So, What Is It That The Anti-Gay Groups Actually Fear?

Aug 17, 2012 Full story: lezgetreal.com 18,016

What makes hate, well, hate? Given that today is something of a quiet news day, it may be nice to give ourselves a breather and think about some things.

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“Psalms 27:14 HOPE! ”

Since: Dec 11

Cincinnati, Ohio

#6231 Oct 8, 2012
MisterCharrington wrote:
<quoted text>
So you're saying that the dates given by that site[hilarious it was too] is that the 'great deluge' happened around 2300BCE that is before the alleged birth of jesus.
So how can you say you have nothing from which to reference a timeline?
You would have us believe that this birth was 2012 years ago would you not?
WHICH MEANS THAT THE EGYPTIAN OLD KINGDOM INCLUDING THE BUILDING OF THE PYRAMIDS AND THE OLD KINDOMS CROWNING ACHIVEMENTS OCCURED DURING THE ALLEGED FLOOD!
Either you agree with the dates or you don't in which case how can yu ever cite josephus as a source for anything if you only accept the parts which FIT.
The Middle Kingdom of Egypt did not consist of 63 people all of whom were descended from Noah!
.......now quote some bible like a good girl.
yes the flood was long before Jesus
have you never read the bible?

and yes it was over 2,000 yrs ago that Jesus walked the earth.

what is your point? that there was no halmark calander to tell you the specific day and hour? PFFFFFFF.

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“Psalms 27:14 HOPE! ”

Since: Dec 11

Cincinnati, Ohio

#6232 Oct 8, 2012
MisterCharrington wrote:
<quoted text>
No she can't be taught, truth is relative to her, things can be 'true for now' and then they can be 'false for then' just to make sure she has her ducks in a row.
funny how someone who has read statements i have posted a zillion times over can't retain them for more than 5 min.

what was right and wrong in the begining IS STILL right and wrong today.

do you really think your smoke screen is successful in hiding who you truly are?
which is a person who not only DOESN'T know right from wrong, but who works 24/7 trying to justify immoral behavior as if it was right.

you can't take credit for creation, but you also don't want to give credit where credit is due either.
you lift up impossibilities such as big bangs, evolution and ancestors who swung from trees....
life that designed and created itself from NON life and non matter.
you embrace all that crazyness as if it were established facts documented for the world to see.

you make excuses so you can ease your own conscience.
if you tell yourself there is no GOD then you can equally assure yourself there is no accountibility or higher moral standards.
that way what ever you do, has no consequence to it.
that is why atheists are atheists..........SELFISH.
SIN LOVING.......SELF SERVING.........people.

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“Psalms 27:14 HOPE! ”

Since: Dec 11

Cincinnati, Ohio

#6233 Oct 8, 2012
Lacez wrote:
<quoted text>
Ignore her until the 15th, she'll go batshit insane (even more so).
LOL i guess your atheist nature of being 'self centered' is shining brightly today.
you think a hand full of atheists and gays are the only ones on topix? LOL
how do you fit that oversized ego thru the door?

what happens on the 15th? is that some kind of atheist or gay holiday? LOL

and i think it would be more likely YOU would go crazy, afterall who would you bash and argue with if not for me and those who are here to set you straight about your addictions and love of sin?

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“Psalms 27:14 HOPE! ”

Since: Dec 11

Cincinnati, Ohio

#6234 Oct 8, 2012
Passing Through wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually, you're the liar who changes their assertions with every post.
<quoted text>
Except Mr Charrington didn't say that.What he said was:
"No one who was British deiscovered the Americas"
"the 'pilgrims' did not discover america"
"they [the Pilgrims] were not the FIRST settlers" (emphasis added)
<quoted text>
No, you;re the one who is lying. Boith about historical facts as well as in your summaries of what others have said.
<quoted text>
The actual answer from your site states:
"The Pilgrims came to America from England. They were an oppressed religious group seeking religious freedom. They left for America in 1620."
This answer is factually correct although could be considered somewhat incomplete. Your summarization of it as fleeing from England in 1620 "to escape religious persecution in ENGLAND" is factually incorrect. The Pilgrims England and ultimately settled in city of Leiden in The Netherlands in 1609. In 1617 the Pilgrims became concerned about their long term viability as a congregation in the Netherlands and decided to seek permission to settle in English claimed territory in America. The initial group of Pilgrim colonists left The Netherlands for England in July 1620 on a ship named the Speedwell. In England, they joined up with other colonists hired by the investment company funding the voyage to America. The combined group of Pilgrims and hired colonists left England in September 1620 aboard the Mayflower.
So the Pilgrims were not felling religious persecution in England when they began their voyage on the Mayflower, nor had they even been living in England for more than a decade.
<quoted text>
Nope. The area was already inhabited by Native Americans for thousands of years.
"The native inhabitants of the region around Plymouth Colony were the various tribes of the Wampanoag people, who had lived there for some 10,000 years before the Europeans arrived."
link: http://www.history.com/topics/pilgrims
<quoted text>
No wonder you're an uneducated moron.
<quoted text>
No, your synopsis of the Pilgrim's life immediately preceding their voyage to America is in fact a lie. The Pilgrims didn't live In England at the time they made their voyage to America; they lived in the Netherlands.
wow i have never encountered someone who called the history books in school 'liars' but you have sure painted yourself as a lunitic thats for sure......HAHAHA

