The Jonbenet Ransom note and Dirty Harry

The Jonbenet Ransom note and Dirty Harry

Posted in the JonBenet Ramsey Forum

First Prev
of 2
Next Last
neo

Leawood, KS

#1 Aug 11, 2014
This is from Dirty Harry 1971

Similar Phrases

"Now listen to me carefully." (JBR's RN begins "Listen carefully")
"Now listen. Listen very carefully."
"If I even think you're being followed, the girl dies."
"If you talk to ayone, I don't care if it's a Pekinese p i s s ing against a lamppost, the girl dies." (JBR's RN says "If we catch you talking to a stray dog, she dies")
"... that's the end of the game. The girl dies." (the phrase "the girl dies" is used 3 times, just as in the JBR RN)
"It sounds like you had a good rest. You'll need it."

the RN clearly has references to Dirty Harry. Is there any evidence the R's were fans of this movie or did they discover a VHS copy of this movie in their possession?

One of the great failures of RDI theories is that the ransom note has clear references to movies Dirty Harry. It is clear the R's did NOT write the Ransom note but an intruder.

this intruder was a fan of Dirty Harry. This intruder, jonbenet's killer, felt a need to quote Dirty Harry in writing this ranson note.

for a clear explanation as to why an intruder would include references to Dirty Harry in the ransom note copy and paste this link to your browser

http://www.crimeshots.com/forums/showthread.p...
Just Wondering

Oak Hill, WV

#2 Aug 13, 2014
The Ramseys had their own entertainment center in their bedroom, if I am not mistaken. And they had several movie posters in their basement.

It is obvious that several references in the note reflect Hollywood action movies. If you are well off, naïve, and not privy to the seedier side of life, you might feel the need to reference what you have seen and heard from Hollywood. Anyone familiar with "real" life and not given to the dramatic and theatrical would know to pen a short note not a TRIOLOGY. I think that in and of itself argues FOR Patsy as the author.
Just Wondering

Oak Hill, WV

#3 Aug 13, 2014
The handwriting in Scorpio's note does not match the handwriting in the Ramsey note.

Did Mr. Cruel use cursive as well as print lettering in his notes? Patsy certainly did in her notes and the ransom note reflected that trait as well. Coincidental?
neo

Leawood, KS

#4 Aug 14, 2014
handwriting in RN clearly matches scorpio. it does NOT match patsy's
neo

Leawood, KS

#5 Aug 14, 2014
there's no evidence the R's owned those movies, nor were familiar with that. as references by Carnes, the BPD inventoried all the books movies etc in the household. no copy of those movies were found. hardly argues "for" Patsy.
Just Wondering

Oak Hill, WV

#6 Aug 16, 2014
neo wrote:
there's no evidence the R's owned those movies, nor were familiar with that. as references by Carnes, the BPD inventoried all the books movies etc in the household. no copy of those movies were found. hardly argues "for" Patsy.
No one knows what Burke watched when he went to his friends' homes. And, in addition, no one can prove what movies the Ramseys went to the threaters to see. Also, if you were a family member and knew that they had watched the movies at your home, would you be willing to come forward with info that might incriminate them? Blood runs thicker than water.
Note

Flint, MI

#7 Aug 17, 2014
Good point.

The was a good family rated movie for most.

Watching this movie would not make you kill someone.

But the real killer may have like the movie.

Adding movie lines it to the ransom note wording.

The lab.
Note

Flint, MI

#8 Aug 17, 2014
Just Wondering wrote:
The Ramseys had their own entertainment center in their bedroom, if I am not mistaken. And they had several movie posters in their basement.
It is obvious that several references in the note reflect Hollywood action movies. If you are well off, naïve, and not privy to the seedier side of life, you might feel the need to reference what you have seen and heard from Hollywood. Anyone familiar with "real" life and not given to the dramatic and theatrical would know to pen a short note not a TRIOLOGY. I think that in and of itself argues FOR Patsy as the author.
They did get posters from the local movie house. Some were on the basement walls.
That said,
The killer enter the home and at one point spent some time in the basement.
He may have seen these framed posters in the train room and use the movie ideas in the ransom note.

