Since: Mar 07

Detroit, MI

#13061 Oct 21, 2012
Les Martin wrote:
<quoted text>
This is interesting. The dog matches the breed of dog hairs found on some of the victims. They only found black (one) and white animal hairs on the victims. Buster is black and white. I was involved in a meeting with numerous LE about the dog and everyone gasped when they saw the picture of Buster.
The person that presented the picture to the group acted like "brace yourself before I show you this picture".
Kdogg got the same reaction when he told a different group of LE what the breed and colors of the dog were.
I have always maintained throughout my posts that the black hair in particular will be a DNA match. Only the investigators know why I specifically make the claim about the black hair.
Wow, how rare, a black and white dog. What are the odds? My brother had a black and white beagle. Gary gave me a picture of his neighbors black and white dog. Why I have no idea and told me that the previous dog just died and it was all white. Dog looked like some long haired terrier/collie breed. I repeat how RARE is a black and white dog??????Odds must be a million and one against it at least. LMAO
Reasoning

Sterling Heights, MI

#13062 Oct 22, 2012
Les Martin wrote:
<quoted text>
I got a little newsy news for you Helen. About half of the readers on this site already knew for a fact that the meeting happened. You my darling are being left in the dark. They are all getting a dose of your ridiculously blind statements.
Let's see here. We have these meetings between LE and Les Martin. Les has stated before that he actually had contact with the forensics team directly. This is rather unusual in itself. They have already covered a Buster photo and they grasped with excitement over the dog type. Now we have KDOGG (Keven R) that actually had meetings with other LE staff over this same matter. About half the readers here know all about these meetings. I'm willing to bet that they are held to confidentiality. Still Helen is being accused of making blind statements and obstructing justice. NOW WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE?
David Shurter

Council Bluffs, IA

#13063 Oct 22, 2012
If Helen knows so much- why isn't anyone contacting her?

Again- everyone knows who did it and yet here we are- 30+ years later and still there is no resolution. Helen would say that the cops and detectives are to blame- and maybe they are- since Helen KNOWS who did it but isn't saying cause she doesn't want the media attention- and yet she is in here trashing anyone who disagrees with her or is offering another suggestion.

She is so sickening nice on the phone- but in here it shows what she is really all about. You guys are nasty to each other- and gang up like most groups do (as groups generally respond in certain ways with each other.

And Les- damn- people in here have been ultra critical that I said Tullock's office called me- and without speaking to them personally- have convinced themselves that that they KNOW why I was called- although they have no clue what is going on down here.

Convinced that I must be Bob- I have been dismissed- ridiculed, and attacked for simply asking a few questions and suggesting that MI could somehow be connected to Omaha- which is something most of you know absolutely nothing about.

Helen- if you are so determined that you are right and have all this proof- why don't you write a book and release it? Thats right- you dont want the media attention. And yet you seek as much attention as you can get in this room. I think if you really knew- you would have already done this- because if anything- you LIKE the attention that this gives you. Most old people are lonely- so there is nothing to be ashamed of.

However- your general attitude in here is one of a knowitall and it is difficult to take- since your talking about a case 30+ years old and there is still no resolution. Which makes ALL the info questionable if you ask me. If it isn't solved- then chances are they are either 1. Not interested in the truth- or 2. You guys don't seem to know enough to interest those who do know.

Ricki Chadeck's case was known as the Babysitting killer- because he was so well taken care of before he was murdered. Same with your four. Helen will say that all I can think about is Cult, Cult, Cult- but when there are so similarites to what happened down here- it is hard not to think that. But because it disagrees with what Helen believes- she will proabably visciously attack again- but it is no matter. What I am concerned about is police- and I will probably make a phone call this week to make sure that they got my letter and book. Tullock's office at least gave me hope that that they are at least checking into the situations that Bob told them about- which is similar I guess to what I have been saying. That is more telling to me than anything that happens in here.
Les Martin