"In fourteen hundred and ninety two
Columbus sailed the ocean blue.
He had 3 ships that left from spain
he said thru sunshine, wind and rain.
and the Columbus song goes ON and ON and tells the story of how He explored the NEW WORLD.... and settled here.

http://www.edu-cyberpg.com/IEC/iecmusic6.html

the pilgrims came to America in 1620 FROM ENGLAND
to what was called the NEW WORLD.
it was not established or founded as AMERICA unto 1776
the fact there were indians living on some of the lands thru out the NEW WORLD didn't erase the fact the PILGRIMS did flee from England to come here to settle a new world.
and that is what they did.
they settled it in colonies.....and it was the colonists who later founded AMERICA in 1776 not the Indians.
there was not one indian among our founding fathers.

http://answers.ask.com/Society/Other/what_cou...

you can NOT argue with HISTORICAL FACTS.
but i know you think you can.

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“Psalms 27:14 HOPE! ”

Since: Dec 11

Cincinnati, Ohio

#6235 Oct 8, 2012
Passing Through wrote:
<quoted text>
And the full topic is what fear do you have that causes you to be anti-gay. The thread's topic isn't your bible that you can just cherry pick whatever word(s) you want to focus on.
<quoted text>
On the contrary, I reject your logical fallacy of a false dichotomy. Nor am I bound by your misinterpretation of the thread's actual topic.
<quoted text>
We already know you choose lies, hypocrisy and bigotry on which to build your opposition. None of which have any standing from a constitutional standpoint on which to justify denying gays equal protection under the law.
<quoted text>
I'm merely correcting your erroneous assertion as to the actual topic of the thread. YOU are the one who whines incessantly about others being off topic. The thread's title defines the topic; YOU don't get to ignore it simply because you want to hijack the thread and spew your religious cyber diarrhea.
<quoted text>
Your boat sunk many years ago. It's merely the delusions caused by your mental illness that you believe you're "rowing" anything.
LOL, the thread was started by A GAY.
i don't oppose SS out of fear, i oppose it because i have enough sense to know it is wrong.

prove i cherry pick the bible.
show me what part of the bible i ignor or believe is irrelvant.

again you fabricate falsehoods.

every word of the bible is equally important.

oh your bound alright.......... unless you can stop the world and get off, you are bound by the same laws of the creator that I am.

and what you are really bound to is satan, cause you come here and PROMOTE SS as if it was right.......KNOWING, the bible says it is wrong.

you are an enemy of GOD by your own confession and deeds.

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“Psalms 27:14 HOPE! ”

Since: Dec 11

Cincinnati, Ohio

#6236 Oct 8, 2012
How I See It wrote:
<quoted text>
Eternal fire is symbolic of eternal death and nothing more. Gehenna was a pit kept burning near Jerusalem for the destruction of refuse as well as criminals. It is used often in the scriptures to symbolize complete destruction, not eternal torment.
your soul is going to exist one place or the other for all of eternity.

thats what the bible says.

