Evolution vs. Creation

There are 20 comments on the Jan 6, 2011, Best of New Orleans story titled Evolution vs. Creation. In it, Best of New Orleans reports that:

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Best of New Orleans.

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#101080 Oct 13, 2013
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
Not only stay up with out a rider, but correct itself, make turns, make jumps etc etc.
Attack of the riderless bikes?
Like a bicycle stampede?

“Don't be mad at me.”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

I'm just a little bunny.

#101081 Oct 13, 2013
woodtick57 wrote:
<quoted text> a bike with no rider makes turns? you mean it may veer to one side and correct itself.
now it seems you are giving these riderless bikes intelligence...that's one hell of a gyroscopic effect...
The bike in that video was on a track. the track was going downhill. Gravity was keeping it rolling so it was maintaining speed even without a rider. No intelligence necessary and I think any pseudo-corrections were the result of the track and gravity.

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#101082 Oct 13, 2013
DanFromSmithville wrote:
<quoted text>The bike in that video was on a track. the track was going downhill. Gravity was keeping it rolling so it was maintaining speed even without a rider. No intelligence necessary and I think any pseudo-corrections were the result of the track and gravity.
Some grocery carts seem to come alive in the parking lot, but we know it's just gravity and wind. I saw one head down the parking lot zig zaging, going over bumps stopping a few times, but eventually made it to the street. Then proceeded to go down it, I wasn't ready to declare it a new life form...lol

“Don't be mad at me.”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

I'm just a little bunny.

#101083 Oct 13, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text> Some grocery carts seem to come alive in the parking lot, but we know it's just gravity and wind. I saw one head down the parking lot zig zaging, going over bumps stopping a few times, but eventually made it to the street. Then proceeded to go down it, I wasn't ready to declare it a new life form...lol
Yes, they do seem to "know" where they are going. I saw a furniture dolly roll away, make a perfect left turn and then head straight for a car one time. It was as if it had targeted the car and gone right for it.

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#101084 Oct 13, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh NOOOOOO!
I already went through this with Aura.
Nope, counter steering.
If you push a bike, it will say upright for a time because of gyroscopic effects and the caster of the front wheel. If you cancel out the caster and gyroscope, it's not a mystery that it will stay upright for a (shorter) time. It is simply Newton's first law of motion working on both the vertical and horizontal axes. It will maintain direction through inertia and will remain upright until it leans far enough off its center for gravity to pull it over. Asymmetric drag on the front wheel will be the primary cause of instability. If you mounted a modified bicycle frame (changing the head tube angle to 90 degrees from horizontal) on short narrow runners and gave it a shove on ice you would see precisely the results you should expect.
Irish Bob

Plymouth, MA

#101085 Oct 13, 2013
To all you evolutionist's.
My beliefe in God is threw Nature. If i was to look at man and his corrupution of ideology, then i would be like most here that God is a man made creation. But nature teaches me that God is the only answer to explain the balence of things in nature. The bible in it self doesn't teach me that God is real. Expecially the O T. To believe that nature came into existence by chemical formation over thousands of years is ludicious. As a tech guy, that's like teaching kids that a computer all of a sudden came into it's own. A cell phone came into it's own..This stupidity of thought just doesn't compute in a intelligent mind. I don't look at man and say that he is here because of a God. I look into nature that tell's me, that God is real and i respect every thing i see that inforces that belief.

“Don't be mad at me.”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

I'm just a little bunny.

#101086 Oct 13, 2013
Irish Bob wrote:
To all you evolutionist's.
My beliefe in God is threw Nature. If i was to look at man and his corrupution of ideology, then i would be like most here that God is a man made creation. But nature teaches me that God is the only answer to explain the balence of things in nature. The bible in it self doesn't teach me that God is real. Expecially the O T. To believe that nature came into existence by chemical formation over thousands of years is ludicious. As a tech guy, that's like teaching kids that a computer all of a sudden came into it's own. A cell phone came into it's own..This stupidity of thought just doesn't compute in a intelligent mind. I don't look at man and say that he is here because of a God. I look into nature that tell's me, that God is real and i respect every thing i see that inforces that belief.
Meaningless and circular. I think the natural world is wonderful, but it is wishful thinking to see more in it than is there. My belief, is belief and not the same as the facts I accept from science.

