it. No galaxy is central because there is no center of expansion.
What BB offers is a mess that satisfies a philosophy, the Copernican principle, and uses mysteries to explain 97% of itself.
No, the BB describes quite well the expansion of the universe, the abundances of light elements, the structure of the cosmic background radiation, the effects of gravitational lenses, etc. It does hypothesize dark matter and dark energy, which make up about 97% of the *energy* density, but that is a very different thing than simply fitting a philosophy.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#104714 Nov 5, 2013
bohart wrote:
Abiogenesis is a theory that attempts to explain the origin of life through random natural processes.
Wrong. Abiogenesis attempts to explain the origin of life through natural processes. But those processes are NOT random.

“Help religion science wander”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

into the night.

#104715 Nov 5, 2013
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> So, science is imaginary?
Chuck, I don't know if this will help, but think of property lines or political boundaries between countries. Those lines exist on maps, but the representations on the map don't reflect an actual line of natural origin on the ground. They are a human construct based on real principles and established by consensus (for lack of a better term) that allow us to define an area of land. Longitude and latitude are established in the same way, based on scientific principles, but they are conceptual and not physical.

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