Evolution vs. Creation

Jan 6, 2011 Read more: Best of New Orleans 155,441
High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008. Read more

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#90411 May 24, 2013
Worthington wrote:
<quoted text>
So plow horses can run races, some dogs are better trackers.
And you, in total ignorance, imagine that the rules of nature
do not apply to homo sapiens. Brains beget brains. Average Black
IQ USA 85 with 23% at 75 or less! Want a shocker?
Google "IQ and the Wealth of Nations."
I Googled "Worthington" instead:
http://socialbarrel.com/wp-content/uploads/20...

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#90412 May 24, 2013
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>
You dogmatically stated that no evidence of God exists.
It is impossible to honestly make a statement like that, because no one has examined off of the evidence.
What evidence do you have beyond an occasional warm and fuzzy feeling?
KJV

United States

#90413 May 24, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
[QUOTE who="KJV
"]<quoted text>
Weird!
You talk about sheep herders and leave off the wise men who left their rich palaces to ride for months or even years on camels to worship God.
Not slanted at all. NOT.
You're a failure. "

What are you talking about? The bogus nativity story?

Please that fails on so many levels it is not even funny.
Never failed,

http://www.bethlehemstar.net/

For centuries, believers, scoffers and the curious have wondered at the Biblical account of the Star of Bethlehem. The Bible recounts unusual or even impossible astronomical events at Christ’s birth. For many doubters, the account of the Star is easily dismissed as myth. For many believers, it’s a mystery accepted on faith. But what happens if we combine current scriptural accounts, astronomical fact and a desire for truth? The Star of Bethlehem documents the search to understand how the Lord used the stars and planets to reveal His plans for Christ’s birth. Uncover the mystery for yourself.

From Producer Stephen McEveety, The Passion Of The Christ

http://www.christiancinema.com/catalog/produc...
KJV

United States

#90414 May 24, 2013
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>Yes, but in so doing they are effectively denying either one of two things:

1. If they believe that only mutations and natural selection account for all life, they are denying that God directed the creation.
2. If they believe that God directed the transmutation of species, then they deny the proposed mechanisms of evolution as sufficient to explain life.
Agreed

Does Evolution contradict the Bible?

Is it possible to believe in evolution and still be a Christian?

If being a Christian means believing that the Bible is the authentic, trustworthy Word of God and that Christ is our Creator and Savior, the answer is “No.” One cannot believe these things and also believe in evolution as the explanation for the origin of life on our earth as we know it.
KJV

United States

#90415 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
[QUOTE who="KJV
"]<quoted text>
Weird!
You talk about sheep herders and leave off the wise men who left their rich palaces to ride for months or even years on camels to worship God.
Not slanted at all. NOT.
You're a failure. "

YOU talk about slanted? ROFL!!! Failure? I'll bet you even think the entire globe was flooded 4,500 years ago.
You jumped a few thousand years between Genesis day one and year one AD. The Magi are absolutely irrelevant, Failure. I said creation mythS are weird - plural, not just the Abrahamic one.
BTW, humans domesticated sheep 10,000 years ago and we are still herding them - and still on the same obscure ball of mud, except now we have quads and dirt bikes.
What is this babble suppose to mean?

Since: Mar 11

Minnesota's North Coast

#90416 May 24, 2013
[QUOTE who="KJV
"]<quoted text>
Never failed,
http://www.bethlehemstar.net/
For centuries, believers, scoffers and the curious have wondered at the Biblical account of the Star of Bethlehem. The Bible recounts unusual or even impossible astronomical events at Christ’s birth. For many doubters, the account of the Star is easily dismissed as myth. For many believers, it’s a mystery accepted on faith. But what happens if we combine current scriptural accounts, astronomical fact and a desire for truth? The Star of Bethlehem documents the search to understand how the Lord used the stars and planets to reveal His plans for Christ’s birth. Uncover the mystery for yourself.
From Producer Stephen McEveety, The Passion Of The Christ
http://www.christiancinema.com/catalog/produc...
[/QUOTE]yet other cultures that also lived by watching the stars did not report such a star...imagine that!
KJV

United States

#90417 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
Descartes did, but do you?
Is there any shred of evidence outside of the Bible for a flood that submerged the mountains under the entire heavens? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence in the diversification of the biosphere that indicates a global genetic bottleneck within the history of man? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence that all of mankind except for 4 related couples was eliminated 4,300+/- years ago? Nope.
Yes!


