The Oakland County Child Killer
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17047 Aug 18, 2013
Hi Truth Dude,
You are always such a gentleman. It’s kind of funny to see you swear.
I have no quarrel with Officer Williams. I addressed him as a good and honorable man in my story. I wish he had been more forthcoming about Alan McCoy. But he has his reasons I am sure. Maybe it is personal. He may just be very touched by how it all ended for that young man.
One of the problems I have with Detroit/Wayne County in general is that they have never nor will they ever, give-up the name of the Michigan State Police Sergeant who was buddies with LAWSON. He IS the one who recommended Lawson to the Detroit PD and they are the ones who gave him his little badge. That gave him and his crew, all of them, carte blanche at the smorgasbord of children in the Cass and many points beyond. And they were brutal and open and unafraid while using it too.
I find it hard to believe there is a cop among them from back then, or who has worked this case and doesn’t know that name.
The cop who comes foreword with that name will be a hero. I don’t hold-out a lot of hope though.
Any thoughts?
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#8782
"John Hastings" appears in post 8088, but is not referenced in an accusatory fashion. I will keep skimming from there until now
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#8812
Manny wrote:
<quoted text>
Seriously, just as a member of the viewing public, nobody is ever going to think of the polygrapher as someone who threw a monkey wrench in the case. This case is older than dirt, it's not some riveting, heat of the moment, blow by blow case. At the very least if this ends up not panning out, people are now aware that Busch was a pedophile who got some serious strings pulled in his favor and that is worth whatever energy it takes to vet this guy as a suspect. Plus it hit the refresh button on the OCCK case in the public eye. I don't think the polygrapher is ever going to be seen as having done anything as less than noble, he really stuck his neck out there.
Well stated.
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17048 Aug 18, 2013
HERE SHE POSTS FROM FLORIDA TO HINT BUSH AND GUNNELS>>WHY? HER CAREER IS BASED UPON LIES AND MISINFORMATION>>>TRUS T
just-thinking
Kissimmee, FL
Reply »#9070
mybrotherskeeper wrote:
<quoted text>
My understanding, and it is hearsay--is that this particular hair was a facial hair. But there WAS a hair found in his genital region--that is established in the documents I quoted from. Additional hearsay--that a pubic hair was also found in Tim's mouth. Think the cops told the media everything? Think again. And guess what, Dr. Spitz, on being interviewed for the recent t.v. show said that the mtDNA match (partial though it may be) between Gunnels and the hair found on Kris was HUGE. HUGE. Maybe Helen should call Dr. Spitz and talk to him herself.
I agree that the Gunnels match speaks volumes. The chances of that hair not being Gunnels in the given circumstances and with him providing a way it could have gotten there instead of a denial, as Truthdude points out, are slim and none. Gunnel's explanation is lacking severly in my estimation.
just-thinking
Kissimmee, FL

#9081
Manny wrote:
Seems to me we need more information on Busch. Someone said there is a record of FOIA reports from a nephew he molested, that he took him on fishing trips. Are there any details on (other than rape) what happened on these trips? Is there testimony or statements from any of his other victims that is public information? I'm talking about how long he kept his victims, what he did while he had them under his charge, things that might explain the two girl victims and keeping all of the children for so long, especially once for 19 days. Is there a profile of Busch? Childhood friends that could give insight into his personality and psychology?
Someone should subpeona Bennett for GJ testimony. He is listed as having been arrested with Greene and Busch. He is alive and well judging by his photo. I hope this is being tended to or has been.
DOES SHE ANSWER THIS QUESTION???Or this even better question…or FaCT
Lilly
Denver, CO

just-thinking wrote:
<quoted text>
Someone should subpeona Bennett for GJ testimony. He is listed as having been arrested with Greene and Busch. He is alive and well judging by his photo. I hope this is being tended to or has been.
Hi Just Thinking,
If they have not brought him back for testimony or if they don't then this isn't a real investigation - not by a stretch.
just-thinking
Kissimmee, FL
justice Denied wrote:
J-T, where did you find the photo of Bennet?
I believe this is your guy. Copy this link as it may get removed.

http://www.homefacts.com/offender-detail/AL02 ...

NO SHE DIDN’T ANSWER THE QUESTION OR FACT< THIS BUSH GREEN BENNET ANGLE IS JUST THAT< AN ANGLE MEANT TO LEAD IN A DIFFERENT AREA LEADING TO NOWHERE>>>HOW MANY YEARS DID THIS BUSH ANGLE LAST> WE STILL TRYING TO FIGURE OUT IT LEADS NOWHERE!!! TRUST
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17049 Aug 18, 2013
just-thinking
Kissimmee, FL
#9110
Manny wrote:
<quoted text>
Of interest here is their ages Greene 26, Busch 25, Bennett 19, Gunnels 15,(ages are approx). Need to know where they all lived during that time period and the years before, were they in close proximity?
If I could postulate here also in response to Truthdude's question about how they may have gotten together; one possibility is that they were put into contact with each other via G. Richards. His smut business would have been something many Michigan pedophiles would have sought out. Perhaps Busch, greene, and maybe Bennett were given the job of snatching or coercing kids for porn production and or use on the Island. I would also guess that there were places in Michigan other than Busch homes where kids may have been kept to be transferred to the Island or wherever they were to be raped. It is possible that these places existed through the operation of N. Fox Island and may have never been discovere after. I find it unlikely that all kids that were taken to the Island were picked up and flown directly there. G. Richards was a potential link for all players. Potential, not certain. He may have gotten the guys together and they may have continued after the Island was shut down, but with no place to deliver the kids after they had there way with them. The girls could have been a smoke screen or could have been payment for help in coercing boys. Bennett was younger, but who knows when they met and if he was or was not also a victim of Busch and Greene. Subpeona him.
just-thinking
Kissimmee, FL
#9116
Lilly wrote:
Am I reading this wrong? Is this suggesting the last girl found, Kristine was sexually assaulted?
From Keeper’s posted file last night:
“My point is we are trying to pin it down to male or female. We don't know if, for instance on the last girl that was found, if it is a male, that kind of helps us along. Could have been a foreign object is what we are trying to determine.”
Hi Lilly,