Warren, MI

#13064 Oct 22, 2012
Reasoning wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's see here. We have these meetings between LE and Les Martin. Les has stated before that he actually had contact with the forensics team directly. This is rather unusual in itself. They have already covered a Buster photo and they grasped with excitement over the dog type. Now we have KDOGG (Keven R) that actually had meetings with other LE staff over this same matter. About half the readers here know all about these meetings. I'm willing to bet that they are held to confidentiality. Still Helen is being accused of making blind statements and obstructing justice. NOW WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE?
You have to understand. They were much more interested in my participation than if I was telling the truth about Punky. They can't investigate or charge a dead man. Jessica Copperhead has made that clear. When Kdogg was asked what type of dog Punky had the detectives all looked at each other with raised eyebrows. There are at least 5 readers here that know for a fact that these meetings took place and some of the readers were there.
Helen is obstructing justice by attacking anyone with possible evidence. All of her statements are made from her gut feelings and nothing from fact. She pretends to be an expert on every subject and she talks out of both sides of her mouth. When a news release appears to be in her favor or shoots down someone else's suspect she is in her glory and the news releasess are based on fact. When a news release is not in her favor LE are a bunch of lying SOBs. As stupid as Helen is she puts on her granny glasses and presents her hopes and wishes as facts of the case. Sometimes entertaining and the judge marks reflect what people think of her expertise.
She is always the first to attack and pretend she is an innocent victim. That part she just helps make my case when she tries to disassemble my claims.
Les Martin

Warren, MI

#13065 Oct 22, 2012
DETROIT wrote:
<quoted text>Wow, how rare, a black and white dog. What are the odds? My brother had a black and white beagle. Gary gave me a picture of his neighbors black and white dog. Why I have no idea and told me that the previous dog just died and it was all white. Dog looked like some long haired terrier/collie breed. I repeat how RARE is a black and white dog??????Odds must be a million and one against it at least. LMAO
Dan the Dagger has jumped into the ring and hits Les the Mess over the head with his wheel chair. Les the Mess gives Dan the Dagger the helicopter twirl and slams him to the mat.

First off I have never seen a black and white beagle without red. However maybe the red hairs don't shed as much. Chuckle. I have learned to hate LOLs because they remind me of scum. A high school has actually banned LOLs from being used in school writings.
Yes Dan many people have black and white dogs. There is nothing remarkable about it. However you like most people have no concept of math. That is why the lottery is so rich. There is nothing remarkable about hitting one number but it is extremely remarkable to match 5 or 6 numbers. The odds of Punky not being the OCCK would be about the same as hitting 3 lotteries in a row. You like everyone else loves to down play one factor of my evidence and ignore the fact all of my facts line up. Laugh away you simple minded freak of nature. I have to laugh when Helen buddies up with you Dan because in reality you turn her stomach. But how’s a walking dead woman going to fight a gorilla by herself?
Reasoning

Sterling Heights, MI

#13066 Oct 22, 2012
Les Martin wrote:
<quoted text>
You have to understand. They were much more interested in my participation than if I was telling the truth about Punky. They can't investigate or charge a dead man. Jessica Copperhead has made that clear. When Kdogg was asked what type of dog Punky had the detectives all looked at each other with raised eyebrows. There are at least 5 readers here that know for a fact that these meetings took place and some of the readers were there.
Helen is obstructing justice by attacking anyone with possible evidence. All of her statements are made from her gut feelings and nothing from fact. She pretends to be an expert on every subject and she talks out of both sides of her mouth. When a news release appears to be in her favor or shoots down someone else's suspect she is in her glory and the news releasess are based on fact. When a news release is not in her favor LE are a bunch of lying SOBs. As stupid as Helen is she puts on her granny glasses and presents her hopes and wishes as facts of the case. Sometimes entertaining and the judge marks reflect what people think of her expertise.
She is always the first to attack and pretend she is an innocent victim. That part she just helps make my case when she tries to disassemble my claims.
Boy Les. Imagine finally zeroing in on the Dog type connection that they have been searching for over 35 years. And here you have it handed over to them. Raised eyebrows and the works just to completely drop it because the Grand Jury can't look into dead guys. After everything else I've read, I guess I'm just about ready to believe anything.
Les Martin

Warren, MI

#13067 Oct 22, 2012
Reasoning wrote:
<quoted text>
Boy Les. Imagine finally zeroing in on the Dog type connection that they have been searching for over 35 years. And here you have it handed over to them. Raised eyebrows and the works just to completely drop it because the Grand Jury can't look into dead guys. After everything else I've read, I guess I'm just about ready to believe anything.
I am sure you heard Jessica Cooper with your own ears. She said in a news conference "We are not a historical society, we will not investigate a dead man". "That just leaves good ole Les and hopefully he will die soon so we don't have to investigate him".

