Why should Australians fear from Musl...

Why should Australians fear from Muslims?

There are 46739 comments on the Scoop story from Dec 23, 2007, titled Why should Australians fear from Muslims?. In it, Scoop reports that:

About 800 people gathered in Camden, NSW and raised their voice against the plan for an Islamic School to be built in the area.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Scoop.

Jake Bradock

Robina, Australia

#36732 Feb 5, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Ans.
Omitting Obiter Dicta from your post, here is my response to your observations:
01. If the definition of success is what you mentioned, then Islam and Muslims do have that success.
We do Righteous Worship of a True Loving God and have tolerance for all religions and their religious personalities. I do not see any Muslim using foul and insulting language for Moses, jesus, Rama and Krishna, Buddha etc.
But I see followers of these religions using foul language and insulting our Prophet, our religious scriptures and our ways of living.
So you fail in your own definition of success!!
02. If you think that success is the increase in Worldly Power and High standard of living, then what would you say about the "First three centuries of Christianity"?
a. Was Christianity a "failure" in those three centuries? When Christians were a persecuted lot, having no power and no authority. And then what about Jesus' own time. Was he a failure and success?
b. And then what about dark ages of Medieval Europe? Was Christianity a success then?
c. And do you think the increase in science and technology and wealth of Modern White people is because they follow Christianity?
d. You are deluded, because the rise of White People started when the "Left" Christianity and started following "Reason and Logic"
e. Now these Christian nations are "pitching" for Homosexuality, Free Sex, gambling, Pornography and every type of sexual perversion.
Just go back to your Scriptures and find out what is the meaning of success.
02. If you think that success is the increase in Worldly Power and High standard of living, then what would you say about the "First three centuries of Christianity"?

ANS- In the 1st three centuries of Christianity it was but a seedling growing in a world darkness , the fact it rose in such dark times is testermont to its success.

a. Was Christianity a "failure" in those three centuries? When Christians were a persecuted lot, having no power and no authority. And then what about Jesus' own time. Was he a failure and success?

ANS- Yes, the fact that Christianity grew in its love of all mankind dispite the worlds persacution against it is proff of its success.

b. And then what about dark ages of Medieval Europe? Was Christianity a success then?

ANS- Yes, as I said tha fact that such a loving religion still grew in such unchristian dark times is proof of gods eternal love and persistance and the success of Christianity.

c. And do you think the increase in science and technology and wealth of Modern White people is because they follow Christianity?

ANS- the fact that Christianity exists in secutar government nations yet gets slaughtered in islamic governed nations is a sign of its success . and islams failure to accept the teachings Of Jesus`s faith.

d. You are deluded, because the rise of White People started when the "Left" Christianity and started following "Reason and Logic"

ANS- white people didnt forsake christianity because it exists as the largest faith in white nations, its only persacuted in the intollerent islamic lands.

e. Now these Christian nations are "pitching" for Homosexuality, Free Sex, gambling, Pornography and every type of sexual perversion.

ANS- No they dont , Christians resist the acceptance of those sins but as they walk in the foot steps of all mighty Jesus they dont persacute or harm those who walk in sin, they pray and love thy enemys in the hope that god will turn there hearts away from sin and walk in rightousness.
You muslims simply kill them.

` he who is without sin cast the first stone` you muslims constantly throw stones and condem thoughs you think walk in sin yet commit the worse sins yourselves as hypocrits.
This is why god dosen`t give you the right to judge others as you are unworthy sinners yourselves.

Just go back to your Scriptures and find out what is the meaning of success

Ans- practise what you preach
Jake Bradock

Robina, Australia

#36733 Feb 5, 2013
This is what happens to a Christian in islamic lands who dosen`t turn from his lord and saviour Jesus Christ, You`ll notice no where around the world will you find a Christian killing a muslim for not turning from his faith.....or lack of it.

Christian man mortally wounded in Baluchistan for refusing to convert to Islam
by Jibran Khan
Younas Masih, 55, died this afternoon after days in agony. Last Thursday, a gunman shot him five times as he made his way home from work. Recently, his co-workers had tried to force him to embrace Islam. Police has refused so far to open an investigation into his murder.

