Why did Patrick Burke stop Patsy?

Why did Patrick Burke stop Patsy?

Posted in the JonBenet Ramsey Forum

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Learnin

Spring Hill, KS

#1 Mar 29, 2009
After JBR's body was found, the Ramseys stayed with Pasta Jay Elowsky, a friend. During this time, Elowsky was charged with attempted assault on two individuals whom he mistook for media outside his home.

Patsy was home at the time and was called in to give testimony as to what happened just prior to the incident.

Patsy entered the Justice Center, in Boulder, accompanied by her attorney, Patrick Burke. The two sat down with a Jeff Hendry and Kevin Parker, employees of the Sheriffs Department. The DA's office was represented by Pete Hofstrom.

While being asked about the behavior and actions of Elowsky, Patsy began talking about JBR's death...repeating that someone had broken into her house and killed her baby. Burke, at first, let her talk but after she kept repeating, Burke got up and placed himself in front of Patsy and stared at her without uttering a word. Patsy stopped talking and the interview was over.
Now I quote directly from PERFECT TOWN PERFECT MURDER.

"During the interview, Hendry felt that Patsy had knowledge of the crime and wanted to talk. He thought Patsy and John were responsible for their daughter's death somehow, but which one killed her and which one was covering for the other-that he didn't know."

Now. There was something in Patsy's demeanor that made this LE officer suspect that Patsy knew something...her need to go into this horrible event when she did not have to...when she was there only to give testimony concerning Elowsky.
Obviously, Burke picked up on this and he stepped in before Patsy could reveal more.

Why did Burke stop Patsy from talking about this when, if she was not guilty and had no knowledge of who did this, why, oh why, did Burke stop her talking? There is nothing she could have said which would incriminate her if she had no knowledge of who did this? Comments?
Dan in Detroit

Sterling Heights, MI

#2 Mar 30, 2009
Cops suk. It`s just like this cop Ray Anger that was in charge of the Mich OCCK case. I called him and he never called me back. Finally I contacted Oakland County big shot Bruce Patterson and Anger was calling my house. They searched the guy I named`s house and even found a photo there of a Lemans that Gary owned that exactly matched the one that they knew was used in the killings. But the police went with hunches instead and did nothing. I even had called Ypsilanti police and told them the killer Gary had mentioned leaving a girl named COFFEE`s body on Gotfredson road in Ypsilanti. I called Ypsilanti police after I got the Internet and using Internet maps had remembered the name of the road that Gary had mentioned. I had said COFFEE girl and Ypsilanti MI police admitted to finding the KOVI womans body on Gotfredson. Furthermore I told them Gary had bragged that him and Paul B. had killed the owners of this property on Gotfredson. Gary claimed to have a large graveyard of childrens bodies there and my own brother had told me that he`d seen it. Ypsilanti police went there and found the owners of both properties gone but the occupant having a single note that gave him permission to be there. Zabasearches show no bills in either owners name for 20 years. Ypsilanti police contacted ANGER and he told them I was a nut. They did nothing. After that I got tax records and using that got phone numbers of next door neighbors on Gotfredson. One neighbor says he had to pull a gun on Paul B. (same story Paul B. told me) and that guy claims to have found a grave some years back on his easement that wasn`t there when he and his brother bought the property. Same place Gary claimed to have buried a couple after Paul B.`s friends got the property when Gary went to Cal and when he came back they flooded out his graveyard and used it to water their horses. SO JUST BECAUSE A COP HAD A HUNCH ABOUT PATSY MEANS NOTHING TO ME.

