Chief James Kolar on the JonBenet Ram...
Just Wondering

Sophia, WV

#128 Nov 5, 2013
Mama2JML wrote:
<quoted text>Burke was interviewed by a psychologist @ 10 years of age. He was uncomfortable talking about sex, exploring the events leading to his sister's murder, & drinking after a stranger. None of this is ABNORMAL, and the psychologist recognized this....AND, Burke remained in the custody of his parents! How did the psych eval contribute to Kolar's BDI theory?
And coming from a relatively well-to-do family, it was quite normal for him to ask, "Is that a Rolex watch?" when given the opportunity to ask any question about his sister's murder. Seeing him grin as his sister's casket is being carried out of the church was very chilling. No tears. No sad face. Drawing a picture of his family and promptly omitting JonBenet when his classmates were still including her in their drawings. Admitting that he was not afraid, even though his sister had just been murdered in his own home. One of these events or actions--even two--may be considered normal behavior, but the totality of his reactions and behavior says otherwise, I think.

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#129 Nov 5, 2013
Just Wondering wrote:
<quoted text>And coming from a relatively well-to-do family, it was quite normal for him to ask, "Is that a Rolex watch?" when given the opportunity to ask any question about his sister's murder. Seeing him grin as his sister's casket is being carried out of the church was very chilling. No tears. No sad face. Drawing a picture of his family and promptly omitting JonBenet when his classmates were still including her in their drawings. Admitting that he was not afraid, even though his sister had just been murdered in his own home. One of these events or actions--even two--may be considered normal behavior, but the totality of his reactions and behavior says otherwise, I think.
Thankfully op-eds aren't considered evidentiary.

“May you all come home”

Since: Mar 07

safely Bless you all

#130 Nov 6, 2013
Just Wondering wrote:
<quoted text>
And coming from a relatively well-to-do family, it was quite normal for him to ask, "Is that a Rolex watch?" when given the opportunity to ask any question about his sister's murder. Seeing him grin as his sister's casket is being carried out of the church was very chilling. No tears. No sad face. Drawing a picture of his family and promptly omitting JonBenet when his classmates were still including her in their drawings. Admitting that he was not afraid, even though his sister had just been murdered in his own home. One of these events or actions--even two--may be considered normal behavior, but the totality of his reactions and behavior says otherwise, I think.
There is also the behavior of an almost 10 year old boy at the funeral of his sister. While a 9 year old boy is not mature in many cases, they certainly should be able to behave appropriately at a funeral, especially since it is a SAD time for "most" people even if not fully understood.

He was certainly not old enough to grieve as we would expect an adult to grieve, but certainly old enough to be sad at his own sister's funeral and most certainly old enough to behave properly during the services

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#131 Nov 6, 2013
Here's the transcript from Diane Sawyer interviewing Beuf.

http://thewebsafe.tripod.com/09101997bynumabc...

"Dr. FRANCESCO BEUF: Has good appetite. Doesn't like much variety. Amount of TV she watches. Very cooperative behavior. Loves to draw. Scar on her check from being hit with a golf club. And if a parent had been involved in that, then we certainly would have jumped on the situation. I did not write down who had been the hitter."

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#132 Nov 6, 2013
Capricorn wrote:
<quoted text>There is also the behavior of an almost 10 year old boy at the funeral of his sister. While a 9 year old boy is not mature in many cases, they certainly should be able to behave appropriately at a funeral, especially since it is a SAD time for "most" people even if not fully understood.

He was certainly not old enough to grieve as we would expect an adult to grieve, but certainly old enough to be sad at his own sister's funeral and most certainly old enough to behave properly during the services
Your post is quite vague, but it seems you are insinuating Burke wasn't sad, and he didn't behave "properly" at the funeral/memorial. Why? What makes you think so?
The Truth Hurts

Ypsilanti, MI

#133 Nov 6, 2013
I found this interesting. After Bynum suggests they get a lawyer, JR takes Burke into a room to talk to him:

MICHAEL BYNUM: They certainly never made any mention of it to me. DIANE SAWYER: I'm trying to imagine, if I am in the middle of this agony and my friend says to me, "You better get a lawyer " I think I'd go, "What? What?"

MICHAEL BYNUM: Well...

DIANE SAWYER: This horrible thing has happened to my child. There's a note here. I should get a lawyer?

MICHAEL BYNUM: Well, first of all, that was not the words that I used. I told John there were some legal issues that I thought needed to be taken care of. And John just looked at me and said, "Do whatever you think needs to be done," and he and Burke -- he went into a room to talk with Burke and so I did.
The Truth Hurts

Ypsilanti, MI

#134 Nov 6, 2013
Also, the little walk JR and Beuf took the night after the murder interests me.