Islamabad (AsiaNews)- Younas Masih died this afternoon after he was shot five times last Thursday as he made his way home. An unknown gunman fired at the 55-year-old Christian man. From the beginning, his conditions appeared critical. It is believed he was attacked after he resisted pressures from co-workers to convert to Islam.

Masih worked for a company in Chaman. His friends describe him as honest and reliable. Strong in his Christian faith, he was regularly involved in his local parish.

Speaking anonymously, local sources told AsiaNews that Muslim co-workers had began pressuring him to convert, which he rejected, standing firm in his beliefs in Christ.

Sheilaa

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#36735 Feb 5, 2013
Roxon defeated by the free speech she tried to gag


Andrew Bolt
February 06 2013 (11:35am)

Free speech

Janet Albrechtsen gives Nicola Roxon the sendoff she deserves:

Not only did Nicola Roxon prove to be Australia’s most radical attorney-general with draft anti-discrimination laws that sought to render illegal opinions that were offensive and insulting. But her reluctant decision to scrap these provisions after a community backlash provides the perfect lesson in the power of ideas.

Indeed, Roxon’s humiliating backdown should be a textbook example of why free speech matters: her decision to pursue “other options” proves what can happen when ideas and opinions are thrashed around freely and robustly. Dumb ideas tend to get exposed as dumb. And sensible ideas are allowed to flourish.

Importantly, demolishing silly ideas such as Roxon’s nanny-state vision to render offensive opinions illegal can happen only when the machinery of free speech is kept clean of the grit and grime of politically correct laws that would otherwise inhibit the free flow of ideas.

That’s why free speech sits at the heart of liberty. Not just because we like the freedom to say whatever we want, though that is surely part of living in a healthy liberal democracy. No, the best reason to staunchly defend free speech is because it is the true gem of Western civilisation. Without it, other freedoms will not last for long.

Albrechtsen gives much credit where it is due - which, significantly, does not include the state-funded broadcaster or Fairfax, once so keen to denounce John Howard as an enemy of free speech:

Take a bow, too, the staff, headed by John Roskam, at the Institute of Public Affairs and the IPA’s paying members who ran Freedomwatch - a campaign that garnered rational, passionate, liberty-based arguments against Roxon’s bill…

[But] there was a disappointing lack of curiosity among many journalists at our national broadcaster. Who can recall a senior ABC journalist discussing in any detail the serious ramifications of Roxon’s bill?... Curiously, the day Roxon was in Sydney to promote her anti-discrimination bill, she appeared on the ABC’s premier political program 7.30. Yet host Leigh Sales devoted every question to the royal commission into child abuse. Free speech didn’t get a look-in.

Simon Breheny of the IPA’s Freedomwatch explains why Roxon’s backdown on some parts of her dangerous blueprint still leaves far too much that will muzzle debate:

The options paper makes a number of suggestions for words that could replace “offends” and “insults” in the definition of discrimination. These include words just as ambiguous as those already in the draft Bill:“degrade,”“denigrate,”“hu miliate” and “intimidate.” This option is a farce and should be rejected…

The idea that minor amendments can save the draft Bill is becoming a very bad joke. The reality is that this proposal is fundamentally flawed. As I explained last week, the draft Bill simply cannot be cured. None of the options presented by the Attorney-General’s Department would restore the reversed burden of proof under the draft Bill, fix the costs structure that would encourage frivolous litigation or overcome the fact that this draft Bill threatens, rather than protects, human rights. Mark Dreyfus should take advantage of the opportunity he has been presented with as the new Attorney-General and abandon the anti-discrimination consolidation project altogether.