I think they were trying to say there was no evidence found with the last girl to indicate the gender of the kidnapper/murderer, ie: if it was a man penetration would have probably been indicated.
STILL POSTING WHILE ON VACATION< YET MONTHS BEFORE SHE SAID PEOPLE NEED TO GET A LIFE OR CAREER>>>her REAR is on the line for her career…TRUST
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17050 Aug 18, 2013
just-thinking
Kissimmee, FL
#9120
stillhere wrote:
<quoted text>
Like JT I keep going back to Richards. But, we only know of him due to the Federal investigations and we nothing of the small time operations (bookstores and /or publications) that could have existed. Richards was fairly careful in his screening of clients. So much so that Shelden et al were comfortable dealing with him. I'm not sure Busch or Greene initially would have been an acceptable risk for Richards without being vouched for.
While he may have been careful they were all associated with N. Fox Island. How they all became associated is an unknown, but it would seem that Busch must have been acceptable to all the principals or he would not be carting around their rolls of film. Richards could have assumed that given Busch's family's social status he would be a safe bet to deal with. To Richards I would assume Shelden, Grossman, and Busch would appear filthy rich. Perhaps he had witnessed or was aware of the effectiveness of Busch family hush money. They may have all seemed like exactly the type of clients he would accept, not sure. Greene and Bennett may have been Busch cronies that Busch brought in on his own.
just-thinking
Kissimmee, FL
Justice denied wrote:
Lawson told LE in a recent interview that Moore claimed he was snatching kids for Chris Buschs father H Lee Busch. Considering the source is a scumbag who knows if this is true or not, but I don't know why he would lie given his life sentence. This should shed some light on how messed up his entire family and childhood were. Busch in my opinion was molested by his father and then molested ho's nephews. Who knows if his brothers were molested as well. The rich all know one another and this fox island thing is huge.
One question and one comment:
Question: Is this interview available on the web so we can read it?
The rich all know eachother and this Fox Island thing is huge. This is true. This would seem to provide an almost perpetual motive for any family members of any rich people associated with Fox Island to keep quiet to this day (if they know) and on into the future. Somebody knows some names of other patrons of this disgusting enterprise. The leaking of even just a few names would probably bring huge press exposure and it should. Something continues to prevent this from happening. I know this moves off topic, but more and more I think it is one big picture with different endings for different players and a walk for most if they dummy up
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17051 Aug 18, 2013
just-thinking
Kissimmee, FL
#9110
Manny wrote:
<quoted text>
Of interest here is their ages Greene 26, Busch 25, Bennett 19, Gunnels 15,(ages are approx). Need to know where they all lived during that time period and the years before, were they in close proximity?
If I could postulate here also in response to Truthdude's question about how they may have gotten together; one possibility is that they were put into contact with each other via G. Richards. His smut business would have been something many Michigan pedophiles would have sought out. Perhaps Busch, greene, and maybe Bennett were given the job of snatching or coercing kids for porn production and or use on the Island. I would also guess that there were places in Michigan other than Busch homes where kids may have been kept to be transferred to the Island or wherever they were to be raped. It is possible that these places existed through the operation of N. Fox Island and may have never been discovere after. I find it unlikely that all kids that were taken to the Island were picked up and flown directly there. G. Richards was a potential link for all players. Potential, not certain. He may have gotten the guys together and they may have continued after the Island was shut down, but with no place to deliver the kids after they had there way with them. The girls could have been a smoke screen or could have been payment for help in coercing boys. Bennett was younger, but who knows when they met and if he was or was not also a victim of Busch and Greene. Subpeona him