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“Psalms 27:14 HOPE! ”

Since: Dec 11

Cincinnati, Ohio

#6237 Oct 8, 2012
EdmondWA wrote:
<quoted text>
They'd have to read every single post on every page, for that to qualify. Do you do that? I don't. I skim, I look for the conversation threads that I'm directly involved in, but I don't pick through EVERY word. BOOORING. Plenty of conversations here are nothing but insult-slinging, and I have no interest in any of THAT nonsense.
Somewhere online, someone has posted THEIR answers to any number of my questions. If I wanted to hear people just recite canned answers, I could go there. But, we ALL could do that, and that would put an end to forums like this. Where's the fun in THAT? Direct, real-time interaction is far more interesting. I'm more interested in hearing what people have to say about their beliefs when they're "in the moment". You learn FAR more about a person's beliefs when you can ask them, directly, "What do you believe, and why do you believe it?" and then go from there.
Think of it this way: You've repeatedly told me that you've already explained these aspects of your beliefs "hundreds" of times. You've spent paragraph after paragraph, post after post, telling me this. Wouldn't it have been SHORTER and SIMPLER to have just provided me the answer, rather than WASTE huge blocks of text avoiding it?
That's like asking someone for directions which would take them 30 seconds to give, and then listening to them talk for 10 minutes about why they CAN'T give you directions. The directions would have been faster in the first place!
<quoted text>
Why not, when you're speaking to different people each time?
I'm on this site because I ENJOY communicating with people about these subjects. How strange would it be for me to GRIPE about spending time in these conversations? I'm here because I LIKE it. Each time a new person asks me to explain myself and my position, I THRILL at being able to tell it again to someone new. You make it sound like explaining your beliefs is a CHORE that you'd prefer to avoid. So why hang out in discussion forums?
<quoted text>
And we reach different conclusions, which sparks a debate on the subject. Shouldn't we try to find out WHY we have different perceptions of the same thing?
<quoted text>
I have the ability to seek MANY things. But I don't PRESUME what I'm seeking. If I simply DECIDE that I already know, why seek?
<quoted text>
I see TONS of disorder as well. I see things that, if they WERE deliberatly designed, would represent the height of cruelty and evil.
<quoted text>
I have the desire for truth. If it turns out that truth DOESN'T come from the supernatural, I'm open to it. Are you?
<quoted text>
It sounds as though you will always accuse me of not having desire, unless I desire the same things as you.
So, fine. You're not up for answering questions about your beliefs, you resent conversation about the subject, and you're dismissive about any findings that differ from your own (without any questions or conversation about it).
I'll leave you alone. Have fun with... whatever you're here for.
I PROMISE you that ever answer i have given, has been given more than once to the same person.

i get tired of spending along time typing facts and information ONLY to have it PIDDLED on by the God haters.
you must know that gets boring for me.

ask what you will and i will do my best to address it.

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“Psalms 27:14 HOPE! ”

Since: Dec 11

Cincinnati, Ohio

#6238 Oct 8, 2012
Passing Through wrote:
<quoted text>
The US Supreme Court can indeed invalidate any portion of a state constitution found in conflict with the US constitution (hint for uneducated morons: The US Supreme Court is part of the judicial branch of the federal government). And it has invalidated state constitutional amendments on more than one occasion, including a case involving an anti-gay amendment in Colorado (se Romer v. Evans).
And while I believe the Supreme Court should invalidate state prohibitions against same sex marriage based on precedent, I nor anyone else can predict how the justices would decide to rule when such a case is brought before the court. However, even an adverse ruling against gays would no necessarily be the final word as even the Supreme Court itself has admitted they've gotten their initial rulings in equal protection cases wrong on occasion (see Plessy v Fergusson compared to Brown v Board of Education or Bowers v Hardwick compared to Lawrence v Texas).
<quoted text>
Then why do you whine and complain incessantly about most everything?
OF COURSE you think the Supreme court should mandate it state wide
you are PRO-immorality.
so of course you think that.
but the truth is, at this time it is not that way in America.
even our current president who supports SSM in his PERSONAL thoughts, said that he does not believe the FEDERAL government should tamper with or interfer with the individual states decisions on it.

let me clue you in on a little fact you are not taking into consideration.
ROE vs WADE as in abortion........what happened just last year in Mississippi? they passed an amendment to recgonize 'LIFE' at conception.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/11/04/us/mississippi-...

it is called personhood amendments
http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2011/10/03/3...

my point is that LAWS CHANGE.
so even if by some fluke the supreme court ever tried to mandate it statewide, the OPINION and feelings of the MAJORITY of folks in each state who has voted NO, would and could petition in repeals to 'change' such laws.
happens all the time.

