Homosexuality and the Bible

Aug 15, 2011 Full story: www.smh.com.au 30,881

Given the ongoing debate about same-sex marriage, it is time I looked at the two Testaments to remind myself why belief is so hard for me to embrace.

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“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#27084 Jul 5, 2014
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
What a stupid claim.
Homosexuality is not a sin, it is a sexual birth defect.
A dyke is one step from being transgendered, and a lesbian attracted to a dyke is one step from being heterosexual. This exposes a spectrum of sexual orientation aberration in LGBTs.
However, the inherent harm, unhealthiness and demeaning nature of anal sex IS a sin. It is a violation of nature and should be a violation of law.
RevKen wrote:
<quoted text>
Sexual "birth defect?"
Left-handedness is a birth defect. A penis the size of a baseball bat is a sexual defect. Blue eyes are a genetic defect. A vagina too small to allow normal birth, requiring a birthing mother to undergo a caesarian section or risk death by natural birth, is a sexual birth defect. Red hair and porcelain-like skin is a genetic defect.
Personally, I like good-looking red-headed women. I've always appreciated this genetic defect.
Obsession over anal sex is a mental defect.
What people say and do with and for each other, as mutually consenting adults, in the privacy of their own bedroom is their own business and nobody else's. Any law written to define the acceptability and variability of such private behavior is both unenforceable and unconstitutional.
Inserting hemorrhoid suppositories for relief of symptoms is a violation of nature. So is a colonoscopy. So is a prostate exam.
What kind of clothes they wear and how they see themselves in terms of personal sexual identity and orientation and attraction to others is a matter of personal, individual right and freedom of expression.
There are reasonable boundaries that can be expected of an individual who is accepting of responsibility and of cooperatively functioning within a lawful and moral society. More freedom of expression is generally much better than less freedom of expression. However, such freedoms require that the general mix of the citizenry collectively understand the "whys" and the "what fors" that are written so that such freedoms and the resultant variations in behavior are both allowed and defended.
Can't fix stupid. But, what can be defined as stupid is, to a degree, fixable.
Rev. Ken
Um, rev,

you are confusing mutations with defects.

Abuse is NEVER acceptable. Someone that gives consent to abuse is sick.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#27085 Jul 5, 2014
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
I am obsessed much with anal sex.
This should help.

http://mormonboyz.com/

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#27086 Jul 5, 2014
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
Yet you were the one who claimed that meaning yes or no only applied when you made an oath, even though Jesus said not to make any oaths.
<quoted text>
How does that crow taste lying jackass?

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#27087 Jul 5, 2014
KiMare wrote:
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
What a stupid claim.
Homosexuality is not a sin, it is a sexual birth defect.
A dyke is one step from being transgendered, and a lesbian attracted to a dyke is one step from being heterosexual. This exposes a spectrum of sexual orientation aberration in LGBTs.
However, the inherent harm, unhealthiness and demeaning nature of anal sex IS a sin. It is a violation of nature and should be a violation of law.
<quoted text>
Um, rev,
you are confusing mutations with defects.
Abuse is NEVER acceptable. Someone that gives consent to abuse is sick.
Um, nope.

Most mutations are defects. Whether or not such defects are or can be found to be useful and become successively normalized within society often depends on the ability to overcome such "defect." A woman with a vagina that is too small to accommodate the birth of a normally-sized child is a good example. Birth by caesarian section is the acceptable remedy that overcomes the defect.

The winnowing of the genetic pool is a constant process. You should know.

"Abuse" or the definition of such is wholly subjective. Whether or not it is moral is collectively subjective. Masturbation is regarded as "normal." But, it is a form of self-abuse.

Adornment by piercing is a form of self-abuse. The earring industry would disagree. The use of restraint during sex is a form of abuse. Is it illegal or wrong or sinful, even though it is permitted by the person restrained, and is it then a form of abuse?

It most certainly is abuse. But, unless the person is forced into submission against their will and reports the abuse later, as having been an unwilling participant, the Law cannot be brought to bear.

I am sorry that you have problems with personal abuse, specifically with your understanding of anal sex. But, your experience and understanding are not a proper, normalizing barometer of how other people understand and experience variations in sexual experience, including anal sex and stimulation.

You don't belong in their personal, mutually consensual behaviors. You have nothing to say about it.

In fact, every time you reiterate your views and try to mischaracterize the behaviors of others by attempts to morally define their experience for them in terms of YOUR own limitations, you trespass. Furthermore, you reveal to everyone else the nature of your obsessions.