Evidence for a Global Flood

by Laurence D Smart B.Sc.Agr., Dip.Ed., Grad.Dip.Ed

Email: laurence@unmaskingevolution.co m

Webpage: www.unmaskingevolution.com

[Free to print and distribute. Copy must be in full.]

In the past, scientists largely dismissed Noah's flood as a myth, or a local flood, as it was believed that there could not have been enough rainwater to cover the world as high as Mount Everest. Recent discoveries in plate tectonics and crustal physics have shown that a much flatter Earth could have easily been flooded, with the resultant volcanic and geologic activity altering the land surface. These details have demolished the main argument against a global flood, but the tag of "local flood" has remained because atheists do not want any evidence that supports the existence of an Almighty, Creator/God.



Here are over 100 evidences in support of a global flood, rather than a local one.

FROM LOGIC.........[12 reasons]

(1) For rain to fall for forty uninterrupted days on one localized area is currently close to impossible.

(2) A rainbow appeared for the first time after the flood, indicating a radical change in atmospheric conditions as a consequence of a cataclysmic event.

(3) The waters remained for over a year. This would not occur in a local flood.

(4) To be higher than the highest mountains, the flood could not have been local.

(5) To cover the mountains continually for 9 months, the flood could not have been local.

(6) The purpose of the flood was to destroy all human beings. This could only refer to a worldwide flood.

(7) If the flood was local, people living elsewhere in the world would have escaped.

(8) The enormous size of the ark (equivalent to the capacity of 500 railroad freight carriages) would hold much more than local species of animals.

(9) The purpose of the ark to "keep seed [species - NKJ] alive upon the face of the earth" is only rational if the flood was global.

(10) Noah and his family could have migrated to a locality away from the local area to be flooded. There would have been no need to spend 120 years building an ark.

(11) Many of the animals in the flooding area could have easily migrated to escape the deluge if the flood was local. There would have been no need to build an ark to provide them with a safe haven.

(12) If God made a promise based on a lie (ie. that the flood being local rather than global), then he can't be trusted to save us from our sins.

http://unmaskingevolution.com/18-flood.htm
KJV

United States

#90418 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
ago? Nope.
Continued......

FROM SCIENCE.......[45 reasons]

(13) There is a worldwide tradition among natives of a global flood.

(14) According to current archaeological evidence, civilization appears to have originated in the Ararat/Babylon region.

(15) The genealogical records of many of the European kings can be traced back to Japheth, son of Noah.

(16) An analysis of population growth statistics confirms that there was zero population at the estimated time of the end of the flood. This indicates the global demise of humans by Noah's flood.

(17) Human palaeontological evidence exists even in the earliest geologic 'ages'(eg human footprints in Cambrian, Carboniferous, and Cretaceous rocks). If the layers of rock were laid down by a global flood and then interpreted as evolutionary long-ages, human remains and artefacts would appear to be in such positions.

(18) The most ancient human artefacts date to the post-flood era. This indicates that the earlier hardware could have been buried beyond reach by a huge flood.

(19) Calculations have shown that there is nearly the same amount of organic material present today, worldwide, as there would have been if all the fossils were still alive (Morris p:685). This indicates the demise of all living things in a single global event.

(20) Paleontological evidence indicates that the early earth had a warm/humid climate. This is consistent with the destruction of the old atmosphere by the processes of a global flood as described in Genesis.

(21) The glacial period started very quickly. This would require a cataclysmic event such as a global flood to trigger such a rapid climatic change.

(22) Similar geologic formations exist in rocks of all ages (eg rifts, folds, faults, thrusts, etc.). These can just as easily be explained as being created in the same cataclysmic global event.

(23) Studies show that much of the world's folded beds of sediment have no compression fractures, indicating that they were contorted while they were still wet and soft. For this to occur on a global scale, and on sediment thousands of metres thick, it would have required a catastrophic global flood.

(24) Rocks of different geologic 'ages' have similar physical features indicating that they could have been created by a single worldwide event - such as a global flood.

(25) There is an absence of physical evidence that indicates a time change between rocks of 'successive ages'. Sedimentary rock layers worldwide appear to have been laid down very quickly, as by a global flood.

(26) Globally, there is an almost complete absence of any evidence of animal and plant root activity within the tiny layers of sediment. Slowly deposited layers should show this activity, flood deposits wouldn't.

(27) All types of rocks (eg limestone, shale, granite, etc) occur in all geologic 'ages'. This indicates a common formation on a global scale - the situation that would have been created by the mixing of sediment in a global flood.