The lab.
Just Wondering

Oak Hill, WV

#9 Aug 17, 2014
Or Patsy used the movie quotes in the note because Burke suggested them. After all, what would Patsy or Burke know about writing a ransom note? They lived a fairly sheltered life, no doubt.
Note

Flint, MI

#10 Aug 17, 2014
Just Wondering wrote:
The Ramseys had their own entertainment center in their bedroom, if I am not mistaken. And they had several movie posters in their basement.
It is obvious that several references in the note reflect Hollywood action movies. If you are well off, naïve, and not privy to the seedier side of life, you might feel the need to reference what you have seen and heard from Hollywood. Anyone familiar with "real" life and not given to the dramatic and theatrical would know to pen a short note not a TRIOLOGY. I think that in and of itself argues FOR Patsy as the author.
Walk through the basement.
As the killer walk down the steps, at the bottom step he must turn right.
Turn right again and a few step is the door to the train room.
As soon as he open the train room door to the right, on the wall was a framed movie poster of the movie "An officer and a gentleman"
That said.
The ransom note stated " The two gentlemen watching over your daughter do not particularly like you so I advise you not to provoke them."
The ransom note "two gentlemen" The poster on the wall " Officer and a gentlemen"
Is a officer one person and a gentlemen is a second person? Two people.
Was this poster use to help print the ransom note wording.
We write with our brains, not or hands, the hand are a extension of the brain.
The lab.
Just Wondering

Oak Hill, WV

#11 Aug 17, 2014
To accept your theory about the "two gentlemen" we would have to believe that the ransom note was written after he had murdered Jonbenet since not until that point would the "two gentlemen" be watching over her. If indeed this were the case, then the killer was writing with his brain, but that was all he was using it for. Who would take time to write a three page rn after the murder unless it was absolutely necessary? But I will admit, that was an eerily interesting take on the Officer and a Gentleman poster.
Note

Flint, MI

#12 Aug 17, 2014
The ransom note was written before the crime.
Two foot impression found n wine cellar next to JonBenet body.
The note was calmly printed, this was written after the killing, the note would have many type / printing mistakes.

The lab.
Note

Flint, MI

#13 Aug 17, 2014
Profile

The killer enter the home eary that night.
He travel on foot, bike and bus.
His plans are not to take JonBenet out of the house.
He must plan the crime so he can monitor the family to stay in controll of the crime.
First, he neads to convince the family he and other has JonBenet out of the house, he travels on foot and taking JonBenet from the house was not the plan.
He tries had to print the ramsom note from the middle of a note pad found in site in the back hall way on a counter. He dog ears page one so it can be easly located at time of placement in the dark. It is keep in place intill the note will be place at bottom of back steps.
The plan is design to have JonBenet hide in the many room finish basement. One room that was a metal elevator shaft had a door that lock him in at one point, looking for a place to hide Jonbenet.
He had to pry him self out leaving tool marks damage the John seen the next day and was note in the report.
The plan is as soon as a member of the family find the ransom note, what evert time this is, they are instructed to weight and not call police of JonBenet dies.
He is located in the basement asd the house design allows him to monitor the family from there.
They do call police and the crime become a killing and the killer has just minutes to exit the house.
This was a preplan crime and so was how the killer was to exit. Up the out of the way, hard to find basement steps, out the out of view butler service door, down the fence line to the dark alley way into history.
The ransom note left instructing that a call will be place to the home between 8:00 and 10:00 am the next day.
At 10:00 am John had a call that the caller did not say any thing foe 30 seconds and hang up the line. Was this the killer letting John know.
The note was part od the preplan crime that turn at the end into a killing because of the 911 call.
The killer need the family to follow his plan for this crime to be completed. If completed, outer may have lost their life that day.
Calling the police was the right thing to do because families are not train for this type of problem.
The ransom note was printed before the crime and JonBenet was never to leave the home.
The lab.
Just Wondering

Oak Hill, WV

#14 Aug 18, 2014
The coroner stated that death would have been between midnight and two in the morning. Also, the pineapple in her digestive tract proved she had died about thirty minutes after eating it. Unless he carried pineapple to the basement, removed the tape from her mouth--which would have been a very daring move--and fed her then killed her within thirty minutes while the family was rummaging around upstairs calling 911, you need to rethink your theory.

Another thing that bothers me, being a parent of a rambunctious family, my first thought would have been that my children were playing a prank on me. I would have awakened Burke immediately.

