Evolution vs. Creation

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008. Full Story
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#98217 Aug 20, 2013
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
Space time is referring to outer space time as we know it.
Spacetime refers to our entire current universal expansion, which includes planet Earth. It's been known since at least Einstein that there is no one objective single reference to "time".
replaytime wrote:
Now time would pass even slower on the surface of a Jupiter or a planet the size of Jupiter,
Jupiter or a Jupiter, right...
replaytime wrote:
which we consider outer space.
Actually most of us consider to be a gas giant.

A gas giant which is NOT currently occupying our present position in the spacetime continuum.
replaytime wrote:
But if Jupiter was inhabitable
It is.
replaytime wrote:
then time would still be slower there
Hence habitability is irrelevant.
replaytime wrote:
but would it would not be considered outer space to its inhabitants.
It's not considered outer space to anyone sane.
replaytime wrote:
So again time is physically different than space.
Non-sequitor, does not follow. But then you are claiming that time is not actually physical at all, but rather an abstract concept completely separate from our spacetime continuum which we exist in. This is a common mistake amongst those who didn't quite grasp what Einstein was saying (bear in mind that he's since been superceded by quantum physics which only adds more technicality while little altering the original point).
replaytime wrote:
Only mathematical are they part of one thing.
Wrong. This is why you're quite confused. Math in itself IS a purely abstract thing. It is a tool, which can be applied to reality. And when applied correctly it measures reality. And when we measure that space and time are one and the same it's because they ARE. Just as some people can't quite grasp the concept of "nothing" when referring to "beyond" the boundaries of our universe, you appear to not be able to grasp the concept of no time beyond the boundaries of our universe.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#98218 Aug 20, 2013
The Almighty Tzar wrote:
<quoted text>
Five random questions on fossils.
1) Life’s Unexpected Explosion
Forty major animal groups appear out of nowhere at the bottom of the fossil record. Where did this “Cambrian Explosion” come from?
2) Those Not-So-Dry Bones
If dinosaurs died millions of years ago, how can their fossils still contain soft tissue?
3) Without a Leg to Stand On
Birds are vastly different from dinosaurs, even in the way they walk. How could one come from the other?
4) Amazingly Preserved Leaves
When leaves die, they shrivel up and crumble. So why is the fossil record full of well-preserved, flat leaves?
5) Tracks But No Trilobites
Why do we find lots of trilobite tracks in lower rock layers, but we don’t find any trilobite fossils until higher up?
Icr.org
Because your website is stupid and dishonest.(shrug)
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#98219 Aug 20, 2013
imagine2011 wrote:
<quoted text>
Blah, blah, blah
Hateful little winch
Irony meter go boom.

Go cry, Muggins.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#98220 Aug 20, 2013
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>
Finally , here is the puddle sludge faith described in all it's grandeur! You are a product of slime and random chance.
It's astonishing that a sentient being would believe this,...and it is a belief, totally backed by faith, nothing more.
Yeah, just like all the other times you failed to argue your case.(shrug)
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#98221 Aug 20, 2013
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey Ticky,...all you need is the first teensy, weensy shred of evidence that might even possibly suggest that maybe life started on it's own on a warm rock.
Got any yet? Nope, cause no human in history has found it.
But that doesn't stop you from believing it does it? Because your's is a faith based belief. Faith, you know like Osama Bin Ladin's and Billy Graham's,..just like them you have faith in the unseen!
Since I've already demonstrated numerous times over why you're lying are you ever gonna get around to addressing any of the arguments presented the first few hundred times? Or you just gonna keep whining and throwing out ad-homs?
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#98222 Aug 20, 2013
Jay-Gee1992 wrote:
what do young Creationists have to say about Carbon dating?
Reality isn't real therefore Goddidit with magic.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#98223 Aug 20, 2013
Croco_Duck wrote:
Hey I have a question for everyone to ponder. I know the answer and it is not a supernatural one.
How did all the fish get into the lakes?
They swam.

