Evolution vs. Creation

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susanblange

Norfolk, VA

#90777 May 27, 2013
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
Look up Job 40:15
Behemoth has the following attributes in Job 40:15-24 •It “eats grass like an ox.”
•It “moves his tail like a cedar.”
•Its “bones are like beams of bronze, His ribs like bars of iron.”
•“He is the first of the ways of God.”
•“He lies under the lotus trees,In a covert of reeds and marsh.”
Where in the heck is that confusing??????????
The key verse that identifies behemoth as the Messiah is :19 "He is the chief of the ways of God, he that made him can make his sword to approach unto him". What doesn't kill us makes us stronger. And regarding :18 there's another scripture that says, "yea saith the spirit, no broken bones".

“I'm Your Huckleberry ”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

That's Just My Game

#90778 May 27, 2013
susanblange wrote:
<quoted text>The key verse that identifies behemoth as the Messiah is :19 "He is the chief of the ways of God, he that made him can make his sword to approach unto him". What doesn't kill us makes us stronger. And regarding :18 there's another scripture that says, "yea saith the spirit, no broken bones".
So you are saying the Messiah grazes and eats grass like the ox? Has a big tail like the cedar? He lies under the lotus trees in a covert of reeds and marsh? It's bones are like beams of bronze, His ribs like bars of iron? That may be your Messiah but it isn't mine.
susanblange

Norfolk, VA

#90779 May 27, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
No, in context the Bible says that the Earth is flat.
To get it to say that the Earth is a sphere you have to take it out of context.
The bible says the earth is round. "It is he that sits upon the circle of the earth..." Isaiah 40:22.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#90780 May 27, 2013
downhill246 wrote:
<quoted text>
Since the New Testament wasn't finalized until the fourth century those Christians were using the Old Testament,to be more specific,the Greek Septuagint which was the Greek version of the Hebrew Old Testament. The fact that they knew the world was a sphere and you didn't know they knew the world was a sphere, merely reflects upon your own ignorance.
So thank you for pointing out , there is no known ancient Hebrew pointing out the fact.
susanblange

Norfolk, VA

#90781 May 27, 2013
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
So you are saying the Messiah grazes and eats grass like the ox? Has a big tail like the cedar? He lies under the lotus trees in a covert of reeds and marsh? It's bones are like beams of bronze, His ribs like bars of iron? That may be your Messiah but it isn't mine.
Haven't you ever heard of a metaphor?

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#90782 May 27, 2013
imagine2011 wrote:
<quoted text>
Wrong...
There is tons of evidence proving the global flood and Genesis.
There is proof of the Egyptian carriages in the Red Sea.
There are hundreds of proven prophecies also.
Man, you are getting desparate.
Nope, all so called evidence is easily debunked.

And no, when investigated there are no real proven prophecies, but there are debunked ones.

How am I getting desperate? I am not the one who is telling stories that are easily debunked.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#90783 May 27, 2013
susanblange wrote:
<quoted text>The bible says the earth is round. "It is he that sits upon the circle of the earth..." Isaiah 40:22.
A circle is flat. Did you fail geometry along with the others here? All descriptions in context describe a flat Earth, not a spherical one.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#90784 May 27, 2013
downhill246 wrote:
<quoted text>
Heck, just about every sailor knew the earth was round since sailing ships all came into view top of sails first and mountains that were far away were only visible on top.In addition early Christians using scripture all said the earth was a sphere. I wonder why almost all Christians believed that?
The Hebrews were not well know for being sailors. Some of them were fishermen, that does not make them sailors.

Due to the influence of the Greeks the fact that the world is a sphere was fairly well known after Jesus died. Many translations were affected by the proper knowledge of the shape of the Earth. How do you think Genesis might have been translated if they knew the truth about evolution?

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#90785 May 27, 2013
downhill246 wrote:
<quoted text>
Maybe you just hang out with liars and thieves which would explain your ASSiest disposition to be a dipsh!t. You are easy.
What, you don't like the fact that I do not accept lies?

I am not a Christian. Lying goes against my personal philosophy. Too many Christians seem to have no problem lying for Jesus.

