Evolution vs. Creation

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008. Full Story
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#92804 Jun 15, 2013
GLXGT wrote:
<quoted text>
One thing you are completely overlooking about the bible. God did not write it, humans did. Humans are not perfect, humans misunderstand, humans don't always repeat things word for word that they have heard or been told. So what the bible says is a human said God said that.
Wow. With the exception of your first sentence you actually said something rational!

:-p
susanblange

Norfolk, VA

#92805 Jun 15, 2013
Dinoeater wrote:
now my turn for a counterattack. you guys believe that there are three diets right? carnivore herbivore and omnivore right? what if I told you the bible says that the basic diet was vegetarian?
From creation to the flood, we were all herbivores. After the flood, Man and some creatures became omnivores and carnivores. There were no dietary laws at that time except for the prohibition against the consumption of blood, which means you don't eat meat raw. When the Messiah comes, "the wolf also shall dwell with the lamb" and creatures will no longer be predatory.
Dinoeater

Clifton, NJ

#92806 Jun 15, 2013
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
It's "new age," that is the category and no, your bibles are wrong, not to mention the bibles only say specific meats not "all" meats. There is a lot of red meat served up in the bible even. Cain was a vegan, and look where that got him.
yes he was strong enough to kill a man and farm but was too jealous of his brother. jealousy is what started it all after all
Dinoeater

Clifton, NJ

#92807 Jun 15, 2013
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah, not it's not. First, a dairy allergy is very common, you should have that checked in case it worsens with age, otherwise you'll have to avoid all cheese as well as most prepared foods, oh, and fruit smoothies. Nothing to do with hormones.
The worst case with the hormones are all cosmetic changes, healthy males growing breasts, healthy women growing facial hair, nothing that actually decreases the health. But then, there are no more hormones in the meats than have been used in the past. Now we can even test the levels accurately, and the FDA does. The one thing the FDA does correctly is catch potential food problems, in spite of the media hype. The FDA is more strict, and tests products themselves, on food. However, since they cannot test every bit of it, there are things like e-coli that can get past the screening occasionally. For drugs they suck at their job, because they use independent test results instead of doing it themselves.
But, we don't see healthy men growing breasts, and healthy women with beards everywhere.
if you just watch the videos you would understand. but I guess you are more interested in arguing.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#92808 Jun 15, 2013
GLXGT wrote:
<quoted text>
And this proves my point. I am not a creationists but yet you want to argue with me about the bible. Did something happen in your life that you blame God for so that is where all your hatred of him comes from? IF so,,, get over it!! If it just that your an evolutionists then you might try promoting that more and projecting about God less if you want to make a point to them.
You are missing something important here. We can promote evolution all day and night here but it doesn't make any difference to fundies. They don't understand it, they don't accept it, they don't like it, they are not INTERESTED in it, and for ONE reason. Cuz that's not what the Bible sez.

When we provide evidence that evolution works they do NOT counter it with a rational rebuttal. Instead they counter it with apologetics. The subject of apologetics is all about making up excuses to rationalize the Bible. And, so their "logic" goes, if their apologetics is correct then the Bible iz troo and evilushun iz rong. Which is WHY we end up having to point out the flaws in their religious opinions too, because they don't give us anything else.

We don't post to convince the fundies because 99.999999999999999% of the times they aren't capable of critical thinking. We post to counter lies and misrepresentations of science, no matter the source. This includes science cranks, nihilists, alt-med promoters, science-woo promoters, AIDS deniers, moon-landing hoax promoters, new-age and UFO nuts, you name it we've had it. It's just the vast majority of anti-science promoters around these parts happen to be fundie creationists who all claim reality isn't real because the Flinstones is a science documentary.

And for the most part if they weren't illegally pushing their bollox in public school science classes we'd leave them to it.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#92809 Jun 15, 2013
GLXGT wrote:
<quoted text>
If someone wants to live their life believing in something that is not true that is their choice. Not up to me, you or anyone to tell them they are stupid and wrong. Like you said no one is going to change the opinion of someone who is unwilling to be reasonable.
It IS their choice.