Since: Mar 07

Detroit, MI

#17052 Aug 18, 2013
DIVINE INTERVENTION wrote:
Gordon Parshall
Jackson, MI
#8172
Henrietta McPhee wrote:
<quoted text>
Surely if Ms. Dagner has a son who is a police officer, and she also has a daughter who is a detective-sergeant, as Ms. Dagner has said on this Topix forum, then Ms Dagner might possibly have had some previous inside confidential police information about the description of Kristine's pants?
There was enough leaking of confidential information in the Ramsey case by Steve Thomas to make me realize that sort of thing does go on.
I agree that Detroit Breakdown can be a bit short on hard facts. I still think Detroit Breakdown's hunches, and his knowledge about suspicious activities by Gary, should be thoroughly and properly investigated.
Gary's DNA like Fleet White's DNA, seems to be a bit of a mystery. There has been no official report ever made public that either of these two characters has ever been DNA tested that I know about. Just to say that they 'obviously' have been tested simply isn't good enough.
Does anybody know if Gary is a pedophile, or has ever been in a pedo ring, for a start?
You should Google "Gary Leiterman" and the word "Polaroid" and then you will know that he is, indeed, a pedophile of the first degree. This was with a foreign exchange student. Scary thought: he had previously sponsored 2 or 3 foreign exchange students according to a cop I know. Gary got caught with his pants up and he deserves to be in prison.
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#8275
I think the picture of Busch's screen door propped open looks like it leads outside from the garage not from house to garage. Doesn't that look like outside siding and maybe a basement window? I was previously under the impression there was a door propped open from the house to the garage. Which is true?
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#8354
Helen Dagner wrote:
"You Helen are in a category of your own making.: Well thank you Patrick for realizing that -in return I corrected your mis-spelled word...
Misspelled
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#8479
Gosh. Imagine losing a child back then and not knowing it was being investigated as part of the OCCK. That eliminates a third of the inquiries from the get go.
page 400
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
ladyJ, I find the funeral home/cemetery angle interesting. I have no idea if it has ever been looked into, but it seems such a profession would provide lots of places to hide a child where they could not be heard and a cover for transporting a body. We could come up with any number of possible professions, jobs, or living situations (like Busch's or JH's) that could fit the bill, but your question is a good one. It struck a chord for some reason with me. Well, the suspect I originally came here with (Gary Leiterman) did display his victim (Jane Mixer) in a cemetery with a grave blanket over her, but his was a different MO and she a different age range, though he did turn out to possess nude polaroids of a young exchange student he sponsored. I have no idea if he has been looked at for these crimes, and again this may just muddy the waters more, but I thought your question showed good thinking.
Detroit Breakdown was my original name when I started the OCCK thread on this forum. Obviously long time posters realize that GARY is not Gary Leiterman.
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17053 Aug 18, 2013
BONITA SPRINGS IS PRETTY PRICEY>>>YET SHES STILL PLANTING SEEDS HERE
just-thinking
Bonita Springs, FL
#9178
Helen Dagner wrote:
Wow! Kudos to all of you for working so long and so hard to prove the already widely known and universally accepted fact that Busch was a pervert. Now, all you have to do is show whatever evidence there is to connect him to the OCCK, as if that's all it takes to be the killer, well, you've got a pretty big suspect pool, with all the pervs in Cass Corridor, But then there were probably several hundred, if not thousands of creeps in the area at the time. I mean, there were plenty of nonviolent pedos in the area that don't like girls, why isn't any one of them your chief suspect? It seems that some intelligent, well meaning, sincere people, just can't think out of the box for these weird killings. Since almost everything about these cases is strange and unique, differing from all other child abductions and killings, it stands to reason that we're not looking for the usual, run of the mill child molester. Also, some who claim to be in the know, continue expounding about the "Bloody Garrotes" which never existed, and was only a long boat mooring line, with marine motor oil and grease on it. But some still insist on trying to connect "invisible dots" which (only they can see), to some how point to Busch. Well congratulations, you've caught a pervert. Since you've solved that, now you should be feel free to work on catching the OCCK
Child rape is violent. He was certainly more than a pervert.
WHAT A FAKE..pretends she knows nothing about grand jury yet here she adds more info…
just-thinking
Bonita Springs, FL
thanks, I have done more reading on it now. A witness can take the fifth in grand jury proceedings. After a few questions with the fifth invoked the witness is generally either compelled to testify with imposed use immunity or is excused. Other forms of immunity may also be arranged. Grand jury proceedings are actually a part of what the fifth ammendment describes. It is also interesting to note that some evidence that would not be included in a trial, because it was obtained in violation of the fourth, fifth, or sixth ammendments can be included in grand jury proceedings.
Still on vacation, yet here she says no name calling…yet wait until Pill Fickleson shows up in a year…and she knows I lost my kid because of this too…heartless FAKE swine…
just-thinking
Bonita Springs, FL
#9303
We should all try to adhere to the golden rule when here. Name calling is way overboard and terribly disrespectful to the people who were directly affected by these crimes. Time to hit the behavioral reset button, please.
DING DING>>>SHE IS SUSPECT< AS HER REAR IS ON THE LINE FOR HER CAREER
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17054 Aug 18, 2013
Notles
Warren, MI
#9304
I see a huge double standard here.
I have seen some horrible things said and you turn a blind eye as long as the horrid spewing of acid was aimed in a different direction. I am not just referring to Helen's insane rants either.

