Legislators unveil plan to address ci...

Legislators unveil plan to address civil rights for gay couples

There are 25 comments on the deseretnews.com story from Nov 10, 2008, titled Legislators unveil plan to address civil rights for gay couples. In it, deseretnews.com reports that:

Seeing silver in the cloud of controversy surrounding the recent passage of California Proposition 8, a group of Utah lawmakers unveiled five pieces of proposed legislation aimed at securing rights for gay couples...

Join the discussion below, or Read more at deseretnews.com.

First Prev
of 2
Next Last

Since: Oct 08

Portland, OR

#2 Nov 10, 2008
Screw that crap! Who do they think they are dealing with here? We are not going to settle for separate but equal anymore. We won't be satisfied until we have equality. Period.

“Read my name”

Since: Jul 07

Raleigh, North Carolina

#3 Nov 10, 2008
One piece of legislation would fix everything and it doesn't have to be marriage. The legislation could state that marriage is a religious ceremony between one man and one woman. The religious marriage ceremony has no legal basis nor benefit.

Then go on to state that all current legal documents that currently contain the word "Marriage", "Married", etc,.. must now be interpreted to mean "Domestic Partnership", "Domestic Partner", etc. A "Domestic Partnership" would be between two consenting adults. All "Domestic Partnerships" would have all the rights and benefits previously attributed to the status of married.

Essentially a piece of legislation like this would BAN the word marriage as a legal term and only recognize "Domestic Partner" from then on,...
Duce Big-low

Thousand Oaks, CA

#4 Nov 10, 2008
Lillith1959 wrote:
Screw that crap! Who do they think they are dealing with here? We are not going to settle for separate but equal anymore. We won't be satisfied until we have equality. Period.
Oh, STOP being so picky, No one is prventing you from being married to someone of the opposite sex.

“ reality, what a concept”

Since: Nov 07

this one

#5 Nov 10, 2008
While separate and clearly unequal is completely unacceptable as the final decision on this issue, a guarantee of some rights is somewhat marginally better than no rights whatsoever for same sex couples. This is Utah we're talking about here afterall and their current constitutional amendment does not even make separate but equal an option. This is Mormon central and a state where the campaign for Attorney General included discussion of whether same sex marriage or just the Lawrence decision was sufficient justification to bring down laws against polygamy and incest. Believe it or not, there are Lesbians and Gays who live in Utah and they need as much protection as they can get from the whackos. If Equality Utah can get the LDS Church to live up to their own words, more power to them in the interim while the fight for true equality continues...

“religion is corrupt-able”

Since: Jul 07

Bloomington, IN

#6 Nov 10, 2008
Rick in Kansas wrote:
While separate and clearly unequal is completely unacceptable as the final decision on this issue, a guarantee of some rights is somewhat marginally better than no rights whatsoever for same sex couples. This is Utah we're talking about here afterall and their current constitutional amendment does not even make separate but equal an option. This is Mormon central and a state where the campaign for Attorney General included discussion of whether same sex marriage or just the Lawrence decision was sufficient justification to bring down laws against polygamy and incest. Believe it or not, there are Lesbians and Gays who live in Utah and they need as much protection as they can get from the whackos. If Equality Utah can get the LDS Church to live up to their own words, more power to them in the interim while the fight for true equality continues...
For real! I agree. And let's not forget about other states that don't afford gay and lesbians any rights... We are all getting huffy over gay marriage in California.... but they have same sex partner benefits... amoung other things. What about my friends in Tennessee who have nothing! If there was as much fervor for gay rights in that state as was put into trying to oppose proposition 8, then maybe we'd be a little closer to equal. Enough with everyone wanting benefit for one state... what about benefit for the whole nation in regards to same sex lifestyles!