(28) Many geological processes have a recent geological date. If the long-age evolutionary time scale is ignored, these processes would have occurred in the very recent past - ie. as a result of the flood cataclysm.

(29) Recent volcanic rocks are distributed widely.(see last point above)

(30) The uplift of the major mountain ranges are relatively young, based on evolutionary chronology. If the long-age evolutionary time scale is ignored, these processes would have occurred in the very recent past - ie as a result of the flood cataclysm.

http://unmaskingevolution.com/18-flood.htm
KJV

United States

#90419 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
.
Continued..........

(31) There is a lack of correlation between radiometric 'ages' and assumed palaeontological 'ages'(Morris p:686). A global flood could easily create an illusion of geologic 'ages'. The consequent conflict between dating methods confirms the illusion.

(32) Fossil 'graveyards' are found worldwide, and in rocks of all 'ages'. Only a catastrophic global flood could achieve this.

(33) The burial of fossil deposits worldwide had to have occurred in a catastrophic event. Only massive flooding could bury in such a fashion.

(34) Marine fossils can be found on the crests of mountains. Apart from mountain uplifting, this can also be explained as the marine animals being washed there and then buried. A global flood could do this.

(35) There is a worldwide distribution of most of the fossil types, indicating transportation on a global scale by a global flood.

(36) Fossils from different 'ages' are often found mixed. This indicates a huge mixing of animal bones that is not consistent with a local flood.

(37) Worldwide, fossils from different 'ages' are often found in the wrong order. This indicates a global mixing of fossils as a consequence of a global flood.

(38) Supposed evolutionary fossil sequences often parallel the ecological zonation that occurs today (Morris p:686). If a global flood mixed organisms from different areas, it would create the illusion of a fossil sequence over time.

(39) Dinosaurs and many other prehistoric creatures died out suddenly. A catastrophe such as a global flood could have produced this result.

(40) Polystrate fossils (viz. vertical fossil tree trunks) that are found worldwide indicate turbulent or rapid deposition. A global flood would be required to do this worldwide.

(41) Polystrate fossils also form when water-logged timber sinks in a large body of water. A year long global flood could produce worldwide polystrate fossils formed in this way.

(42) Animal tracks and other ephemeral markings (ripple-marks and raindrop imprints) have been preserved throughout the geological column. Rapid covering of these markings is required for this preservation worldwide - ie. by a global flood.

(43) Meteorites are basically absent from the geologic column. With the large number of meteorites hitting the earth each year, they should be very plentiful throughout the sedimentary rocks - unless much of the world's sedimentary rocks were laid down in one year.

(44) Sedimentary rocks contain fossil ripple-marks and raindrop imprints, but no hail imprints. A global flood (with associated rain), that was not caused by storms would not leave hail imprint marks.

(45) Some desert areas show evidence of 'recent' water bodies. Water from a recent global flood would remain in large pools (bodies of water) for some time before evaporating.

(46) There is evidence of a recent drastic rise in sea level. A global flood could easily have created this feature.

(47) Raised shorelines are found worldwide indicating a time when the world had a different sea level. A consistent interpretation of this is that a global flood altered the levels of the oceans and seas.

(48) Mountain-high water level marks found throughout the world are consistent with the recession of a global flood.
KJV

United States

#90420 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
Descartes did, but do you?
Is there any shred of evidence outside of the Bible for a flood that submerged the mountains under the entire heavens? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence in the diversification of the biosphere that indicates a global genetic bottleneck within the history of man? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence that all of mankind except for 4 related couples was eliminated 4,300+/- years ago? Nope.
http://unmaskingevolution.com/18-flood.htm

Continued..........

(49) River terraces are found worldwide.(Morris p:685)

(50) There is a universal occurrence of rivers in valleys too large for the present stream. Slow erosion over millions of years could not have created these valleys as the mountains would have eroded, keeping pace with the valley erosion. The drainage of global floodwaters from the land surface could easily create such wide valleys in a short period of time.

(51) Only modern sediments show any evidence of surface drainage systems. If the majority of the world's sedimentary rocks were laid down by a global flood there would not be any sign of drainage erosion except for the top layers eroded during the recession of the flood waters off the land.

(52) Hydrologic evidence points to the rapid deposition of sedimentary rock layers. Therefore, the thousand's of metres of sediment must have been deposited by a catastrophic global flood.