“If life gives you melons”

Since: Nov 06

You might be dyslexic

#3 Mar 30, 2009
This wasn't the place for your rant on cops. Quit bringing other cases on the JBR threads...and leave Gary home too.
BrotherMoon

Denver, CO

#4 Mar 30, 2009
Learnin wrote:
After JBR's body was found, the Ramseys stayed with Pasta Jay Elowsky, a friend. During this time, Elowsky was charged with attempted assault on two individuals whom he mistook for media outside his home.
Patsy was home at the time and was called in to give testimony as to what happened just prior to the incident.
Patsy entered the Justice Center, in Boulder, accompanied by her attorney, Patrick Burke. The two sat down with a Jeff Hendry and Kevin Parker, employees of the Sheriffs Department. The DA's office was represented by Pete Hofstrom.
While being asked about the behavior and actions of Elowsky, Patsy began talking about JBR's death...repeating that someone had broken into her house and killed her baby. Burke, at first, let her talk but after she kept repeating, Burke got up and placed himself in front of Patsy and stared at her without uttering a word. Patsy stopped talking and the interview was over.
Now I quote directly from PERFECT TOWN PERFECT MURDER.
"During the interview, Hendry felt that Patsy had knowledge of the crime and wanted to talk. He thought Patsy and John were responsible for their daughter's death somehow, but which one killed her and which one was covering for the other-that he didn't know."
Now. There was something in Patsy's demeanor that made this LE officer suspect that Patsy knew something...her need to go into this horrible event when she did not have to...when she was there only to give testimony concerning Elowsky.
Obviously, Burke picked up on this and he stepped in before Patsy could reveal more.
Why did Burke stop Patsy from talking about this when, if she was not guilty and had no knowledge of who did this, why, oh why, did Burke stop her talking? There is nothing she could have said which would incriminate her if she had no knowledge of who did this? Comments?
Patsy was curious about herself, being such a nacissist. She wanted the group of individuals found out. "They" wanted recognition. "They" were split-off personas in Patsy. Patsy repeatedly tried to spill the beans. But nobody, except me, listened carefully.
Learnin

Spring Hill, KS

#5 Mar 30, 2009
BrotherMoon wrote:
<quoted text>
Patsy was curious about herself, being such a nacissist. She wanted the group of individuals found out. "They" wanted recognition. "They" were split-off personas in Patsy. Patsy repeatedly tried to spill the beans. But nobody, except me, listened carefully.
Well, she was talking about it for a reason. She was called in to talk about Jay and started going on about this break in...break in...she kept repeating.....and had to be stopped by her "conscience"....

I was hoping to get some real good discussion on this event since it is so significant and offers a lot....it offered so much that the Sheriff's office came away with the impression that she knew what happened...
cyber

United States

#6 Mar 30, 2009
Learnin wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, she was talking about it for a reason. She was called in to talk about Jay and started going on about this break in...break in...she kept repeating.....and had to be stopped by her "conscience"....
I was hoping to get some real good discussion on this event since it is so significant and offers a lot....it offered so much that the Sheriff's office came away with the impression that she knew what happened...
How do we know that Burke actually did this? Because Schiller wrote it in his book? Where did this information come from? Who witnessed it? Thos are the questions that need to be answered first, otherwise we might be barking up a tree that doesn't even exist.
lucy

Lillington, NC

#8 Mar 30, 2009
People who have experienced trauma will have one of two reactions:

1. They will NEVER talk about it (war veterans)

2. They talk about it incessantly and relive it constantly (post-traumatic stress syndrome.)

I would guess that the lawyer wanted to keep Patsy quiet because he is a lawyer. If she mentioned her daughter's case while giving testimony or in a deposition, then it opens up that line of questioning. If lawyers could have their clients' mouths wired shut, they would do it.
learnin

United States

#9 Mar 31, 2009
lucy wrote:
People who have experienced trauma will have one of two reactions:
1. They will NEVER talk about it (war veterans)
2. They talk about it incessantly and relive it constantly (post-traumatic stress syndrome.)
I would guess that the lawyer wanted to keep Patsy quiet because he is a lawyer. If she mentioned her daughter's case while giving testimony or in a deposition, then it opens up that line of questioning. If lawyers could have their clients' mouths wired shut, they would do it.
Good thoughts Lucy and appreciated.