“Created Equal”

Since: Feb 08

USA

#7 Nov 10, 2008
VUCK YOU wrote:
Vuck the filthy dirty "good christain" sheeple.
We must take our lives the SCOTUS. And with OBama already stating GLBT citizens should have equal rights, OBama should stand up for us.
One more thing, I'm vucking delighted the filthy dirty "good christain" sheeple are:
1. loosing their houses.
2. loosing their jobs.
3. loosing their retirement savings.
4. and their kids are dead from george's revenge war.
My constitutional rights will no longer be decided by the filthy dirty "good christain" sheeple (white, black, brown, purple).
VUCK YOU!
I agree with the side of the argument you're on, and at the same time, I abhor your abrasive cut-and-paste knee-jerk spam. If you want to help, act like a human being, not a Xerox machine.

“Created Equal”

Since: Feb 08

USA

#8 Nov 10, 2008
Rick in Kansas wrote:
While separate and clearly unequal is completely unacceptable as the final decision on this issue, a guarantee of some rights is somewhat marginally better than no rights whatsoever for same sex couples. This is Utah we're talking about here afterall and their current constitutional amendment does not even make separate but equal an option. This is Mormon central and a state where the campaign for Attorney General included discussion of whether same sex marriage or just the Lawrence decision was sufficient justification to bring down laws against polygamy and incest. Believe it or not, there are Lesbians and Gays who live in Utah and they need as much protection as they can get from the whackos. If Equality Utah can get the LDS Church to live up to their own words, more power to them in the interim while the fight for true equality continues...
Again Rick, you offer a voice of reason amidst the tumult, and I thank you.

I think we need to redouble our efforts particularly now. But I also know that never have justice and equality been rendered in one smooth motion. This fight is one of incremental progress, and involves periodic setbacks. This is the way of progress.

In the past six days, I have seen more petty bitterness from our community than I thought was possible, and that's saying a lot. Don't people understand that for us to appear to be disheartened and rattled, to fly off the handle half cocked...(I love mixing metaphors) this sort of reaction is yet another victory for the opposition.

I think it's better to get planned and organized and continue moving forward. I'm glad that there are level-headed people like you who are ever committed to paying attention to the details. Kudos.

1noteasilyfooled

“Fundie SMACKER..”

Since: Mar 08

Sunshine city, St Petersburg

#9 Nov 10, 2008
I want to know why these legislators are concerned whether the freakin church agrees or not. My life, my families life and the laws and protections in this country don't have a damn thing to do with any church. Its none of their business. WHY are we placating to the 'church'? I thought this was the USA not iran or saudia arabia.
JeffHouston

United States

#10 Nov 10, 2008
The Mormons said that they weren't opposed to Gay civil unions that exactly mirrored the rights of marriage. That means Utah. Don't get mad at Sen. Scott McCoy for proposing this.

Its a win-win. Either we get wide reaching Gay rights legislation in Utah or the Mormon leaders are shown to be complete liars.

My guess is that we'll get the latter, in which case we throw it back at them the next time the Mormons dare to oppose us on anything.

If we get the former, we move to Idaho, Nevada, and Arizona.

Not that passing Gay civil unions will cause anyone to stop pushing for marriage, but since the Mormons offered their support for this on a national basis in their press release, there isn't anything wrong with calling their bluff.
ComeOn

San Francisco, CA

#11 Nov 10, 2008
I am pretty sure that despite the sincere effort of the govt. to reconcile the differences and correct the division created by Prop 8, that the obnoxious and snobbish LGBTs will find this proposal totally unacceptable because it is still separate but equal.

IN FACT, NOTHING ON EARTH WILL SATISFY THE GAYS BUT TO BE MARRIED JUST LIKE A MAN AND A WOMAN SO THEY CAN PROVE THAT HUMANKIND NO LONGER CONSIDERS THE BIBLE AS THE WORD OF GOD BECAUSE IT CONSIDERS HOMOSEXUALITY AS ABOMINABLE.