(53) Hydrologic evidence points to the world's sedimentary rocks being deposited in one continuous episode. All the layers could have been laid down by a single event, such as a global flood.

(54) Hydrologic experiments show that flowing sediment automatically settles out in distinct layers. Therefore, sedimentary rock layers can be just as easily explained as flood debris, as slow deposition.

(55) There is a worldwide occurrence of deep alluvial deposits and sedimentary rocks consistent with a huge global flood.

(56) There is a near-random deposition of formational sequences.(Morris p:685)

(57) Nowhere in the world is it possible to see the complete geologic column as a single structure. It is always found in bits and pieces, and mostly with pieces missing. Globally, a worldwide flood could create the illusion of a geologic column.

(58) The oldest organisms still alive on Earth today, the Californian Redwoods, Sequoias and Bristlecone Pines, are around 3,000-4,000 years old. Nothing is older that the date of Noah's flood.

KJV

United States

#90421 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
Descartes did, but do you?
Is there any shred of evidence outside of the Bible for a flood that submerged the mountains under the entire heavens? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence in the diversification of the biosphere that indicates a global genetic bottleneck within the history of man? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence that all of mankind except for 4 related couples was eliminated 4,300+/- years ago? Nope.
FROM THE GENESIS NARRATIVE........[47 reasons]

(59) The account in Genesis speaks of the flood being a universal event at least thirty times.

(60) God promised three times not to "smite [destroy - NKJ] every living thing" by a flood (Gen8:21; 9:11; 9:15). Three occurrences in Scripture indicates absolute truth.

(61) Following the flood, Eden was no longer discussed geographically. If it was a local flood, its general whereabouts would still be known. The total obliteration of the whole earth's geography is therefore inferred - such as by a global flood.

(62) The "waters above the firmament [earth - NKJ]" would not have been localised into a small area.(Gen 1:7)

(63) No rain on the earth before the flood speaks of a worldwide condition.(Gen 2:5)

(64) The whole earth was watered by a mist, prior to the flood.(Gen 2:6)

(65) The dawn of civilization had a high civilization (Genesis chapter 4). This was wiped out and did not recover for a long time.

(66) The long life spans of the pre-diluvial people indicates an entirely different biosphere.(Gen 5:5; 5:8; 5:11; etc)

(67) The subsequent decline in life span following the flood indicates a radically different biosphere.(Gen 23:1; 25:7)

(68) God described the pre-flood people as universally evil (Gen 6:5). He never described the post-flood people as universally evil, so something universal (ie. worldwide) must have happened to weed it out.

(69) Mankind had multiplied all over the earth (Gen 6:1), so the flood had to be global to destroy them all.

(70) God was sorry that he created all living creatures, not just a localised population of animal creatures.(Gen 6:6-7)

(71) The whole earth was seen by God as corrupt.(Gen 6:11-12)

(72) God decided to destroy the whole earth.(Gen 6:13)

(73) Everything that had breath was to die.(Gen 6:17)

(74) The purpose of the ark was to keep two of every breathing animal (ie. worldwide species) alive.(Gen 6:19)

(75) Two of every kind of animal and bird came to Noah, not just local fauna.(Gen 6:20)

(76) Noah had to collect samples of all food eaten, not just local foodstuffs.(Gen 6:21)

(77) God wanted the ark "to keep seed [species - NKJ] alive upon the face of the earth".(Gen 7:3)

(78) God promised to destroy every living thing on the earth.(Gen 7:4)

(79) The Hebrew word for flood "mabbul" only refers to Noah's flood, so it must have been different to all other floods.(Gen 7:10)

(80) All the "fountains of the great deep" broke up in one incident.(Gen 7:11)

(81) The "fountains of the great deep" would not have affected a simple, local land-based flood.(Gen 7:11)

(82) The opening of the windows of heaven (if this refers to "the waters above the firmament") would had a global impact.(Gen 7:11)

(83) The double superlative, "all the high mountains under all the heavens" ["all the high hills under the whole heaven" - NKJ], indicates a global covering.(Gen 7:19)

(84) The highest mountains were covered by 15 cubits (6.75m) of water.(Gen 7:20)

(85) The Hebrew word, "kasah", used to mean that the mountains were covered has a meaning of "overwhelming".(Gen 7:20)

(86) Every human died on the whole earth.(Gen 7:21)

(87) All living things on dry land, with "nephesh" life in them, died.(Gen 7:22)

(88) Every living thing on the earth was destroyed.(Gen 7:23)

(89) The floodwater remained at maximum height for 5 months.(Gen 7:24)

(90) The "fountains of the deep" were open for 5 months.(Gen 8:2)

http://unmaskingevolution.com/18-flood.htm
KJV

United States

#90422 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
Descartes did, but do you?
Is there any shred of evidence outside of the Bible for a flood that submerged the mountains under the entire heavens? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence in the diversification of the biosphere that indicates a global genetic bottleneck within the history of man? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence that all of mankind except for 4 related couples was eliminated 4,300+/- years ago? Nope.
Continued........