The sheriff's department could not question Patsy about JBR's murder. She was called in to answer questions about another case and it would have been illegal for them to question about the other case. But, the deputy said he was not going to stop her if she wanted to, freely, talk about the case. So, Burke did not intervene because of possible LE questioning. She could have talked for hours and the LE would not have been able to follow up on anything...but they sure could have used any information that she freely offered.

Patrick Burke, at first, let her talk but, after she kept going on, he stepped in front of her. The deputies had the impression she knew something and, evidently, Burke was sensing something, too.

Why didn't Burke simply offer: "Patsy, the officers are busy and they are interested only in Jay's behavior."

He didn't do this. He stepped in front of her and looked at her. Here's my take.

If Burke only suggests she stop talking because she is taking up the officer's time, Patsy might return to talking again. Without saying anything, Burke wanted to make sure Patsy got the point to SHUT UP! You might say he got in her face.
cyberpoop

United States

#10 Mar 31, 2009
learnin wrote:
<quoted text>
Good thoughts Lucy and appreciated.
The sheriff's department could not question Patsy about JBR's murder. She was called in to answer questions about another case and it would have been illegal for them to question about the other case. But, the deputy said he was not going to stop her if she wanted to, freely, talk about the case. So, Burke did not intervene because of possible LE questioning. She could have talked for hours and the LE would not have been able to follow up on anything...but they sure could have used any information that she freely offered.
Patrick Burke, at first, let her talk but, after she kept going on, he stepped in front of her. The deputies had the impression she knew something and, evidently, Burke was sensing something, too.
Why didn't Burke simply offer: "Patsy, the officers are busy and they are interested only in Jay's behavior."
He didn't do this. He stepped in front of her and looked at her. Here's my take.
If Burke only suggests she stop talking because she is taking up the officer's time, Patsy might return to talking again. Without saying anything, Burke wanted to make sure Patsy got the point to SHUT UP! You might say he got in her face.
Okay but how do we know this really happened?
BrotherMoon

Denver, CO

#11 Mar 31, 2009
Learnin wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, she was talking about it for a reason. She was called in to talk about Jay and started going on about this break in...break in...she kept repeating.....and had to be stopped by her "conscience"....
I was hoping to get some real good discussion on this event since it is so significant and offers a lot....it offered so much that the Sheriff's office came away with the impression that she knew what happened...
Lawyers want control. Patsy was a loose canon. Patsy's needs and wants went against the lawyer's and John's needs and wants. Patsy invited the world in to see her passion play. She was so self involved that she killed her daughter over her own problems. She wanted the attention. She wanted to be found out. She wanted "them" to get the blame. The police and the lawyers never understood what they were dealing with.
BrotherMoon

Denver, CO

#12 Mar 31, 2009
cyberpoop wrote:
<quoted text>Okay but how do we know this really happened?
Protocol. The cops go by it. The lawyers try to manipulate it. Patsy had her own agenda that trumped the other's protocol. Burke tried to stop Patsy's trump.

I think Burke thought Patsy was just not right, not under her own control. But actually Patsy wanted her "situation" to be exposed.
candy

East Lansing, MI

#13 Dec 28, 2012
Bumping this up, the actions of one of the current DA's 2012 campaign contributors, who suddenly doesn't want to do anything with the Ramsey case, or put any resources into it.
Heloise

Macclesfield, UK

#14 Dec 29, 2012
I wonder how well Patrick Burke knows Garnett. During the original investigation, the incestuousness of the Boulder legal fraternity was a clear impediment to the proper administration of the case. I would hate to think that it was still a factor.
candy

East Lansing, MI

#15 Jun 6, 2013
I was always disturbed that current DA Stan Garnett never appeared on Boyles show, despite Boyles asking him several times. Yesterday, I found this quote from Stan Garnett, then a lawyer in Denver, about Patrick Burke, Patsy Ramsey's lawyer:

"Pat is the kind of person you would hire if you had a family crisis,'' said Stan Garnett, a Denver lawyer.

http://m.rockymountainnews.com/news/1997/jan/...