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#136 Nov 6, 2013
The Truth Hurts wrote:
I found this interesting. After Bynum suggests they get a lawyer, JR takes Burke into a room to talk to him:

MICHAEL BYNUM: They certainly never made any mention of it to me. DIANE SAWYER: I'm trying to imagine, if I am in the middle of this agony and my friend says to me, "You better get a lawyer " I think I'd go, "What? What?"

MICHAEL BYNUM: Well...

DIANE SAWYER: This horrible thing has happened to my child. There's a note here. I should get a lawyer?

MICHAEL BYNUM: Well, first of all, that was not the words that I used. I told John there were some legal issues that I thought needed to be taken care of. And John just looked at me and said, "Do whatever you think needs to be done," and he and Burke -- he went into a room to talk with Burke and so I did.
This was on the 26th,@ the Fernies' home. JonBenet, Burke's sister was murdered hours before, and you find it's interesting that John "went into a room to talk with Burke"; after Burke had been interviewed by investigators @ the Whites'. What do you think John was saying to Burke?

“May you all come home”

Since: Mar 07

safely Bless you all

#137 Nov 6, 2013
The Truth Hurts wrote:
I found this interesting. After Bynum suggests they get a lawyer, JR takes Burke into a room to talk to him:
MICHAEL BYNUM: They certainly never made any mention of it to me. DIANE SAWYER: I'm trying to imagine, if I am in the middle of this agony and my friend says to me, "You better get a lawyer " I think I'd go, "What? What?"
MICHAEL BYNUM: Well...
DIANE SAWYER: This horrible thing has happened to my child. There's a note here. I should get a lawyer?
MICHAEL BYNUM: Well, first of all, that was not the words that I used. I told John there were some legal issues that I thought needed to be taken care of. And John just looked at me and said, "Do whatever you think needs to be done," and he and Burke -- he went into a room to talk with Burke and so I did.
There is obviously more to the story as we well can imagine. Again, I'd like to check the phone records of Bynum for that morning and then go from there after the hmmmmmmmmm moment

According to Patsy in DOI, they never even knew they were suspects until well after they got to Atlanta

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#138 Nov 6, 2013
Just IMAGINE!... You do it quite well & without actual evidence. Who needs evidence when one's imagination can create BDI scenarios, regardless of facts & forensics?

Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#139 Nov 6, 2013
Capricorn wrote:
<quoted text>
There is obviously more to the story as we well can imagine. Again, I'd like to check the phone records of Bynum for that morning and then go from there after the hmmmmmmmmm moment
According to Patsy in DOI, they never even knew they were suspects until well after they got to Atlanta
Also, according to Patsy and John, they never talked to Burke about the murder.

Nor did they know he was awake...until he testified on video to the Grand Jury. Or something. Because they weren't supposed to know what he said to the Grand Jury...I mean, you know...secrecy and all that.

But if they knew what he told the Grand Jury, did they know the Grand Jury voted to indict them? Which means they have lied repeatedly about that....

Maybe JR was discussing the weather with Burke. "It's going to be much nicer weather in Atlanta. We can go golfing!"

So many stories, so little truth....

Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#140 Nov 6, 2013
The Truth Hurts wrote:
Also, the little walk JR and Beuf took the night after the murder interests me.
I think Bynum was on that walk...into the dark, no security, murderous Foreign Faction running loose....

I've always felt there were things discussed they wanted to make sure "others" (police guard was posted at the home) wouldn't hear: Patsy's sisters, JR's older children and Melinda's fiance, the Fernies and maybe some of their family--it was their house, after all.

Must have been quite crowded.

Argue all you want that it was normal for JR to want to get out and get some fresh air, etc., in light of the stress, but come on! His daughter was just murdered in his own home, he found her body, for heaven's sake! A ransom note from someone who had the wherewithall to get to his family and do this!

And he's out walking in the dark of Boulder without so much as one security guard THAT NIGHT?

The Ramseys were not worried about any intruder. Not even then.

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#141 Nov 6, 2013
koldkase wrote:
<quoted text>I think Bynum was on that walk...into the dark, no security, murderous Foreign Faction running loose....

I've always felt there were things discussed they wanted to make sure "others" (police guard was posted at the home) wouldn't hear: Patsy's sisters, JR's older children and Melinda's fiance, the Fernies and maybe some of their family--it was their house, after all.

Must have been quite crowded.

Argue all you want that it was normal for JR to want to get out and get some fresh air, etc., in light of the stress, but come on! His daughter was just murdered in his own home, he found her body, for heaven's sake! A ransom note from someone who had the wherewithall to get to his family and do this!

And he's out walking in the dark of Boulder without so much as one security guard THAT NIGHT?