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#101087 Oct 13, 2013
Irish Bob wrote:
To all you evolutionist's.
My beliefe in God is threw Nature. If i was to look at man and his corrupution of ideology, then i would be like most here that God is a man made creation. But nature teaches me that God is the only answer to explain the balence of things in nature. The bible in it self doesn't teach me that God is real. Expecially the O T. To believe that nature came into existence by chemical formation over thousands of years is ludicious. As a tech guy, that's like teaching kids that a computer all of a sudden came into it's own. A cell phone came into it's own..This stupidity of thought just doesn't compute in a intelligent mind. I don't look at man and say that he is here because of a God. I look into nature that tell's me, that God is real and i respect every thing i see that inforces that belief.
I don't usually harp on grammar and spelling, but damn. Never mind the vacuous content, this one is hard on the eyes.
Justice LRS

Shreveport, LA

#101088 Oct 13, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>I know how they are steering.
And yes you are arguing like a creationist. You have supplied no real evidence that supports your claims. The videos you have supplied are not clear enough to show a lack of countersteering. See if you can find any sort of scientific or official paper on the subject. Even no handed steering is done with countersteering.
It is a subtle but extremely important part of starting a turn. To start any turn on a bike the first motion is a countersteering motion.
I have seen biker after biker make your claim, but when push comes to shove they all realize that turns are started by contersteering.
Most aren't even aware they are counter-steering. I've ridden since I was 10, about forty years worth, and I can say this; if you're not counter-steering, you're about to end up on your face. If I'm going through a right-hand turn, my right arm is pushing on the right bar, or counter-steering. Otherwise, the front wheel will drive itself into the pavement. What gets me is the gyroscopic effect when first leaving, say for example, a stop sign. The bike has a natural tendency to "wobble" a touch before it finds its balance. I do leave cleanly sometimes but a slight wobble is the usual. I'm on a sportbike, not an 800lb. cruiser.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Lakeland, FL

#101089 Oct 13, 2013
Irish Bob wrote:
This stupidity of thought just doesn't compute in a intelligent mind.
Uh-huh.
davy

Albuquerque, NM

#101090 Oct 13, 2013
You threw nature? How far did it go? Did someone catch it? Did it bounce when it hit the ground?
Irish Bob wrote:
To all you evolutionist's.
My beliefe in God is threw Nature. If i was to look at man and his corrupution of ideology, then i would be like most here that God is a man made creation. But nature teaches me that God is the only answer to explain the balence of things in nature. The bible in it self doesn't teach me that God is real. Expecially the O T. To believe that nature came into existence by chemical formation over thousands of years is ludicious. As a tech guy, that's like teaching kids that a computer all of a sudden came into it's own. A cell phone came into it's own..This stupidity of thought just doesn't compute in a intelligent mind. I don't look at man and say that he is here because of a God. I look into nature that tell's me, that God is real and i respect every thing i see that inforces that belief.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#101091 Oct 13, 2013
replaytime wrote:
Ok new subject. Science does not know exactly why ice is slippery. Who is going to be first to tackle this one?
Does this LOOK like the Why Ice Is Slippery thread? No it isn't. Go start a new thread in the physics forum. we're in the evolution (biology) forum.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#101092 Oct 13, 2013
Irish Bob wrote:
After the Big Bang, the universe was sterile. SOMETHING happened to cause life to appear out of nothing. YES, Something Happened.That's why we creationist believe in GOD.
Yes, if you're a creationist you believe life appeared out of nothing, despite the abundance of materials which could be found in the universe at the time. And that's what science proposes, that life developed via natural chemical processes, something which was prevalent throughout the universe.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#101093 Oct 13, 2013
Irish Bob wrote:
To all you evolutionist's.
My beliefe in God is threw Nature. If i was to look at man and his corrupution of ideology, then i would be like most here that God is a man made creation. But nature teaches me that God is the only answer to explain the balence of things in nature. The bible in it self doesn't teach me that God is real. Expecially the O T.
That's nice. Can you provide any objectively verifiable evidence that this God of yours even exists?

Don't worry, we already know that the answer is no.
Irish Bob wrote:
To believe that nature came into existence by chemical formation over thousands of years is ludicious. As a tech guy, that's like teaching kids that a computer all of a sudden came into it's own. A cell phone came into it's own..This stupidity of thought just doesn't compute in a intelligent mind.
Except your analogy is fatally flawed. Cellphones and computers are not naturally occurring self-reproducing organisms. The fact you did not spot this fallacy does not lend well to the hypothesis that you have an intelligent mind.