Mark Steyn put the case for free speech - and against Roxonism - brilliantly in a defence of me for which I will be forever grateful:

Go Australia. Go free speech!!!!!!!!!!
MUQ

Qatif, Saudi Arabia

#36736 Feb 5, 2013
Jimmyom wrote:
Everyone should fear of Muslims because these religious hungry to kill fanatics only dreaming about killing people whom they call the infidels, not because they really need to do this, but because Islam says so.
Muslims are plague of our century. The biggest part of crimes, in Europe for instance, is committed by muslims. Media is quite about the facts, because governments still support tolerance and multiculturalism, and both as we all know failed.
Tell you story of my own. I had a muslim neighbor and he seemed to be a good guy, but one day a police officer called me to give him all I know about the guy. I told the police that he many times organized meetings at his place with other members of muslim community and some other details. It turned out that a 'good' guy and his kinsmen were planning terrorist attacks in a number of European countries. And now they are rotting in prisons.
Don't trust these filthy muslim animals. They are just two-faced bastards and that's one of the reasons why everyone should be afraid of them. Stay cautious.
How pleased would Hitler be to get your services for the GUSTAPO?

Like twin brothers you two, he also spoke these "pleasing words" about all Jews.

And you are repeating the same about all Muslims, depending upon you puny little experience.

So many rapists and serial killers and mass murderers were looked upon their neighbors as "nice and simple men"...

So no one should trust their neighbors because they are nice and simple?

How idiotic you people look when you speak like this!!

Sheilaa

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#36737 Feb 5, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
How pleased would Hitler be to get your services for the GUSTAPO?
Like twin brothers you two, he also spoke these "pleasing words" about all Jews.
And you are repeating the same about all Muslims, depending upon you puny little experience.
So many rapists and serial killers and mass murderers were looked upon their neighbors as "nice and simple men"...
So no one should trust their neighbors because they are nice and simple?
How idiotic you people look when you speak like this!!
Why would Hitler need them when he so many Muslims to do his dirty work. All provided by The Grand Mufti of Egypt who was so far up Hitler's ass he spoke through Hitler's mouth

Sheilaa

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#36738 Feb 5, 2013
*had
MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#36739 Feb 5, 2013
Sheilaa wrote:
<quoted text>
Why would Hitler need them when he so many Muslims to do his dirty work. All provided by The Grand Mufti of Egypt who was so far up Hitler's ass he spoke through Hitler's mouth
If he needed a Nurse, he could always have hired you as his twin sister!!

But he would have to set you on Muslims and not Jews!!

Ha, Ha , Ha.

Sheilaa

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#36740 Feb 5, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
If he needed a Nurse, he could always have hired you as his twin sister!!
But he would have to set you on Muslims and not Jews!!
Ha, Ha , Ha.
Funny that you laugh at your own jokes, no one else does. In relation to hiring people he was not interested in saving lives so he wouldn't have needed a nurse. The fact is that I wasn't even born at that time. He just needed Muslims who were adept at killing people and that is what the Mufti offered him and what he got. A lean mean killing machine.
SandCastle

Telopea, Australia

#36742 Feb 5, 2013
Sheilaa wrote:
<quoted text>
Why would Hitler need them when he so many Muslims to do his dirty work. All provided by The Grand Mufti of Egypt who was so far up Hitler's ass he spoke through Hitler's mouth
Muslims often omit such a thing. It somewhat weakens the shame inducing nazi rhetoric they spew when we protest against islamic intolerance demonstrated in our lands and afar.

It is humorous no doubt seeing MUQs consistent attempt to demonstrate our western intolerance when it is muslims who are pouring into this country and it is muslims who still live and breathe the social hierarchy that Hitler implemented in their own lands.

Yet... we with our fair equality laws are the evildoers. My goodness.
MUQ

Qatif, Saudi Arabia

#36743 Feb 6, 2013
Sheilaa wrote:
<quoted text>
Funny that you laugh at your own jokes, no one else does. In relation to hiring people he was not interested in saving lives so he wouldn't have needed a nurse. The fact is that I wasn't even born at that time. He just needed Muslims who were adept at killing people and that is what the Mufti offered him and what he got. A lean mean killing machine.
Are you capable of laughing? I doubt it, some one with so much hate and hatred stored in her bosom, where would be the place of laugh?

When any thought of laughing will come, immediately the super thought of so many murders, rapes, kidnapping, suicide bombers....would take that laugh off the face.

