Evolution vs. Creation

Full story: Best of New Orleans

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008.
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“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

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#83874
Mar 29, 2013
 
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text> You are projecting here.
I never said anything whatsoever about aliens...that's all YOUR crap.
Nor have I said anything about the construction of the pyramids yet either...more of YOUR projection.
Does this satisfy you? the figures are all the same or nearly anyway...it is common knowledge.
http://atheism.about.com/od/religiousplaces/i...
http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2012/08...

You forget the Greeks were quite advanced , Archimedes ans such thinkers who are puzzling even to this day with their inventiveness.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

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#83875
Mar 29, 2013
 
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
There is a big difference between a hypothesis and a theory.
Heck there is a big difference between a testable hypothesis and most hypotheses out there.
You have to learn to not give the hype too much credit. That is why science developed the very important and powerful tool of peer review. A group of experts in your field will try to rip your hypothesis to shreds if you ever go through that ordeal.
And so they should.

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#83876
Mar 29, 2013
 
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text> And so they should.
And yet you pay all of your attention to nonpeer reviewed science.

Whose fault is that?

“Darwin was right..of course.”

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#83877
Mar 29, 2013
 
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text> That would depend on the type of stone that was being worked. Being limestone(the "T" blocks), they could have been worked with harder stone tools.
I have reservations about every discovery being labeled as a "religious" or "sacrificial" site. That is just ridiculous. To call a 30 acre site "religious" in the midst of hunter/gatherers is insanity, don't you think?
I tend to agree. The first thing that came to my mind when I first heard of it and it was described as a temple site or religious in some way....what the hell were they thinking. But....why have humans ever built such places if not for some kind of religious purpose. I think it may be awhile before we truly understand it.

Amazing site though, and I believe we will learn about things we didn't know before. I follow them closely
Mark

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#83878
Mar 29, 2013
 
woodtick57 wrote:
<quoted text>see, mark, where you go wrong is assuming that there must be human life on earth..
if those things were not the way they are , then human life on earth just might not be here. big whoop...
see, you cant start with a false premise like humans were suppowsed to be on Earth..again, if you had really gone to university you would know this stuff...(at least a good university...)
You need to understand that I came from same persuasion and worldview as you in my youth. I was immersed in all the same origins information X10 coming from the home of a noted and nationally recognized senior biologist. I even tagged onto his field, did research, field trips and wrote papers before I was 18, and notably made predictions that came to pass, I was on my way.

The moon deal is big to me. Living in Alaska and operating boats and vessels in 20-30 ft tides is serious business. We all had the tide tables in our heads. It was a continuous battle, memorable after you bust your back for hours dragging boats over huge flats or getting locked up on a reef for hours. I thought as you that the world was an accidental given, and life was a battle of will, physics and fate. I was as tough as they come to win over it. Then I had an event, I had dodged fate one too many times and my number was up. At that moment I was given another chance by something bigger than I knew existed. For some reason I was passed over, not by my chance but by as I discovered later, by Gods Grace. Then I got it - I had been fooled, tricked and kept in the dark about the biggest truth in life; the existence of Almighty God!

My perspective radically changed, I realized that this beautiful planet and universe was made for us, and was not an accidental lab for some chance existence at some far off date. That’s the lie, to fool us into thinking we have no value, we all do. The Creator had set the moon in just the right place, made just the correct size and at just the right distance for our benefit, in the very beginning, not by chance. The soils are in wonderful quantity, the weather patterns, although extreme at times, work wonderfully, and the sun and moons position work perfectly to pull it all together. We only see a broken image of a wonderful "Very Good" earth and the life that was originally placed here. It fit, I got it and the evidence is all there. Believe in accidents all you want, the hand of God is everywhere. Another "Black Box" was opened, the final one.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

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#83879
Mar 29, 2013
 
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2012/08...
You forget the Greeks were quite advanced , Archimedes ans such thinkers who are puzzling even to this day with their inventiveness.
Yes they were. However, the Romans had great difficulty on moving obelisks weighing not much more than 300 tons, and took hundreds of years to move them up hills after sawing them off because they couldn't handle them in real life situations.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

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#83880
Mar 29, 2013
 
thewordofme wrote:
<quoted text>
I tend to agree. The first thing that came to my mind when I first heard of it and it was described as a temple site or religious in some way....what the hell were they thinking. But....why have humans ever built such places if not for some kind of religious purpose. I think it may be awhile before we truly understand it.
Amazing site though, and I believe we will learn about things we didn't know before. I follow them closely
I think you are correct. It will be interesting to find the actuality of it all.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

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#83881
Mar 29, 2013
 
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
And yet you pay all of your attention to nonpeer reviewed science.
Whose fault is that?
Projection.