Abiogenesis proposes that life developed from naturally occurring chemical processes. This is not really a stretch when you realise that all life IS is chemical processes. And those chemical processes produce life every single day. All over the entire planet.

You on the other hand propose life was magically poofed into existence by a magic Jew, who just so happens to live forever and therefore did NOT need any preceding cause to exist. So life on Earth needed your magical Jew to exist, while your magical Jew did not need anything. That's like saying a cellphone or computer came into its own!!!
Irish Bob wrote:
I don't look at man and say that he is here because of a God. I look into nature that tell's me, that God is real and i respect every thing i see that inforces that belief.
Yes, it's called incredulity. Nature is amazing therefore an invisible magic wizard must be responsible.

“If It Is Possible”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

It Will Likely Happen

#101094 Oct 13, 2013
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, if you're a creationist you believe life appeared out of nothing, despite the abundance of materials which could be found in the universe at the time. And that's what science proposes, that life developed via natural chemical processes, something which was prevalent throughout the universe.
13.7 billion years ago, when the entire universe existed as a singularity. According to the big bang theory, one of the main contenders vying to explain how the universe came to be, all the matter in the cosmos -- all of space itself -- existed in a form smaller than a subatomic particle.

So dude where did all that abundance of material come from? Where did chemicals come from? Where did water come from? Where did gases come from? Where did planets come from? Where did organic compounds come from? Where did anything come from? Was everything hidden inside of something smaller than a subatomic particle?

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#101095 Oct 13, 2013
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
13.7 billion years ago, when the entire universe existed as a singularity. According to the big bang theory, one of the main contenders vying to explain how the universe came to be, all the matter in the cosmos -- all of space itself -- existed in a form smaller than a subatomic particle.
So dude where did all that abundance of material come from? Where did chemicals come from? Where did water come from? Where did gases come from? Where did planets come from? Where did organic compounds come from? Where did anything come from? Was everything hidden inside of something smaller than a subatomic particle?
The Big Bang only made hydrogen, helium and a skosh of lithium.

Different elements were "born" in stars. The elements heavier than iron were made when stars went supernova.

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#101096 Oct 13, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
The Big Bang only made hydrogen, helium and a skosh of lithium.
Different elements were "born" in stars. The elements heavier than iron were made when stars went supernova.

You mean....

The elements heavier than hydrogen, helium and a skosh of lithium.

Were created in star Nucleosynthesis vs hydrogen, helium and a skosh of lithium that were created in big bang Nucleosynthesis.

I won't cave in from this one. It isn't counter steering. Because all elements heavier than hydrogen and helium, are considered metals in cosmology.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metallicity
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#101097 Oct 13, 2013
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
13.7 billion years ago, when the entire universe existed as a singularity. According to the big bang theory, one of the main contenders vying to explain how the universe came to be, all the matter in the cosmos -- all of space itself -- existed in a form smaller than a subatomic particle.
So dude where did all that abundance of material come from? Where did chemicals come from? Where did water come from? Where did gases come from? Where did planets come from? Where did organic compounds come from? Where did anything come from? Was everything hidden inside of something smaller than a subatomic particle?
http://img.docstoccdn.com/thumb/orig/13494836...

There ya go. This is the point where you move the goalposts backwards as far as you can go, as if that somehow justifies your position or makes any of your invalid criticisms valid.

Of course NONE of this is relevant to the point that HE was making, and which I subsequently ADDRESSED, which was that he didn't believe in abiogenesis cuz he thinks the invisible magic wizard did it.

Then you came along and RADICALLY changed the subject to an event from a mere 9 BILLION years earlier.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#101098 Oct 13, 2013
EVOLUTION (biology) VS CREATION THREAD.

Yeah, well what about abiogenesis, huh?

Yeah, well what about the Big Bang huh? What about that?

Yeah, well what about why ice is f cking slippery, huh? What about that one huh??? HUH?!? CAN YA FEEL THIS BABY, HUH?!? WELL CAN YA?!? OOMF!!!

“If It Is Possible”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

It Will Likely Happen

#101099 Oct 13, 2013
The Dude wrote:
EVOLUTION (biology) VS CREATION THREAD.
Yeah, well what about abiogenesis, huh?
Yeah, well what about the Big Bang huh? What about that?
Yeah, well what about why ice is f cking slippery, huh? What about that one huh??? HUH?!? CAN YA FEEL THIS BABY, HUH?!? WELL CAN YA?!? OOMF!!!
LMFAO. Want some cheese to go with your meltdown whine?

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