“Psalms 27:14 HOPE! ”

Since: Dec 11

Cincinnati, Ohio

#6239 Oct 8, 2012
Rose_NoHo wrote:
<quoted text>
Homophobes are famous for lying while trying to demonize gay men. It's a well know fact.
<quoted text>
Rose's Law:
Morons, like Bob, who have no real argument scream, "But what about the children!?"
you mean like how people like yourself are ALWAYS blaming others for everything?
you can't demonize anyone.
YOU are responsible for your own actions and words
if someone is demonized they are at their own choosing.

why do you call what is right a lie all the time?
why do you call sexual immorality right and 'purity and design' a lie?

you are not wired right.

“Psalms 27:14 HOPE! ”

Since: Dec 11

Cincinnati, Ohio

#6240 Oct 8, 2012
Passing Through wrote:
<quoted text>
Torah and Tanakh are not interchangeable words, you ignorant hag. Torah does refer to the first five books of Hebrew scripture. However, Tanakh refers to the entire contents of the Hebrew bible.
Just another example of your false claim to know anything about the Jewish faith.
<quoted text>
I inquired why "why don't Protestant bibles place the texts of Hebrew scripture in the same order that Jews do?" Hebrew scriptures contain more than five books. What about the other ones? Come on and dazzle us with your oft proclaimed knowledge of the Jewish faith.
i think it is way past time you and I fish or cut bait.
anotherwords the 'dance' is over.

every post you send is a infusion of namecalling.
arguing NO MATTER WHAT I SAY.
disputing links i send
calling the bible a lie
rejecting what GOD says in the bible about SS being an abomination
avoiding the truth.
and CHRISTIAN BASHING.

lets us lay our cards on the table.
YOU are hateful, insultive and against GOD and the bible.
YOU are a supporter of sexual immorality.
YOU are a bigot of anyone who opposes it based on biblical teaching.
and YOU are a pottymouth.

YOU WILL NEVER CHANGE.
because you harbor bitterness and rebellion in your heart.

I love GOD...... I trust the bible as the truth it is.
and i will not walk away from GOD or what i know is right.

so we are at an impass.........
you go your way
i will go mine.

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“Unconvinced”

Since: Nov 09

Seattle, WA

#6241 Oct 8, 2012
Pattiecake58 wrote:
I PROMISE you that ever answer i have given, has been given more than once to the same person.
None of them were me.
Pattiecake58 wrote:
i get tired of spending along time typing facts and information ONLY to have it PIDDLED on by the God haters.
you must know that gets boring for me.
Then why are you here? As I explained, I enjoy the debate on these subjects. I keep coming back for more. If I were "tired" of it and found it "boring", I'd give it up and find something more fulfilling. You don't HAVE to be here.
Pattiecake58 wrote:
ask what you will and i will do my best to address it.
My primary question would be: How can we know that the claims of Christianity and the Bible are TRUE?(The rest of this just explores that question in more depth).

The Bible contains SO MUCH that is patently wrong. I've listed some of my issues, like talking animals, the use of bird's blood to cure leprosy, the presence of fictional animals (which exist in my version but not in yours), the endorsement of slavery and misogyny... etc. Don't these things kind of throw the Bible into question? Bats are simply NOT BIRDS, and should NEVER be included on a such a list. An "all-knowing" god should know this. Primitive people WOULDN'T, and it's a mistake we can expect THEM to make, but not gods.

If the Bible were the ONLY book on the planet with people claiming it came from the supernatural, that might lend it SOME credibility, but that isn't CLOSE to being true. This planet is LITTERED with "scriptures". Why pick one over the others? What have all those other people done wrong in picking THEIR favorites? Heck, why should I pick YOUR version, which has had its dragons and unicorns scrubbed out, over MY version?

If you were trying to sell your religion to me, if you were trying to convert me, what points would you emphasize in order to convince me? What would elevate this book ABOVE the level of common mythology?

Keep in mind that I am reading it now, I'm sure I'll be done... eventually (speaking of boring). But so far I've seen stories of people doing AWFUL things and being REWARDED for it by God. I've seen people COMMANDED to do awful things BY God. I've seen stories of events that defy reality and logic. I've seen stories which remarkably resemble the myths of other cultures. I've seen NOTHING which couldn't have been written by the primitive people of the time.

I'm not "blinded" or "rebellious", I'm simply logical and analytical. If I wanted to CONFIRM that the Bible is true, how would I do it? The scientific method gives us a path for confirming our discoveries in nature. We test, we measure. We repeat our tests. We demonstrate our findings where everyone can see them, and so that anyone can repeat our tests. We include safeguards for falsifiablitiy, so that if our ideas about our tests are WRONG, we can test for that TOO. Will this method work for studying the claims of the Bible? Can the supernatural be tested?