“Darwin was right..of course.”

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#83882
Mar 29, 2013
 
Mark wrote:
<quoted text>
You write:
“My perspective radically changed, I realized that this beautiful planet and universe was made for us, and was not an accidental lab for some chance existence at some far off date. That’s the lie, to fool us into thinking we have no value, we all do. The Creator had set the moon in just the right place, made just the correct size and at just the right distance for our benefit, in the very beginning, not by chance. The soils are in wonderful quantity, the weather patterns, although extreme at times, work wonderfully, and the sun and moons position work perfectly to pull it all together. We only see a broken image of a wonderful "Very Good" earth and the life that was originally placed here. It fit, I got it and the evidence is all there. Believe in accidents all you want, the hand of God is everywhere. Another "Black Box" was opened, the final one.”
The earth has been here for maybe 4.8 billion years…. life has been here for maybe 3.5 billion years.

Pre-humans of various types have been around for well over a million years. Pre-humans evolved from one species to another to finally Homo-sapiens around 200,000 years ago. We share some DNA with Neanderthals showing either early mating with them or just the common ancestor. This has established a link for us to the earlier hominids.

I think humans just evolved into what was already here. We love it and thrive in it because we have grown into it over at least a million years time.

“Darwin was right..of course.”

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#83883
Mar 29, 2013
 
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text> Yes they were. However, the Romans had great difficulty on moving obelisks weighing not much more than 300 tons, and took hundreds of years to move them up hills after sawing them off because they couldn't handle them in real life situations.
And yet the Romans captured Egypt and had access to the Egyptian knowledge of moving the tremendous blocks for the pyramids. Funny that.

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#83884
Mar 29, 2013
 
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text> Projection.
Well it is nice to hear you admit this.

Now that you know what you are doing wrong there is a chance that you can start to learn.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

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#83885
Mar 29, 2013
 
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text> Yes they were. However, the Romans had great difficulty on moving obelisks weighing not much more than 300 tons, and took hundreds of years to move them up hills after sawing them off because they couldn't handle them in real life situations.
The Byzanz-Obelisk was moved in 2 weeks up hill 300 meters. The Bal Bekaa blocks were moved a short distance all down hill.
But by far the largest example was by the Russians, and it is documented.

http://www.publicartreview.com/tag/history-of...

1,250,000 kilograms 1.5 times the weight trilithon blocks.. By Empress Catherine II of Russia (1762-1796) Done without cranes or modern machines, all by hand.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

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#83886
Mar 29, 2013
 
thewordofme wrote:
<quoted text>
And yet the Romans captured Egypt and had access to the Egyptian knowledge of moving the tremendous blocks for the pyramids. Funny that.
I dunno. The largest block in the pyramids was around 15 tons, so it doesn't look like they figured out the methods at all.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

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#83887
Mar 29, 2013
 
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>The Byzanz-Obelisk was moved in 2 weeks up hill 300 meters. The Bal Bekaa blocks were moved a short distance all down hill.
But by far the largest example was by the Russians, and it is documented.
http://www.publicartreview.com/tag/history-of...
1,250,000 kilograms 1.5 times the weight trilithon blocks.. By Empress Catherine II of Russia (1762-1796) Done without cranes or modern machines, all by hand.
Ya. That's pretty amazing. And out of a swamp! On bronze ball bearings...
Mark

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#83888
Mar 29, 2013
 
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
That's because it doesn't work. If it DID work you could explain exactly who or what did the designing, when it did it, where it did it and what the heck exactly it did.
<quoted text>
Why yes, it IS irrelevant. Since life has been around FAR longer than harvesting.
Duh.
<quoted text>
Of course, that's because all your personal anecdotes render literally hundreds of thousands of peer-reviewed literature moot. Because you are THAT important.
<quoted text>
I don't care if you personally met Jesus Himself. The RATE group are liars for Jesus, period. That's why they have no scientific credibility. And that's WHY the ONE thing they got right was the part where they OPENLY ADMIT ON THEIR OWN WEBSITE that they couldn't give a frak about science.
In the meantime you're still here doing the exact same thing (lying for Jesus) and have yet to address the fact that evidence is utterly superfluous to your position. Or indeed been able to explain the "scientific theory" of creationism. In the meantime we'll surely look forward to yet another irrelevant personal anecdote as if it means a damm.
Complexity = design, design = Designer. We can go back and forth arguing weather in your opinion an eye formed itself, or the complex reaction after a photon strikes a rod to create sight utterly dashes every evolutionary pretext mathematically, stretches every element of reason into the ridiculous, and has never been, nor can be replicated is your kind of "science"? Your side asserts that time, mutations and chance produce it and a thousand other biochemical features in life (and life itself), requires faith outside of science, as mine does. You "believe" it, and always hope that in time your side will find the magic answers. The Goddoneit position makes fantastic complexity point to God. That’s His business, it's pretty amazing work, and He choose creation to be a daily reminder for us.

