Jonbenet 'accidentally' what????
robert

Yellowknife, Canada

#26 Jan 18, 2014
moonjack wrote:
What sort of fill in the blank answer do the IDIs have for this statement by John?????

10 JOHN RAMSEY: Very little. It's hard to discuss
11 with her accidentally (INAUDIBLE).
12 MIKE KANE: What would that be?
---#12---Mike Kane ask " What would that be?" There must be more to what was said-- this leaves one hanging.
Referring to the word ACCIDENTALLY meaning JR slipped and referring to JB dying from an accident which is not murder , leaves one to question why would he say accident?

Since: May 13

Location hidden

#27 Jan 18, 2014
2 MIKE KANE: The autopsy report, have you
3 seen it?
4 JOHN RAMSEY: No.
5 MIKE KANE: You haven't seen it?
6 JOHN RAMSEY: No, I have not. I can't look at
7 that.
8 MIKE KANE: Okay. Have you discussed in general
9 what's in there, in general?
10 JOHN RAMSEY: Very little. It's hard to discuss
11 with her accidentally (INAUDIBLE).
12 MIKE KANE: What would that be?
13 JOHN RAMSEY: That there was her skull
14 fracture; that there were abrasions in her pubic
15 area; two of her organs were swollen which
16 indicated a slow death.
17 MIKE KANE: Did you do your own investigation
18 into this? Did you have any experts look into
19 those -- like you said there were bruises in the
20 pubic area?
21 JOHN RAMSEY: I don't know if we did.
22 MIKE KANE: I mean here, now?
23 JOHN RAMSEY: I know. No, not to my knowledge.
24 MIKE KANE: I'll bring another aspect about
25 the (INAUDIBLE) fragments.
0363
1 JOHN RAMSEY: Well I think we've had
2 pathologists look into the report, but I don't
3 know where or what they said.
4 MIKE KANE: You never received the report
5 then?
6 JOHN RAMSEY: No.
7 MIKE KANE:(INAUDIBLE)
8 JOHN RAMSEY: No.
9 MIKE KANE: How about Mrs. Ramsey?
10 JOHN RAMSEY: No.
11 MIKE KANE: What do you understand about
12 that trauma, vaginal trauma?
13 JOHN RAMSEY: It's something I don't like
14 to think about. I don't understand or read
15 anything about it, because there are certain facts
16 that I just can't bear to know.

Maybe the "her" John was referring to was Patsy? Kane seems to be trying to find out exactly how much the both of them knew about JonBenet's injuries. Maybe Patsy unintentionally ("accidentally") read something printed somewhere about findings from the autopsy?

(Just a thought.)
robert

Yellowknife, Canada

#28 Jan 18, 2014
--I don't recall the mention of two swollen organs in the autopsy report--JR adds " which indicated a slow death" on his own-- which is not in the autopsy . I assume the fragments they was talking about where that of the paint brush. Something don't add up on the whole interview if JR didn't know if he had his own investigators investigate into this.
Pat

Netherlands

#30 Jan 19, 2014
robert wrote:
--I don't recall the mention of two swollen organs in the autopsy report--JR adds " which indicated a slow death" on his own-- which is not in the autopsy . I assume the fragments they was talking about where that of the paint brush. Something don't add up on the whole interview if JR didn't know if he had his own investigators investigate into this.
Good point.
The cords were not tied tight as one may think. So this was a slow death. She was played with by the killer.

Sad to think about

“If life gives you melons”

Since: Nov 06

You might be dyslexic

#34 Jan 21, 2014
robert wrote:
--I don't recall the mention of two swollen organs in the autopsy report--JR adds " which indicated a slow death" on his own-- which is not in the autopsy . I assume the fragments they was talking about where that of the paint brush. Something don't add up on the whole interview if JR didn't know if he had his own investigators investigate into this.
Robert, JR parroted whatever Smit told him, and Smit wasn't right about anything. And then there was the fact that JR couldn't tell the same story more than once without deviating from his prior statements, even in his own books. The simple truth was you knew JR was lying if his lips were moving.
real Topaz

AOL

#35 Jan 21, 2014
I hardly think she was 'toyed' with by the killer judging by loose wristcords. The tape on her mouth was put there post mortem, so it's highly doubtful the killer toyed with her while she was able to scream and then decided to cover her mouth once she died. Way to revise the facts of this case and make her death something it wasn't.
If anyone 'toyed' with her it was her molester..pre death. The wristcords would have shown there'd been a struggle if she were tortured and toyed with and they did not. They were neatly tied OVER her shirt cuffs without any signs of struggle or life. aye aye aye

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#36 Jan 22, 2014
The cords were loose because they were only put on as staging, only to look menacing not to function as restraints. They were part of the costume, like an accessory, a prop in the drama of Jonbenet and what Patsy wanted for her and needed from her.

Jonbenet didn't die a slow death and was not tortured.

Victims of such horrific deaths wear a mask on their face refelcting these things with eyes swollen and red from crying and stained chapped cheeks, mouths are open in gapping silent screams and even the body position is contorted.