If the answer is simply "have faith", then to me this sounds like "just DECIDE that you like these stories and that you believe them". But I can't do that (and if there's a god, then he made me like this, he gave me these standards of confirmation). You can't MAKE yourself believe what you don't believe. I must be CONVINCED first. I must be swayed by evidence. These stories are not convincing (though obviously they were to you), and I can't be blamed for their failure. I need more, and if there's a god, he should understand that.

I don't appreciate the general Christian attitude that my questioning and skepticism ("scoffing", to you) is some sort of crime to be looked down on and punished. This is how people learn. I know of no other way. If Christianity can't measure up to the questions with valid, thorough, coherent answers, then I see no point in pursuing it as a path to "truth".

“Psalms 27:14 HOPE! ”

Since: Dec 11

Cincinnati, Ohio

#6242 Oct 8, 2012
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Perhaps you don't use cuss words.
But from what I have seen, you express hostile, nasty, vulgar thoughts.
And that's far worse than an occasional dirty word.
we christians are humans, and the bible teaches us that we CAN get angry, but we are not suppose to sin in our anger.

so if someone comes at me with vile hateful vulgar words to attack me or my faith, OF COURSE I CAN GET ANGRY.........it is a human emotion that is there for a reason, but it would be wrong of me to react in like manner by cussing at them or using vulgar words.

do you expect i should NOT express my disgust or speak the truth such as calling someone who IS bashing God and or the bible as what they are which is 'demonic and foolish'?

i know i can be stern and bold and sometimes 'cutting' which i KNOW i should not be, but i have feelings to and i react to attacks with directness and choose my words carefully.
always being 'clean' in the words i use.

how stupid would i be NOT to stand up for myself or my faith?

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“Psalms 27:14 HOPE! ”

Since: Dec 11

Cincinnati, Ohio

#6243 Oct 8, 2012
EdmondWA wrote:
<quoted text>
None of them were me.
<quoted text>
Then why are you here? As I explained, I enjoy the debate on these subjects. I keep coming back for more. If I were "tired" of it and found it "boring", I'd give it up and find something more fulfilling. You don't HAVE to be here.
<quoted text>
My primary question would be: How can we know that the claims of Christianity and the Bible are TRUE?(The rest of this just explores that question in more depth).
The Bible contains SO MUCH that is patently wrong. I've listed some of my issues, like talking animals, the use of bird's blood to cure leprosy, the presence of fictional animals (which exist in my version but not in yours), the endorsement of slavery and misogyny... etc. Don't these things kind of throw the Bible into question? Bats are simply NOT BIRDS, and should NEVER be included on a such a list. An "all-knowing" god should know this. Primitive people WOULDN'T, and it's a mistake we can expect THEM to make, but not gods.
If the Bible were the ONLY book on the planet with people claiming it came from the supernatural, that might lend it SOME credibility, but that isn't CLOSE to being true. This planet is LITTERED with "scriptures". Why pick one over the others? What have all those other people done wrong in picking THEIR favorites? Heck, why should I pick YOUR version, which has had its dragons and unicorns scrubbed out, over MY version?
If you were trying to sell your religion to me, if you were trying to convert me, what points would you emphasize in order to convince me? What would elevate this book ABOVE the level of common mythology?
Keep in mind that I am reading it now, I'm sure I'll be done... eventually (speaking of boring). But so far I've seen stories of people doing AWFUL things and being REWARDED for it by God. I've seen people COMMANDED to do awful things BY God. I've seen stories of events that defy reality and logic. I've seen stories which remarkably resemble the myths of other cultures. I've seen NOTHING which couldn't have been written by the primitive people of the time.
I'm not "blinded" or "rebellious", I'm simply logical and analytical. If I wanted to CONFIRM that the Bible is true, how would I do it? The scientific method gives us a path for confirming our discoveries in nature. We test, we measure. We repeat our tests. We demonstrate our findings where everyone can see them, and so that anyone can repeat our tests. We include safeguards for falsifiablitiy, so that if our ideas about our tests are WRONG, we can test for that TOO. Will this method work for studying the claims of the Bible? Can the supernatural be tested?
If the answer is simply "have faith", then to me this sounds like "just DECIDE that you like these stories and that you believe them". But I can't do that (and if there's a god, then he made me like this, he gave me these standards of confirmation). You can't MAKE yourself believe what you don't believe. I must be CONVINCED first. I must be swayed by evidence. These stories are not convincing (though obviously they were to you), and I can't be blamed for their failure. I need more, and if there's a god, he should understand that.
I don't appreciate the general Christian attitude that my questioning and skepticism ("scoffing", to you) is some sort of crime to be looked down on and punished. This is how people learn. I know of no other way. If Christianity can't measure up to the questions with valid, thorough, coherent answers, then I see no point in pursuing it as a path to "truth".
might i enquire have you read the bible all the way thru?
or just parts of it?
it is an ongoing plan from Gen to Rev.
we can know it is true because it has been tired and tested by scholars and historians and researchers over the course of time and established as AUTHENTIC.
historically
PROPHETICALLY....the long standing position it has ALWAYS held
i will go for now and continue this tomorrow..have a nice evening.