You don't "believe" that man was here in the beginning based on your faith in the same origins science that tells you sight is an easy accident! Very ironic to me. All early human history show that Ag was going on, not to mention the Bible.

Playing in perceptions can get you far in politics and the self-feeding world of evolutionary thought, but it will not change truth, that is my absolute. Don't you tire of calling everyone that doesn't agree with your opinions "liars" get old? And you claim you are the educated enlightened one! You will get no respect for that! In the end we are challenging each other over the strength of one faith over the other. You say no God and then call me a liar, pretty childish in my view and you don't know me.

As in Behe's book, I would recheck which "Black Box" you are in. My stories are reflective of reality and experiance, which are noticably absent amoung this group. Like flying around with siesmic gear or portable drill rigs and working with highlevel exploration geologists. No liars allowed.

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#83889
Mar 29, 2013
 
Mark, referring to Behe does not help your case at all. He was totally discredited in the Dover trial.

Mark, we also know that your stories are all lies.

Some of them are moderately entertaining. I suppose you copied those. Most of them are laughably wrong.
Mark

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#83890
Mar 29, 2013
 
thewordofme wrote:
<quoted text>
The earth has been here for maybe 4.8 billion years…. life has been here for maybe 3.5 billion years.
Pre-humans of various types have been around for well over a million years. Pre-humans evolved from one species to another to finally Homo-sapiens around 200,000 years ago. We share some DNA with Neanderthals showing either early mating with them or just the common ancestor. This has established a link for us to the earlier hominids.
I think humans just evolved into what was already here. We love it and thrive in it because we have grown into it over at least a million years time.
Thank you for your kind and respectful response.

A question to ponder, or 2;

1. If we do the math on popluation growth of humans based on known factors,- and run this out 1 mill years, there would have been more than 10X25th people who whould have lived on the earth. Most of the known universe could not hold all the bones.. A thought, when all the bones if these transitionals can fit on your living room floor.

2. Ayala was very concerned about genetic load,(posters her are stating 120+ per generation), that in 200 generations (10K y)the human race would be done for. His words, not mine.

“Universal Conscious Conscience”

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#83891
Mar 29, 2013
 
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
Just as the astronomical planet concept is fixed.
Sorry, I mean was.
No, the laws that govern this astronomical planet is fixed. Meaning any concept or idea that refutes it is wrong. I will explain why this is so. There is something the scientific method does not cover that the scientific researcer or scientist must comply to when searching for other un-discovered scientific laws.

“Darwin was right..of course.”

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#83892
Mar 29, 2013
 
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> Was there a flood or not?
The answer is, there was flood and the bible said so.
The issue is, whether it was global or regional.
To me, i believe the people then thought it was global, this does not mean that the bible is in error.
The magnitude of the flood led to that conclusion.
But, we have that pesky Bible saying that the flood was world-wide and we have all those little details about the animals and floating around for nearly a year and landing on a 14,000+- foot high mountain.

And of course there is the DNA that totally does not support the story.

And then there is all that archaeology work over the last hundred years, on thousands and thousands of prehistoric sites, not supporting the story at all

Then we have the fact that world-wide...geology and geologists say there is no real evidence for a world-wide flood at any time.

I think we can safely say the Biblical story of the Noachian flood is just a parable....no truth to it at all

“Darwin was right..of course.”

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#83893
Mar 29, 2013
 

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Mark wrote:
<quoted text>
Thank you for your kind and respectful response.
A question to ponder, or 2;
1. If we do the math on popluation growth of humans based on known factors,- and run this out 1 mill years, there would have been more than 10X25th people who whould have lived on the earth. Most of the known universe could not hold all the bones.. A thought, when all the bones if these transitionals can fit on your living room floor.
2. Ayala was very concerned about genetic load,(posters her are stating 120+ per generation), that in 200 generations (10K y)the human race would be done for. His words, not mine.
Hey Mark, thanks for the response.

Despite what you say about known factors in human population growth I believe some archaeologists and paleoanthropologists have done some work on this and come to the conclusion that this kind of growth would be impossible.

World-wide population at around 10,000 BC has been put at 1 to 3 million depending on what scientist you listen to. And Homo-sapiens has been roaming the earth for 200,000 years....that's not spectacular growth in my opinion.

Think about medical care for women and infant mortality rates up until about 1940 to 1950. It was horrendous and birth rates were historically low. Anthropologists have said that ancient humans were hard pressed to replace themselves (two surviving children)

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