The Oakland County Child Killer

Since: Aug 11

Naperville, IL

#6859 Aug 20, 2011
If you consider all of the names of predators listed in the various articles from 1976 forward, and consider that at LEAST three-times as many unnamed men were involved, there are tens of thousands of child victims, primarily boys.

Since: Aug 11

Naperville, IL

#6860 Aug 20, 2011
"Campers." Give me a break. Required equipment for kids: none; no clothing needed. Required equipment for adult campers: Polaroid cameras and 8 mm video cameras. Animals. And most of these animals WALKED.
Les

Warren, MI

#6861 Aug 20, 2011
I just read an old internet thread that places
Rev Gary Berthiaume at Ascension Parish. The same church that my brother in law, Gary, was a janitor.
This is the first time I have ever read this.
Is there anyone here, even Dan, that can elaborate if this true or knows what years Berthiaume was there? I would have pasted the post but I was told that is a no-no.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#6862 Aug 20, 2011
Henri,

One of the most despicable exploitations of victims & their families,(often by self-proclaimed victim advocates or other persons who have offered them some kind of assistance or support), would have to be - attempts to manipulate them into expanding the list of persons who abused them, or who are known by them to be abusers, to include highly implausible or blatantly impossible names of public figures and/or celebrities whom (coincidentally of course) the "victim advocate" happens to hold a grudge against.

A principal figure in the Franklin case was exploited in this manner, by a long list of 'advocates' and 'investigators' who successively "debriefed" him - by feeding him information they wanted him to regurgitate - and then coincidentally extracted from him a 'testimony' that one of the advocate/investigator's enemies had abused him.

The victim that these people tried to turn into a ventriloquist's dummy developed glitches, however, he would make mistakes and get things wrong - inadvertently revealing that he didn't actually know anything about the person he was accusing and therefore that the accusation was false. In one example of this, an investigator is recording the Franklin victim's testimony and asks him if he can remember the names of any Senators or Governors that allegedly abused him. The victim hums & haws and can't seem to bring any names to memory, except:
"There is ONE Senator I remember, I remember his name. I'm certain of it" he says. The investigator prompts him to reveal the name.
"Senator Barney Franks. I'm certain of it" states the victim. The investigator queries him: "FrankS, with an "S"?" "Yes" states the victim, "I'm certain of it".

But there is no Senator Barney Franks. There never has been a Senator Barney Franks. There is a Congressman Barney Frank - with no "S" - the obviously intended target of this slanderous false accusation. Barney Frank is an openly gay congressperson and that fact, in and of itself, is so offensive to some Americans that they would do/say ANYTHING they believed might hurt his chances of being re-elected yet again.
Henri McPhee

Enniskillen, UK

#6863 Aug 21, 2011
I agree that politicians, and even teachers, can be falsely accused with regard to all these pedophile activities. The fact remains that something smells about drug trafficking and pedophile parties with regard to the Bushes and the Clintons. This has never been properly investigated, or reported, by the police, CIA, FBI, or by CNN or Fox News, or by Lockheed Martin and General Motors.

The CIA have been described as the Cocaine Importation Agency in the past for some reason. Drug smuggling through Fort Bragg was very relevant to the MacDonald case false conviction.

I also agree that many child prostitutes, like any other prostitutes, are willing participants and victims and make good money from it. It could easily be that many of them are not capable of telling the truth.

The thing that annoys me that the police adopt the attitude that child prostitution and pedophile parties and activities don't happen. It may be beyond their comprehension and experience. In the Ramsey case, Nancy Krebs was treated as a fruitloop, and deluded, by the police for making similar allegations.

In the UK there have been some big recent corruption pedophile scandals in regard to orphanages in Northern Ireland, Wales and the Channel island of Jersey involving people in high places. There was another big pedophile scandal in Portuagl, and in Belgium. There have been no prosecutions that I'm aware of, except for a few low types.

I don't know if this is directly relevant to the OCCK murders in Michigan but it looks to me as if people who have spoken out or contacted the police have ended up dead. I think it's likely that there was more than one person involved in those OCCK murders, or Cass Corridor murders, and that connections could be made between those different people.

There is a bit about this matter from an old English law book published in 1932:

"The first point is one to which I have already referred, the fact that mistaken inferences are often drawn from a man or woman having told told a confused, lying story in the witness box. Every common law clerk knows the way in which witnesses will sometimes lie in the most aimless way when their proofs of evidence are being taken. Statements are made which are recklessly untrue, yet without any possible motive."
Lilly

Denver, CO

#6864 Aug 21, 2011
withgreatrespect,

Pedophileophobia.com
“A site to combat the ever growing hysteria over pedophilia.”

THE ABOVE SITE AND THEIR AGENDA IS THE TRUE TRAGEDY.

They have found a footing and a place for advocacy. For the very reasons you describe.
When the authorities push the accuser into even just one falsehood for the sake of an AGENDA and then when the falsehood is uncovered (as it should be) you have those who will believe the Entire Story of Abuse is a Lie.

Never has there been a more perfect example of what you describe then the McMartin Pre-Schools Scandal. And in fact this site uses this case as the corner stone of their argument of “Pedophile Hysteria.”

These were real little ones and some of their descriptions of what happened to move them around, interactive exercises-rituals (drawings etc.) which were sent home to be hung on the refrigerator and also acted as a reminder to insure their silence, some of the actual abuse parties, locales and photo ops were told through a baby’s eyes.