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“Marriage equality for all”

Since: Jul 07

Illinois

#6244 Oct 8, 2012
Pattiecake58 wrote:
<quoted text>
I get tired of spending along time typing facts and information ONLY to have it PIDDLED on by the God haters.
And we are tired of you using your Bible bigotry to take a crap on other people. You would like to believe that you're spreading God's word but you're simply using your religion to denigrate others. If you're so tired, just go away. We'll promise to miss you horribly.

FYI, I'm not a God hater; I'm a retired church employee.

“Unconvinced”

Since: Nov 09

Seattle, WA

#6245 Oct 8, 2012
Pattiecake58 wrote:
might i enquire have you read the bible all the way thru?
I started reading it this summer, with the goal to go from cover to cover. I'm somewhere in Judges, I think. Haven't picked it up in many weeks. Stephen King was much more interesting.
Pattiecake58 wrote:
it is an ongoing plan from Gen to Rev.
we can know it is true because it has been tired and tested by scholars and historians and researchers over the course of time and established as AUTHENTIC.
You say "we" as in "we can know it is true". What do you mean by "we"? Who are you talking about? Because as far as I know, this debate continues, even among scholars and historians. If this had been settled, someone would be holding a Nobel prize. If this is proven, then where is this proof written up? Why does doubt and disbelief persist in the world? Can't the evidence simply be held up in front of everyone to end all doubt?

This kind of statement will always bring me back to the simple question: Can animals talk?

Any story in which they do, could not be described as "authentic".
Pattiecake58 wrote:
historically
The Bible says that all the world's languages were created because God didn't like it that people had banded together in an attempt to build a tower to reach him (out of bricks). But this is not "historically accurate". We KNOW that languages EVOLVED (quite like species do) from earlier languages. Spanish and French come from Latin. Latin had its own internal evolutions for a while, which started with Etruscan. Which came from Greek. Which predates the Bible. This path holds true for MANY languages: German, Japanese, Navajo. It's not "historically accurate" to say they were all formed at ONCE (to say nothing about why a god would be worried by a brick tower, or why he wouldn't want humans cooperating on such a project).

Even WITHIN the Bible are "historical" inconsistencies. Differing geneologies for Jesus. Differing accounts of what happened at his "resurrection". Differing accounts of how Judas died. I haven't read these sections directly yet, but I've studied them and I know that they stand out as problems in biblical errancy. Scholars and Historians continue to squabble over them.
Pattiecake58 wrote:
PROPHETICALLY....
I'm still curious about those prophecies...
Pattiecake58 wrote:
the long standing position it has ALWAYS held
It has always been in question. There have always been disbelievers.

Is disbelief really so bad, that disbelievers deserve eternal torture? I don't accept the claims of science just to be rebellious. I do it because science has convinced me much better than Christianity (or any other religion) has. Science doesn't simply say "here's a virgin who got pregnant, here's some dead people that came back to life, now BELIEVE it or burn!". Science EXPLAINS physics, fluid dynamics, fusion, fossilization, genetic drift, marine oxygenation, cellular mitosis... in terms that ANYONE can research for themselves and come to the EXACT SAME CONCLUSIONS. While Christian A says "God hates fags" and Christian B says "God has no problem with gay people". Even Christians can't agree on their own doctrine, out of the very same book. Which one sounds more convincing?
Pattiecake58 wrote:
i will go for now and continue this tomorrow..have a nice evening.
You too!