Jonbenet died quietly, without even a whimper....... as thought Burke knocked her old cold and the family dysfunction took over inventing an alternative scenario to keep the disgusting truth about Jonbenet and Burke silent.

But of course not a single IDI came forward with a plausible word that John couldn't look at the autopsy because 'Jonbenet accidentally ______'.
robert

Yellowknife, Canada

#37 Jan 22, 2014
moonjack wrote:
The cords were loose because they were only put on as staging, only to look menacing not to function as restraints. They were part of the costume, like an accessory, a prop in the drama of Jonbenet and what Patsy wanted for her and needed from her.
Jonbenet didn't die a slow death and was not tortured.
Victims of such horrific deaths wear a mask on their face refelcting these things with eyes swollen and red from crying and stained chapped cheeks, mouths are open in gapping silent screams and even the body position is contorted.
Jonbenet died quietly, without even a whimper....... as thought Burke knocked her old cold and the family dysfunction took over inventing an alternative scenario to keep the disgusting truth about Jonbenet and Burke silent.
But of course not a single IDI came forward with a plausible word that John couldn't look at the autopsy because 'Jonbenet accidentally ______'.
-- When Kane ask" What would that be?" Does not fit with Dieing or Hit in the head either .

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#38 Jan 22, 2014
I take the 'what would that be' as is another term for what did you say, come again, repeat that, or HUH?

Again, I'm sure the technology exists to unlock the inaudibles from the transcripts.

“May you all come home”

Since: Mar 07

safely Bless you all

#39 Jan 22, 2014
real Topaz wrote:
I hardly think she was 'toyed' with by the killer judging by loose wristcords. The tape on her mouth was put there post mortem, so it's highly doubtful the killer toyed with her while she was able to scream and then decided to cover her mouth once she died. Way to revise the facts of this case and make her death something it wasn't.
If anyone 'toyed' with her it was her molester..pre death. The wristcords would have shown there'd been a struggle if she were tortured and toyed with and they did not. They were neatly tied OVER her shirt cuffs without any signs of struggle or life. aye aye aye
This death was not a long drawn out process, despite what some would like everyone to believe. Once you realize that this is obvious staging, it becomes clear that this was not a planned crime and was done to throw everyone off the track, which it did initially, unfortunately

She was not tied tightly at all, the tape was applied after she died. This is staging, plain and simple. She was not hung, she was not toyed with, she was not struggling or fighting. She was fatally injured during ---------- and the Ramseys needed to stage the scene to throw suspicion outside the house and its occupants at the time. They couldn't and WOULDN'T leave her body out for two MAIN reasons. The first reason is because of possibly being seen and the second was loving her and not being able to leave her out in the cold with the wildlife.

All my opinion

“May you all come home”

Since: Mar 07

safely Bless you all

#40 Jan 22, 2014
moonjack wrote:
I take the 'what would that be' as is another term for what did you say, come again, repeat that, or HUH?
Again, I'm sure the technology exists to unlock the inaudibles from the transcripts.
Not only does the technology exist, but all they'd have to do is REVISIT John and ASK HIM LOL, but I'm sure they have already figured it out, whatever it was anyway. I'm sure it wasn't anything exculpatory or they would have told us :)........a million times LOL

Since: Jul 14

Location hidden

#44 Feb 4, 2015
alexa3 wrote:
<quoted text>
It would also make sense if he said that he found the body at 11 meaning 11 pm. This gives plenty of time to do plenty of staging.
He meant 11am.

Steve Thomas - JB:ITRMI- Page 138
Unexpectedly, a witness stepped forward and broke both his silence and John Ramsey's story about the timing of the discovery of JonBenet's body.
In a telephone interview, Stewart Long, the boyfriend of John Ramsey's daughter Melinda, recounted for me the sudden rush to reach Colorado that he, Melinda, and her brother, John Andrew, had made on the morning of December 26. When they arrived at the Ramsey home about 1 P.M., they were unaware of anything more than that JonBenet had been kidnapped.
Long said that John Ramsey climbed into a van with him and John Andrew and told them that JonBenet "was with Beth now." The father and son broke down in tears as *John Ramsey described how he had discovered the body around eleven o'clock that morning.*
I almost dropped the phone as I reached to make sure that the "record" button was pressed on my tape recorder. "When you say eleven o'clock that morning, are you assuming that was Mountain time or Eastern time?"
"I'm assuming that was Mountain time. He said eleven o'clock, so I am assuming he was speaking of his own time reference."
I was blown away. We had just found a *credible witness who heard John Ramsey say he'd discovered the body two hours earlier than we previously believed.* That punched a big hole in the generally accepted timeline. Eleven o'clock would have been just about the time John Ramsey temporarily vanished from the sight of Detective Arndt, when she thought he had gone out to get the mail. I recalled how Arndt described the marked change in his behavior after he came back, silent, brooding and nervous.
berrytea333

