Evolution vs. Creation

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008. Full Story

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#61167 Nov 26, 2012
Don't you love how Maz points out that if this were a well moderated debate that others would be in trouble when she is one of the biggest offenders here?
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#61168 Nov 26, 2012
MazHere wrote:
This researcher is actually concerned about saving lives.
What an ironic thing for an AIDS denier to say...

No, AT BEST he's concerned about saving souls. Specifically his own, so by "saving" others that will surely ensures his goes to eternal paradise.
MazHere wrote:
You quack quack about dna. Where were you when I was disussing the myth of 1%, junk dna, and the chasing of erv ghosts?
Where were you?(shrug)
MazHere wrote:
What evidence in DNA are you talking about? Do you even understand what assumptions underlie genetic distancing in relation to deep ancestries? I doubt it.
Yup. It's called young Earth apologetics. In other words, make up any old shite even if it's contradictory and hope no-one will notice.

Well don't worry, none of the creationists around here noticed.

That's because they're all uneducated and have no intellectual honesty to speak of. You must be proud.
MazHere wrote:
I suppose you think researchers head for creationism just to purposely destroy their careers for no reason.
Nah, they do it to feel like Jesus and feed their massive martyr complex. Then they realise that touring the evangelical church circuit and writing books on apologetics is more profitable.

Behe figured this out in 2006. Hence his lack of "creation science" since he got trounced in court.
MazHere wrote:
One does not have to be a creo to have faith in God.
If you wofflers want to try to maintain that creos have NO support for their pardigm then you should be able to demonstrate for yourself and articulate what new research into epitasis does not support Sanford. Sanford provides some algorithmic magic just like evos can.
We don't provide magic. That's what creationism is for. We merely point out that reality is different to creationist claims. Or God is a liar, like Bobby the Frenchman admitted yesterday.
MazHere wrote:
You should also be able to demonstrate how the reseachers that suggest that non coding dna is functional are idiots and wrong, because validation of predictions is a creationist supoport that evos are either too stupid to understand or too proud and ignorant to accept.
Except you're just too ignorant and proud to accept the fact that not only have you contradicted yourself (again) but this has already been addressed. Multiple time.

“That's just MY opinion...”

Since: Jan 07

Location hidden

#61170 Nov 26, 2012
MazHere wrote:
I suppose you aren't bright enough to understand that the research into junk dna being at least 80% functional has been peer reviewed...
You obviously are unfamiliar with the work or are too stupid to understand it.

Since: Sep 12

United States

#61171 Nov 26, 2012
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>Then you are wise. Many creationists on here do not realise they are at least as guilty of sin as gays are.
The church is guilty of many many sins. Every man is right in his own eyes. This is why I don't tell people to listen to me or believe as I do or you'll be condemned to hell. Read the bible and find truth. If you read it and can't find truth than stop reading it. The words of Christ were good even if you don't believe in God he taught a good lesson we can all learn from.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#61172 Nov 26, 2012
Bat Foy wrote:
A lot of very smart people believe in God.
Yeah, like Ken Miller, Francis Collins, Lord Robert Winston...

Maz claims they're all evil evolutionist atheists and part of the anti-Christian conspiracy to destroy God.

“I Am No One Else”

Level 7

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#61173 Nov 26, 2012
Constitution-lover wrote:
<quoted text>
I love life. I love everyday God has gave me. I just look forward to eternity in heaven with God. You only live for this life and ignore that you will burn in hell for eternity if you dont turn your heart to God. I feel sad for you. Imagine hell.......Now why would you want to go there when excepting God would save you from that. I mean you lsoe nothing by taking God into your heart and lose all if you dont. SEEMS SIMPLE TO ME.
No, you hate this life so much you expect a second one, worse, you expect to live forever. If your life is so meaningless that what you do here has no importance to you, why do you bother?
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#61174 Nov 26, 2012
Bat Foy wrote:
The bible says nothing about dinosaurs but it also says nothing about cell phones and cars.
Careful, there's a fundie around here called Wolvie who thinks the Bible was referring to helicopters when it talked of giant mosquitos or dragonflys or something. Wolvie also shot Bigfoot.

“I Am No One Else”

Level 7

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#61175 Nov 26, 2012
Constitution-lover wrote:
To all you non-believers I say that is your choice. I wont cendem you or call you names or say bad things about you. I ony ask this....WHAT IF YOUR WORNG? Imagine if God is real and you dont follow him and you do end up in the hell of the Bible??? How is living a good life and being good and believeing in God gonna hurt your daily life?
What if you're wrong? Zeus sounds way more scary than your god, imagine if he's the real one? What if you're wrong and Cthulhu is the real god, then we're all screwed either way. What if you're wrong?

