Homosexuality and the Bible

Homosexuality and the Bible

There are 36053 comments on the www.smh.com.au story from Aug 15, 2011, titled Homosexuality and the Bible. In it, www.smh.com.au reports that:

Given the ongoing debate about same-sex marriage, it is time I looked at the two Testaments to remind myself why belief is so hard for me to embrace.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at www.smh.com.au.

Since: Apr 12

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#12267 Oct 14, 2012
Sorry, I try again:

According to the definition of ignorance (lack of knowledge), who is ignorant, those who interpret it literally because they don't see the whole picture or those who disregard some passages because they disregard facts?

Of course it depends on faith? Is the Bible God's Word? Is it valid today? What is right? How should it be interpreted? Literally or more overall interpretation? What about all the contradictions in Scripture? How can we know what is valid today and what is not? Is only some of it valid today? So what is knowledge? Facts or the ability to interpret?

Of course I can not choose for anyone else and other people cannot choose for me?

I think everybody has to make their own decission about what they believe in, but what make people on both? sides so angry?

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

#12268 Oct 14, 2012
I guess it is fact that it is written; The Bible says so, but should it be followed today just because a book says so or is it the human responsibility to interpret into our time? We got a challenge? It is written, but it is not valid today? We should understand that? Or some got a challenge to fight for something, other to fight for other things?

The point was to learn to be respectful for each other? The point from Above was to make us humble?

What if the same God put different convictions into different people for a reason?

But it could still be that one of them was right or not?

Should we learn respect and other values? Should we be prepared for something?

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

#12269 Oct 14, 2012
Or we should learn to fight or protect ourselves? There could be a lot of things we should learn? Or to love?

There could be a lot of things we should learn?

Or what do you say guys?

Could there be other things than just the opinion about homosexuality that is the point behind?
doug

Tsumeb, Namibia

#12270 Oct 14, 2012
Joe DeCaro wrote:
from smh:
"Similarly one could argue that nowhere in the Gospels does Jesus condemn homosexuality. Perhaps Jesus was not concerned about it? This argument is not strong for Jesus does not mention a range of other sins so his pronouncements on sin could not be assumed to be exhaustive."
You are so wrong read the Bible: Lev:18:22 and Romans 1:27

Since: Aug 09

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#12271 Oct 14, 2012
Post #12241

Since: May 11

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#12273 Oct 14, 2012
doug wrote:
<quoted text> You are so wrong read the Bible: Lev:18:22 and Romans 1:27
Ja boet!
Three quarters of the posts on this forum have repeated that verse but none of the faithful have been able to answer the question as to why contravention of that rule merits the death penalty while it is ok to ignore all the other biblical laws that merit the death penalty

Lev. 11:10 says that eating shellfish is an abomination.
Do you consider that equal to or worse than homosexuality?

Lev.18:19 No sex during the woman's period
Even if she is very horny and needs a bonk!

Lev 19:27 Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard.
I am clean shaven and my hair is cut with a number 1 blade so am I condemned?

Exodus 35:2 clearly prohibits working on the Sabbath and demands that offenders should be put to death.
Doctors & emergency workers should stay at home on the Sabbath?

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

#12274 Oct 14, 2012
Ivorydick wrote:
<quoted text>
Ja boet!
Three quarters of the posts on this forum have repeated that verse but none of the faithful have been able to answer the question as to why contravention of that rule merits the death penalty while it is ok to ignore all the other biblical laws that merit the death penalty
Lev. 11:10 says that eating shellfish is an abomination.
Do you consider that equal to or worse than homosexuality?
Lev.18:19 No sex during the woman's period
Even if she is very horny and needs a bonk!
Lev 19:27 Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard.
I am clean shaven and my hair is cut with a number 1 blade so am I condemned?
Exodus 35:2 clearly prohibits working on the Sabbath and demands that offenders should be put to death.
Doctors & emergency workers should stay at home on the Sabbath?
I think your questions are fair, and I don't know the answer.

“Trolls are Clueless”

Since: Dec 07

Aptos, California

#12275 Oct 14, 2012
Manmanman wrote:
<quoted text>
I think your questions are fair, and I don't know the answer.
The answer is all those rules were made up by man. Jesus called those the laws of man in the Gospels.

Since: Dec 11

Mountain Lakes, NJ

#12276 Oct 15, 2012
None of those books condemn two men (women too, just saying men since I'm a dude) in a committed faithful relationship.

The term homosexual did not exist, so if you see that in your bible- your bible is wrong.

The only word used in the ancient world, that described a man having no lustful, or sexual desires for the opposite sex; was a Eunuch(Greek), or Saris(Hebrew/Assyrian). Ultimately this word was used to categorize the 3 types of men who did not procreate.

1.Homosexual- Jesus describes this Eunuch as born this way from their mother's womb.