The Ramseys were not worried about any intruder. Not even then.
Why would he worry about his own security? He might have welcomed death, by any means, at that point...

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#142 Nov 6, 2013
koldkase wrote:
<quoted text>Also, according to Patsy and John, they never talked to Burke about the murder.

Nor did they know he was awake...until he testified on video to the Grand Jury. Or something. Because they weren't supposed to know what he said to the Grand Jury...I mean, you know...secrecy and all that.

But if they knew what he told the Grand Jury, did they know the Grand Jury voted to indict them? Which means they have lied repeatedly about that....

Maybe JR was discussing the weather with Burke. "It's going to be much nicer weather in Atlanta. We can go golfing!"

So many stories, so little truth....
BRILLIANT one-time offenders, eh?

Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#143 Nov 6, 2013
Mama2JML wrote:
<quoted text>
Why would he worry about his own security? He might have welcomed death, by any means, at that point...
Your excuses you make up for the Ramseys are laughable.

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#144 Nov 6, 2013
koldkase wrote:
<quoted text>Your excuses you make up for the Ramseys are laughable.
I have no personal investment in this case. If the Rs are guilty, then so be it. I want to see this case solved. PERIOD. Do you know whom I suspect? Would you be surprised if I had suspicions about the family or a family member? Our perceptions regarding behaviors and reactions of POIs, witnesses, suspects, etc. will not solve this case. All the speculation, imagination, & baseless, biased bullchit in the world won't result in justice. I prefer to discuss facts supported by valid and reliable sources, forensics supported by science, and the testimony of experts meeting the Daubert standard. What do you wish to contribute?
Nobodyudno

Cub Run, KY

#145 Nov 6, 2013
Mama2JML wrote:
<quoted text>I have no personal investment in this case. If the Rs are guilty, then so be it. I want to see this case solved. PERIOD. Do you know whom I suspect? Would you be surprised if I had suspicions about the family or a family member? Our perceptions regarding behaviors and reactions of POIs, witnesses, suspects, etc. will not solve this case. All the speculation, imagination, & baseless, biased bullchit in the world won't result in justice. I prefer to discuss facts supported by valid and reliable sources, forensics supported by science, and the testimony of experts meeting the Daubert standard. What do you wish to contribute?
This is a public board. Do you always act like this when you don't get your way?

Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#146 Nov 6, 2013
Mama2JML wrote:
<quoted text>I have no personal investment in this case.[snip] Our perceptions regarding behaviors and reactions of POIs, witnesses, suspects, etc. will not solve this case. All the speculation, imagination, & baseless, biased bullchit in the world won't result in justice. I prefer to discuss facts supported by valid and reliable sources, forensics supported by science, and the testimony of experts meeting the Daubert standard. What do you wish to contribute?
Oooohhh...you used a legal term...Daubert! I'm so impressed! You so smart! I so dumb!!

lol

JR was SUICIDAL? Who's speculating now? LOL I LOVE hypocrisy; it's my favorite character flaw in humans.

John Ramsey himself said he was worried about that old intruder coming back while he was at the Fernies' house.

My source: what JR stated TO LE.

6 LOU SMIT: So then you go to the Fernies.
7 Can you just kind of remember? This would have
8 been during the afternoon. Can you just remember
9 basically what you did as a family, Patsy and
10 yourself?
11 JOHN RAMSEY: I don't remember much. I mean,
12 we went to the Fernie's house, we were in the
13 living room. The police might have been there. I
14 know we had a police officer 24 hours a day, which
15 we felt made us feel secure. We were very afraid.
16 LOU SMIT: Of?
17 JOHN RAMSEY: Of the killer or who was
18 after us, who was trying to harm us. Were they
19 going to harm Burke. We were frightened. And
20 having the policeman there was very comforting. I
21 remember that.(INAUDIBLE) you leave, I don't
22 know.
23 But we pretty much just stayed in the
24 living room.

Though I do believe he was lying as fast as his lips could move, I believe his statements to LE are sufficient to have a case discussion. If you don't, why are you here?

As for me speculating, anyone who comes up with a theory IS SPECULATING. Where you're getting your "testimony of experts" to lord over us bullchitters, I can't WAIT to hear. This case has never been to trial, so there are no "facts" tested by a jury, who are THE FINDERS OF FACT.

Or do you think thoughts that pop out of your mind are The Gospel According To You? All Hail Queen Mama?

My INTERPRETATION of the disparities in what JR said and what he actually DID is that John's intruder worries didn't extend to his actions.

ARE YOU ARGUING HE MEANT TO GET DR. BEUF AND LAWYER BYNUM KILLED the night of Dec. 26th, AS WELL AS HIMSELF? I must admit, I'm just not smart enough to come up with such FACTS!

