'The War Is Not Over'

Full story: Los Angeles Times

WASHINGTON - President Bush led the nation on Monday in marking the fifth anniversary of the Sept.
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ABs

Aiken, SC

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#287697
May 7, 2013
 
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Just wait and watch.
Israel has "all the support" from All the world's Superpowers.
They have single out Syria alone because no neighbor is strong enough to help Syria.
So the odds are in their favours.
But
If the Syrians do not call for cease fire and continue this fight till either they all die or all Isreali die....there are MORE chances that Isreal will loose.
A country which could not "exterminate and defeat" HAMAS and HIZBOLLAH, how it can defeat Syrian army.
Other nations should wait and watch the outcome and let there be no cease fire and / or intervention, till the issues are settled once and for all.
And THIS time, It is Isreal who has been the aggressor, so they cannot play the "sympathy card" any more!!
And once again you glaze over the obvious, with nuclear weapons at their disposal Israel all of Israeli will not die...or lose...why do you think Iran is so thirsty for a nuke? It is obvious, to assure mutual destruction...
ABs

Aiken, SC

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#287698
May 7, 2013
 
News you not hear on IRNA or SMART TV...muslims killing muslims who don't pay for "protection"...

A bomb tore through an election rally in Pakistan's tribal belt yesterday, killing at least 20 people and wounding dozens more in the deadliest incident yet in the violence-plagued run-up to this Saturday's election.

The Taliban claimed responsibility for the blast, but while other attacks have targeted liberal, secular parties, this one hit the Islamist party Jamiat Ulema-e-Islam, which has close links to the Taliban, the New York Times reports.

The Taliban says it targeted the candidate's rally because he had betrayed Arab jihadists, but government officials say they believe the Taliban is charging candidates protection money and attacking those who refuse to pay up.

So what is worse in the eyes of Allah, comrade MUQ? Betraying the muslim call to violent jihad or not paying jizya?

The Qur'an:
Qur'an (9:29)- "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth,(even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

Bukhari (53:386)- The command for Muslims to spread Islamic rule by force, subjugating others until they either convert to Islam or pay money, is eternal: Our Prophet, the Messenger of our Lord, has ordered us to fight you till you worship Allah Alone or give Jizya (i.e. tribute); and our Prophet has informed us that our Lord says:-- "Whoever amongst us is killed (i.e. martyred), shall go to Paradise to lead such a luxurious life as he has never seen, and whoever amongst us remain alive, shall become your master." This is being recounted during the reign of Umar, Muhammad's companion and the second caliph who sent conquering armies into non-Muslim Persian and Christian lands (after Muhammad's death).
ABs

Aiken, SC

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#287699
May 7, 2013
 
According to the esteemed historian Ibn Kathir, Muhammad established the jizya as a means of compensating the "converted" Meccans for their loss of revenue following the total ban of other religions from the Kaaba. This ended the centuries-old tradition of pilgrimages by people of all faiths during the holy months, on which the local economy depended:

Allah, most high, ordered the believers to prohibit the disbelievers from entering or coming near the sacred mosque. On that,[Muhammad's home tribe of]Quraysh thought that this would reduce their profits from trade. Therefore, Allah, most high, compensated them and ordered them to fight the people of the Book until the embrace Islam or pay the jizya. Ibn Katheir, The Battles of the Prophet, p. 183-184


This practice enabled Muhammad and his successors to fund Islamic military expansion and the lifestyle of the religious class through extortion from non-believers. In 630, the prophet of Islam first marched an army into Christian lands in what came to be known as the "Battle of Tabuk." In fact, there was no battle because there was no opposing army. The residents were taken by surprise. Some were killed, and the survivors were forced to pay protection money to Muhammad.(Clearly abrogating the previous rule of "no compulsion in religion" that contemporary apologists are so fond of repeating).


Only eleven years after Muhammad's death, his companions swept through North Africa, putting to the sword those who would not submit to Islamic rule. In 643, Tripoli was conquered and the native Christian Berbers were forced to give their wives and children to the Muslims as slaves to satisfy the jizya.

This lucrative extortion racket was practiced down through the centuries and was a part of the brutal Ottoman rule over Christians, Jews and others. The Serbs of Europe were particularly hard hit and often had to hand over their children to satisfy the collector. The children were then converted to Islam and trained as Jihad warriors for use in foreign campaigns (the so-called Janissaries).