WHAT A LIAR>>here she is on vacation sprouting more lies...read thru her pig schtick
just-thinking
Bonita Springs, FL
#9306
Notles wrote:
I see a huge double standard here.
I have seen some horrible things said and you turn a blind eye as long as the horrid spewing of acid was aimed in a different direction. I am not just referring to Helen's insane rants either.
I don't turn a blind eye to any of it. Ignoring what is inappropriate works best for me, but I see a general lack of respect for the sensitive matter at hand lately. Perhaps this is true on my part too as I have digressed to discuss how people here interact with each other, but I do that, because I think it has gotten out of hand. We don't have any professional obligations here, only moral and ethical. Bashing anybody's ideas, if they are presented in a dignified and honest manner, is inappropriate. Character assasinations, even backed by real evidence, are inappropriate. It is easy to have a high ethical standard. Just think of how you want to be treated and treat others that way.
SHOWING HER TRUE KNOWLEDGE>>>NOTICE SHE DOESN’T SOUND SO DUMB LIKE SHE DID WHEN SHE JOINED TOPIX TO CAUSE CONFUSION AND SPREAD THE ILLUSION>>>TRUST
just-thinking
Bonita Springs, FL
#9382
Lilly wrote:
From The Facts:
Why has Cooper’s new investigation failed to uncover how the children were bound? All reported and posted means have been inaccurate.
To The Facts:
Handcuffs??
Lilly, because of this question asked by facts I believe it is possible his posts are an endorsed limited GJ leak. That is my opinion. The leak could be limited so that leaking is made an issue thereby providing more impetus to ensure no real information gets out. A sort of straw man, if you will. Ie: somebody is talking about things they shouldn't so a stern warning should now go out to LE and jurors to remain tight lipped.
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
TruthDude wrote:
<quoted text>
Detroit,
I concur, and would further suggest that Gunnels is perhaps frozen in time. His body is over 50, but those wasted years in prison has him still in his 20's or 30's developmentally. Perhaps an Attorney is needed to advise him that his victimization and age at the time limits any ability to further punish him, and that in fact nobody is in a better position to assist the case, obtain use immunity, etc.; as to what he knows or witnessed in this era. We all want the adult perpetrators here to be brought to justice. I think either D.A. would grant this as a pragmatic move that also the families would not object to if the full truth came out as to who the adult perpetrators were in this ring.
If he wants immunity he would want to obtain transactional immunity and get a promise that he will in no way be prosecuted or have his or another's testimony used against him.
DANG, SHE REALLY KNOWS THE INS AND OUTS OF JUSTICE>>>just thinking…
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17055 Aug 18, 2013
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#9516
Notles wrote:
I repeat this statement is plastered all over the internet. Try a search “Gunnels hair match” Lots of other searches will work.
Quote off internet- The hair found on Mihelich's blouse is a mitochondrial DNA match with a man living in Kalamazoo. But because of the quality of the hair, a perfect DNA match is impossible. A mitochondrial match narrows the hair to 1 percent of the Caucasian population. Police reports say this is "the first physical evidence match in the Oakland County Child Killer case's history."
Unquote
Yes, the mitochondrial DNA comes from the mother but who Gunnels inherited his hair from plays no part in this case. Mitochondrial matches are passed down to males and females so the hair found on Mihelich could be a female hair. There is nothing else that can be determined about the hair other than it came from a pool of 33,300 people within a reasonable distance from the abduction locations.
I am very much for the Kings getting air time. The more publicity the case gets the better. Calling and treating Gunnels as a suspect was being over dramatic. We still have a thing that a person is innocent until there is proof otherwise.
Since this Gunnels spectacle seems to be media driven they obviously need to be as sensational as possible. Saying that the mitochondrial match must come from Gunnels or a close relative goes against all other sources of information I have read on the internet. How about anyone that disputes that the mitochondrial match is anything less than 1% of the Caucasian population should identify the source to support their claim.
I am inclined to believe that all contributing coinciddences like Gunnels not denying his hair, admitting he was in Busch's car, providing the possible transfer point, etc. all make it virtually impossible that it may not be his hair, but throw it out, let's say, for the sake of argument. He still knows much much more, and as far as we here know has said very little. Did he know H. Lee Busch or other Busches? The nephews? How was he treated? We don't have to get the answers here, but he knows more than what he has said. If the hair is not his he has already started talking. He should finish the story and start at the beginning.
Dang, look at the words she uses…she’s the smartest person on here, no wonder how she’s Chief District Judge, shes’ brilliant and deceptive…Yet someone is showing her true cause, IE EXPONENTIALLY SMARTER>>>thank Jah for that…
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#9531
Notles wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you saying that Truth Dude is not creating elaborate scenerios and most everyone else is?
Are you supporting all of Truth Dudes statements and beliefs?
What are the facts? If the facts tell the story you are implying the case is already solved. I have seen so many versions of the facts that I don't think anyone person outside the investigation can honestly claim to know the facts. I think the King family has become a lynch mob.
Let's please not call them a "Lynch Mob." That has very specific connotations that are really not relevant here. If they follow the information they discover while investigating the lrape and murder of their family member that is entirely appropriate. Hyperbole just makes people hurt and reactionary. I think your posts are generally a positive contribution.
YOUR WISHES ARE COMING TRUE< CHOP GOES THE TOTEM POLE>>>
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17056 Aug 18, 2013
just-thinking
Jackson, MI