My simple mind runs thus: If JR thought there was an intruder so able and willing to kill his child, whom he just carried up from his basement hours earlier, why would he not fear that murderer who didn't get his $118K--and oops, LE got called!

By his own statement, JR either thought that, as well, or he surmised he WOULD have, had there been an intruder.

So either he was trying to kill himself--and Dr. Beuf and Mr. Bynum might as well come along for the suicide party, as you IMAGINE it, or JR wasn't worried about any Foreign Faction, no matter how Small.

I swear, those Ramseys knew how to have a good time! First a Dawn Kidnapping Party, followed by a Suicide Party!#Note to self: your life is boring.

And to answer your condescending question: I contribute...NOTHING. P.E.R.I.O.D. I'm just the peanut gallery.

You may need to sit down for this shocker: neither do you. WE will not "solve" this case. Anyone who thinks we're doing more than having a public discussion about it has delusions of grandeur.

However, if you think you have some kind of superior knowledge and crime-solving ability (!) separating you from us low-brow forum beer can collectors, please use your expertise with your fellow geniuses who are ready to crack it wide open...any decade now...based on Team Ramsey lies, red herrings, and DNA disinformation.

Woohoo! Hurry hurry hurry! We RDI dummies aren't getting any younger! All that crow waiting! Yummie!

Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#147 Nov 6, 2013
Mama2JML wrote:
I have no personal investment in this case.[snip] Our perceptions regarding behaviors and reactions of POIs, witnesses, suspects, etc. will not solve this case. All the speculation, imagination, & baseless, biased bullchit in the world won't result in justice. I prefer to discuss facts supported by valid and reliable sources, forensics supported by science, and the testimony of experts meeting the Daubert standard. What do you wish to contribute?
JR was SUICIDAL? Who's speculating now? LOL I LOVE hypocrisy; it's my favorite character flaw in humans.

John Ramsey himself said he was worried about that old intruder coming back while he was at the Fernies' house.

My source: what JR stated TO LE.

6 LOU SMIT: So then you go to the Fernies.
7 Can you just kind of remember? This would have
8 been during the afternoon. Can you just remember
9 basically what you did as a family, Patsy and
10 yourself?
11 JOHN RAMSEY: I don't remember much. I mean,
12 we went to the Fernie's house, we were in the
13 living room. The police might have been there. I
14 know we had a police officer 24 hours a day, which
15 we felt made us feel secure. We were very afraid.
16 LOU SMIT: Of?
17 JOHN RAMSEY: Of the killer or who was
18 after us, who was trying to harm us. Were they
19 going to harm Burke. We were frightened. And
20 having the policeman there was very comforting. I
21 remember that.(INAUDIBLE) you leave, I don't
22 know.
23 But we pretty much just stayed in the
24 living room.

Though I do believe JR was lying as fast as his lips could move, I believe his statements to LE are sufficient to have a case discussion.

As for me speculating, anyone who comes up with a theory IS SPECULATING. Where you're getting your "testimony of experts" to lord over us bullchitters, I can't WAIT to hear. This case has never been to trial, so there are no "facts" tested by a jury, who are THE FINDERS OF FACT.

Or do you think thoughts that pop out of your mind are The Gospel According To You? When we need an idea you'll give it to us?

My INTERPRETATION of the disparities in what JR said and what he actually DID is that John's statements of intruder worries didn't extend to his actions. LE asked the Ramseys about these numerous inconsistencies every time they interviewed them.

So if YOU'RE ARGUING JR MEANT TO GET DR. BEUF AND MR. BYNUM KILLED the night of Dec. 26th, AS WELL AS HIMSELF? I must admit, I'm just not smart enough to come up with such FACTS!

My simple mind runs thus: If JR thought there was an intruder so able and willing to kill his child, whom he just carried up from his basement hours earlier, why would he not fear that murderer who didn't get his $118K--and oops, LE got called!

By his own statement, JR either thought that, as well, or he surmised he WOULD have, had there been an intruder.

So either he was trying to kill himself--and Dr. Beuf and Mr. Bynum might as well come along for the suicide party, as you IMAGINE it, or JR wasn't worried about any Foreign Faction, no matter how Small.

I swear, those Ramseys knew how to have a good time! First a Dawn Kidnapping Party, followed by a Suicide Party!#Note to self: your life is boring.

And to answer your condescending question: I contribute...NOTHING. P.E.R.I.O.D. I'm just the peanut gallery.

You may need to sit down for this shocker: neither do you. WE will not "solve" this case. Anyone who thinks we're doing more than having a public discussion about it has delusions of grandeur.

“If life gives you melons”

Since: Nov 06

You might be dyslexic

#148 Nov 6, 2013
Nobodyudno wrote:
<quoted text>
This is a public board. Do you always act like this when you don't get your way?
;)

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