I THEREFORE EXPECT THE GAYS TO GIVE THE UTAH LEGISLATORS THE FINGER AND TELL THEM TO SHOVE IT UP THEIR POSTERIORS.
ComeOn

San Francisco, CA

#12 Nov 10, 2008
JeffHouston wrote:
The Mormons said that they weren't opposed to Gay civil unions that exactly mirrored the rights of marriage. That means Utah. Don't get mad at Sen. Scott McCoy for proposing this.
Its a win-win. Either we get wide reaching Gay rights legislation in Utah or the Mormon leaders are shown to be complete liars.
My guess is that we'll get the latter, in which case we throw it back at them the next time the Mormons dare to oppose us on anything.
If we get the former, we move to Idaho, Nevada, and Arizona.
Not that passing Gay civil unions will cause anyone to stop pushing for marriage, but since the Mormons offered their support for this on a national basis in their press release, there isn't anything wrong with calling their bluff.
Great idea, why not do exactly what the Jewish people did and do a GAY EXODUS TO MASSACHUSETTS where you can be allowed to settle and establish your own HOMOSEXUAL STATE?

In fact the US govt under Barack Obama will be more than happy to oblige because Native Americans are already granted prime land for their own exclusive use, including the establishment of casinos that really bring in the millions in revenue.

I think this is the best deal that the LGBT community should bargain for, an autonomous state that will allow just about anything for the benefit of its residents. This really beats prop 8 hands down.
JeffHouston

United States

#13 Nov 10, 2008
ComeOn wrote:
I am pretty sure that despite the sincere effort of the govt. to reconcile the differences and correct the division created by Prop 8, that the obnoxious and snobbish LGBTs will find this proposal totally unacceptable because it is still separate but equal.
IN FACT, NOTHING ON EARTH WILL SATISFY THE GAYS BUT TO BE MARRIED JUST LIKE A MAN AND A WOMAN SO THEY CAN PROVE THAT HUMANKIND NO LONGER CONSIDERS THE BIBLE AS THE WORD OF GOD BECAUSE IT CONSIDERS HOMOSEXUALITY AS ABOMINABLE.
I THEREFORE EXPECT THE GAYS TO GIVE THE UTAH LEGISLATORS THE FINGER AND TELL THEM TO SHOVE IT UP THEIR POSTERIORS.
I'd argue that Gay people could care less about what others think. They came out - didn't they? But you are right in one regard, Gays won't stop with civil unions. They want full equality under the law. I'm just giving the Mormon leaders the opportunity to prove that their statements weren't just 'lying for the lord' when they said they didn't oppose civil unions. Go to the LDS website and read the statement. Do you think they were lying? I do. But I'll give them the opportunity to prove they weren't.
JeffHouston

United States

#14 Nov 10, 2008
ComeOn wrote:
<quoted text>
Great idea, why not do exactly what the Jewish people did and do a GAY EXODUS TO MASSACHUSETTS where you can be allowed to settle and establish your own HOMOSEXUAL STATE?
In fact the US govt under Barack Obama will be more than happy to oblige because Native Americans are already granted prime land for their own exclusive use, including the establishment of casinos that really bring in the millions in revenue.
I think this is the best deal that the LGBT community should bargain for, an autonomous state that will allow just about anything for the benefit of its residents. This really beats prop 8 hands down.
The Gays aren't meekly asking you (or anyone else) for advice. They are standing up for their equal rights. And it is beautiful to watch. Good for them.

Since: Sep 07

Fort Lauderdale, FL.

#15 Nov 10, 2008
ComeOn wrote:
NOTHING ON EARTH WILL SATISFY THE GAYS BUT TO BE MARRIED JUST LIKE A MAN AND A WOMAN SO THEY CAN PROVE THAT HUMANKIND NO LONGER CONSIDERS THE BIBLE AS THE WORD OF GOD BECAUSE IT CONSIDERS HOMOSEXUALITY AS ABOMINABLE.
Is there still out there people who believe that the bible is the word of God? Perhaps people in denial?