(91) The "windows of heaven" were open for 5 months.(Gen 8:2)

(92) The floodwaters took 5 months to drain off the land.(Gen 8:3)

(93) The ark floated above the mountains for 5 months.(Gen 8:4)

(94) The waters receded for 2.5 months before the mountain tops were visible.(Gen 8:5)

(95) The dove couldn't find solid ground until the water had receded for 4 months.(Gen 8:9)

(96) Plants did not grow for 9 months.(Gen 8:11)

(97) Noah, his family, and the animals were in the ark for over a year.(Gen 8:14)

(98) All current life came out of the ark.(Gen 8:19)

(99) God promised that he would not destroy all living things again in the same way.(Gen 8:21)

(100) The current seasonal conditions date from the end of the flood (Gen 8:22), indicating a radical change from the previous environment.

(101) God commanded Noah and his family to breed and fill the earth with people again.(Gen 9:1)

(102) A flood will not be used by God to destroy the earth again.(Gen 9:11)

(103) The earth was re-populated from Noah's family.(Gen 9:19)

(104) Everyone spoke the same language after the flood (Gen 11:1), indicating decent from a single ancestor.

(105) Everyone lived in the same area after the flood.(Gen 11:9)



FROM ELSEWHERE IN SCRIPTURE......[9 reasons]

(106) The floodwaters overturned the earth.(Job 12:15)

(107) The floodwaters covered the whole earth.(Is 54:9)

(108) The flood took all people off the face of the earth.(Matt 24:39)- Jesus talking

(109) The flood destroyed all humans.(Luke 17:27)- Jesus talking

(110) The whole world was condemned.(Heb 11:7)

(111) God destroyed the old world.(II Peter 2:5)

(112) God flooded the whole world.(II Peter 2:5)

(113) The Greek word for flood, "kataklusmos", is only used to describe Noah's flood. This indicates that it was vastly different from any other flood.(II Peter 2:5)

(114) The old world perished by flood.(II Peter 3:6)



http://unmaskingevolution.com/18-flood.htm
KJV

United States

#90423 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
Descartes did, but do you?
Is there any shred of evidence outside of the Bible for a flood that submerged the mountains under the entire heavens? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence in the diversification of the biosphere that indicates a global genetic bottleneck within the history of man? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence that all of mankind except for 4 related couples was eliminated 4,300+/- years ago? Nope.
http://discovermagazine.com/2012/jul-aug/06-b...

"Long before the discovery of the scablands, geologists dismissed the role of catastrophic floods in interpreting European geology. By the end of the 19th century such ideas not only were out of fashion but were geological heresy. When J Harlen Bretz uncovered evidence of giant floods in eastern Washington in the 1920s, it took most of the 20th century for other geologists to believe him. Geologists had so thoroughly vilified the concept of great floods that they could not believe it when somebody actually found evidence of one.
Bretz was a classic field geologist and a controversial figure throughout his career. In 1925 he presented the story of the region’s giant floods, seeing what others at first could not—and then would not—see. He spent his lifetime piecing together the story of how a raging wall of water hundreds of feet high roared across eastern Washington, carving deep channels before cascading down the Columbia River Gorge as a wall of water high enough to turn Oregon’s Willamette Valley into a vast backwater lake.

Bretz found exotic granite boulders perched on basalt cliffs hundreds of feet above the highest recorded river level. In the scablands, a desolate region stripped of soil, he came across dry waterfalls and potholes hundreds of feet above the modern river. Gigantic gravel bars deposited within dry valleys implied deep, fast-flowing water. Streamlined hills rose like islands, extending more than 100 feet above the scoured-out channelways.

He realized the chaotic landscape had been carved by an enormous flood that chewed deep channels through hundreds of feet of solid basalt. The ancient flood deposited an enormous delta around Portland, Oregon, backing up flow into the Willamette Valley. The waters, he eventually realized, could have come from catastrophic drainage of Lake Missoula, an ancient, glacier-dammed lake in western Montana.