2.Men who've become Eunuch by other men. This would be castration.

3.Eunuch who devotes himself 100% to god. He studies, studies, studies, preaches, preaches, preaches. Travels spreading the good word, and helping those in need. He has no time to marry and raise children.

Jesus does not condemn these people, nor rejects them- and is basically saying they too may receive the lord. The first two types of men were often ridiculed harshly by people- because they did not follow custom in which that men had to procreate.

This was New Testament though, the world had changed- some of the laws of the Old Testament, were no longer needed.

Eunuch also meant "one who keeps or guards the bed". Gays were used to guard the king's concubines. A castrated man could still have sexual desires for women, and so could for the King's wives- which would be adultery. He could then go further to do sexual things with her... With his um.. Well, mouth- or other things.

A man however who had no sexual attraction, lust, desire for women were the perfect guards.

As far as anal sex goes... This sort of behavior was NOT seen as ideal among two men who loved each other. Even in cultures who did not yet know the Hebrew god- so basically there would be mutual masturbation between the two, when things became... Intimate, and there is nothing in the bible that condemns masturbation- just tells you to CLEAN RIGHT- so it lessens the chance of disease.

Since: Dec 11

Mountain Lakes, NJ

#12277 Oct 15, 2012
CORINTHIANS, condemns prostitution- men or women selling their bodies for sex. It condemns men using little boys for sex (pederasty)- which unfortunately is still done in some parts of Greece, and big time in the Middle East.

It condemns a particular cowardice in men, that was even condemned before knowledge of the Hebrew god. In which a man was passive in ALL ways towards another man.

He'd never be his own man, and would allow himself to be kept, and penetrated by men. This was the relationship between a slave boy (passive/effeminate), and the master (aggressive/penetrator), or the behavior of a man penetrating a temple prostitute who were very often males.

This sort of behavior was also seen as part of "Porniea" or porn- which was also condemned here. In the ancient world pornography, which often showed men with men, was NEVER a depiction of the ideal relationship of two men in love. In some Greek/Roman bath houses. People would do graffiti of porn, which often depicted men with boys, men penetrating men and women- or women using dildo on women (yes dildo were around in the ancient world, and were wood or marble... ouch lol)- again not ideal behavior.

You can even see today, how people covered these images; finding them offensive, and how they were repainted.

Since: Dec 11

Mountain Lakes, NJ

#12278 Oct 15, 2012
LEVITICUS: This comes from the Greek word "Leuitikos". Which means "In relation to the Levites". The Levites were the priest or priestly tribe(men). So basically part of this book described how YHWH's priest were to worship, or NOT worship in HIS temple... Conduct in YHWH temple.

"Man shall not LIE with man as he LIES with woman"

"To lie", is an archaic(primitive) word used to describe sexual intercourse, aka penetration. A man has sex with a woman by penetrating her. In cultures who did not yet know the Hebrew god- this was highly unfavorable behavior of two men emotionally, and physically in love. ESPECIALLY in the Hellenistic era in which the ideal male among other masculine attributes- was seen as "one without holes"- meaning he was NOT to be penetrated.

They viewed it as treating the other man, or allowing oneself to take on the role of a female- and be penetrated. Or taking on the role of a slave boy, temple prostitute, or defeated enemy to be further humiliated. All of which was seen as highly degrading, disrespectful, disgusting, and inconsiderate- even more so if they were warriors.

This book also tells the Levites to NOT behave as the Pagans do in their temples. Which was Idolatry- and then the sexual side of Idolatry known as Fornication. In which a man will lie with temple prostitutes in the hope of some sort of divination from this pagan god... Again temple prostitutes were very often males. Feminized males at that.

In the Viking era, feminized men- would make themselves up as wizards, and men would lie with them in hopes to gain some sort of magic...Ritualized sex is what it was, which is fornication. Not all of it was male on male, some of it was male on female, or female on female- but most often male on male.

Since: Dec 11

Mountain Lakes, NJ

#12279 Oct 15, 2012
ROMANS: Romans is funny, because you see how YHWH's priest- screwed up, disobeyed him, slipped up lol. They began to practice as the pagans did, doing Idolatry(idol worship), and Fornication(ritualized sex). It was men with men, men with women, women with women. There were phallic objects (dildos perverted women used on women, emulating male penetration of women), and all kinds of freakishness going on.

And so YHWH punished them... When god says, no sex in the champagne room... No sex in the champagne room. lol

Since: Dec 11

Mountain Lakes, NJ

#12280 Oct 15, 2012
Forgot to mention the bestiality- which was also done by pagans. In Minos, they worshiped bulls. Its believed the queen mated with a bull- and gave birth to a half bull have man creature. Interestingly they've actually found a lot of truth to this story. Though more than likely; speaking as someone who does believe in god.