“ reality, what a concept”

Since: Nov 07

this one

#17 Nov 10, 2008
Thank you. While I'm very much a true believer in full equality, living out here in Kansas, I know what it is like to be much further from that finish line than we are in other states. For us out here, even the possibility that our legislature would even consider such a measure is just a pipe dream at this point, as we can still be discriminated against when it comes to employment (except by the state and even that could change with the next Governor in 2010), housing and public accomodations. While in California marriage can be considered as an absolute right and taking our message to the streets might seem like a good idea, in many of the states in-between the coasts, we've come to realize that any little victory is an important one, because we don't get them that often...
ScottyMatic wrote:
<quoted text>
Again Rick, you offer a voice of reason amidst the tumult, and I thank you.
I think we need to redouble our efforts particularly now. But I also know that never have justice and equality been rendered in one smooth motion. This fight is one of incremental progress, and involves periodic setbacks. This is the way of progress.
In the past six days, I have seen more petty bitterness from our community than I thought was possible, and that's saying a lot. Don't people understand that for us to appear to be disheartened and rattled, to fly off the handle half cocked...(I love mixing metaphors) this sort of reaction is yet another victory for the opposition.
I think it's better to get planned and organized and continue moving forward. I'm glad that there are level-headed people like you who are ever committed to paying attention to the details. Kudos.
JeffHouston

United States

#18 Nov 10, 2008
ScottyMatic wrote:
<quoted text>
Again Rick, you offer a voice of reason amidst the tumult, and I thank you.
I think we need to redouble our efforts particularly now. But I also know that never have justice and equality been rendered in one smooth motion. This fight is one of incremental progress, and involves periodic setbacks. This is the way of progress.
In the past six days, I have seen more petty bitterness from our community than I thought was possible, and that's saying a lot. Don't people understand that for us to appear to be disheartened and rattled, to fly off the handle half cocked...(I love mixing metaphors) this sort of reaction is yet another victory for the opposition.
I think it's better to get planned and organized and continue moving forward. I'm glad that there are level-headed people like you who are ever committed to paying attention to the details. Kudos.
I'm gonna argue that the play it nice HRC model has been a absolute failure for the Gay/Lesbian community. Going to 'black tie dinners' and being non-controversial trying to win acceptance and tolerance doesn't seem to be working fast enough for me.

But if you want the 'never ever' do anything that might upset anyone else, even if they play dirty and win by playing dirty because we don't respond because we're afraid of losing tolerance, might I suggest you join the Human Rights Campaign? Thats what they do. Look for tolerance and acceptance.

The people on the streets are looking for civil rights.

Don't get me wrong, I know you want full equality. And you have every right to cluck admonitions at us. But remember, most of those people have tried it your way for years. If the choice is between being tolerated and being a full citizen, I'm going to choose citizenship. Even it can be a bit unpleasant. And my equal rights doesn't translate into tolerance.

Since: Apr 07

Norristown, PA

#19 Nov 11, 2008
Duce Big-low wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, STOP being so picky, No one is prventing you from being married to someone of the opposite sex.
This poster is lying.

This is one of the only comments that reminds me of Hitler, the holocaust, etc. on these boards.

Yes, I did just say that.

I will say it again. Please, come reply to my post and *challenge me on that* so I can repeat myself.

The comment from this poster is saying, "Who cares about your rights or your happiness. You can enter into a *MEANINGLESS* marriage which would have *ZERO* meaning to you, which would be inseparable from *GARBAGE*, but you should be happy because society is granting you that." No, apparently that's not working.

This poster has told this lie, and so have other posters on these boards, more than once.

This poster *FAILS* to mention that what s/he says here is the same as a heterosexual *BEING FORCED* to marry the *SAME* gender -- not the opposite one. They would hate, excoriate and condemn *their own marriage* and would find it *meaningless*. But this poster doesn't say those things to the board, because they don't help his/her case.

Instead, let's just lie again.

Let's *PRETEND* we're moral and "CHRISTIAN" while we lie, lie, lie, lie, lie. WHOOPS, looks like there's a commandment against lying. WHOOPS, looks like this is no christian behavior.

Lie, lie, lie, lie, lie. And they'll alllll wake up tomorrow, and lie again tomorrow. And the next day. Lying, and lying, and lying, because their own "christian precepts" only apply to them *when it is convenient*.

Thank god for the internet; thank god I can metaphorically rip this poster's face off their bleeding scalp, jam it down their throat, and let them choke on it. Because the lies have gone way, way, way, way too far by now.

“Equality for all!”