#9579
Notles wrote:
No one is waiting in the wings to take someone out for fear of being exposed as a participant in the OCCK case or any other case.
There are just a few people so freaked out to see their own dreams crumbling before their very eyes that they would rather see more people silenced than face what is coming. So much for just wanting plain justice. The damn has broke. I am sure you have all wondered how certain people would react to the day of reckoning. You all may find out. Maybe sooner maybe later.
Although I am sure we are all interested in finding out what we can I only hope this damn breaking you speak of provides some answers for those directly affected.
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#9591
Few substantive leaks would suggest that at least one of the grand juries is moving toward some real resolution or indictment, while frequent leaks containing real information would suggest a lack of confidence in progress by the prosecutors invloved, the witnesses, or the jurors in my opinion. I think we will here an announcement over time, but who knows? It is all speculation.
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#9592
What I mean is if the people involved believe in the process they will protect it while if they think it is a sham there is a greater chance of somebody trying to undermine it or render it less effective. I meant hear not here in the previous post.
THIS COULD BE BOB, read this and realize how they can lie and not be held accountable..I wonder when this was put into place? no wonder why cory Williams and the WCPO office refuse to budge…IE DETROIT COP CHARLES BLANCHARD
The Facts
Petoskey, MI
#9616
members of the victims should be cautious of what investigators tell you and how much trust you have in them. They may be using you for their own benefit.

What they tell you and what the truth actually is are two different things. Do you think they are really informing you of actual information from Grand Jury proceedings or their investigation? If they did they would be guilty of a felony.

With that said remember investigators and prosecutors can lie to you and not beheld accountable for their actions. However, when they operate under the color of law and commit crimes they can be arrested, charged, convicted, and sent to prison.

Ask yourself to what extent they would go to avoid that, or to what extent would they go to be re-elected.

It is a fact that Jessica Cooper convened the Grand Jury in Oakland County and asked Kim Worthy to convene one in Wayne County for the sole purpose of preventing information from being made public. Documentation in support of the above and much more shall be disclosed for public review in a manor that shall not jeopardize bringing those responsible of violating the law to justice.

When information is released publicly use your resources and energy to demand an investigation into all aspects of this matter by and investigative agency outside the jurisdiction of Oakland County, Wayne County, the Michigan Attorney Generals Office, and the Michigan State Police. The extent of this matter reaches far beyond the Oakland County four cases.

Tick Tock JC and MSP.
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17057 Aug 18, 2013
HELEN IS RIGHT< BOB WAS FROM PETOSKEY…WHAT HAPPENED TO HIM.? they chopped off his hands, I know that…HE visited me in my Dreams, and visions are from GOD ….TRUST…
The Facts
Petoskey, MI
#9708
I was wondering if anyone here knows what is about to hit the fan inside of Jessica Cooper'S office.

Press conference will be held on Tuesday April 24th.

Get information and updates at:

www.wepay.com/donations/serialkillers

hmmm. some folks say the media and pigs don’t read here…pffft , they show up on here while on vacation to spread lies and misinformation, BUSH LEAD LEAD TO years of speculation…GOOD JOB FEDS, too bad this is gods world…TRUST
pbdbn
Troy, MI
#9718
I'm waiting to see what happens.
Interesting Cooper was on channel 4 tonight ?
Same night as the new info is "slightly" let out ?
We just have to wait.
Dagner's statement is just that, coming from her.
I never suspected any family members ?? But, of course it's possible, though not likely.
I'll believe something on here when I see the King sister posting, no one else.
New information implicates at least one person associated with law enforcement, more than three additional suspects, and a possible ongoing cover-up or conspiracy by law enforcement.
Here Bob states how Jessica Cooper relates this as a vacuum…funny to know now isn’t
it, as the prosecutors office has done all it can to spin these illusions into a tornado …It’s time to destroy all of those placed to hinder truth and justice…TRUST
The Facts
Petoskey, MI
Reply »#9722
Late Tuesday in response to the announcement of a Press Conference next week Oakland County Prosecutor Jessica Cooper’s Office Released This Statement:“Conspiracy theories flourish in a vacuum. But that vacuum is necessary and long overdue for an effective investigation without interference and wild speculation from conspiracy theorists.” A spokesperson for the prosecutor’s office also said the Department of Justice does not have jurisdiction over local murders, no matter how old they are.

It appears that the only vacuum that is flourishing is the one inside the Oakland County Prosecutor's Office. A vacuum that is preventing the truth from being learned through an ineffective investigation being led by Jessica Cooper and the Oakland County Prosecutors Office that has failed to solve any of these serial abductions and killings of children.

The media and public should be asking Jessica Cooper and the Oakland County Prosecutors Office these questions: Why are you so fearful of the Department of Justice coming in to investigate these cases? What are you afraid they will discover?

If it is nothing but “wild speculation” and “conspiracy theorist” as you claim then why not welcome an outside investigation in to these cases that your office has failed to solve. Are you afraid of what will be uncovered because it is what you have been trying to hide all along? What could be more important than finding those responsible for these Serial Child Killings through any means possible? Unless that there is a reason you do not want the truth to be uncovered.

If Jessica Cooper and the Oakland County Prosecutors Office are not involved in a cover up or conspiracy related to these cases. Then why is Jessica Cooper not at the head of the line asking the Department of Justice to come in and investigate these cases if it means justice for the children who were victims of these Serial Child Killers? Only one answer comes to mind.