For some people the life is real tough.....and that includes hate and hatred mongers like yourself.

You should try to laugh once in a while, even if it is sneering , or a hypocritic smile.

“Free Speech in a Free World ”

Since: May 10

May the Force be with You .

#36744 Feb 6, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you capable of laughing? I doubt it, some one with so much hate and hatred stored in her bosom, where would be the place of laugh?
When any thought of laughing will come, immediately the super thought of so many murders, rapes, kidnapping, suicide bombers....would take that laugh off the face.
For some people the life is real tough.....and that includes hate and hatred mongers like yourself.
You should try to laugh once in a while, even if it is sneering , or a hypocritic smile.
What the Grand Mufti did,was it the right thing to do ?
MalbarCACA Controller

Luton, UK

#36745 Feb 6, 2013
Neville Thompson wrote:
<quoted text>
What the Grand Mufti did,was it the right thing to do ?
What thing?

“Free Speech in a Free World ”

Since: May 10

May the Force be with You .

#36746 Feb 6, 2013
MalbarCACA Controller wrote:
<quoted text>
What thing?
That "THING" !
Moon god doesnt care 4u

Sydney, Australia

#36748 Feb 6, 2013
MUQ wrote:
Rejoinder on the Mo’taliza Post:
I do not know what is your purpose of presenting this post on Mo’taliza?
There have been many attempts to “modernize Islam and bring it closer to the Ongoing Philosophy being popular in the world at that time”, but they all failed.
Islam has retained its shape and beliefs as it was when the Prophet of Allah and his companions
left it.
You made such a longish post for something which is only to be found in the history books. And from Islamic books mind you, not from an
y Non Muslims books.
If Muslim Scholars had not written extensively about them, no one would even have remembered their names.
These Mo’taliza claimed that they are “reasonable” people and always talk with reason and logic. But when they failed to “prove” that Quran was a Created thing, they resorted to use
of “Brute Force”.
What force they used on Imam Ahmad bin Hanbal to get a confession of faith that “Quran
was a created thing” led to their collapse and rejection by the majority of people and they were thrown in the dump yard of history.
Similar attempts were made to “make a patch
between Islam and Socialism and Islam and Communism” and Islam and so many isms that are floating in the world.
But there can never be any mixing between truth
and falsehood. Islam and Quran and sayings of Prophet can never mix with any falsehood and they stand separated.
That is why Islam is today what it was 1400 years back.
Just look at Christianity, one person (St. Paul) single handedly demolished the teachings of Jesus Christ and substituted his own reason and logic in its place…. And there is no one in
Christianity to undo his handiwork and restore the True Teachings of Jesus!!
That is difference between Islam and other religion. There is no place for St. Paul in Islam.
All deviant groups tried to become St. Paul but they were always rejected by majority of Muslims.
They can only exist on margins (Like Shia and Ismaeli etc.) and confuse people with their double talk.
Allah Knows Best
Been away. Clearly that rattled you and createe serious doubt about the apostasy you preach.
I know more about Islam and it's confection than you ever will. You argument is shallow and evident in its flaw. As you subliminally admit:
"That is why Islam is today what it was 1400 years back".
Exactly. Re read the post and explain why Islam given the chance to evolve and align itself to human and social needs, still remains trapped in a 7th century Pre feudal Arabic belief system that can not incorporate logic or love.
Your idols are as distant & uncaring and without humanity as the moon. An Allah that does not connect with humanity. So you worship the man image of a false prophet and pray to objects.
Unreformed and unredeemable, any Muslim that knew better but conciously choses to continue to worship false gods and false prophets commits a
sin. You know this, it is why Islam is neurotic and aggressive rather than relaxed and confident of it's purity and logic like true religions.
MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#36749 Feb 6, 2013
Neville Thompson wrote:
<quoted text>
What the Grand Mufti did,was it the right thing to do ?
I do not know what Grand Mufti did or did not do.

I am not answering questions about any individual.

Grand Mufti is not what Islam is. He is not like Pope of Christians. These are human given names.