Bretz was ridiculed until 1940, when geologist Joe Pardee described giant ripple marks on the bed of Lake Missoula. The 50-foot-high ripples, he said, were formed by fast-flowing currents and not by the sluggish bottom water of a lake. Only sudden failure of the glacial dam could have released the 2,000-foot-deep lake. The catastrophic release of 600 cubic miles of water through a narrow gap would sweep away everything in its path. In 1979, when Bretz was 97 years old, the Geological Society of America awarded him its highest honor, the Penrose Medal."
KJV

United States

#90424 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
Descartes did, but do you?
Is there any shred of evidence outside of the Bible for a flood that submerged the mountains under the entire heavens? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence in the diversification of the biosphere that indicates a global genetic bottleneck within the history of man? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence that all of mankind except for 4 related couples was eliminated 4,300+/- years ago? Nope.
Jun 19, 2010 – Harold G. Coffin got his Ph.D. from the University of Southern California in 1969.

Clyde L. Webster, Ph.D.
Senior Research Scientist
Geoscience Research Institute

"The evidence presented here provides a basis for additional detailed research that could be done. Such research would be beneficial for our understanding of these unique fossil deposits. Offhand, the in situ model would appear to be the simplest and most natural explanation, but closer examination uncovers features that are difficult to explain for trees in growth position. A transport model involving the flotation of trees and organic debris in a body of water, as illustrated in Spirit Lake, gives a better fit to the data as observed in the Yellowstone Petrified Forests. We propose that the Yellowstone Petrified Forests provide an example of catastrophic deposition."

http://www.grisda.org/origins/24002.htm
KJV

United States

#90425 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
Descartes did, but do you?
Is there any shred of evidence outside of the Bible for a flood that submerged the mountains under the entire heavens? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence in the diversification of the biosphere that indicates a global genetic bottleneck within the history of man? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence that all of mankind except for 4 related couples was eliminated 4,300+/- years ago? Nope.
A fossilized human skull was found in coal that was sold in Germany (mid-1800s). A jawbone of a child was found in coal in Tuscany (1958). Two giant human molars were found in Montana (1926). A human leg was found by a West Virginia coal miner. It had changed into coal.�pp. 34-35.

A woman, in Illinois, reportedly found a gold chain in a chunk of coal which broke open (1891). A small steel cube was found in a block of coal in Austria (1885). An iron pot was found in coal in Oklahoma (1912). A woman found a child's spoon in coal (1937).�p. 35.

In 1944 Newton Anderson claimed to have found this bell inside a lump of coal that was mined near his house in West Virginia. When Newton dropped the lump it broke, revealing a bell encased inside.

What is a brass bell with an iron clapper doing in coal that is supposed to be hundreds of

millions of years old? According to Norm Scharbough's book Ammunition (which includes a compilation of many such "coal anecdotes") the bell was extensively analyzed at the University of Oklahoma and it was found to contain an unusual mixture of metals, different from any modern usage. Photo and text from Genesis Park.

Man-made objects in rock.

An iron nail was found in a Cretaceous block from the Mesozoic era (mid-1800s). A gold thread was found in stone in England (1844). An iron nail was found in quartz in California (1851). A silver vessel was found in solid rock in Massachusetts (1851).

The mold of a metal screw was found in a chunk of feldspar (1851). An intricately carved and inlaid metal bowl was found in solid rock (1852). An iron nail was found in rock in a Peruvian mine by Spanish conquistadores (1572).�pp. 35-36.

http://s8int.com/page8.html
KJV

United States

#90426 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
Descartes did, but do you?
Is there any shred of evidence outside of the Bible for a flood that submerged the mountains under the entire heavens? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence in the diversification of the biosphere that indicates a global genetic bottleneck within the history of man? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence that all of mankind except for 4 related couples was eliminated 4,300+/- years ago? Nope.
The whole earth was covered with the Flood waters, and the world that then existed was destroyed by the very waters out of which the earth had originally emerged at God's command (Genesis 1:9; 2 Peter 3:5,6). But where did those waters go after the flood?

There are a number of Scripture passages that identify the flood waters with the present-day seas (Amos 9:6 and Job 38:8-11 note “waves”). If the waters are still here, why are the highest mountains not still covered with water, as they were in Noah's day? Psalm 104 suggests an answer. After the waters covered the mountains (verse 6), God rebuked them and they fled (verse 7); the mountains rose, the valleys sank down (verse 8) and God set a boundary so that they will never again cover the earth (verse 9)[1]. They are the same waters!