Level 2

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#98224 Aug 20, 2013
The Dude wrote:
They swam.
Nope. I'm sure you have lakes in the UK. Don't you wonder how the fish got there?

“Nothing can stop, This Pony..”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#98225 Aug 20, 2013
Croco_Duck wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope. I'm sure you have lakes in the UK. Don't you wonder how the fish got there?
Depends if they are indigenous, introduced or invasive and some are stocked from elsewhere. Some are hybrids engineered at hatchery's.
They say the snakehead was brought by Chinese to here to wreak havoc
it can devastate the fish population here.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2013/08/0...

Level 2

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#98226 Aug 20, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
Depends if they are indigenous, introduced or invasive and some are stocked from elsewhere. Some are hybrids engineered at hatchery's.
They say the snakehead was brought by Chinese to here to wreak havoc
it can devastate the fish population here.
http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2013/08/0...
It has nothing to do with humans.

“If It Is Possible”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

It Will Likely Happen

#98227 Aug 20, 2013
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
Spacetime refers to our entire current universal expansion, which includes planet Earth. It's been known since at least Einstein that there is no one objective single reference to "time".
<quoted text>
Jupiter or a Jupiter, right...
<quoted text>
Actually most of us consider to be a gas giant.
A gas giant which is NOT currently occupying our present position in the spacetime continuum.
<quoted text>
It is.
<quoted text>
Hence habitability is irrelevant.
<quoted text>
It's not considered outer space to anyone sane.
<quoted text>
Non-sequitor, does not follow. But then you are claiming that time is not actually physical at all, but rather an abstract concept completely separate from our spacetime continuum which we exist in. This is a common mistake amongst those who didn't quite grasp what Einstein was saying (bear in mind that he's since been superceded by quantum physics which only adds more technicality while little altering the original point).
<quoted text>
Wrong. This is why you're quite confused. Math in itself IS a purely abstract thing. It is a tool, which can be applied to reality. And when applied correctly it measures reality. And when we measure that space and time are one and the same it's because they ARE. Just as some people can't quite grasp the concept of "nothing" when referring to "beyond" the boundaries of our universe, you appear to not be able to grasp the concept of no time beyond the boundaries of our universe.
In physics, spacetime (also spacetime, space time or spacetime continuum) is any mathematical model that combines space and time into a single continuum.Spacetime is usually interpreted with space as existing in three dimensions and time playing the role of a fourth dimension that is of a different sort from the spatial dimensions.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spacetime

You think Jupiter is habitable? A gas planet with a toxic atmosphere. What do you think does or could inhabit it?

You don't think Jupiter is in outer space? Well then you must not be sane,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outer_space

“Darwin was right..of course.”

Level 9

Since: Jun 11

Park City, Utah

#98228 Aug 20, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Ah! There's your problem.
You are assuming that bohart is a sentient being.
Boy O' boy is that a very wrong assumption. He can't seem to understand the basics.
Level 1

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#98229 Aug 20, 2013
macumazahn wrote:
<quoted text>Boolocks. It's been happening since life began, and is still happening.

All species are transitional, and that's demonstrable.
Nope
Level 1

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#98230 Aug 20, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>No, so called "polystrate" fossils have been explained hundreds of times.

There is no whale "polystrate" fossil. That is a cretard lie.

Please. Show evidence for this. If you want to make me laugh link some creatard source. I know you cannot find a source that uses science to support this latest idiocy.
"There is no whale "polystrate" fossil. That is a cretard lie."