This, on top of a campaign contribution Patrick Burke made to Garnett's 2012 re-election campaign (where he ran unopposed and didn't need any campaign contributions) make me wonder about Stan Garnett's friendship with Patsy Ramsey's lawyer. And if you think those things don't matter, read Steve Thomas's entire book and listen to all of Peter Boyles radio shows on this case since 1996.
candy

East Lansing, MI

#16 Jun 6, 2013
Steve Thomas mentions Patsy Ramsey's powerful attorney (and friend of the current DA, Stan Garnett) no less than 11 times. Everyone who wants to know about this case needs to know who these attorneys are, and their friends.

ST hardback, p. 128-129: "On top of that, we learned that it had been disclosed to Patsy's lawyer, Patrick Burke, that our experts were saying Patsy's handwriting looked very much like tht on the ransom note. It was a huge concession. Team Ramsey immediately started rounding up specialists of their own to dispute the damaging findings.

One day (Patrick) Burke rushed up to me in the police department lobby, and after I grabbed Detective Trujillo to be a witness, I listened to his DEMANDS. Always referring to his client as "my lady," he wanted 1) a first generation copy of the ransom note and to know 2) whether semen had indeed been discovered, 3) whether there was in fact a practice ransom note 4) how many detectives were working the case and 5) if we had accounted for a couple of "prime suspects" they had named.

We stared hard at each other. I was insulted that he thought I would hand over confidential case information JUST BECAUSE HE DEMANDED IT. I told him that if the parents had worked with us, they might have been cleard by now. "Tell your lady to come by any day, or every day, I said." HE SIMPLY WENT AROUND ME AND GOT THE INFORMATION ELSEWHERE. Few secrets were held very long."
candy

East Lansing, MI

#17 Jun 6, 2013
ST hardback, p. 129 "I hand delivered a letter to Commander Eller from attorney Patrick Burke that laid out their conditions for us to interview the Ramseys. THE POINTS, WHICH WERE PLAINLY UNACCEPTABLE, included having the sessions take place the very next day in the office of another Ramsey lawyer. Patsy would have both a doctor and a lawyer at her side, probably be AVAILABLE FOR ONLY ONE HOUR, and be questioned only by Detective Arndt. They wanted Pter Hofstrom of the DA's office present."
candy

East Lansing, MI

#18 Jun 6, 2013
It's clear Patrick Burke co-opted Detective Arndt:

ST hardback, p. 160: While Detective Trujillo was in the lobby giving the material to defense lawyer Patrick Burke, DETECTIVE ARNDT CAME UP AND GAVE (Patrick) BURKE A HUG."

later in the book, Steve notes "Team Ramsey had gone out of it's way to put Patsy and John off limits to the police, but an experienced defense attorney like Patrick Burke had allowed Arndt and Patsy to be alone for an hour. I FELT THAT WAS NO ACCIDENT."
candy

East Lansing, MI

#19 Jun 6, 2013
From Six Degrees of Separation:

"Patrick Burke, Boulder defense attorney representing Patsy Ramsey. He defended, along with Foreman (5) two of the "neo-Nazi thugs" accused of murdering talk show host Alan Berg, mentor and best friend of radio talk show host Peter Boyles, fervent anti-Ram. Said by to be chummy with Hofstrom (9) and DeMuth (28). "

http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Senate/6...
BrotherMoon

Arvada, CO

#20 Jun 6, 2013
Q. Why do people run interference for Barack Obama?

A. To perpetuate the Progressive Illusion.
candy

East Lansing, MI

#23 Sep 19, 2013
Read the above examples of Patsy Ramsey's lawyer, Patrick Burke's actions in this case. It's reminiscent of Johnnie Cochran or the vile Robert Kardashian at their worst. Yet, Garnett praised this man when he became Patsy Ramsey's attorney in 1997, and he took campaign contributions from Burke, even though he was running unopposed. I don't need to tell anyone that the Boulder Daily Camera never reported on this "interesting" connection. They don't do due dilligence as to why NOTHING has been happening at the DA level in this case.

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