Beginning next Tuesday Jessica Cooper will be exposed
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17058 Aug 18, 2013
The Facts
Petoskey, MI
Reply »#9722
Late Tuesday in response to the announcement of a Press Conference next week Oakland County Prosecutor Jessica Cooper’s Office Released This Statement:“Conspiracy theories flourish in a vacuum. But that vacuum is necessary and long overdue for an effective investigation without interference and wild speculation from conspiracy theorists.” A spokesperson for the prosecutor’s office also said the Department of Justice does not have jurisdiction over local murders, no matter how old they are.
It appears that the only vacuum that is flourishing is the one inside the Oakland County Prosecutor's Office. A vacuum that is preventing the truth from being learned through an ineffective investigation being led by Jessica Cooper and the Oakland County Prosecutors Office that has failed to solve any of these serial abductions and killings of children.
The media and public should be asking Jessica Cooper and the Oakland County Prosecutors Office these questions: Why are you so fearful of the Department of Justice coming in to investigate these cases? What are you afraid they will discover?
If it is nothing but “wild speculation” and “conspiracy theorist” as you claim then why not welcome an outside investigation in to these cases that your office has failed to solve. Are you afraid of what will be uncovered because it is what you have been trying to hide all along? What could be more important than finding those responsible for these Serial Child Killings through any means possible? Unless that there is a reason you do not want the truth to be uncovered.
If Jessica Cooper and the Oakland County Prosecutors Office are not involved in a cover up or conspiracy related to these cases. Then why is Jessica Cooper not at the head of the line asking the Department of Justice to come in and investigate these cases if it means justice for the children who were victims of these Serial Child Killers? Only one answer comes to mind.
Beginning next Tuesday Jessica Cooper will be exposed
YIKES>>>TOLD YA IT”S BIGGER THAN ONE COULD IMAGINE< MUCH LESS COMPREHEND>>>
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17059 Aug 18, 2013
just dropping in
Lowell, MI
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#9724
2
I looked some of this up after a post I saw:
Flint, Michigan - Former Genesee County Prosecutor Arthur A Busch
Bloomfield Hills, Michigan – Current Oakland County Prosecutor Jessica Cooper
Michigan FOIA – Named as known - deceased sex offender Christopher B Busch
Michigan FOIA – Name connected with above sex offender Dale Arthur Cooper
Busch Cooper Busch Cooper hummm…
From this Forum:
Flint, Michigan – Genesee County – Known location of pedophile ring involving Christopher Busch.
From this Forum:
Michigan FOIA & Source Information - Far reaching organized pedophile ring operating through out the state from late 1960s.
From this Forum:
FOIA & Source Information – Far reaching organized pedophile ring operating throughout the country - members from every strata of society including police, social service workers wealthy powerful people and those from the opposite end of the socioeconomic scale.
The conspiracy theories did not incubate in a vacuum. The obvious lies missing evidence and names and combative uncooperative aggressive ways that Jessica Cooper handled herself and investigations makes it clear to intelligent people that there is only one actual reason for any of it. COVER-UP COVER-UP COVER-UP!
Whoever they were protecting a long time ago they are still protecting today and I bet a lot more have been added to that list. The reason for the failed investigation about the deaths of the children we know about and many more that we don’t know about BEFORE these four killings and AFTER are direct results of COVER-UP COVER-UP COVER-UP!
From southern Wayne County to northern Leelanau County all the way up the east side of the state and back down the west side to OTHER parts of the country this was huge AND THEY KNOW IT!
I saw it posted and talked about here by Lilly Just Thinking and agreed on by others that there is no way only four kids died from these maniacs over all these decades. To think so is just plain stupid. I believe that.
If a suspect came up no matter who it was or is that could lead back to the truth of all of this then they got hidden so the case never got solved. Anyone who doesn’t see it is blind.
The people who are still alive should all go to jail and anyone who protected them should rot there too. Too bad Michigan don’t have the death penalty.
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17060 Aug 18, 2013
YIKES>>JUST LIKE ROBERT ANGLIN WAS SET UP FOR CHARLES R BLANCHARD MURDER< AND YOU ALREADY KNEW THAT>>>WHY DID YOU MENTION ANN ARBOR CO ED BEFORE- TO PLACE BLAME ON SOMEONE ELSE, IE NOT BLANCHARD>>>SEEMS YOUR FEAR IS STARTING TO SHOW< AND THE PRESS CONFERENCE HASN”T HAPPENED JUST YET>>>just thinking your BUSTED
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#9751
Remember when I brought Gary leiterman up the first time I posted. It was because he was free for 35 years after the murder of Jane Mixer, who until Leiterman's DNA was found on her things was lumped in to John Norman Collins' "Michigan Murders". While he was free he presumably did not twiddle his thumbs. He was found to possess nude photos of an underaged exchange student, which points out that naked kids and perversion at their expense were on his mind. I find it very hard to believe that he would have committed such a horrific crime and displayed the body as he did in sicko fashion then hung it up for all those years.
Another serial killer was credited with Mixer's murder and, but for a fluke, Leiterman may have never been caught. I am sure this happened many times over the years where one person was convicted of another person's crime and a killer roams free. My point is there must be countless unsolved murders and abduction/rape/murders in the U.S. It is very hard to imagine OCCK or plural killing four victims the way he or they did in two years with nothing leading up to and nothing following those crimes. I would be surprised if there are no other victims.
I am as baffled as ever as to who committed the Oakland County Child Killings. When I get judged with the clueless lightbulb it fits, but then again it is still a mystery to all of us and at this point we are all speculating. Might I suggest that if regular posters aren't posting it is because they think that is more helpful at this time.
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#9752
Correction. I don't believe Collins was convicted of jane Mixer's murder just credited with it.
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17061 Aug 18, 2013
ALL IN THE SAME AFTERNOON< YEP SHE”S WORRIED>>>
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#9754
Whatever happens with the the GJs, the investigation, or the press conference I hope it brings the truth to light and I hope if some justice can be dealt that it is. Time will tell.
If there is real info they would want it to consider with everything else and would have access to it and anything else the had knowledge of. I do not see why they would be kept from any exposure to any type of press conference or any event. Maybe I am wrong. Perhaps an expert can reply while I research it.
http://republicassembly.com/docs/evidence/gra ...