Since: Mar 07

Detroit, MI

#13070 Oct 22, 2012
Les Martin wrote:
<quoted text>
I am sure you heard Jessica Cooper with your own ears. She said in a news conference "We are not a historical society, we will not investigate a dead man". "That just leaves good ole Les and hopefully he will die soon so we don't have to investigate him".
Les,What was your friends name that you allege was involved with Pervinkler, or that Pervinkler confided in, about the Judy Ferro murder? Was his name Carl or was that your brother in law?
David Shurter

Council Bluffs, IA

#13071 Oct 22, 2012
again- an attack Helen.

If they knew as much as you claim to do- then why has this case been dragging on the way it has?

Must be some reason for it.
Reasoning

Sterling Heights, MI

#13072 Oct 22, 2012
David Shurter wrote:
again- an attack Helen.
If they knew as much as you claim to do- then why has this case been dragging on the way it has?
Must be some reason for it.
Well David you seem to have so many answers in the short time you've looked into the OCCK angle that maybe you can explain to us some day.
Gum Shoe

Ypsilanti, MI

#13073 Oct 22, 2012
Helen Dagner wrote:
CasObs~ Your wasting your time trying to get through to David-He like Les -GumShoe and others here-well in fact there are only two of you -yourself and Reasoning-that know enough about these cases to even comment-I addressed that in the two posts that I made last night-and used your names...David knows very well why he was called-and he wasn't the only one -Ben Harbor of Atlanta Ga was also called-because that is who "BOB" stole the Info from-When David called me-to brag that he had been called-I took a lot of time to explain to him why-so for him to come back on Topix and say-or try to make it appear that they the Investigators are looking into this-because they think there is something to this Cult deal---Well nothing could be further from the truth-There is nothing to the Cult Deal-s has started to come out-and will be made very clear to everyone soon-One of the reasons I posted to you and reasoning last night-was I wanted to bring to your attention -that the three of us-would find all the new Info released to the public-very interesting- Because we knew all of this and that it could all be found on the videos-lol--but it must have just been to much info for the moderator to digest-
Helen you are amusing as nowhere on this blog site does it say Helen Danger has the paten and the authority to dictate who can and cannot blog. The bloggers all need to stay on topic here but for some reason it bothers you that educated people take an interest in the resolution of this case. Stay on your own site and blow your own horn there because you aren’t as important or an intricate part in solving this case as you’d like people to believe. This is all I am going to deviate from the topic at hand so please leave the off color comments to your own site. Enough said.
David Shurter

Council Bluffs, IA

#13075 Oct 22, 2012
Reasoning- first- wipe off your nose- it is a bit brown.

I am just saying that the angle I am presenting can't be completely dismissed because since there is still no resolution to the case- even after 30+ yrs- that something is LACKING from it- like maybe a sense of justice.

Helen says she has the answers but doesn't want to come forward due to the media that would descend- and yet she is in here almost every day expounding upon how she KNOWS who the killer is- while people like reasoning run right along with her- even though there is still NO RESOLUTION to the case.

I don't know the details- I do down here in Omaha but I don't up there. However- I do know that no one has been arrested or even detained on the case- so whatever info you all have must be lacking as well.

Interesting that withgreatrespect went away right after I was slammed with info that could basically have only come from my family (like the date of my parents divorce). I think that there are a bunch of losers in here TRYING SPECIFICALLY to mess with the issues in here- since ALL OF YOU CANT HAVE THE ANSWER.
Lest the Pest

Warren, MI

#13076 Oct 22, 2012
Helen Dagner wrote:
David-Why would I want to write a book-when my Occk Video Views,Have already reached over One Million Views...
I hear your finger has the most well exercized muscle in your body.
Lest the Pest

Warren, MI

#13077 Oct 22, 2012
DETROIT wrote:
<quoted text>Les,What was your friends name that you allege was involved with Pervinkler, or that Pervinkler confided in, about the Judy Ferro murder? Was his name Carl or was that your brother in law?
My brother in law (currently married to Jackie's sister) was best friends with Gary Pervinkler. This was told to me in front of his mother and brother so I have to feel he would not say something in front of them that was not true. His name is Scott Merrit.
Now do you want this info for legitimate research or are you just looking for something to belittle me with? Or do I have to give you another helicopter twirl?
David Shurter

Council Bluffs, IA

#13079 Oct 22, 2012
Helen- again- you think WAY to high of yourself. That is typical of a drinker- again.

You are the one who turned on me- not the other way around- for whatever reasons you give yourself- you are still a snake.

Down here- you don't figure into ANYTHING. No one has any clue as to who you are. And down here is where I am primarily interested. Personally I could care less what MI is all about or the particulars, but I DID find it interesting that Tullock was not even interested in you.