What goes on in other people's bedrooms or in private is none of your or anyone else's business. That is, unless the participants decide to broadcast their private behavior in some manner in which case it is often regarded as pornography. Even then, much of it is legal, but, perhaps not so much moral.

Go find help for your improperly intrusive moral obsessions.

Rev. Ken

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#27088 Jul 5, 2014
RevKen wrote:
<quoted text>
Um, nope.
Most mutations are defects. Whether or not such defects are or can be found to be useful and become successively normalized within society often depends on the ability to overcome such "defect." A woman with a vagina that is too small to accommodate the birth of a normally-sized child is a good example. Birth by caesarian section is the acceptable remedy that overcomes the defect.
Rev. Ken
In the old days, that woman would probably die meaning the norm would be women with big vaginas.

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#27089 Jul 5, 2014
lides wrote:
<quoted text>
Congratulations, Joe, you've failed to address the core of the argument ...
Not only are you clueless of the core, you don't even know what the argument is.
But that's never stopped you from posting before, has it?
RevKen wrote:
<quoted text>
What is all this obsessively useless semantics about !????
The passage is about the taking of oaths. Period.
If you want to qualify your understanding of the meaning of the passage, you can say it is about NOT taking oaths. But, everybody knows that is "straining at gnats" and that whether or NOT makes no difference.
Either a person's word is good or it is not ...
... and WasteWater's isn't.
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
How does that crow taste ...
See above and tell us who would trust a poster who calls himself waste water?
Your "yes" and "no" are as meaningless as everything else you have posted here.
You are a waste of time, a waste of space ....

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#27090 Jul 5, 2014
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
Not only are you clueless of the core, you don't even know what the argument is.
But that's never stopped you from posting before, has it?
<quoted text>
... and WasteWater's isn't.
<quoted text>
See above and tell us who would trust a poster who calls himself waste water?
Your "yes" and "no" are as meaningless as everything else you have posted here.
You are a waste of time, a waste of space ....
Your Bible quote is pure nonsense Jackass.

Who are you trying to impress? Everyone here knows you are clueless jackass.
LUKE

Anonymous Proxy

#27091 Jul 5, 2014
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
Your Bible quote is pure nonsense Jackass.
Who are you trying to impress? Everyone here knows you are clueless jackass.
Dude only jackass here is you simpleton.
Jacob

Dade City, FL

#27092 Jul 5, 2014
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
Fair enough.
"I would also like to add that I'm not trying to judge anyone. I'm just sharing what the Bible says. I'm not sharing my opinion. It's God's opinion. I know someone is going to twist it and say,“Oh, he's just being judgmental and saying gays should burn in Hell!” But I'm not saying that. I'm just saying we love (or at least I do, and all Christians are supposed to) gays; we just don't like the sin of being gay. In other words, love the person, hate the sin."
1. You say what is written in the Bible is "God's opinion." We know that men wrote the Bible which makes everything written in the Bible "man's opinion" of God. To claim knowledge of God's opinion is ludicrous.
2. "Love the person, hate the sin," is trite nonsense, as is your claim to non-judgment. If one calls a homosexual sinful, then it is neither love nor non-judgment.
3. The fact is homosexuality is a state of being. It is the way a person is. To call that sinful is abusive and hurtful.
4. Using the Bible against others is a form of idolatry because each person is in-being with God as the Gospels speak of the Holy Sprit. Using the Bible to insult the Holy Spirit within others is elevating the Bible above God which is idolatry.
Here is a passage to keep in mind.
1 Peter 4:15New King James Version (NKJV)
15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer, a thief, an evildoer, or as a busybody in other people’s matters.
It is best to look after one's own sins and stay out of other people's affairs.
Ok. Let me explain all of that.
1. God spoke through man. He isn't a physical being. He chose to speak through us. It may be hard to believe, but we have to have faith. If we're wrong, and you just see blackness when you die, then oh, well. We were wrong. If we were right, and you see either Heaven or Hell, then all non-Christians will sadly be in Hell. He warns us in the Bible about that. Anyway, back on the topic.
2. I'm simply saying that homosexuality is wrong. Just homosexuality itself; as a verb. I'm sure all homosexuals are really nice people if you get to know them.
3. You can change the way you are. For example, let's say someone's a murderer. It may be “judgemental” to say that murdering is wrong, but you have to say something. They may tell at you and say it's just the way they are and they can't change that, but it's still wrong. It doesn't make it any less wrong.
4. I agree. It is wrong to use the Bible against others. Sometimes Christians just are so mean and use the Bible to support their opinion. We need to stop being so mean to people and tell them the same message but in a loving way. Think about the most popular verse, John 3:16.“For God so LOVED the world...” He loves us so we need to love each other because of His example.
Jacob