"A remarkable fossil find has been found in Peru: 346 whales buried in diatomaceous earth. The preservation of the whales is so pristine and complete, the authors of the paper in the Feb. 2004 issue of Geology1 conclude that the whales had to be buried rapidly, in days or weeks. If so, it represents a rate of accumulation of diatoms many times higher than what occurs in modern oceans.
The authors point out some amazing things about this fossil deposit:
Condition: The whale skeletons are “preserved in pristine condition (bones articulated [i.e., still assembled] or at least closely associated), in some cases including preserved baleen.”
Fine details:“The most complete whale (WCBa 20) was fully articulated; the microscopic detail of its baleen was preserved … and there is black, heavy-mineral replacement of the spinal cord and some intervertebral disks. There were no similar minerals in the surrounding sediment. These nonbony tissues were still present when the whale was completely buried.” Other instances of baleen, the delicate straining structure of the whale’s mouth, were also found.
Vertical extent:“The 346 whales within ~1.5 km2 of surveyed surface were not buried as an event, but were distributed uninterrupted through an 80-m-thick sedimentary section.” Since they were found uniformly distributed from bottom to top of the formation, the conditions in which they were buried must have also been uniform.
Unlaminated strata:“The diatomaceous sediment lacks repeating primary laminations, but instead is mostly massive, with irregular laminations and speckles.” In other words, it was not due to a cyclic process, like the annual climate change that produces tree rings.
Lack of bioturbation: Small organisms have not altered the deposit.“There is no evidence for bioturbation by invertebrates in the whale-bearing sediment.” Apparently they didn’t have the chance, it happened so fast.
Intact diatoms:“If most diatoms dissolve before preservation in the sediment, one would find frustules in all stages of dissolution. Diatoms in the Pisco diatomaceous sediment are often broken, but SEMstudy indicated fine preservation, with no significant evidence of dissolution.… In the shallow-water Pisco Formation, the diatoms were probably buried too quickly for much dissolution to occur.” The authors point out that in contemporary diatom deposits, only 2–3% of the frustules (glass shells) usually remain undissolved, up to 24% in special cases in Antarctica."

http://crev.info/2004/02/hundreds_of_whales_b...
Level 1

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#98231 Aug 20, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>No, so called "polystrate" fossils have been explained hundreds of times.

There is no whale "polystrate" fossil. That is a cretard lie.

Please. Show evidence for this. If you want to make me laugh link some creatard source. I know you cannot find a source that uses science to support this latest idiocy.
"There is no whale "polystrate" fossil. That is a cretard lie."

"‘We knew it was a great find,’ said paleontologist Leonard Brand about the fossil whales he saw in Peru in 1999, 350 km (200 miles) south of Lima, the capital. Eagerly he organized a team of creationist research scientists. They recently published their findings in the secular journal Geology.1,2,3
Overall, they found 346 whales within a 1.5-km2 (370-acre) area, buried in an 80-m (260-ft) thick layer of sedimentary rock called diatomite. This layer is part of the Pisco Formation, which varies in thickness from 200–1,000 m (650–3,300 ft).

Diatomite is sedimentary rock containing a high percentage of fossil diatoms—small single-celled algae, which commonly live near the ocean surface. The layer of diatomite in Peru has 5 to 10% clay and abundant volcanic ash.

Today, when diatoms die, their silica skeletons accumulate on the ocean floor. One gram (0.035 oz.) of diatomite may contain up to 400 million skeletons.4 Diatomite sediment normally accumulates slowly—only a few centimetres per thousand years.1Even where the rate is higher, such as in some shallow-water areas, accumulation is still slow. For example, in the fjords of British Columbia, diatoms and clay accumulate at 2.5–5.0 mm (0.1–0.2 inches) per year.2

Also today, when a whale carcass sinks to the bottom of the ocean, many kinds of scavengers quickly attack and colonize it. And in their quest for food, some scavengers churn up the adjacent sediments.5

However, in Peru, the fossilized whales and diatoms were well preserved and the whale skeletons were mostly intact. There was no evidence of normal decay, such as wormholes, barnacle encrustations or general degradation. Neither was there any sign that organisms had churned up the adjacent sediment."

http://creation.mo bi/dead-whales-telling-tales
Level 1

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#98232 Aug 20, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
That's Tater Salad to you bub.