Talk to me about what are Islamic teachings on any issue and then judge who was right and who was not.

Since in Christianity you have no rules, so you have to look at their actions and comment.

What "little rules" they have like "Turn the other cheek" and "Love your enemies".... I do not see any Christian nation practicing it in past 2000 years, not a single one.

But every Christian would be jumping and pointing "Look at our Jesus, he was Prince of peace".

Well, he might have been, but what benefit will you get if you do not follow his path?
MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#36750 Feb 6, 2013
My Journey from Christianity to Islam – By Capt.(R ) M.A. Ondigo- Part-

Jesus Did not die on the Cross:

Going thru the Gospels and Quran, I found that it is not historically acceptable to say that Jesus Christ willingly gave himself to die on the cross for sins of humankind. There are numerous passages in the Bible to the contrary. In fact when we read the Bible, we came to the conclusion that Jesus was not ready to die for anybody’s sins.

The following are just a few of those passages indicating that Jesus never at any time wanted to die:

1. Jesus was Reluctant to die (Matthew 26:50-51)

2. Jesus beseeched God for help (Matt. 26:36-39)

3. God Heard the prayers of Jesus (Matt. 7:7-11)

4. An angel of God was sent to strengthen Jesus ((Luke 22:43)

5. Pilate Finds Jesus not guilty of the Charges against him (Matt. 27:22-25 and Luke 23:13-15)

6. Jesus was supposedly on the Cross for only three hours (Matt. 27:45-46)

7. Two of Jesus’‘cross-mates’ were alive (John 19:32-33)

8. Forthwith came out blood and water (John 19:33-38)

9. Thunderstorm, earthquake and darkening of sun (Matt. 28:1-4)

10. The Jews doubted whether Jesus was dead (Matt. 27:62-64)

11. Pilate marvels to hear that Jesus is dead (Mark 15:44-46)

12. Stone and Winding sheets had to be removed (Matt. 28:1-4 and Luke 24:1-5)

13. The Disciples were petrified upon seeing Jesus alive (Mark 14:44-50 and Luke 24:36-43)

14. The Miracle of Jesus was like that of Jonah (Matt.12:38-41)

These verses and many make a serious doubt what exactly happened on the mount of Calvary. There was no single eyewitness who could recount the entire episode. The bits and pieces which Gospel writers have provided for us, make an confused account.

While Quran’s view that Jesus did not die on cross and was not killed by his enemies and those who say so are full of doubt and confusion, they have no real knowledge but only speak with conjecture … is the most accurate and authentic rendering of the whole episode!!

Then when we look at the statements of Jesus as recorded in Gospels, there is no mention at all about his dieing for the sins of humanity. Let us see the following statement:

“And behold, one came and said to him “Good Master, what good things shall I do, that I may have eternal life? And he said “Why you call me good? There is none good but one, that is God, but if you will enter into life, keep the commandments (Matt. 19:16-17)

In this answer, Jesus said nothing about the redeeming power of his blood.

In my quest for the truth I found that Islam completely and strongly rejected the dogma of blood atonement for salvation….

Allah says “No bearer of burden can bear the burden of another..”(53:38-40)

Islam’s scheme of salvation to be attained in the hereafter is based on:

a. The Grace of God

b. True and Sincere faith in God and not mere lip service faith.

c. Good works that are the fruits of sincere faith.

d. Repentance of the committed sins, major or minor before one dies.

There are many very clear verses and Quran and sayings of Prophet Mohammad recorded in the most authentic books of Hadith verifying these.