In India, well into the 17th century, Muslim tax collectors would also take the wives and children of impoverished Hindus and sell them into slavery for the jizya requirement. The only way for many to avoid losing their families was to convert to Islam. This tremendous discrimination is how Islam made inroads into populations that wanted nothing to do with it.

Technically, there is no such thing in Islam as an innocent non-Muslim, which makes those ballyhooed condemnations of "terror against innocent people" even more useless. There is a basis for protecting the "People of the Book" (originally Jews and Christians, but later extended to Hindus when Muslim leaders realized that killing them was not as profitable as taxing them). These would be those who place themselves completely under the rule of Muslims, relinquishing all rights and agreeing to finance the Muslim expansion. Unfortunately, even this has not been enough to spare religious minorities from extreme persecution and massacre...
ABs

Aiken, SC

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#287700
May 7, 2013
 
News you not hear on IRNA or Smart TV cont'd:
Traditionally the collection of the jizya occurs at a ceremony that is designed to emphasize the subordinate status of the non-Muslim, where the subject is often struck in a humiliating fashion. M.A. Khan recounts that some Islamic clerics encouraged tax collectors to spit into the mouths of Hindu dhimmis during the process. He also quotes the popular Sufi teacher, Shaykh Ahmad Sirhindi:

"The honor of Islam lies in insulting the unbelief and the unbelievers (kafirs). One who respects kafirs dishonors Muslims... The real purpose of levying the Jizya on them is to humiliate them...[and] they remain terrified and trembling." Islamic Jihad

British preacher, Anjem Choudary, points out that "the normal situation is for [Muslims] to take money from the kuffar" (at the time, he was encouraging believers in the UK to quit working and live on public benefits). The Qur'an also affirms that the collection of jizya is is the ideal relationship between Muslims and non-Muslims. The verse mandating this (9:5) occurs much later than the verse stating that there is "no compulsion in religion" (2:256), meaning that it takes precedence and abrogates the earlier verse. This is why Islamic purists such as Hamas and the Taliban wish to reinstate the jizya.

An Egyptian cleric on al-Hafaz TV said in 2013 that American foreign aid to that country was a form of jizya "owed" to them. He believed that Muslims should demand more money from the Americans so that, in his words, "we can leave them alone." Only when the jizya is paid will America "be allowed to to recognize its own interests, the ones we agree to."

Contemporary Muslim apologists frequently tout the earlier "no compulsion in religion" verse when attempting to portray Islam as peaceful, and are somewhat reluctant to admit that the jizya is a penalty for not being Muslim. They usually fall back on claiming that the jizya is merely a tax paid to the government - glossing over the fact that this "tax" was imposed on the basis of religious status and was nearly always a much greater burden than that required of Muslim citizens. The interesting thing about this rhetorical strategy is that it directly contradicts any pretense that Islam is merely a religion and not a political system.

Tolerance in Islam isn't free. The jizya is money paid by non-Muslims so that they can keep practicing their religion. Under Islamic law, if the money is not paid, the people are to be killed or enslaved.
ABs

Aiken, SC

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#287701
May 7, 2013
 
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
Huh the hell are you rambling about?
Let me slow it down for you pops.....if it is a felony for a felon to be in possession of a firearm that must mean there is a LAW against felons possessing firearms, correct? If there is a LAW against felons possessing firearms, how can it be that a felon has a firearm??? Perhaps more useless lwas will help???
henry

Bad Langensalza, Germany

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#287702
May 7, 2013
 
ABs wrote:
<quoted text>
Hank, we have all ready discussed that...atheism is a religion which you have stated all religions are false therefore atheisnm is false making what you say false as well...got it?
Atheism is of course no Religion at all!
henry

Bad Langensalza, Germany

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#287704
May 7, 2013
 
ABs wrote:
<quoted text>
Was Karl the older or younger brother of Groucho? I get them mixed up...
Don`t worry Fukushima was not the last nuclear big accident. So you don`t have to bother who is who!
henry

Bad Langensalza, Germany

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#287705
May 7, 2013
 
ABs wrote:
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Things heating up between Syria and Israel, comrade...how do you see that playing out?
Well Israel has an unknown number of atombombs. Syria not!
henry