Isaiah gives this same statement that the waters of Noah would never again cover the earth (Isaiah 54:9). Clearly, what the Bible is telling us is that God acted to alter the earth's topography. New continental landmasses bearing new mountain chains of folded rock strata were uplifted from below the globe-encircling waters that had eroded and leveled the pre-Flood topography, while large deep ocean basin were formed to receive and accommodate the Flood waters that then drained off the emerging continents.

That is why the oceans are so deep, and why there are folded mountain ranges. Indeed, if the entire earth's surface were leveled by smoothing out the topography of not only the land surface but also the rock surface on the ocean floor, the waters of the ocean would cover the earth's surface to a depth of 1.7 miles (2.7 kilometers). We need to remember that nearly 70 percent of the earth's surface is still covered by water. Quite clearly, then, the waters of Noah's Flood are in today's ocean basins.

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-aig/aig-flo...
KJV

United States

#90427 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
Descartes did, but do you?
Is there any shred of evidence outside of the Bible for a flood that submerged the mountains under the entire heavens? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence in the diversification of the biosphere that indicates a global genetic bottleneck within the history of man? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence that all of mankind except for 4 related couples was eliminated 4,300+/- years ago? Nope.
"A remarkable fossil find has been found in Peru: 346 whales buried in diatomaceous earth. The preservation of the whales is so pristine and complete, the authors of the paper in the Feb. 2004 issue of Geology1 conclude that the whales had to be buried rapidly, in days or weeks. If so, it represents a rate of accumulation of diatoms many times higher than what occurs in modern oceans.
The authors point out some amazing things about this fossil deposit:
Condition: The whale skeletons are “preserved in pristine condition (bones articulated [i.e., still assembled] or at least closely associated), in some cases including preserved baleen.”
Fine details:“The most complete whale (WCBa 20) was fully articulated; the microscopic detail of its baleen was preserved … and there is black, heavy-mineral replacement of the spinal cord and some intervertebral disks. There were no similar minerals in the surrounding sediment. These nonbony tissues were still present when the whale was completely buried.” Other instances of baleen, the delicate straining structure of the whale’s mouth, were also found.
Vertical extent:“The 346 whales within ~1.5 km2 of surveyed surface were not buried as an event, but were distributed uninterrupted through an 80-m-thick sedimentary section.” Since they were found uniformly distributed from bottom to top of the formation, the conditions in which they were buried must have also been uniform.
Unlaminated strata:“The diatomaceous sediment lacks repeating primary laminations, but instead is mostly massive, with irregular laminations and speckles.” In other words, it was not due to a cyclic process, like the annual climate change that produces tree rings.
Lack of bioturbation: Small organisms have not altered the deposit.“There is no evidence for bioturbation by invertebrates in the whale-bearing sediment.” Apparently they didn’t have the chance, it happened so fast.
Intact diatoms:“If most diatoms dissolve before preservation in the sediment, one would find frustules in all stages of dissolution. Diatoms in the Pisco diatomaceous sediment are often broken, but SEMstudy indicated fine preservation, with no significant evidence of dissolution.… In the shallow-water Pisco Formation, the diatoms were probably buried too quickly for much dissolution to occur.” The authors point out that in contemporary diatom deposits, only 2–3% of the frustules (glass shells) usually remain undissolved, up to 24% in special cases in Antarctica."
http://crev.info/2004/02/hundreds_of_whales_b...
KJV

United States

#90428 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
Descartes did, but do you?
Is there any shred of evidence outside of the Bible for a flood that submerged the mountains under the entire heavens? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence in the diversification of the biosphere that indicates a global genetic bottleneck within the history of man? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence that all of mankind except for 4 related couples was eliminated 4,300+/- years ago? Nope.
"‘We knew it was a great find,’ said paleontologist Leonard Brand about the fossil whales he saw in Peru in 1999, 350 km (200 miles) south of Lima, the capital. Eagerly he organized a team of creationist research scientists. They recently published their findings in the secular journal Geology.1,2,3
Overall, they found 346 whales within a 1.5-km2 (370-acre) area, buried in an 80-m (260-ft) thick layer of sedimentary rock called diatomite. This layer is part of the Pisco Formation, which varies in thickness from 200–1,000 m (650–3,300 ft).