This was probably a fallen angel (demon) mating with her, which made her give birth to a Nephilim. They weren't Jack and the beanstalk giant sized, by quite above average to the average man which was smaller in the old world. The bible describes them as "men of fame"- which gives truth to stories of pagan gods, and heroes in all cultures. Nephilim like fallen angels loved being worshiped by man- and felt man should worship them.

The man or "Minotaur" was no doubt unnaturally big- and probably wore a bull's head on his own, which made people think he had the head of a bull. He was also a cannibal, and the people of Minos would send virgin males, and females down to him... They found bones of young males and females in this labyrinth, the bones looked as if they were rapaciously mangled-as if something inhuman devoured them violently.

Since: Dec 11

Mountain Lakes, NJ

#12281 Oct 15, 2012
DEUTERONOMY: This comes from the Greek word "Deuteronomion" which means "second law". In Hebrew its "Devarim" "spoken words".

The sexual, things condemned here are...

1. Men substituting men in place of women. This can happen in settings in which no women are around for awhile. This happens in prison of course, but also in the military. Which is also part of why YHWH talks of a time period in which the soldiers are to be away at war- away from their women.

In cultures who did not yet know the Hebrew god- this was also seen as unfavorable, particularly among the Spartans. They believed that using another man (and especially boy), as a woman- feminized the boy or man. You were robbing him of his masculinity, his manhood, and even his warrior-hood.

In prison many masculine straight men- who are used for sex willingly (in hopes of being protected by the man who keeps them), or unwillingly (rape, used for sex); will completely change this man's mind and behavior in all the wrong ways. This sort of behavior among military, is quite known in Russian military in which the man being used or substituted as female for penetration- is called "suka" which is "bitch"

This even happens in our military, I've heard stories (unfortunately), but its widely kept on the down low. A friend of mine in the Marines was raped by a few others- and he was too ashamed to tell anyone.

2.Rape- in many ancient cultures defeated foes were raped for further humiliation- it also condemns rape of women.

3.Condemns men making themselves appear as women, and women appearing as men.

4.Teaches men (mainly soldiers), how to clean after a wet-dream when his seeds spill during it.

Since: Dec 11

Mountain Lakes, NJ

#12282 Oct 15, 2012
In the ancient world, and Old Testament times at that- due to the state of the world (not many humans on earth after flood)- Even if you were gay, meaning no sexual desire of women. You still had to marry and procreate.

1. To continue your line, especially if you were of importance.

2. Produce a citizen for the state/nation.

3. Care for you in old age.

In New Testament as I said, the world was not as harsh anymore, and different- so many of these laws no longer needed strict enforcement, or were needed at all.

Jesus states that marriage is between one man, and one woman. In ancient times, men did not marry men- it was seen as emulating male/female; and again if you loved and respected your man, you did not want him nor yourself to emulate such a dynamic.

However men did form covenants- which were agreements now in the eyes of the law, of the land. If one in the relationship died, the survivor would gain his property, and would even have to care for his family.

On the heterosexual side, this means none of that marrying X amount of wives... Polygamy -_-.

I've learned, that there are many homosexual men; who do not engage in anal sex, nor call the other "boyfriend" or "husband", or marry like man and woman. They follow the ideal view of the ancient world- and are harshly ridiculed by gays who follow mainstream gay culture/lifestyle. It was quite interesting, and sad to see.

Since: Dec 11

Mountain Lakes, NJ

#12283 Oct 15, 2012
God, the son, and the angels know mankind far better than we know ourselves. God is also the seer of all hearts, meaning only he knows the true hearts of men, and therefore is the ONLY one who can judge a man's soul(body) and spirit.

He knows our limits, and knows we are imperfect.

People do not yet understand why some are born gay, however its becoming clear- that people can in fact be born gay. There are many theories, as to why this happens, which does make sense.

People ignorantly assume, and think upon hearing the word "homosexual"-as someone who has a rapacious lustful behavior towards everything same sex...This is wrong, as the same could be thought of with heterosexual men. Gay people are people like anyone else, and have the need for love, companionship, and natural sexual needs. To deny and condemn them, is evil- and nothing of what Jesus did.

Since: Dec 11

Mountain Lakes, NJ

#12284 Oct 15, 2012
If people learned, and understood more the culture of the ancient world, maybe learn a bit of Hebrew and Greek- and meanings of the words... Most of all NOT take the bible so literally, they'd have a much better understanding of it... You don't need to be some big time religious scholar, or figure- as many of them too don't get it.

Good night ^_^

Since: Apr 12

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#12285 Oct 15, 2012
Ink_knight; Where do you have the information from?

Since: Apr 12

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#12286 Oct 15, 2012
RevKen has big problems. Not smart to be in contact with him?:)

Since: Apr 12

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#12287 Oct 15, 2012
Middleway also seems to struggle with aggression, and this Rhys maybe.

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