Bad Langensalza, Germany

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#287706
May 7, 2013
 
ABs wrote:
<quoted text>
But radiation is and has always been present, ever before the dawn of the nuclear age...
Yes, but what about the Radiation while nuclear accidents??
spocko

Oakland, CA

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#287707
May 7, 2013
 
ABs wrote:
<quoted text>
Let me slow it down for you pops.....if it is a felony for a felon to be in possession of a firearm that must mean there is a LAW against felons possessing firearms, correct? If there is a LAW against felons possessing firearms, how can it be that a felon has a firearm??? Perhaps more useless lwas will help???
Huh the hell are you rambling about?
If laws could make things disappear we'd surely pass one to eliminate stupidity which, I'm afraid, would be the end of you :-)
MUQ

Jubail, Saudi Arabia

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#287708
May 7, 2013
 
ABs wrote:
<quoted text>
And once again you glaze over the obvious, with nuclear weapons at their disposal Israel all of Israeli will not die...or lose...why do you think Iran is so thirsty for a nuke? It is obvious, to assure mutual destruction...
How come USSR "died" with so many nukes at her disposal?

Who told you that Nukes will provide "immortality" to ANY NATION?

It is standing up to truth and do justice on the land, that provides longevity to any nation, not its arms, armies, nukes of acting like a bully.!!!

Learn from the history of human nations of the past.
henry

Altengottern, Germany

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#287709
May 7, 2013
 
ABs wrote:
<quoted text>
Was Karl the older or younger brother of Groucho? I get them mixed up...
I think you get something mixed!
henry

Altengottern, Germany

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#287710
May 7, 2013
 
ABs wrote:
<quoted text>
But radiation is and has always been present, ever before the dawn of the nuclear age...
Well, tell that in Tshernobyl and some other places!
henry

Altengottern, Germany

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#287712
May 7, 2013
 
ABs wrote:
<quoted text>
But radiation is and has always been present, ever before the dawn of the nuclear age...
So Tchernobyl and other places are apparently only phantoms?
henry

Altengottern, Germany

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#287713
May 7, 2013
 
ABs wrote:
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Please provide an example of where communism has worked and bettered society...if you can.
Why should I, Texas is far away. You go along with death sentences as Long as you can before the next nuclear Inferno.(Irony)
ABs

Aiken, SC

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#287714
May 7, 2013
 
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
How come USSR "died" with so many nukes at her disposal?
Who told you that Nukes will provide "immortality" to ANY NATION?
It is standing up to truth and do justice on the land, that provides longevity to any nation, not its arms, armies, nukes of acting like a bully.!!!
Learn from the history of human nations of the past.
You prove my point..the iron curtain collapsed but what prevented the vultures of the world from swooping in on the carcass of Russia?...give me an "N"...give me a "U"...give me a "K"...give me an "E"...give me a "S"...

Sorry comrade MUQ, it doesn't take an engineering degree to figure out that Israel has assured that its destruction mutually assures the destruction of the nations of islam...
ABs

Aiken, SC

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#287715
May 7, 2013
 
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
Huh the hell are you rambling about?
If laws could make things disappear we'd surely pass one to eliminate stupidity which, I'm afraid, would be the end of you :-)
VEry well said, frankster...say it again...IF LAWS COULD...class is over...
spocko

Oakland, CA

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#287717
May 7, 2013
 
henry wrote:
<quoted text>be
This is disappointing, I always believed Karl Marx was a great philosopher of the international Labor force and generally and unfortunately he still is it! George Bush may have politically spoken been a bad comedian. But Marx??
Marx indeed is great and, in many ways, a unique thinker and philosopher, but the notion that a state or a government would give up it's power willingly is one of his fantasies. It nevertheless is a very nice thought and very naive notion ...
ABs

Austell, GA

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#287718
May 7, 2013
 
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
Marx indeed is great and, in many ways, a unique thinker and philosopher, but the notion that a state or a government would give up it's power willingly is one of his fantasies. It nevertheless is a very nice thought and very naive notion ...
IS great? I thought you and hank didn't believe in afterlife...
ABs

Austell, GA

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#287719
May 7, 2013
 
henry wrote:
<quoted text>
So Tchernobyl and other places are apparently only phantoms?
world average background radiation of 0.87 mSv/a from cosmic and terrestrial sources...varies by locations

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