Diatomite is sedimentary rock containing a high percentage of fossil diatoms—small single-celled algae, which commonly live near the ocean surface. The layer of diatomite in Peru has 5 to 10% clay and abundant volcanic ash.

Today, when diatoms die, their silica skeletons accumulate on the ocean floor. One gram (0.035 oz.) of diatomite may contain up to 400 million skeletons.4 Diatomite sediment normally accumulates slowly—only a few centimetres per thousand years.1Even where the rate is higher, such as in some shallow-water areas, accumulation is still slow. For example, in the fjords of British Columbia, diatoms and clay accumulate at 2.5–5.0 mm (0.1–0.2 inches) per year.2

Also today, when a whale carcass sinks to the bottom of the ocean, many kinds of scavengers quickly attack and colonize it. And in their quest for food, some scavengers churn up the adjacent sediments.5

However, in Peru, the fossilized whales and diatoms were well preserved and the whale skeletons were mostly intact. There was no evidence of normal decay, such as wormholes, barnacle encrustations or general degradation. Neither was there any sign that organisms had churned up the adjacent sediment."

http://creation.mo bi/dead-whales-telling-tales
KJV

United States

#90429 May 24, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
Descartes did, but do you?
Is there any shred of evidence outside of the Bible for a flood that submerged the mountains under the entire heavens? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence in the diversification of the biosphere that indicates a global genetic bottleneck within the history of man? Nope. Is there any shred of evidence that all of mankind except for 4 related couples was eliminated 4,300+/- years ago? Nope.
http://www.grandcanyontreks.org/geology2.htm

"Inevitably, some of these visitors will turn to a park ranger and ask: "How did the Grand Canyon get formed? Why did this happen here and nowhere else?"

The honest answer is that nobody knows. One hundred and thirty-one years after John Wesley Powell first mapped the Colorado River by riding its 161 rapids in heavy wooden boats, no one can prove how the canyon was formed.

But it is not for lack of trying.

Geologists are puzzle freaks who love nothing more than collecting fragmentary clues -- clumps of gravel, fossilized shells and pollens, the dates that muddy sediments were deposited in dried-up lakes or whole mountain ranges were lifted -- and then trying desperately to figure out how the modern topography before their eyes was produced.

More.....

The modern Colorado appears to be a young river that flows out of the Rockies and hits a huge plateau, called the Kaibab Upwarp, which is 50 million to 70 million years old. Instead of being shunted away from this barrier, the river runs right through it. Moreover, when sediments from the river are examined closely, it is clear that the western end of the canyon -- where it flattens out and begins its final run to the Gulf of California -- is many millions of years younger than the eastern part of the river.

To many experts, this difference means that the Grand Canyon could have been cobbled together from ancient river basins that were created during different geologic eras. But if so, when and how were those ancient rivers formed and where did they go?
KJV

United States

#90430 May 24, 2013
woodtick57 wrote:
[QUOTE who="KJV
"]<quoted text>
Never failed,
http://www.bethlehemstar.net/
For centuries, believers, scoffers and the curious have wondered at the Biblical account of the Star of Bethlehem. The Bible recounts unusual or even impossible astronomical events at Christ’s birth. For many doubters, the account of the Star is easily dismissed as myth. For many believers, it’s a mystery accepted on faith. But what happens if we combine current scriptural accounts, astronomical fact and a desire for truth? The Star of Bethlehem documents the search to understand how the Lord used the stars and planets to reveal His plans for Christ’s birth. Uncover the mystery for yourself.
From Producer Stephen McEveety, The Passion Of The Christ
http://www.christiancinema.com/catalog/produc...
"

yet other cultures that also lived by watching the stars did not report such a star...imagine that!
The DVD is very well done and Science proves the star existed.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Weird Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Whatcha' doing? (Apr '12) 2 min Observer 8,166
News Disgraced DEA agent from Silk Road case sent we... 5 min Bit 1
"Any 3 word combination" (Dec '12) 6 min Observer 1,329
***Keep a Word~Drop a Word*** (Jan '10) 8 min Observer 78,591
motorcycle traveling stories 9 min Sublime1 65
Thinking Out Loud....Feel Free To Say What's On... 11 min Observer 27
Impossible brand and product combinations (Jan '12) 12 min wichita-rick 408
Word Association (Jun '10) 19 min wichita-rick 27,030
What song are you listening to right now? (Apr '08) 32 min Observer 159,976
Still arguing with Billy R (Oct '09) 5 hr Hitesrunprincess 543
More from around the web