(Abridged)

IIPH, Riyadh Saudi Arabia
www.iiph.com.sa
Jake Bradock

Robina, Australia

#36751 Feb 6, 2013
Lets teach MUQ about his own religion, this is why your not trusted MUQ
Are Muslims permitted to lie?
Summary Answer:
Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences."
There are two forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted under certain circumstances, taqiyya and kitman. These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them.
The Qur'an:
Qur'an (16:106)- Establishes that there are circumstances that can "compel" a Muslim to tell a lie.
Qur'an (3:28)- This verse tells Muslims not to take those outside the faith as friends, unless it is to "guard themselves."
Qur'an (9:3)- "...Allah and His Messenger are free from liability to the idolaters..." The dissolution of oaths with the pagans who remained at Mecca following its capture. They did nothing wrong, but were evicted anyway.
Qur'an (40:28)- A man is introduced as a believer, but one who must "hide his faith" among those who are not believers.
Qur'an (2:225)- "Allah will not call you to account for thoughtlessness in your oaths, but for the intention in your hearts" The context of this remark is marriage, which explains why Sharia allows spouses to lie to each other for the greater good.
Qur'an (66:2)- "Allah has already ordained for you,(O men), the dissolution of your oaths"
Qur'an (3:54)- "And they (the disbelievers) schemed, and Allah schemed (against them): and Allah is the best of schemers." The Arabic word used here for scheme (or plot) is makara, which literally means deceit. If Allah is deceitful toward unbelievers, then there is little basis for denying that Muslims are allowed to do the same.(See also 8:30 and 10:21)
Taken collectively these verses are interpreted to mean that there are circumstances when a Muslim may be "compelled" to deceive others for a greater purpose.
From the Hadith:
Bukhari (52:269)- "The Prophet said,'War is deceit.'" The context of this is thought to be the murder of Usayr ibn Zarim and his thirty unarmed men by Muhammad's men after he "guaranteed" them safe passage (see Additional Notes below).
Bukhari (49:857)- "He who makes peace between the people by inventing good information or saying good things, is not a liar." Lying is permitted when the end justifies the means.
Bukhari (84:64-65)- Speaking from a position of power at the time, Ali confirms that lying is permissible in order to deceive an "enemy."
Muslim (32:6303)- "...he did not hear that exemption was granted in anything what the people speak as lie but in three cases: in battle, for bringing reconciliation amongst persons and the narration of the words of the husband to his wife, and the narration of the words of a wife to her husband (in a twisted form in order to bring reconciliation between them)."
Bukhari (50:369)- Recounts the murder of a poet, Ka'b bin al-Ashraf, at Muhammad's insistence. The men who volunteered for the assassination used dishonesty to gain Ka'b's trust, pretending that they had turned against Muhammad. This drew the victim out of his fortress, whereupon he was brutally slaughtered despite putting up a ferocious struggle for his life.
From Islamic Law:
Reliance of the Traveler (p. 746 - 8.2)- "Speaking is a means to achieve objectives. If a praiseworthy aim is attainable through both telling the truth and lying, it is unlawful to accomplish through lying because there is no need for it. When it is possible to achieve such an aim by lying but not by telling the truth, it is permissible to lie if attaining the goal is permissible (N:i.e. when the purpose of lying is to circumvent someone who is preventing one from doing something permissible), and obligatory to lie if the goal is obligatory... it is religiously precautionary in all cases to employ words that give a misleading impression...

cont
Jake Bradock

Robina, Australia

#36752 Feb 6, 2013
Additional Notes:


Muslims are allowed to lie to unbelievers in order to defeat them. The two forms are:



Taqiyya - Saying something that isn't true.



Kitman - Lying by omission. An example would be when Muslim apologists quote only a fragment of verse 5:32 (that if anyone kills "it shall be as if he had killed all mankind") while neglecting to mention that the rest of the verse (and the next) mandate murder in undefined cases of "corruption" and "mischief."



Though not called Taqiyya by name, Muhammad clearly used deception when he signed a 10-year treaty with the Meccans that allowed him access to their city while he secretly prepared his own forces for a takeover. The unsuspecting residents were conquered in easy fashion after he broke the treaty two years later, and some of the people in the city who had trusted him at his word were executed.



Another example of lying is when Muhammad used deception to trick his personal enemies into letting down their guard and exposing themselves to slaughter by pretending to seek peace. This happened in the case of Ka'b bin al-Ashraf (as previously noted) and again later against Usayr ibn Zarim, a surviving leader of the Banu Nadir tribe, which had been evicted from their home in Medina by the Muslims.