“I'm Your Huckleberry ”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

That's Just My Game

#90786 May 27, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
A circle is flat. Did you fail geometry along with the others here? All descriptions in context describe a flat Earth, not a spherical one.
But again Sub, with all due respect that is what you are putting it out to be. It never says the Earth is "flat". Now back then they knew "circle" and they knew "flat". They did not have a vast vocabulary nor did they know of 2,3,4 dimensional. So you have to realize the bible was written by simple people that did not know things like we know today.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#90787 May 27, 2013
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
But again Sub, with all due respect that is what you are putting it out to be. It never says the Earth is "flat". Now back then they knew "circle" and they knew "flat". They did not have a vast vocabulary nor did they know of 2,3,4 dimensional. So you have to realize the bible was written by simple people that did not know things like we know today.
No, in context it describes a flat circle. Circles are always flat by definition. They had the word for "ball" in that time too. They never describe the Earth as a ball, but the word does appear in Isaiah. Does it make sense to "hang" a sky over a sphere lilke a tent? No. Does it make sense to "hand" one over a flat disc? Yes. With the sphere there would be no sky over half of the world. For them the supposed sky would be under their feet.

Here is a blog from a scholar of ancient Hebrew who can explain this better than I can:

http://youngausskeptics.com/2008/12/what-you-...

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#90788 May 27, 2013
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
But again Sub, with all due respect that is what you are putting it out to be. It never says the Earth is "flat". Now back then they knew "circle" and they knew "flat". They did not have a vast vocabulary nor did they know of 2,3,4 dimensional. So you have to realize the bible was written by simple people that did not know things like we know today.
They simply had no concept of outer space. Period!

“I'm Your Huckleberry ”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

That's Just My Game

#90789 May 27, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
No, in context it describes a flat circle. Circles are always flat by definition. They had the word for "ball" in that time too. They never describe the Earth as a ball, but the word does appear in Isaiah. Does it make sense to "hang" a sky over a sphere lilke a tent? No. Does it make sense to "hand" one over a flat disc? Yes. With the sphere there would be no sky over half of the world. For them the supposed sky would be under their feet.
Here is a blog from a scholar of ancient Hebrew who can explain this better than I can:
http://youngausskeptics.com/2008/12/what-you-...
Sub I understand what you are saying. But you all bring up biology, geology, algebra, geometry ect ect. One thing is those did not exist back in the biblical days. They were simple people with simple minds and ways. Ask any preschool kid the shape of a ball and 99.9% of them will tell you it is a circle. That's about what their mental capability was like back then. A preschooler compared to a professor now days. That is a silly comparison but again they were simple people that did not know a lot.

“I'm Your Huckleberry ”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

That's Just My Game

#90790 May 27, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text> They simply had no concept of outer space. Period!
Thank you. You help prove my point they were simple people that in reality did not know anything compared to the people of today.

“I'm Your Huckleberry ”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

That's Just My Game

#90791 May 27, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
No, in context it describes a flat circle. Circles are always flat by definition. They had the word for "ball" in that time too. They never describe the Earth as a ball, but the word does appear in Isaiah. Does it make sense to "hang" a sky over a sphere lilke a tent? No. Does it make sense to "hand" one over a flat disc? Yes. With the sphere there would be no sky over half of the world. For them the supposed sky would be under their feet.
Here is a blog from a scholar of ancient Hebrew who can explain this better than I can:
http://youngausskeptics.com/2008/12/what-you-...
In your link he goes on to say one particular Christian pointed out that a circle and sphere are the same, wow, I know, but it’s so sadly true. He then tried to elaborate,”What is a box?”, my reply ”It’s a cube, it is three dimensional”, he said,”It’s a square” and I nearly fell over. Bach THEN they did not know of a cube, let alone a 3 dimensional cube. They called things square.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#90792 May 27, 2013
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
Sub I understand what you are saying. But you all bring up biology, geology, algebra, geometry ect ect. One thing is those did not exist back in the biblical days. They were simple people with simple minds and ways. Ask any preschool kid the shape of a ball and 99.9% of them will tell you it is a circle. That's about what their mental capability was like back then. A preschooler compared to a professor now days. That is a silly comparison but again they were simple people that did not know a lot.
You can't have it both ways. You are right that they were a simple people. They thought the world was flat. Check with any historian who is familiar with these people.