Dade City, FL

#27093 Jul 5, 2014
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
To get your attention. I guess it worked.
Hope you weren't too offended.
No, I wasn't offended. But thanks anyway.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#27094 Jul 5, 2014
Jacob wrote:
<quoted text>
Ok. Let me explain all of that.
1. God spoke through man. He isn't a physical being. He chose to speak through us. It may be hard to believe, but we have to have faith. If we're wrong, and you just see blackness when you die, then oh, well. We were wrong. If we were right, and you see either Heaven or Hell, then all non-Christians will sadly be in Hell. He warns us in the Bible about that. Anyway, back on the topic.
2. I'm simply saying that homosexuality is wrong. Just homosexuality itself; as a verb. I'm sure all homosexuals are really nice people if you get to know them.
3. You can change the way you are. For example, let's say someone's a murderer. It may be “judgemental” to say that murdering is wrong, but you have to say something. They may tell at you and say it's just the way they are and they can't change that, but it's still wrong. It doesn't make it any less wrong.
4. I agree. It is wrong to use the Bible against others. Sometimes Christians just are so mean and use the Bible to support their opinion. We need to stop being so mean to people and tell them the same message but in a loving way. Think about the most popular verse, John 3:16.“For God so LOVED the world...” He loves us so we need to love each other because of His example.
Item 1. Let's see you prove that using readily verifiable non-ontological evidence.

Item 2. What's wrong with homosexuality? It is simply one's sexual orientation.

Item 3. People don't change their sexual orientation which is established during gestation. Your comparison to behaviors is fallacious.

Item 4. If you say it is wrong, then why are you doing it? You are effectively driving people away with your hurtful opinion that it is wrong to be homosexual, which is the way some people are. What if someone told you it was wrong to be how you are?

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#27095 Jul 5, 2014
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
Item 1. Let's see you prove that using readily verifiable non-ontological evidence.
Item 2. What's wrong with homosexuality? It is simply one's sexual orientation.
Item 3. People don't change their sexual orientation which is established during gestation. Your comparison to behaviors is fallacious.
Item 4. If you say it is wrong, then why are you doing it? You are effectively driving people away with your hurtful opinion that it is wrong to be homosexual, which is the way some people are. What if someone told you it was wrong to be how you are?
One time when I was much younger, I was hitch-hiking from FL to IL. Coming through IN, I got picked up by a young couple in a big old Buick driving toward Indy with their four-year-old son.

The kid had a cast-like wrapping and sling on his left arm, completely immobilizing it. Now, I'm left-handed myself. So, I naturally was curious and asked the parents what had happened and what was wrong with the little boy's arm.

The dad piped up and said, "Oh, there's nothing broken. He's left-handed and we are just changing him over to right-handed." The ignorant, cavalier attitude of the parents struck me like a sledgehammer.

After composing myself, I proceeded to educate them about how the brain of their child had been genetically wired for left-handedness. I told them that they were very likely doing damage to him and potentially significant damage! All of which is true.

Such attempts at changing like this often result in serious dyslexia-like learning and coordination problems.

There are a lot of very poorly informed people out there, WW. Your patience with them is very much appreciated, although maybe not by the ones who most need it.

I don't know if my serious lecture made a difference for that boy and his parents. But, I sure hope so.

Rev. Ken

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#27096 Jul 6, 2014
RevKen wrote:
<quoted text>
Um, nope.
Most mutations are defects. Whether or not such defects are or can be found to be useful and become successively normalized within society often depends on the ability to overcome such "defect." A woman with a vagina that is too small to accommodate the birth of a normally-sized child is a good example. Birth by caesarian section is the acceptable remedy that overcomes the defect.
The winnowing of the genetic pool is a constant process. You should know.
"Abuse" or the definition of such is wholly subjective. Whether or not it is moral is collectively subjective. Masturbation is regarded as "normal." But, it is a form of self-abuse.
Adornment by piercing is a form of self-abuse. The earring industry would disagree. The use of restraint during sex is a form of abuse. Is it illegal or wrong or sinful, even though it is permitted by the person restrained, and is it then a form of abuse?
It most certainly is abuse. But, unless the person is forced into submission against their will and reports the abuse later, as having been an unwilling participant, the Law cannot be brought to bear.
I am sorry that you have problems with personal abuse, specifically with your understanding of anal sex. But, your experience and understanding are not a proper, normalizing barometer of how other people understand and experience variations in sexual experience, including anal sex and stimulation.
You don't belong in their personal, mutually consensual behaviors. You have nothing to say about it.
In fact, every time you reiterate your views and try to mischaracterize the behaviors of others by attempts to morally define their experience for them in terms of YOUR own limitations, you trespass. Furthermore, you reveal to everyone else the nature of your obsessions.
What goes on in other people's bedrooms or in private is none of your or anyone else's business. That is, unless the participants decide to broadcast their private behavior in some manner in which case it is often regarded as pornography. Even then, much of it is legal, but, perhaps not so much moral.
Go find help for your improperly intrusive moral obsessions.
Rev. Ken
So you agree that homosexuality is a sexual birth defect.