At the time, Usayr ibn Zarim was attempting to gather an armed force against the Muslims from among a tribe allied with the Quraish (against which Muhammad had already declared war). Muhammad's "emissaries" went to ibn Zarim and persuaded him to leave his safe haven on the pretext of meeting with the prophet of Islam in Medina to discuss peace. Once vulnerable, the leader and his thirty companions were massacred by the Muslims with ease, belying the probability that they were mostly unarmed, having been given a guarantee of safe passage (Ibn Ishaq 981).



Such was the reputation of Muslims for lying and then killing that even those who "accepted Islam" did not feel entirely safe. The fate of the Jadhima is tragic evidence for this. When Muslim "missionaries" approached their tribe one of the members insisted that they would be slaughtered even though they had already "converted" to Islam to avoid just such a demise. However, the others were convinced that they could trust the Muslim leader's promise that they would not be harmed if they simply offered no resistance.(After convincing the skeptic to lay down his arms, the unarmed men of the tribe were quickly tied up and beheaded - Ibn Ishaq 834 & 837).



Today's Muslims often try to justify Muhammad's murder of poets and others who criticized him at Medina by saying that they broke a treaty by their actions. Yet, these same apologists place little value on treaties broken by Muslims. From Muhammad to Saddam Hussein, promises made to non-Muslim are distinctly non-binding in the Muslim mindset.



Leaders in the Arab world routinely say one thing to English-speaking audiences and then something entirely different to their own people in Arabic. Yassir Arafat was famous for telling Western newspapers about his desire for peace with Israel, then turning right around and whipping Palestinians into a hateful and violent frenzy against Jews.



The 9/11 hijackers practiced deception by going into bars and drinking alcohol, thus throwing off potential suspicion that they were fundamentalists plotting jihad. This effort worked so well, in fact, that even weeks after 9/11, John Walsh, the host of a popular American television show, said that their bar trips were evidence of 'hypocrisy.'
Jake Bradock

Robina, Australia

#36753 Feb 6, 2013
The transmission from Flight 93 records the hijackers telling their doomed passengers that there is "a bomb on board" but that everyone will "be safe" as long as "their demands are met." Obviously none of these things were true, but these men, who were so intensely devoted to Islam that they were willing to "slay and be slain for the cause of Allah" (as the Qur'an puts it) saw nothing wrong with employing Taqiyya in order to facilitate their mission of mass murder.



The Islamic Society of North America (ISNA) insists that it "has not now or ever been involved with the Muslim Brotherhood, or supported any covert, illegal, or terrorist activity or organization." In fact, it was created by the Muslim Brotherhood and has bankrolled Hamas. At least nine founders or board members of ISNA have been accused by prosecutors of supporting terrorism.



Prior to engineering several deadly terror plots, such as the Fort Hood massacre and the attempt to blow up a Detroit-bound airliner, American cleric Anwar al-Awlaki was regularly sought out by NPR, PBS and even government leaders to expound on the peaceful nature of Islam.



The near absence of Qur'anic verse and reliable Hadith that encourage truthfulness is somewhat surprising, given that many Muslims are convinced that their religion teaches honesty. In fact, it is because of this ingrained belief that many Muslims are quite honest. When lying is addressed in the Qur'an, it is nearly always in reference to the "lies against Allah" - referring to the Jews and Christians who rejected Muhammad's claim to being a prophet.



Finally, the circumstances by which Muhammad allowed a believer to lie to a non-spouse are limited to those that either advance the cause of Islam or enable a Muslim to avoid harm to his well-being (and presumably that of other Muslims as well). Although this should be kept very much in mind when dealing with matters of global security, such as Iran's nuclear intentions, it is not grounds for assuming that the Muslim one might personally encounter on the street or in the workplace is any less honest than anyone else.
Jake Bradock

Robina, Australia

#36754 Feb 6, 2013
Jesus never allows lying in any form, even with faced with death at the hands of islam at a forced conversion.

You get off easy MUQ, you can lie to get out of anything, you see, your god is different from ours.

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