Second, they had a perfectly good word for sphere, if that is what they thought the world was. They didn't. And it isn't just this verse. There are others too. You cannot sweep them all under the carpet. If you want to claim that they believed in a spherical Earth you need to find some real evidence that supports your claim.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#90793 May 27, 2013
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
In your link he goes on to say one particular Christian pointed out that a circle and sphere are the same, wow, I know, but it’s so sadly true. He then tried to elaborate,”What is a box?”, my reply ”It’s a cube, it is three dimensional”, he said,”It’s a square” and I nearly fell over. Bach THEN they did not know of a cube, let alone a 3 dimensional cube. They called things square.
His point was that they did not call boxes "squares" in the past. I think you misread this part of the article.

“I'm Your Huckleberry ”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

That's Just My Game

#90794 May 27, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
His point was that they did not call boxes "squares" in the past. I think you misread this part of the article.
here it is word for word. I just read what was there.

Finally, just think for one second logically about what may have gone on when Isaiah was written. What the writer of Isaiah would have seen when he looked at the Moon, was not a sphere but a circle! What did he see if he was game enough to take a glimpse at the Sun, that’s right a circle. Is it not more probably that the writer of Isaiah was simply making an inference from observations he had made previously about the universe and the Earth specifically? Seems logical to me, is it?

It was after I had made all the previous points that this one particular Christian pointed out that a circle and sphere are the same, wow, I know, but it’s so sadly true. He then tried to elaborate,”What is a box?”, my reply ”It’s a cube, it is three dimensional”, he said,”It’s a square” and I nearly fell over. I know this is hard to believe but it is oh so true

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#90795 May 27, 2013
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
here it is word for word. I just read what was there.
Finally, just think for one second logically about what may have gone on when Isaiah was written. What the writer of Isaiah would have seen when he looked at the Moon, was not a sphere but a circle! What did he see if he was game enough to take a glimpse at the Sun, that’s right a circle. Is it not more probably that the writer of Isaiah was simply making an inference from observations he had made previously about the universe and the Earth specifically? Seems logical to me, is it?
It was after I had made all the previous points that this one particular Christian pointed out that a circle and sphere are the same, wow, I know, but it’s so sadly true. He then tried to elaborate,”What is a box?”, my reply ”It’s a cube, it is three dimensional”, he said,”It’s a square” and I nearly fell over. I know this is hard to believe but it is oh so true
Yes, and you forgot the rest of it:

" I have never blogged before this being my first time. I have commented others blogs occasionally, but I was so irritated at this reasoning that I just had to write down my thoughts and decided I should join the other bloggers and post them. I did try to explain further that a cube can be made of 6 squares but it is not a square. At that point I realized I was getting nowhere and decided to end the conversation. These people were not open to evidence and reason and simply dismissed others with no proof of their own as they often remarked ”You have to have faith”."

A cube is not a square. If you are far enough away from a cube it practically never looks like a square. Yet, if you are far enough away from a sphere it looks like a circle. If you make a two dimensional projection of a cube it will usually have six sides. Only if you are looking dead on at a flat surface will you see only four edges.

“I'm Your Huckleberry ”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

That's Just My Game

#90796 May 27, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, and you forgot the rest of it:
" I have never blogged before this being my first time. I have commented others blogs occasionally, but I was so irritated at this reasoning that I just had to write down my thoughts and decided I should join the other bloggers and post them. I did try to explain further that a cube can be made of 6 squares but it is not a square. At that point I realized I was getting nowhere and decided to end the conversation. These people were not open to evidence and reason and simply dismissed others with no proof of their own as they often remarked ”You have to have faith”."
A cube is not a square. If you are far enough away from a cube it practically never looks like a square. Yet, if you are far enough away from a sphere it looks like a circle. If you make a two dimensional projection of a cube it will usually have six sides. Only if you are looking dead on at a flat surface will you see only four edges.
I read that but I don't agree. If I took a box and a flat square stood up(end of a box and set them 100 yards from you would be pressed to tell which one was which by looking directly at them.

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