Abuse is not wholly subjective. What an idiot, sick claim.

"There are a number of health risks with anal sex, and anal intercourse is the riskiest form of sexual activity for several reasons, including the following:"

http://www.webmd.com/sex/anal-sex-health-conc...

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#27097 Jul 6, 2014
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
Your Bible quote is pure nonsense ...
Only because the Bible is a closed book to a pathetic troll like yourself.

Waste of water, waste of time, waste of electrons ...

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#27098 Jul 6, 2014
WasteWater wrote:
What's wrong with homosexuality?...
The same thing that's wrong with you: an empty wastefulness of which you are oblivious to.

See above.
Close to God

Hillsboro, OR

#27099 Jul 6, 2014
God approves of homosexuality, and all possible evidence proves it. Here's my reasoning: thousands of his spokesmen have buggered little boys for centuries and gone on and on doing it, even getting the church to enable their continued buggering.

God is all knowing and all seeing, so he obviously saw his spokesmen doing this, and not only getting away with it, but using their position as his spokesmen to bring in more young butts to violate and to silence their victims.

As stated in the bible, thousands of years ago God disapproved of homosexuality and punished it (Sodom and Gamorah). Obviously, he has changed his policy now.

If the president's spokesman ate meat in front of the president, and used the president's power to get more meat brought in and eat it, we could conclude that the president allows and somewhat approves of meat eating, even if he was a vegetarian. Of course, if the president didn't know it was happening, and nobody told him, we might believe the president doesn't approve.

In God's case, he knows all about it, and thousands of these devastated young boys begged him for help preventing repeated rapes, and he not only did nothing, he continued letting the homosexual rapists work as his spokesmen. So, either he is at least neutral on the subject, or he's not all knowing and doesn't hear prayers, in which case go ahead and have homosexual sex if that appeals to you (please use consenting adults, though).

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#27100 Jul 6, 2014
RevKen wrote:
<quoted text>
One time when I was much younger, I was hitch-hiking from FL to IL. Coming through IN, I got picked up by a young couple in a big old Buick driving toward Indy with their four-year-old son.
The kid had a cast-like wrapping and sling on his left arm, completely immobilizing it. Now, I'm left-handed myself. So, I naturally was curious and asked the parents what had happened and what was wrong with the little boy's arm.
The dad piped up and said, "Oh, there's nothing broken. He's left-handed and we are just changing him over to right-handed." The ignorant, cavalier attitude of the parents struck me like a sledgehammer.
After composing myself, I proceeded to educate them about how the brain of their child had been genetically wired for left-handedness. I told them that they were very likely doing damage to him and potentially significant damage! All of which is true.
Such attempts at changing like this often result in serious dyslexia-like learning and coordination problems.
There are a lot of very poorly informed people out there, WW. Your patience with them is very much appreciated, although maybe not by the ones who most need it.
I don't know if my serious lecture made a difference for that boy and his parents. But, I sure hope so.
Rev. Ken
Indeed.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#27101 Jul 6, 2014
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
Only because the Bible is a closed book to a pathetic troll like yourself.
Waste of water, waste of time, waste of electrons ...
Total projection DUDE.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#27102 Jul 6, 2014
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
The same thing that's wrong with you: an empty wastefulness of which you are oblivious to.
See above.
How's that crow taste pathetic filth?

“No Headline available”

Since: Jan 08

Defiance, Ohio

#27103 Jul 6, 2014
Joe DeCaro wrote:
Not only are you clueless of the core, you don't even know what the argument is.
But that's never stopped you from posting before, has it?
Joe, you can't blame me because you are a judgmental hypocrite.

Judge not, lest ye be judged.
Treat your neighbor as yourself.
Forgive even your enemies.
Forgive your brother not 7 times, but 70 times 7 times.

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