Obviously state rules can and do vary.
SEEMS HELEN IS A GOOD DETECTIVE AFTER ALL,..NICE WORK HELEN,, TO BAD SHE”S PLACED HERE TO NEVER ALLOW TRUTH AN D JUSTICE…TRUST
Helen Dagner
Petoskey, MI
#9770
just-thinking wrote:
<quoted text>
The fake passport would just give the impression that a person was out of the country. There would be no reason or relevance for a killer to actually leave the country when using a fake passport. It could also be a way to disguise the actual travel dates. In addition it could be a way to cross borders under a different identity or to obtain actual identification under an assumed name. There would be many uses for a fake passport if it was a good enough fake and the person using it was of the mind to shield his whereabouts and or identity.
That does it we are going to turn these occk cases over to you!! As you seem to be able to think things thru clearly-and that is refreshing! Great Posts and O-So true!!!
Helen Dagner
Petoskey, MI
#9779
just-thinking wrote:
<quoted text>
Hi. The impression that one has been out of the country is the actual impression of a country's stamp of place and time made in the passport booklet. Probably for our discussion here which I do not present as my theory the stamps would have also been fake. The fake passport dude would have little business without the fake passport stamps.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passport_stamp
Another good post of Interest-At the time I saw Johns Passports-I had never seen one-and did not have one and didn't know anyone who did--had I the Info you just posted-I could have picked up a lot more-I did notice tho that they were different colors (The little book covers) But I did read in the letter for the second pass port business-that Stamps could be purchase at additional cost----and there was also an add in his Paper Trail Book-that sold additional Stamps-
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17062 Aug 18, 2013
HOW COME NOBODY EVER SAW THROUGH THIS CHICK BEFOR?? LES< DAN AND ALL OF THE OTHER USELESS GARBAGE>>>ANYHOW NOBODY MENTIONED THE WORDS HIDDEN IN THE DRAWING..YET HERE SHE SAYS PEOPLE HAVE< IE THE COPS SHES COVERING WITH LIES ON MORE LIES>>TRUST
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#9792
Im trying to get up to date on this thread, just started reading yesterday and am only up to Feb 21st so far. I was going to wait until I got fully updated before saying anything, but I have to comment here.
On Feb 21, Truth Dude asked if anyone one saw anything cryptic in the drawing found in CB's bedroom. http://horror-fantasy.com/danger/Cbusch_Sketc ...
I see what could be, in a couple of places on the child's left cheek (our right, as we look at it) what could be the number 18. On his right cheek (our left) a triangle with a tree or upward pointing arrow inside and the letter F or E above it. But what intrigues me more, and I'm sure if it's really there and not a trick of the scanning, inside of the mouth there seems to be at least two words I can't make out, one on top of the other, as if someone had pressed hard on the previous page while writing something and the imprint was on the paper when the drawing was made. Does anybody else see that?
There are some here who believe they see words hidden in the drawing. It is discussed at various points in the thread, but it would really take some looking.
I’m betting this dude is Thomas E Cattel of Ferndale police, he has something to do with the cover up, and now hes’ posting from BOYNE CITY, where his family now resides..why bring up the Fox Island ring again, because it’s their illusion..of course Barbara Has the answer..
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
#9915
Knetiknrg wrote:
Was it North or South Fox Island where the sex ring was located? Can anyone provide a link where I could learn more about the whole Fox Island thing?
http://international.loc.gov/service/digsymli ...

There were other links to articles in parts of this forum. I will look back and see if they are still there. When you have time, if it interests you, you should read the entirety of this report. The link above is just one page. There is some interesting relevant testimony in front of congress. and other information.
Knetiknrg
Boyne City, MI
ALL OF THIS CHATTER ON BOB AND THE OTHER KIDS LINKED AND SHE”S STILL POINTING THE OTHER DIRECTION…pretty intelligent, by not being spiteful she’s not blowing her cover….YOU SHOULD HAVE LEARNED FROM HER STC I MEAN SEAN CALLAHAN…
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
1
Read Portraits in the Snow.
DIVINE INTERVENTION

United States

#17063 Aug 18, 2013
just-thinking
Jackson, MI
1
Read Portraits in the Snow.
MEANWHILE at this point in time PILL FICKLESON IS STILL TRYING NOT TO DROOL FROM CALLING THE AUTHORITIES AND TELLING THEM EXACTLY WHAT BOB CLAIMED>>IE KIDS NOT LINKED BURIED WITHIN THE VICINITY>>>>I saw all of this on the news and I thought…hmmm someday I’ll be able to prove I was onto the truth…HELLO FEDS...