Could this have started as a prank--since Burke and Jonbenet probably had heard the story of FW's child coming up missing on a holiday and was found hiding in the house? Something may have gone terribly wrong at some point between Jonbenet and Burke, death occurred and then the cover up was necessary?
Note

Flint, MI

#15 Aug 18, 2014
[QUOTE [/QUOTE]
Rigor mortis
Is one of the recognizable signs of death, caused by chemical changes in the muscles after death, causing the limbs of the corpse to become stiff and difficult to move or manipulate. In humans, it commences after about three to four hours, reaches maximum stiffness after 12 hours, and gradually dissipates from approximately 24 hours after death.
Three to Four hours after death at room temperture. It maxes out at aroung 12 hours.
JonBenet was taken to the basement, a diffent temperture than 70 de as the first floor.
The wine celler floor was a unheaded cold concrete floor. JonBenet was found with two white blankets place over her, not under her, rap tite like a papos. The black tape was place over her mouth after time of death because only a perfit lip impresion was found on the glue side of the black duct tape. If the tape was place on her lips before death, she would have a tung mark on tape as well.
JonBenet was found by her dad at 1:05 pm on a cold unheaded basement floor, taken upstair and place on a heated wood floor. She was move to the front room near the Christmas tree. When the coroner came to the crime scene the time was late in the day, around 10:00 pm.
If JonBenet was killer near 6:00 am, that would be SEVEN hours at the time she was found. Every said she was in full rigor Mortis. Stiff. Remember that start at three to four hours and maxes out at 12 hours at room temperture.
The coroner first look at JonBenet on a head first floor at around 10:00 pm.
From the time near 6:00 am to the time the coroner first look at JonBenet was SIXTEEN hour. That said, from 1:00 to 2:00 am that would be TWENTY TWO hours from time of death. Note, Rigor Mortis reaches maximum stiffness after 12 hours, and gradually dissipates from approximately 24 hours after death. The coroner look at her at 22 hours if the time of death was near 6:00 am.
Body temperture will help the coroner to gress the time of death.
warm and flaccid < 3 hours
warm and stiff 3-8 hours
cold and stiff 8-36 hours
cold and flaccid > 36 hours
John said she was cold at the time she was found. Cold and stiff = 8-36 hours. and she was found on a cold unheated concrete basement floor, it was 7 de out side that very cold night.
Time of death 6:00 am to 1:05 pm is over SEVEN hours and is listed as COLD AND STIFF 8-36 hours at 70 de temperture room. JonBenet was found in a cold room.
Corners all know that the time of death is just a ruff gress. The conditions that the body is in will effect the time of death. Hot and cold. JonBenet had both.
From the official report: Autopsy Report
We write in the order of importance, what we think is true first.
(The proximal portion of the small instestine contains fragmented pieces of yellow to light green-tan apparent VEGETABLE or fruit material which MAY represent fragment of pineapple.)
The killer had JonBenet for many hours alive in the house and in the basement.
Feeding her would be help full in keeping her in control.
Late at night, with the family up stairs asleep. He will need to do what ever it take to keep her quiet. We all know food can help with doing this.
One of the thing the family did do in a time of great stress was to check on the son Burke. This was noted in the report. The order of events show us that this early checking the son's room was high on the list.
Burke's interview with police said the parents did check on him as he tried to look sleeping. He knew something very wrong had happen by the tone of the parent voice and the trip to Michigan most likely was off.
What would you do first and what order would it be in. The ransom note printed they left the house with JonBenet and would contact them between 8 and 10 the next morning. They left the house. This is how the family was thinking because the ransom note wording printed this. It take thirty minutes to print the three page ransom note and it take a wile to read it as well, under stress, longer, then check on the son.
Rupert

Waterford, Canada

#16 Aug 18, 2014
At first glance, the note appears to be a deflection and calling everyone over that morning makes me wonder. However, the parents post behaviour seems understandable and out of curiosity I keep looking at alternative IDI theories.

I get the hand printed note idea (verses typewriter or writing style), but I don't see a strong resemblance or maybe the Mr. Cruel note is just simpler in style.

I looked everywhere but could not find any police talking about Mr. Cruel watching and paraphrasing such movies as Dirty Harry, Ransom, and Speed.

However, I agree with Neo/Spin's idea about "re-enacting these movies" and playing mind games. I don't think this was an accident and someone had some anger issues.