But then the zealots and hysteria mongers got involved. The limb they went out on to push their agenda attempting to pack the numbers of abused kids, while putting words in their little mouths and then the huge mistakes made while questioning the children-which were not “clean” interviews and an attempt to include every adult in the school were all tactics that made for a defense attorney’s dream.

This caused one of the most expensive three ring circus trials and media feeding frenzies in history. THEY ALL eventually walked and have become the perfect MARTYRS for the cause of pedophiles everywhere.

They now describe the little ones’ descriptions as Bizarre-leaving every small child vulnerable to this example should they “tell.”

One would have to read the entire story to not be pulled into the LIE that the “Whole Story Was a Lie.” Many of us here are very familiar with the huge numbers of kids ritually abused through camps, schools and organizations. We are familiar with some of the stories which have similar details. So we are better prepared to move past the pedophiles’ bull-sh-t claims and defense. But the average Joe buys into this crap, leaving kids evermore vulnerable.

Be prepared to have this site turn your stomachs. withgreatrespect’s description of the damage this kind of betrayal does to the truly abused kids, is right on.
batts

United States

#6865 Aug 21, 2011
Does anybody know when the 555 Building was constructed? Were there many apartment complexes in Birmingham prior to the 555?
Les

Warren, MI

#6866 Aug 21, 2011
I read a thread yesterday that in the murder case of Donna Serra in 1972 in Macomb County that they thought that her killer joined the military after killing her. Does anyone here have any idea how they would know that without having a specific suspect?
Her death was similar to the OCCK case in that she was held captive before her body was dumped.
Could it be simply because the killings of this nature stopped for a couple of years?
This implies the killer was about 18 years old at the time.
The thread also indicated this case was poorly handled from a records keeping stand point.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#6867 Aug 22, 2011
Very well said, Lilly!

CandyO

Greenwood, IN

#6868 Aug 22, 2011
batts wrote:
Does anybody know when the 555 Building was constructed? Were there many apartment complexes in Birmingham prior to the 555?
555 was built in the mid 70's. There were apartment complexes all over B'Ham before 555.
batts

United States

#6869 Aug 22, 2011
Thanks Candy...the date is hard to track down for some reason. Just curious.
Helen Dagner

Petoskey, MI

#6871 Aug 24, 2011
Kdogg call me-my number is in the book-I need some Info from you~It is Important -If you don't have a free call service-send me an email at [email protected] your phone number and I will call you~

Since: Aug 11

Naperville, IL

#6872 Aug 24, 2011
Helen, that sketch on your site of the man in a car with two dogs is very interesting (and freaky). A guy posted long ago that a man got out of his car to chase him when he was a young kid and that the man then let his two dogs run after him. He hid; the dogs didn't find him and the man left.

You also post this link, which others might find interesting as well:

http://www.wxyz.com/dpp/news/local_news/inves...
Helen Dagner

Petoskey, MI

#6873 Aug 24, 2011
mybrotherskeeper wrote:
Helen, that sketch on your site of the man in a car with two dogs is very interesting (and freaky). A guy posted long ago that a man got out of his car to chase him when he was a young kid and that the man then let his two dogs run after him. He hid; the dogs didn't find him and the man left.
You also post this link, which others might find interesting as well:
http://www.wxyz.com/dpp/news/local_news/inves...
What is more Interesting is that we have and ID on the Man-From one person and a ID on the Dogs from another-and low and behold-we have been talking about this family for 20 years...and it just never ends- Yes I have problems posting other news site URL's-hafe the time they don't show up-lol
Les

Warren, MI

#6874 Aug 24, 2011
Helen Dagner wrote:
Kdogg call me-my number is in the book-I need some Info from you~It is Important -If you don't have a free call service-send me an email at [email protected] your phone number and I will call you~
I really question the intelligence of some of you people when Helen can't even ask someone to contact her without getting judge marks.
You don't judge stuff like that you idiots.
CandyO

Greenwood, IN

#6875 Aug 25, 2011
Ignore the judging. The person who judges a simple request with peanuts and mean face is an angry, lonely person who thinks those little icons empower them. It doesn't. I'm waiting for my own peanuts on this.
Les

Warren, MI

#6876 Aug 25, 2011
I have opened my book back up for the first time in years. Wolf in a Sheep’s Clothing.
Here is some quotes from the preface.

In the fall of 1984. retiring Michigan Police Captain Robert H. Robertson, the coordinator of the (OCCK) investigation, asked me if I would be interested in writing a book on the case. I agreed. My only condition was that I be allowed access to all records and documents pertaining to the investigation and that Robertson remain readily accessible as my technical advisor and collaborator.
Les

Warren, MI

#6877 Aug 25, 2011
Page 79 WIASC

"I saw this boy, talking to a man who was standing beside one of those funny looking little Gremlin cars. I know that is what it was because I always have to smile everytime I see them on television"

My comment. Four detectives have claimed the woman was wrong. The trouble is none of them agree on what she saw. A Opal Cadet, a Maverick, a Vega and other cars were named as the suspects car.
Gum Shoe

Canton, MI

#6878 Aug 25, 2011
What is interesteing though is the Christopher Busch dove a blue Vega with a White Hockey Stick type stripe down the middle. Busch's car could have easily been confused as a Gremlin.
Les

Warren, MI

#6879 Aug 25, 2011
PG 185 WIASC

In accordance with referenced telephone call May 5, 1977 it is noted that ALL of the victims were thoroughly cleaned with "Phisohex" a product which was taken off the market several years ago.

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