However the fundies are actively trying to REMOVE choice from public schools by teaching THEIR baseless religious opinions over all others.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#92810 Jun 15, 2013
susanblange wrote:
<quoted text>"The Lord is my Rock, my strength and my song" Supertramp is the Rock that begat me "Of the Rock that begat thee thou art unmindful" Deut. 32:18. There is also an album, Shaved Fish by John Lennon and a song, Maggie Mae by Rod Stewart. John Lennon is the king of Rock and roll and the voice from heaven said "Wake up Maggie" and then the song played on the radio. That was on Mothers Day, Sunday morning May 13, 1984.
Rod Stewart is Satan.

“I Am No One Else”

Level 7

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#92811 Jun 15, 2013
Dinoeater wrote:
<quoted text>
if you just watch the videos you would understand. but I guess you are more interested in arguing.
No, I have already seen all the claims, and since none of you ever come up with new ones, there is nothing to bother addressing. They have all been debunked, every one of them. Sorry, but without evidence no claim is even worth addressing, and you have no evidence.

“I Am No One Else”

Level 7

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#92812 Jun 15, 2013
Dinoeater wrote:
<quoted text>
yes he was strong enough to kill a man and farm but was too jealous of his brother. jealousy is what started it all after all
Um, killing a person doesn't take much strength.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#92813 Jun 15, 2013
The Almighty Tzar wrote:
<quoted text>
You like people that burn their kids alive.
I have no problem following Gods word to stone these people. Although I would prefer to burn them alive as they did to the children.
2 Kings 21:6 ESV
And he burned his son as an offering and used fortune-telling and omens and dealt with mediums and with necromancers. He did much evil in the sight of the Lord, provoking him to anger.
2Chronicles 33:6 ESV
And he burned his sons as an offering in the Valley of the Son of Hinnom, and used fortune-telling and omens and sorcery, and dealt with mediums and with necromancers. He did much evil in the sight of the Lord, provoking him to anger.
Deuteronomy 18:10 ESV
There shall not be found among you anyone who burns his son or his daughter as an offering, anyone who practices divination or tells fortunes or interprets omens, or a sorcerer
You support infanticide. Your ONLY problem here is that your god didn't order it.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#92814 Jun 15, 2013
The Almighty Tzar wrote:
<quoted text>
Your 3 BIG Myths:
1) the Big Bang when nothing exploded
and created everything.
2) rain falling on rocks and settling in a mud puddle and spontaneous self generating life sprang forth.
3) plants evolving into plant eating animals.
And when I snap my fingers you will wake up and believe these 3 myths as if they were fact.
"SNAP"
They're all myth because you're misrepresenting the concepts.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#92815 Jun 15, 2013
The Almighty Tzar wrote:
<quoted text>
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism#sectio...
A 2010 survey published in Encyclopedia Britannica found that is atheists at about 2.0%.
Another study assessing religiosity among scientists who are members of the American Association for the Advancement of Science found that "just over half of scientists (51%) believe in some form of deity or higher power.
Sociologist Philip Schwadel found that higher levels of education are associated with increased religious participation and religious practice in daily life.
According to a 2012 report by the Pew Research Center, people describing themselves as "atheist" were 2% of the total population in the US.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_o...
According to the International Bulletin of Missionary Research, an academic journal, "about 80,000 new Christians every day, 79,000 new Muslims every day, and 300 fewer atheists every day."
Another survey attributed to Britannica shows the population of atheists at around 2.4% of the world's population
While there are more atheists than ever before as global population continually increases, the atheist percentage of the total population seem to be declining
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_religi...
Sources outside of Wikipedia give differing estimates:
The CIA's World Factbook gives the world population as 7,021,836,029 (July 2012 est.) and the distribution of religions as Christian 33.39%(of which Roman Catholic 16.85%, Protestant 6.15%, Orthodox 3.96%, Anglican 1.26%), Muslim 22.74%, Hindu 13.8%, Buddhist 6.77%, Sikh 0.35%, Jewish 0.22%, Baha'i 0.11%, other religions 10.95%, atheists 2.01%
persecution. A 2006 study by researchers at the University of Minnesota involving a poll of 2,000 households in the United States found atheists to be the most distrusted of minorities,
In 2012, an article entitled Atheism in decline by Nigel Tomes declared:
In 1970 atheists (those avowing there is no God) numbered 166 million worldwide; that was almost one-in-twenty—4.5% of the globe’s population. By 2012 atheists’ number is estimated at 137 million. That’s a decline of almost 30 million. Since world population is growing, atheists’ share declined to less than one-in-fifty—under 2% in 2012. Put differently, every 24 hours there are 800 fewer atheists in the world! Atheism is in decline.
They're in decline but they're also part of the big giant evil worldwide atheist Darwinist evolutionist scientist liberal communist socialist nazi baby-eating God-hating Christian-suppressing Satan-worshipping Jewish Illuminati Government conspiracy!
Dinoeater