Since: Jul 08

Bedford, Texas

#20 Nov 11, 2008
VUCK YOU wrote:
Vuck the filthy dirty "good christain" sheeple.
We must take our lives the SCOTUS. And with OBama already stating GLBT citizens should have equal rights, OBama should stand up for us.
One more thing, I'm vucking delighted the filthy dirty "good christain" sheeple are:
1. loosing their houses.
2. loosing their jobs.
3. loosing their retirement savings.
4. and their kids are dead from george's revenge war.
My constitutional rights will no longer be decided by the filthy dirty "good christain" sheeple (white, black, brown, purple).
VUCK YOU!
Somebody has an issue with Extremist Christians. I know of a lot of good atheist people, Jewish people, and Buddhist people who are losing their homes, their jobs, their retirement savings, and loved ones...

Since: Mar 07

Location hidden

#21 Nov 11, 2008
Duce Big-low wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, STOP being so picky, No one is prventing you from being married to someone of the opposite sex.
When YOU marry only for convenience, and teach YOUR children that a marriage to one they can never be attracted to or love is the only REAL form of marriage, you can come back and say this without being a hypocrit.

I would suspect, however, that this is NOT what you have taken for yourself, or what you will teach your children.

Folks that preach one form of action for others, but shun it as unsatisfactory for themselves, are hypocrits and fools, don't you think?

“Created Equal”

Since: Feb 08

USA

#22 Nov 11, 2008
JeffHouston wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm gonna argue that the play it nice HRC model has been a absolute failure for the Gay/Lesbian community. Going to 'black tie dinners' and being non-controversial trying to win acceptance and tolerance doesn't seem to be working fast enough for me.
But if you want the 'never ever' do anything that might upset anyone else, even if they play dirty and win by playing dirty because we don't respond because we're afraid of losing tolerance, might I suggest you join the Human Rights Campaign? Thats what they do. Look for tolerance and acceptance.
The people on the streets are looking for civil rights.
Don't get me wrong, I know you want full equality. And you have every right to cluck admonitions at us. But remember, most of those people have tried it your way for years. If the choice is between being tolerated and being a full citizen, I'm going to choose citizenship. Even it can be a bit unpleasant. And my equal rights doesn't translate into tolerance.
Hey, whoa. I guess you haven't seen some of my other posts from yesterday. I've been advocating an enormous escalation of in-your-face creative activism. And believe me, I'm so gung-ho on these issues, and so radically "politically incorrect" in my LGBT and anti-religious views that i absolutely DON'T get invited to those black tie fundraisers.

I'm not saying that we should mute the enormous outcry that has come-up from the LGBT community over this issue. Not at all what i've been saying. I'm a pragmatist. I'm saying, instead of suddenly screaming that all legal marriage should be abolished, or some other such totally unrealistic nonsense, it is absolutely crucial that we take this outrage and anger and channel it into effective plans and strategies and demonstrations and activism that can actually accomplish something... as opposed to allowing it to be yet another straw on the camel's back of LGBT stereotypes, painting us as as a bunch of irrational, radical wacko faggots who would think nothing of throwing-out the baby with the bathwater.

That's not who we are. We're just stinging mad right now. I'm not saying we shouldn't be mad. I'm saying we need to take a deep breath, count to 10, and then go obliterate the opposition.

Anybody with me?

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker
First Prev
of 2
Next Last

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Gay/Lesbian Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
My husband left me 4 another man (Nov '09) 15 min xenia 33
News Alabama justice faces possible ouster over gay ... 16 min Xstain Mullah Fra... 3
News 'Free Kim Davis': This is just what gay rights ... (Sep '15) 1 hr Jonah1 18,527
News Moore goes before ethics panel on gay marriage ... 1 hr Justin 5
News Eastern Kentucky holds first Pride Festival 1 hr Justin 103
News The Escape Every Gay San Franciscan Loves 2 hr Xstain Mullah Fra... 1
News Priests and nuns hold bizarre ceremony to 'puri... 2 hr Hogan 50
News Colo. gay discrimination alleged over wedding cake (Jun '13) 4 hr Andy 40,551
The gay cafe for GLBT, friends and family (Oct '09) 6 hr Frankie Rizzo 68,993
More from around the web