Humans are unlike hermaphroditic worms

[Will]

LOL...last time I checked, humans were NOT hermaphroditic and human behavior was MUCH more complex than "liv[ing] in dirt, eat[ing]germs"!

[FROM Reuters]:

"Gene switch altered sex orientation of worms
Fri Oct 26, 2007 11:56am EDT
By Julie Steenhuysen

CHICAGO (Reuters)- Altering a gene in the brain of female worms changed their sexual orientation, U.S. researchers said on Thursday, making female worms attracted to other females.

The study reinforces the notion that sexual orientation is hard-wired in the brain, said Erik Jorgensen, scientific director of the Brain Institute at the University of Utah.

"They look like girls, but act and think like boys," Utah researcher Jamie White, who worked on the study published in the journal Current Biology, said in a statement.

Researchers in Jorgensen's lab switched on a gene in female worms that makes the body develop male structures, but they only activated the gene in the brain.

As a result, the female worms still had female bodies, but they behaved like males.

"It suggests sexual behavior is encoded in our genes" and not caused by extra nerve cells specific to males or females, Jorgensen said in a telephone interview.

Animals such as nematodes, fruit flies and mice share many of the same genes as humans and are often used as models to understand human genetics.

But Jorgensen said the study is not likely to resolve the burning question about the genesis of sexual orientation in humans. "A human's brain is much more complex than a worm's brain," he said.

...

LIVE IN DIRT, EAT GERMS

Nematodes, or C. elegans, are tiny worms about one millimeter long that live in the dirt, chomping bacteria. They have no eyes and rely on smell for navigation and propagation.

There are few males, only one in 500, so most of these female nematodes are hermaphrodites, meaning they have both male and female sexual organs. This gives the female worms the ability to fertilize their own eggs and produce offspring in the absence of a male.

"For the most part they are females," Jorgensen said. "It's really hard to tell that they are hermaphrodites, but they do make these few sperm."

When they do mate with males, female worms produce 1,200 progeny, compared with just 200 when they produce their own sperm.

The researchers were trying to understand the underpinnings of sexual attraction in the male nematodes.".....

[McMike]

Wil, it's no surprise you can't get a grip on scientific research, much less reality.

[Dyssonance]

that's not single L wil, thats double L Will.

However, he's apparently unaware that humans and those earthworms share 80% of their genetic codes.

Indeed, we share 70 to 99.95% of our genetic code with every animal studied thus far.

And we have fewer genes than plants.

[Will]

Dyssonance wrote:

that's not single L wil, thats double L Will.
However, he's apparently unaware that humans and those earthworms share 80% of their genetic codes.
Indeed, we share 70 to 99.95% of our genetic code with every animal studied thus far.
And we have fewer genes than plants.

LOL. I am perfectly aware of the distinctions that make no difference or, in this case, the commonalities that make no difference.

Because if our common "genetic codes" with hermaphroditic worms, or rams weaned at birth from female contact and raised exclusively with males thereafter, or even bonobo chimps lead us to be developmently alike in our RELEVANT OR ESSENTIAL BEHAVIORS, then we should open up an immediate DIALOGUE with the worms and the rams and the chimps and inquire what THEIR genetic researchers have concluded regarding the commonalities.

Of course, there are just a few problems with establishing such a dialogue with our genetic bretheren -- they don't HAVE genetic researchers and, while we presume they can to varying degrees communicate, they haven't developed the human capacity to SPEAK!

So, DESPITE sharing ANY percentage of "genetic code", humans and these other species DON'T have that much in common.

[Dyssonance]

Will wrote:

<quoted text>
LOL. I am perfectly aware of the distinctions that make no difference or, in this case, the commonalities that make no difference.
Because if our common "genetic codes" with hermaphroditic worms, or rams weaned at birth from female contact and raised exclusively with males thereafter, or even bonobo chimps lead us to be developmently alike in our RELEVANT OR ESSENTIAL BEHAVIORS, then we should open up an immediate DIALOGUE with the worms and the rams and the chimps and inquire what THEIR genetic researchers have concluded regarding the commonalities.
Of course, there are just a few problems with establishing such a dialogue with our genetic bretheren -- they don't HAVE genetic researchers and, while we presume they can to varying degrees communicate, they haven't developed the human capacity to SPEAK!
So, DESPITE sharing ANY percentage of "genetic code", humans and these other species DON'T have that much in common.

But they do have the commonality of sexual orientation being biologically determined.

[Will]

Dyssonance wrote:

<quoted text>
But they do have the commonality of sexual orientation being biologically determined.