"The evidence of marine animals that has been found could only be created by immense, recent, oceanic tidal waves. If the floods across North America were caused by ice-domed lakes, they would have washed away all evidence of these whale bones and other marine materials; none of the floods would reach Mexico or the Bahamas."

This is bad, it takes none of the actual flood events into account.
The fountains of the deep erupting.
The raising up the land and lowering the ocean floors.
Level 1

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#98233 Aug 20, 2013
Kong_ wrote:
<quoted text>Martin Luther,

On the Jews and Their Lies (German: Von den Jüden und iren Lügen; in modern spelling Von den Juden und ihren Lügen) is a 65,000-word antisemitic treatise written in 1543 by the German Reformation leader Martin Luther.

In the treatise, Luther describes Jews as a "base, whoring people, that is, no people of God, and their boast of lineage, circumcision, and law must be accounted as filth."[1] Luther wrote that they are "full of the devil's feces ... which they wallow in like swine,"[2] and the synagogue is an "incorrigible whore and an evil slut".[3]

In the first ten sections of the treatise, Luther expounds, at considerable length, upon his views concerning Jews and Judaism and how these compare against Christians and Christianity. Following this exposition, Section XI of the treatise advises Christians to carry out seven remedial actions. These are

1.for Jewish synagogues and schools to be burned to the ground, and the remnants buried out of sight;
2.for houses owned by Jews to be likewise razed, and the owners made to live in agricultural outbuildings;
3.for their religious writings to be taken away;
4.for rabbis to be forbidden to preach, and to be executed if they do;
5.for safe conduct on the roads to be abolished for Jews;
6.for usury to be prohibited, and for all silver and gold to be removed and "put aside for safekeeping"; and
7.for the Jewish population to be put to work as agricultural slave laborers.[4]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Jews_and_...

Note that this was about 300 years before Darwin.

I'm simply trying to bring to light the racist views of the father of the Protestant Church(s).

If you want to remain eyes wide shut go ahead.
"I'm simply trying to bring to light the racist views of the father of the Protestant Church(s)."

Thanks for that. I did not know that.

Again I was scolded for posting an article that called evolution racist.
There is racism running all through it.
But as you pointed out racism is every where including religious houses.
Level 1

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#98234 Aug 20, 2013
Jay-Gee1992 wrote:
what do young Creationists have to say about Carbon dating?
I only date within my age group. Cabon dating does nothing for me but to each there own. So if carbon is ok with it and that's what you want to do I say go for it.
Level 1

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#98235 Aug 20, 2013
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>The act of creation would need time also under your rules, but you'll let that slide because your god is always allowed special exemptions from any rules you make.

Time is not required to exist before time starts as that would be a paradox - your claim.

Also science is fine with the existence of time before our universe, in which case time did not start with our universe. All depends on what occurred at the point of singularity. You say invisible wizard. Maybe.

It used evolution though.
"The act of creation would need time also under your rules"

Incorrect. Time was created by God outside (because it didn't exist yet) our universe. God is not held to the law of Physics that he creates for the universe.

Level 2

Since: Dec 08

Location hidden

#98236 Aug 20, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Much more. It is backed by evidence. It's astonishing that a sentient being is incapable of understanding this simple concept.
What evidence? you and the other idiots pool your intelligence and come up with evidence of the life giving sludge.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Weird Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
What song are you listening to right now? (Apr '08) 1 min Good-Evil 157,840
Add a word and drop a word (Jan '14) 39 min skybobbie 2,494
Word Association (Jun '10) 41 min Mega Monster 26,641
True False Game (Jun '11) 1 hr NinaRocks 9,805
Rest in Peace, Spock 1 hr Just TLC 80
Last 3 Letters into 3 new words. (Dec '08) 1 hr Princess Hey 56,088
last word - first (Jun '12) 1 hr Princess Hey 7,467
El's Kitchen (Feb '09) 3 hr Mega Monster 39,253
Obama takes control of Internet 4 hr enter username 136
Five Weird Signs You're Smarter Than Average 5 hr Barry 60
More from around the web