It has also occurred to me that since some nuances of Dirty Harry were revealed in the Ransom Note and the RN author must have had some fanciful reason to leave subtle clues as to the intent and identity of the author S.B.T.C, then there might be some reason why JonBenet was murdered that might be related to Dirty Harry. So what was the message. What is behind the Dirty Harry movie?

From a movie review by "The Corner Critic" at:
http://thecornercritic.wordpress.com/2009/11/...

"This is certainly a critique of liberal policies, which had eliminated the death penalty and focused more on the prisoner’s rights than the victim’s rights. These are debatable ideas that certainly have a place in the public sphere.  And of course the film takes the approach that in the film the prisoner here, Scorpio, is absolutely beyond redemption.  He exists simply to be an antagonist. This may be heavy handed, but again it is based in reality. Keep in mind, Charles Manson had only been in prison for two years when the film was released. Laws were still passed in favor of Manson’s “rights.” And no one appeared to bat an eyelash, speaking for Sharon Tate’s rights."

"Harry still comes across as a sympathetic character who has clearly lost much in life.  Scorpio is deranged, the system that Harry serves is broken, and the system Scorpio serves allows him to flourish. Change is needed, not for punishment, but for honoring the rights of those who’s own rights were violated in horrendous ways."

It has been said that "Dirty Harry" was a conservative backlash to the liberal 60s, but what is so liberal about being drafted to go sacrifice your limb or life for a war that many felt was not necessary. That is why there was so much confusion then. Mortal men are more brave than immortal gods.

Anyway, the Ransom Note in conjunction with the gruesome murder caused quite a sensation and the victimology suggests to me that JonBenet was targeted for some sociological (as well as perhaps personal) reason. It was actually Christmas night December 25, JonBenet was becoming known and her dad was becoming wealthy, she was just turning six, it was a kidnapping hoax that got FBI attention, there were signs left like a red "G" written in her hand, the hearts around John Ramsey in the Esprit Award photo, and the note itself signed by S.B.T.C. I also think the perp(s) knew ahead of time that the Ramseys would be out at someone else's place for Christmas Dinner.
Rupe
Note

Flint, MI

#18 Aug 18, 2014
Does the killer fill like a black sheep in the family, that only DNA can prove his connection. He is so close like one letter before or one letter after in the family chain.

Does the killer fill like he has been treated like the G in the DNA chain, left out, Was the 118,000.00 the payoff he fell he needed?

Was the red G on JonBenet hand like being written off. Red handed.

G was not used in the S B C T code, just like a black sheep in a family or left out or off.

The lab,
Fearless in Antioch

Pittsburg, CA

#19 Sep 5, 2014
Where did you read it was a red G on her hand ? I read it was a red Heart. It was not signed SBCT it was SBTC.
What killer do you know that writes just like the RN and who is also a fan of the Dirty Harry movie ? He called himself the Zodiac killer that 's who. Everyone wants to think the Z is dead, but he is still out there doing his thing.
Rupert

Waterford, Canada

#20 Sep 5, 2014
Fearless in Antioch wrote:
Where did you read it was a red G on her hand ? I read it was a red Heart. It was not signed SBCT it was SBTC.
What killer do you know that writes just like the RN and who is also a fan of the Dirty Harry movie ? He called himself the Zodiac killer that 's who. Everyone wants to think the Z is dead, but he is still out there doing his thing.
Google photo JonBenet red heart and you will find it. Except to me it looks like a capital "G". See for yourself and what you think.

I think Note types fast and doesn't edit all of it and that's why he typed SBCT, but we all know it's S.B.T.C. Note the period separators.

I like it: Fearless in Antioch.
Just Wondering

Oak Hill, WV

#21 Sep 8, 2014
The Zodiac killer loved to taunt the police and news media, if I am not mistaken. I think he would have loved credit for a case that was this sensational and drew so much public attention. He would not have been able to contain himself--also, this was not his M.O. was it?

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker
First Prev
of 2
Next Last

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

JonBenet Ramsey Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Ramsey vs Duggar 1 min rainbow 10
A staged crime scene leaves only two real possi... 1 min Sig Turner 14
How far is the phone from stairs? 7 hr Sleuther 15
Do intruder theorists accept the ransom note at... 8 hr Sig Turner 109
What I believe is close to what happened 9 hr Sig Turner 255
Do you think that... 9 hr Just Wondering 3
For the BDI's 10 hr Just Wondering 4
More from around the web