Works both ways.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#61176 Nov 26, 2012
First of all Dude was way out of line when he compared you to Jenny McCarthy. Obviously you are not the beginnings of a pimple on Jenny's cute little hiny. In spite of her wacko views Jenny has brought lots of attention and even more money to real autism research.
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you now that on a properly moderated debating forum attacking one example that detracts from the point made would usually send you packing by forum members.

Do you know your unsupported rants, lack of evidence, lack of coherent points, outright lies and derogatory attitude would send you packing even faster?
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text> The allegation was that there was more merit to TOE than creationism becsause TOE has made medical advances. I stated that the science of observation in the here and now has absolutely nothing to do with aides research. If there was no connection between chimp and man the current treatments would have still been invented.

Many of the treatments are tested on chimps due to their high genetic and evolutionary relationship to humans. Game,set,match.
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text> The example of the aides deniers was and still an example of exactly what I claimed it to be, which is an example of some scientists, that are not creationists, suggesting that evolutionary assumptions around retrovirus are in error and confounding rtheir attempts to progress the treatment.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/15/us-...

First of all look here.
http://www.trinitysem.edu/Student/LessonInstr...

Second, the reason most often cited for why an effective HIV vaccination has not been found is because the virus EVOLVES TOO FAST!
Look it up. So it is not the Theory of Evolution that is responsible for ineffective treatment ... it is EVOLUTION ITSELF!
http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary/arti...
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text> That example, does not detract from the substance of my post which challenges TOE being responsible for medical treatment.

Blah, blah, blah, luv. This is an assertion.


What is it about creos that they are so desperate and lacking as to want to drag the discussion down any path of evasion they can clutch at?


The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#61178 Nov 26, 2012
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you now that on a properly moderated debating forum attacking one example that detracts from the point made would usually send you packing by forum members.
That's nice. If that were the case you would have been sent packing weeks ago.(shrug)

By the way, there was no anti-evolution or Jewmagic in there. And anti-evolution religious apologetics STILL does not demonstrate the validity of any "scientific theory" of creationism.

Which from what you've said so far is "Energy makes matter therefore GODDIDIT WITH MAGIC!"

“happy to be horny”

Level 2

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#61179 Nov 26, 2012
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
The Bible is inaccurate. There was no global flood, humanity did not start with two humans 6,000 years ago, the Earth is not a flat square circle, and lizards, donkeys and bushes do not talk. The Bible is accurate in some places, inaccurate in others. It is therefore the product of local ignorant goat-herders who knew little of the world outside their own country, and not the "Word of God".
As spokesperson for the local ignorant goatherders union, can I just say......... sorry for all the confusion, it was just a bit of fun and we didn't think anyone would actually believe it let alone base a religion around it...goatherding isn't all it's cracked up to be, believe it or not but, it can get a wee bit boring now and then and it's not like the fellas are averse to having a drink or two or three and well.......let's just say things got out of hand.........our apologies again

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#61181 Nov 26, 2012
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
Careful, there's a fundie around here called Wolvie who thinks the Bible was referring to helicopters when it talked of giant mosquitos or dragonflys or something. Wolvie also shot Bigfoot.

To be fair, Wolvie says he shot AT Bigfoot...... or something like that.

Since: Sep 12

United States

#61182 Nov 26, 2012
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>No they don't. That's why it's called FAITH. If they had first hand knowledge of God it would simply be called KNOWLEDGE.

Fact of the matter is that no-one on Earth knows jack about God any more than anyone else does. And that's assuming that such an entity exists in the first place.

Bat Foy wrote, "Where people of science have faith in some real "smart" guy had an idea ok an educated guess but its still a guess."

And then those guesses are tested via the scientific method. When they start making successful predictions they become more than mere "guesses" and are the formation of a valid scientific theory. Kinda like gravity.

Bat Foy wrote, "When the bottom line is creos are waiting for the evos to just say "I really don't know how it all came about" and lets face it evos have an idea but they do not know. It is your faith in the collective knowledge of people smarter than you coming up with a claim they know but they really don't know either. No one knows the real process of the beginning. You think it is evolution and you guys think a lot."

No, evolution is not the beginning, not by a LONG shot. Evolution occurs only when there is life. Which has only been around these parts for 8-9 billion years AFTER the beginning of the universe.

But yes, we think a lot. Thinking is a GOOD thing. Thinking was banned by God, at least if one takes the Genesis story literally. Some are daft enough to do just that.

Bat Foy wrote, " Come off your pride and vanity accept that no one alive knows where it all started and accept the what if their was a creator."

Science accepts the "what if". It's just there is simply no scientific evidence for it yet. It is pride and vanity which causes ardent theists to demand people take their baseless claims seriously, despite the fact they are in no position at all to make such claims.
Ok lets go there most people have never see 100 million dollars so it isn't real? How many prayers have to be answered in order for God to be real to you? Prove to me their is no God. For that matter prove to me no tooth fairy. Is this beyond your power? Most people will never stand on the moon is it there or is it fake?