Clifton, NJ

#92816 Jun 15, 2013
and also I haven't gotten sick all this year. almost did though thanks to bad water fountain that tasted like iron got a throat infection if I was a normal person eating all those junk foods, meat, etc. I probably would have gotten sick. this is good for me cause I hate going to the doctor. oh yeah on top of that I walked in the rain and snow all this year and nothing.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#92817 Jun 15, 2013
Dinoeater wrote:
<quoted text>
one question what cult would that be? let's look at the definition of cult: A relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or practices regarded by others as strange or sinister.
let's see my religion is worldwide so no.
If you are an SDAer, then yes, by your own rules you are part of a cult.
Dinoeater wrote:
now slavery you can look here: http://www.whatchristianswanttoknow.com/what-...
Um, your Bible has rules on how to treat slaves. If it did NOT support slavery it would have no such rules at all and say "Slavery is illegal, period!"

It doesn't.

Plus then there's: "Thou shalt have no other God before me!"

Bow to God or burn in hell. That's slavery. And there's no way out of it.
Dinoeater

Clifton, NJ

#92818 Jun 15, 2013
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I have already seen all the claims, and since none of you ever come up with new ones, there is nothing to bother addressing. They have all been debunked, every one of them. Sorry, but without evidence no claim is even worth addressing, and you have no evidence.
how do you know if there are no new claims? if you have'nt checked. Don't judge a book by it's cover. at least watch the first video or part of it then we can talk.

“I Am No One Else”

Level 7

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#92819 Jun 15, 2013
Dinoeater wrote:
and also I haven't gotten sick all this year. almost did though thanks to bad water fountain that tasted like iron got a throat infection if I was a normal person eating all those junk foods, meat, etc. I probably would have gotten sick. this is good for me cause I hate going to the doctor. oh yeah on top of that I walked in the rain and snow all this year and nothing.
So many correlation to causation fallacies.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#92820 Jun 15, 2013
Dinoeater wrote:
<quoted text>
really? cause I'm pretty sure its the other way around honest evolutionists become Christians. and most christians that turn atheist are probably catholic.
but I agree with you he was slightly misinformed what the theory says is that basically space was really tiny and then it expanded. for more info on bigbang and how it is wrong go here: http://amazingdiscoveries.org/C-deception_big...
Although SLIGHTLY better than your average creationist source it still misrepresents science (it is a creationist site after all). One example being dark matter, which they call a "fiddle factor", despite the fact the hypothesis makes successful calculations on the motions and positions of astronomical phenomena that Newtonian physics and relativity cannot account for. Yet the fundies rant against dark matter and not against Newton or Einstein.

And let's not forget what fundies put in place of anything we don't know yet - God of the gaps.

“I Am No One Else”

Level 7

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#92821 Jun 15, 2013
Dinoeater wrote:
<quoted text> how do you know if there are no new claims? if you have'nt checked. Don't judge a book by it's cover. at least watch the first video or part of it then we can talk.
Because they are not new claims, if you cite the bibles then they are certainly not new, and there is no evidence supporting any of the new age garbage.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#92822 Jun 15, 2013
Dinoeater wrote:
<quoted text>
Most of those Christians become atheist probably because of the hell thing. But hell does not exist its a made up thing the catholic church invented. when a person dies they are dead as the saying goes "dead men tell no tales"
Now what do you mean i'm a fool if I think Christianity and evolution are incompatible? are you drunk? of course they are incompatible if you guys believe humans are decedents of monkeys and we believe that humans were created by god then its like pouring water into fire. ether the water evaporates or the fire extinguishes you can only have one or the other. and if you are talking about god creating animals and them evolving well now you are just pathetic. making up a fairytale just to satisfy both sides.
Not really, as your religion is just a fairy-tale to satisfy you.(shrug)

At least with theistic evolution, believers don't have to deny reality for the sake of their faith. The latter is what you do.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#92823 Jun 15, 2013
Dinoeater wrote:
<quoted text>
well if you want to know I am seventh day Adventist.
Despite this, can I just say I applaud you for throwing Eugene Shubert out of your church? I don't blame you.

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