Saint Louis, MO

#45 Feb 4, 2015
alexa3 wrote:
<quoted text>
A slow death could also mean slowing the heart rate which can be done by pressing down on the vegas veins along the neck. Once this is done it is hard for someone to come back from that and hence their heart eventually stops.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vagus_nerve
Just Wondering

Oak Hill, WV

#48 Feb 5, 2015
Capricorn wrote:
Anything is possible JW but this is eerily familiar to John stating that he found the body at 11 AM
What makes it the more strange is that over the years, none of it was ever explained or corrected, which certainly would have been done, even if it was just spin so it makes you wonder about John's "slips"
So, if John admitted to finding the body at eleven--which I think is highly likely--then does that suggest that he was not the murderer? And had nothing to do with the cover-up? Obviously, if he had found the body, he did not know it to have been hidden to begin with? Correct. So that would narrow our RDI suspects down to two.

“If life gives you melons”

Since: Nov 06

You might be dyslexic

#52 Feb 5, 2015
alexa3 wrote:
<quoted text>
Why would Patsy call the police on herself or her son if she thought he did it? John didn't call the police Patsy did. Just and odd thing to do if she was guilty or covering up the crime. Maybe she thought John had done this JB and she wasn't going to let him get away with it. The ransom note didn't scare her. She called the cops. John just agreed "later" that calling the police was the best thing to do but physical facts says Patsy called. Would John have called the police if Patsy chose not to???
Patsy asked John, and John told her to call the police.

“If life gives you melons”

Since: Nov 06

You might be dyslexic

#54 Feb 5, 2015
alexa3 wrote:
<quoted text>
Hi Legal Eagle. Thank you for your response. I see your point. I just want to make a point however that John at this point in time "has" to go along with the act of Patsy calling the police because if he said anything to the contrary it would look like he was trying to "cover" it up. In other words if he said no no i didn't want to call the police they would automatically say well Why not? So now he is like yes , yes we needed to call the police we couldn't sit there we would have gone crazy. Its unfortunate for John that he didn't call the police himself otherwise i would be doubting Patsy and not the other way around.
I see it differently.

John is the one who read the note all the way through where is said do NOT contact anyone. Patsy said she only read bits and pieces. He could have said "NO, the note says not to contact anyone" and he didn't say that.

Actually Patsy said something like 'what do I do?', or 'what should I do' and he said call the police.

“If life gives you melons”

Since: Nov 06

You might be dyslexic

#58 Feb 5, 2015
alexa3 wrote:
<quoted text>
I am positive the note said "do not contact the police, the F.B.I etc within the second paragraph on the first page so it didn't take reading the entire note to get that information it was right at the beginning of the ransom note.
Yes it did say that so why didn't he pay attention to that and not call them?

“If life gives you melons”

Since: Nov 06

You might be dyslexic

#59 Feb 5, 2015
alexa3 wrote:
<quoted text>
Well i guess we will just have to take John's word for it. Patsy could easily have made that phone call off her own bat if she wanted to she wasn't a mute nor was she chained to the bed. So having a change of heart about "not" calling the police and doing it on her own steam is possible. Why would the man of the house JonBenet's father not handle this himself. I know how sexist that sounds but if you were trying to keep the police out of a situation then that is exactly what you would do "not call the police" but i guess we will just "have" to take John's word that it was "his" idea to call the police. Well it certainly is the most "favorable" answer to give in the circumstances. Just saying. Don't get narky. We are doing well so far.
Have you red any of the books on this case?
The Ramseys wrote one: The Death of Innocence
Page 12

Patsy: What do we do
John: call the police (He shouts )
Patsy: Are you sure?
John: yes, call them

This conversation transpires after John has been reading the note.

“If life gives you melons”

Since: Nov 06

You might be dyslexic

#60 Feb 5, 2015
alexa3 wrote:

Hi Legal Eagle did you judge my opinion as "incendiary"?
No, should I have?

“If life gives you melons”

Since: Nov 06

You might be dyslexic

#65 Feb 5, 2015
alexa3 wrote:
<quoted text>
Its still just taking his word for it - in a book.
If someone murdered someone they not going to publish a book explaining their guilt. If he was so convinced that calling the police was the precise "immediate" thing to do why did he wait for Patsy to bring up the question at all?? You don't wait for your "wife" to start saying to you ..well do you think we should call? what do you think? do you think we should involve the police? No. If he was so intent on this idea then there would have been no discussion. Could you imagine John "not" calling the police if Patsy had said don't call. No ..he would have gone and did this with or without her consent if he was so adamant that it was the right and correct thing to do.
But that is not what is is saying. He told the police that Patsy! said what should we do? it shows that he didn't act on his thoughts and yet when he talks about it its like he makes this massive statement that he "shouted" Yes call them. Why wait for your wife to work what to do it "obviously" wasn't the most immediate thing he wanted to do at all.
OK, I just gave you one reference ( as an example), perhaps you should read all the transcripts from the police interviews, you can find them at ACRs, WS, FFJ, or most any forum, and/or read all the books on the case.

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