DNF

“Religious Freedom to Marry”

Since: Apr 07

Newark OH / Baltimore MD

#6246 Oct 8, 2012
EdmondWA wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm not "every single atheist". Maybe this is a difficult concept for you. We're all different people. If a 100 Christians asked me the same question, then I'd answer a 100 times.
If I refused even once, then they would be justified in accusing me of dodging the questions.
<quoted text>
Yet all I hear is that you HAVE listed the evidence. Where? When? How can I find your list? At this point, I don't even have evidence that YOU have evidence. It just looks like you don't like being asked for it.
I'm not even sure why you're here on Topix, "discussing" this subject. You seem to resent being approached for conversation, which is the whole point of forums like this.
<quoted text>
There's that denial again. "Oh, the evidence is so OBVIOUS that I don't have to list it, you just don't WANT to see it".
This is dodging.
<quoted text>
That's "inferring", it's not evidence. The universe doesn't have a giant tag on it saying "Made by Jehovah".
<quoted text>
Perfection like cerebral palsy or Down syndrome? The design of nature like the Loa Loa? Why would a god create such an invasive and destructive creature?
<quoted text>
Truth isn't "felt", it's confirmed by demonstration and repetition. We don't learn things by letting our emotions run away with us.
<quoted text>
CAN you? I keep asking, you keep dodging...
<quoted text>
Isn't that what a Buddhist would say? Or a Shintoist? Or a Sikh? Or a Wiccan?
<quoted text>
This is one of the least informative, circular statements I'll hear all day.
<quoted text>
My questions are how I seek truth. Christians seem to want me punished for this. It seems as if they would ENCOURAGE God to continue to ignore me for it.
<quoted text>
And I still don't know what you consider a "miracle". A disease healed by doctors? Lost car keys found? Somewhere in between?
<quoted text>
I'm not trying to "take" anything from you. I'm just curious about your beliefs, but you seem to view these questions as some kind of "theft".
<quoted text>
I see evidence of the universe, but that only proves that the universe exists. If I wanted, I could MAKE myself see "evidence" of Zeus, or Allah, or Quetzalcoatl, or aliens, or tree spirits, or a flying spaghetti monster. REAL evidence can be presented by anyone, and confirmed by anyone else, and it will always be the same.
I had to smile when I read, "If a 100 Christians asked me the same question, then I'd answer a 100 times."

Funny thing is ask any 100 Christian a question about the Bible and you'll get 100 different answers. Same with nearly any other Faith.

DNF

“Religious Freedom to Marry”

Since: Apr 07

Newark OH / Baltimore MD

#6247 Oct 8, 2012
How I See It wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you saying that those who live by Gods laws and are unmarried are sad and lonely? Unlike you they probably think of things other than themselves.
I'm ALMOST hesitant to toss in the over 50% divorce rate to his equation and see what mental mathematics he uses to adjust his moral compass.

Or the number of seniors unable to bear children who marry will do to it as well.

DNF

“Religious Freedom to Marry”

Since: Apr 07

Newark OH / Baltimore MD

#6248 Oct 8, 2012
How I See It wrote:
<quoted text>
Why, do you freaks who want to be heard not want any opinion other than yours?
Just like a lot of famous right wing christian minsters, right?

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

#6249 Oct 8, 2012
Pattiecake58 wrote:
<quoted text>
we christians are humans, and the bible teaches us that we CAN get angry, but we are not suppose to sin in our anger.
so if someone comes at me with vile hateful vulgar words to attack me or my faith, OF COURSE I CAN GET ANGRY.........it is a human emotion that is there for a reason, but it would be wrong of me to react in like manner by cussing at them or using vulgar words.
do you expect i should NOT express my disgust or speak the truth such as calling someone who IS bashing God and or the bible as what they are which is 'demonic and foolish'?
i know i can be stern and bold and sometimes 'cutting' which i KNOW i should not be, but i have feelings to and i react to attacks with directness and choose my words carefully.
always being 'clean' in the words i use.
how stupid would i be NOT to stand up for myself or my faith?
That's not what I was referring to.

You are hostile, nasty and disrespectful toward some members of our society.

DNF

“Religious Freedom to Marry”

Since: Apr 07

Newark OH / Baltimore MD

#6250 Oct 8, 2012
Religionthebiglie wrote:
<quoted text>
I prefer Pastafarian. Look, our first religious disagreement.
And the Great Schism begins.

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