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#61183 Nov 26, 2012
Constitution-lover wrote:
To all you non-believers I say that is your choice. I wont cendem you or call you names or say bad things about you. I ony ask this....WHAT IF YOUR WORNG? Imagine if God is real and you dont follow him and you do end up in the hell of the Bible??? How is living a good life and being good and believeing in God gonna hurt your daily life?
And what if you are wrong, or as you so aptly put it "WORNG"?

What if the real god is Allah, or Zeus, or best of all the Flying Spaghetti Monster? What is your evidence that beats these other religions? They all have holy books too. All of their books say that their god is real and others are not, well the Greeks did throw in a few extra gods, but yours was not included.

All religions say they are right and that the others are wrong. How do you pick one over the other? What if the only thing that religions get right is that all of the other religions are wrong?

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#61184 Nov 26, 2012
Constitution-lover wrote:
<quoted text>
My life is full I have made a good living and raised 4 great kids and taken many trips and seen many greta things. I also look forward to life after this one...All you in your mind have is this life and that is sad. Oh and yes what we DO here is not important really. As long as we worship and believe in God we will have all of eternity in heaven. Life here is short 100 years at most....ETERNITY IS BILLIONS OF TRILLIONS OF YEARS TIMES A TRILLION.

Again, this is an assertion. You have not backed anything up with evidence.

Claiming assertions are facts is dishonest. At least that is what I assert.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#61186 Nov 26, 2012
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
Dude, if you do not have anything intelligent to say the logical thing to do is keep quite!
Keep quite what?

And whose "aides" where you talking about by the way?
MazHere wrote:
Either you can mount an appropraitely supported and articulated refute or you can offer woffle. The latter you have provided demonstrates you are an empty waste of space on a debating forum.
Really now. Because you've avoided the posts where I made valid posts and responded to a generic post instead only to engage me with ad-hom. In the meantime I have successfully demonstrated that the vast majority of your posts require dishonest behaviour on your part and are replete with quite flagrant contradictions because of this. Aside from the monumentally massive fundamentalist ego fueling your pride and quite possibly being the greatest source of mass for planet Earth itself it has caused you to overlook those "minor" problems, most likely because it's all easily fixed with a liberal application of Jewmagic anyway.(shrug)

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#61187 Nov 26, 2012
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
Dude, if you do not have anything intelligent to say the logical thing to do is keep quite!
Either you can mount an appropraitely supported and articulated refute or you can offer woffle. The latter you have provided demonstrates you are an empty waste of space on a debating forum.

Translation: Dude owns me and I cannot put forth a reasoned argument in response to his post.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#61188 Nov 26, 2012
Constitution-lover wrote:
To all you non-believers I say that is your choice. I wont cendem you or call you names or say bad things about you. I ony ask this....WHAT IF YOUR WORNG? Imagine if God is real and you dont follow him and you do end up in the hell of the Bible??? How is living a good life and being good and believeing in God gonna hurt your daily life?
It's probably not.(shrug)

How is living a good life and believing in Zeus gonna hurt your daily life?

It's probably not either.

As for our eternal souls, people here have already pointed out the error of Pascal's wager, that your particular god is only one of THOUSANDS invoked by humanity over the millenia. Each being just as viable as each other so far as can be objectively determined. And each will tell you to "open your heart", but as we've already pointed out this only leads to imminent body-death.

However us "mean old Darwinists" aren't here to poopoo your god. There's the atheism forum for that. Us mean old Darwinists are here to correct the lies spewed by hell-bound liars for Jesus such as MazHere and Bohart, etc.

Maybe there is a God.

But if there is, it's unlikely to be anything like the petty imaginations offered up by anybody here.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#61189 Nov 26, 2012
Bat Foy wrote:
<quoted text>
The church is guilty of many many sins. Every man is right in his own eyes. This is why I don't tell people to listen to me or believe as I do or you'll be condemned to hell. Read the bible and find truth. If you read it and can't find truth than stop reading it. The words of Christ were good even if you don't believe in God he taught a good lesson we can all learn from.
There are some good parts in there, I agree. It's fundamentalist (semi) literalism which is dangerous. Which is why some parts of the Middle East is how it is. That's what Maz wants for him and his children - the right and power to say the Almighty agrees with him. And woe betide any who disagree...

“I Am No One Else”

Level 7

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#61190 Nov 26, 2012
Constitution-lover wrote:
<quoted text>
My life is full I have made a good living and raised 4 great kids and taken many trips and seen many greta things. I also look forward to life after this one...All you in your mind have is this life and that is sad. Oh and yes what we DO here is not important really. As long as we worship and believe in God we will have all of eternity in heaven. Life here is short 100 years at most....ETERNITY IS BILLIONS OF TRILLIONS OF YEARS TIMES A TRILLION.
Yet when you die, you will be forgotten, that's what frightens you. So you need something else to give you a purpose, no matter how much of a lie it is, no matter how shallow and weak that "purpose" is.

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