Aaron Lee Harland better be kept safe and alive, as you will have one more lawsuit to contend with for never allowing justice to prevail...TRUST....hugs and kisses, I miss my lil daughter, taking her away from me brought this on Barbara, as I didn't do anything to deserve to lose my child...TRUST

Since: Mar 07

Detroit, MI

#17064 Aug 18, 2013
Les wrote:
I am sure I understand that Helen is nuts and has made it her life to prove John is the OCCK. But I can't understand what motivates Lilly to visciously attempt to destroy a man and his children being that they have never done any personal to her. Is it greed or ego?
Lilly just never struck me as the evil hell bent c*nt she has turned out to be. Lilly is this all
about your book? Dan, get me that dog collar. I'm gettin the itch again. I might just move up a notch on this one.
Sorry, but Helen`s story makes much more sense than yours with the exception of her two passport theory. Busch molested Gunnels and the hair DNA mitochondrially links to Gunnels. Busch was buddies with Greene. Greene wasn`t there for the last murder. Fits with what Gary said. Gary went to Filthy McNasty`s. So did David Norberg and possibly John Hastings. Hastings lived near Busch. I think John was just a wanna bee, but he had heard them discussing it all and knew where the bodies were laid out.

Last chance to look intelligent. Do you think ROBINson followed by victim on BRUCE LANE means the killer intended BATMAN since BRUCE WAYNE is BATMAN, making ROBIN then BATMAN??? Yes or no???
Reasoning

Sterling Heights, MI

#17065 Aug 18, 2013
DIVINE INTERVENTION You know if someone just squints their eyes just the right way on a sunny day looking directly into the sun, you make more sense then some of the other posters here. The old posts you are bringing up are very interesting and they were when the discussions were lively and before someone took over this board with his personal Bull$hit. So you think STC & Just Thinking are Feds? You think they may be working together to throw this investigation off? You think their are enough readers here to make it worth their efforts? You sure are taking a huge chance risking your life posting here as they zero in on you.
old Gangsta d-pot

Westland, MI

#17066 Aug 18, 2013
PROOF!!! Dat da answer is IT ALL CONNECTED TO BIGGIE N TUPAC!!!

Detective Says He Knows Who Killed The Notorious B.I.G.
Posted by Rob Kenner / Mar 9, 2012 11:34 am
Fifteen years after Biggie's murder, retired detective Greg Kading debunks a few bogus theories and explains why the case will never officially be solved.
According to the police detective who spent three years investigating the murder of Biggie Smalls, the man pictured above—Wardell Fouse a.k.a Darnell Bolton a.k.a.“Poochie”—was the triggerman who killed Biggie fifteen years ago today. His fee for murdering the greatest rapper of all time?$13,000.
On March 9, 1997, Christopher Wallace, a.k.a. The Notorious B.I.G., was shot to death while sitting in a Chevy Suburban outside of a hip-hop industry party in Los Angeles. Biggie’s drive-by shooting occurred just six months after his friend turned foe, 25-year-old Tupac Shakur, suffered a similar fate after a boxing match in Las Vegas. These killings remain the worst tragedies in hip-hop history.
Seeing the two greatest rappers of a generation cut down in their prime was bad enough. The death of two young men who were so beloved by their family, friends, and fans was worse still. Adding insult to injury, Big and Pac were both murdered on busy city streets, in view of numerous witnesses. Yet there has never been an arrest in either case and both murders remain officially unsolved to this day.
Greg Kading is neither a journalist nor a conspiracy theorist. A retired L.A.P.D. detective, he was in charge of the special task force that investigated Christopher Wallace’s murder.
Although the police investigations in Los Angeles and Las Vegas have failed to bring the truth to light, there is no shortage of websites, documentaries, and books detailing various theories and counter-theories—ranging from rap beef and gang violence to crooked cops and government conspiracies. But the latest book to be published, Murder Rap: The Untold Story of the Biggie Smalls & Tupac Shakur Murder Investigations. by Greg Kading (second photo), is different from the rest.
Kading is neither a journalist nor a conspiracy theorist. A retired L.A.P.D. detective, he was in charge of the special task force that investigated Christopher Wallace’s murder between 2006 and 2009. After Biggie’s mother Voletta Wallace filed suit against the City of Los Angeles and the L.A.P.D.—seeking hundreds of millions of dollars in damages—the department was highly motivated to solve the case. That’s when Kading got the assignment.
After his efforts led to two sworn confessions from people who said they played a part in the killings of Wallace and Shakur, Kading was suddenly pulled off the case. At the time, he was under investigation by L.A.P.D. Internal Affairs for allegedly making false statements on an affidavit in a separate case. However, in the end, Internal Affairs cleared Kading of any wrongdoing. Around the same time, the Wallace family’s lawsuit was dismissed.
When the 22-year veteran saw the case he built being shelved, he became so frustrated that he quit the force—but not before making copies of his evidence so that he could put all his findings into a book. His conclusions are controversial to be sure, but they are so thoroughly researched that they’re hard to ignore.
Complex caught up with Kading to talk about the results of his investigation, why no arrests have ever been made, and why he believes these cases will never be officially solved.

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