If anyone in here thinks they know me because of the stuff I type in here- then they are delusional. Just because you have had a few phone calls from me says the same about you- even though I did get the distinct impression that you drink- although you dont like to do that and talk on the phone at the same time. However- it is safe to say that neither of us really know anything about the other.

You attack me and think that judging me makes you out to be more than what you are- but it doesn't. Attacking anyone and everyone who would disagree with you shows that you are a critical old hag, and you have your own mode of operandi with all of this in order to keep ahold of it.

No one can talk about the OCCK case without talking about you Helen- you have made your life out to be this case and to seperate you from soemthing you so lovingly embrace on a daily basis would just be downright cruel. I would never do that.
David Shurter

Council Bluffs, IA

#13081 Oct 22, 2012
What the hell are you talking about Helen- the only other person in my house is my husband and he thinks you are a total flake- so I am not sure who you think was at my house early in the morning waiting anxiously for me to call you- but I assure you- that is something your alcoholic mind made up. Why on earth would anyone down here want to talk with you- no one down here even KNOWS about the OCCK case- that is only in MI- the rest of the world doesn't even know your shit exists. Let alone any of my friends. I was the only one talking with you on the phone- there were NO OTHER PEOPLE- and why you would say this makes me even further your motives.

what we have down here is a bunch of perps who act like they are in the know and act like they are the authorities but their job is only to create disinfo. Much like you said you do- as you dont agree with me and yet you repost my stuff on other sites.

You are a snake Helen- and from the last post- a lying snake. You have more reasons than just seeking justice in here = otherwise you would have ALREADY done what you had to do to make all of this right. Instead- you just attack those who bring a different story to the table like you are some sort of authority- although no one other than those in here even know that you exist.

None of my friends have a clue as to who you are. I know that hurts- but I am sorry. You are not as infamous as you would chose to believe.

Maybe Tullock has no interest in you because they check in this room occasionally and have seen how you act towards others. you say that this site has had a million hits- but then assure everyone that no one official- such as Tullocks office- could be one of those. Like you would have any clue whatsoever.

You talk out your ass Helen- most alcoholics do- and that is probably why no one other than a few in here find you worthwhile in all of this. Your a joke- with a site that you have to be on constantly so that you can defend- not your position generally- but yourself personally.

I think that you are a joke myself.
David Shurter

Council Bluffs, IA

#13083 Oct 22, 2012
lol- you say that it a qualification in here not to have your brain wired right- and yet you are the largest poster in here.

I actually agree with you to be honest- anyone who deals with this room and thinks that it is all that doesn't have that much going on in their lives. Most in here seem like losers who have nothing better to do with their lives than play amateur investigators, and we can all see how successful you all are- since this case is 30+ yrs old now. Wow- with results like that- you all must be very proud of yourselves. Well, for most of you- that goes without saying.

What is different from me than most of you in here is that I will publically- with my name and not as an anon- will say that most of you in here seem like your losers. there doesn't seem to be a "judge this" button for that- but oh well. If anything you all have proved how ineffective you are. Sad.
David Shurter

Council Bluffs, IA

#13084 Oct 22, 2012
Helen- do you just make it up as you go? That is a total lie- who exactly WAS this person. A name. I have never had anyone call you- but then- drinking as you do- I could say that over and over and you wouldnt get it.

Funny- now you are just making up stories to try and discredit me. What did you talk about- and why did I want you to talk to this ficticious person? What info could you possible have that would make any difference down here?

Let alone up there. I mean- honestly- looking at it- you havent made on bit of difference Helen. That is probably why Tullocks office is not interested in you.

Judge away- but you are a liar Helen. Since you remember the whole ordeal so well- please- explain who it was and why it was so important that you talk to them. I would like to hear this myself- hell, Im home tonight and have nothing better to do than listen to you lie.

But the question is for me and will remain- WHY ARE YOU LYING ABOUT SOMETHING SO STUPID? Are you trying to say that I find you more than what you are? You have a nasty, smoke addled voice and you are about as unpleasent on the phone as you are in here, so please- tell me Helen- what was the conversation about? You remember the details- so I would like to hear them.

Since: Aug 11

Naperville, IL

#13085 Oct 22, 2012
David, are you Bob?

Since: Aug 11

Naperville, IL

#13086 Oct 22, 2012
I am asking as someone who has been traumatized by what has been posted here. Yeah, I can take it. Let's hear it.

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