[FROM the Reuters article]:

..."But [Researcher] Jorgensen said the study is not likely to resolve the burning question about the genesis of sexual orientation in humans. "A human's brain is much more complex than a worm's brain," he said."....

[Dyssonance]

Will wrote:

<quoted text>
[FROM the Reuters article]:
..."But [Researcher] Jorgensen said the study is not likely to resolve the burning question about the genesis of sexual orientation in humans. "A human's brain is much more complex than a worm's brain," he said."....

That's referring to the specific causation -- its still biological.

[Will]

Dyssonance wrote:

<quoted text>
That's referring to the specific causation -- its still biological.

LOL...sewer gas is also biological.

So what?

[Will]

[FROM the Reuters article]:

"Gene switch altered sex orientation of worms

...Altering a gene in the brain of female worms changed their sexual orientation, U.S. researchers said on Thursday, making female worms attracted to other females."....

LOL, so then:

1) What gene in the brain of female humans changes their sexual orientation?

2) Is any such gene in the human female brain the same gene in the human male brain?

3) If any such human gene can be switched on and switched off THEN SEXUAL ORIENTATION ITSELF CAN BE CHANGED AND IS THEREFORE NOT AN IMMUTABLE CHARACTERISTIC!

[Dyssonance]

Will wrote:

[FROM the Reuters article]:
"Gene switch altered sex orientation of worms
...Altering a gene in the brain of female worms changed their sexual orientation, U.S. researchers said on Thursday, making female worms attracted to other females."....
LOL, so then:
1) What gene in the brain of female humans changes their sexual orientation?
2) Is any such gene in the human female brain the same gene in the human male brain?
3) If any such human gene can be switched on and switched off THEN SEXUAL ORIENTATION ITSELF CAN BE CHANGED AND IS THEREFORE NOT AN IMMUTABLE CHARACTERISTIC!

*snort* Damn -- can you commit more logical fallacies in that?

Regardless, though -- the fact that its biological doesn't mean it wholly genetic.

There are genetic issues that can differ when the strand of DNA comes from the mother or father. The same section of the gene can be missing, and if it comes from the mother, you get one thing, if it comes from the father, you get another.

Want to keep confusing the issue or do you actually just want to admit that you hate th thought of gay people being equal to you in any way?

[okimar]

Dyssonance wrote:

<quoted text>
*snort* Damn -- can you commit more logical fallacies in that?
Regardless, though -- the fact that its biological doesn't mean it wholly genetic.
There are genetic issues that can differ when the strand of DNA comes from the mother or father. The same section of the gene can be missing, and if it comes from the mother, you get one thing, if it comes from the father, you get another.
Want to keep confusing the issue or do you actually just want to admit that you hate th thought of gay people being equal to you in any way?

You can be kinda hard to find for a dummy like me. go to my profile and you will see where to reach me. OK?

[Dyssonance]

Will do, Oki,

oh, and Will, have you figured out your fallacy with your point number 3 yet?

And, if so, would you admit it?

[Dyssonance]

oh -- and the term hermaphroditic is incorrectly used.

Sexual orientation isn't part of physical sex.

[Will]

Dyssonance wrote:

oh -- and the term hermaphroditic is incorrectly used.
Sexual orientation isn't part of physical sex.

Take your quibble up with the researchers at the Brain Institute at the University of Utah.

[Dyssonance]

Will wrote:

<quoted text>
Take your quibble up with the researchers at the Brain Institute at the University of Utah.

certainly.

in the meantime, try to avoid being dishonest in your presentation.

I now you admire wusspot for it, but, really -- do you want to be admiring a person who hates themself for being born?

[IndyStevie]

Will, give up on the scientific angle. You crash and burn every time you make an attempt like this.

[Will]

IndyStevie wrote:

Will, give up on the scientific angle. You crash and burn every time you make an attempt like this.

LOL, trashtalk from another munchkin.

[Will]

Dyssonance wrote:

<quoted text>
certainly.
in the meantime, try to avoid being dishonest in your presentation.
I now you admire wusspot for it, but, really -- do you want to be admiring a person who hates themself for being born?

Hehehe, you're PROJECTING again -- you know what your therapist told you about that.

[Dyssonance]

Will wrote:

<quoted text>
Hehehe, you're PROJECTING again -- you know what your therapist told you about that.

No -- she actually told me I should project more.

Seems I have a difficult time doing that.

You know, you could probably benefit from seeing her...

[IndyStevie]

Will wrote:

<quoted text>
LOL, trashtalk from another munchkin.

... and that response demonstrates... what? Intelligence?