Well, there are more options, but it does cause the anti-gay to be a little less frivolous with their hate.<quoted text> Are those the only two options? Really? I disagree. In the real world, absolutes rarely exist, i.e., "never." This was not exactly a Matthew Sheppard incident.
Elaine Huguenin, who with her husband operates Elane Photography in New Mexico, asks only to be let alone.
Join the discussion below, or Read more at New York Post.
“Educating the uneducated”
Since: Aug 12
#44 Sep 18, 2012
#45 Sep 18, 2012
Again, I'm not convinced that such frivolous lawsuits don't do more harm than good. Perhaps, and my guess is more likely it causes resentment toward gays to be more hidden and backlash more subtle. Is that what you really want?
#46 Sep 18, 2012
So breaking the Law is frivolous, eh?
“Educating the uneducated”
Since: Aug 12
#47 Sep 18, 2012
It's different if you are the one being discriminated against. It's hurtful and you definitely want to get back at the person for doing it. While I agree, a lawsuit wasn't the best of ideas, it was better than letting it be. If they let it be, the woman would go on to think that she can walk all over whomever she wants. What would a middle ground be? Because I can't think of any at the moment.
#48 Sep 19, 2012
I don't claim to have all the answers. Perhaps finding a way to publicize the woman's behavior *without* resorting to litigation might accomplish exposing the photographer's stupidity and avoided the courtroom... and possible backlash
Look at the bright side. You and I managed to have a legitimate exchange of ideas. You made your points and I made mine. We managed to disagree without descending into stupidity. You managed to make that happen without a lawsuit. It would have been nice if the partner had taken the time and given the matter the same level of thought and dialogue that you started. Certainly managed to turn my attitude in the direction you went... unlike others.
“Educating the uneducated”
Since: Aug 12
#49 Sep 19, 2012
It's nice to be able to have a civilized discussion on this site once in awhile.
#50 Sep 19, 2012
"Perhaps advocates of gay rights should begin to restrain the bullies in their ranks."
I love how often I hear stuff like this. I can't count how many Christians I've heard whine about being victimized and bullied without really knowing what that means. I've heard people who actually fucking think they are being repressed because a television show has gay people on it and omg they're being exposed to this shit, instead of you know, changing the channel and never thinking about it again. Yes there are those who are legitimately harassed, sometimes to extremes, but the number of petty drama queens is absurd.
And it can't even compare to the kind or amount of bullying and harassment that gays receive, especially when you take into account 3rd world countries. Is it any wonder that some of them harbor anger and feel the need to strike back? Why don't christians and others begin doing a better job of restraining the bullies in their own ranks and maybe our side will calm down a bit in response.
Since: Apr 08
#51 Sep 19, 2012
What gets me is how it's "bullying" when someone dares to suggest the antidiscrimination laws that are in place should actually be followed.
“Educating the uneducated”
Since: Aug 12
#52 Sep 19, 2012
They want special rights. They always say we're asking for special rights, but then they want control over every single aspect of everyone's lives. Who's demanding the special rights?
#53 Sep 20, 2012
I skipped BS detector's response -- knew he would run at the mouth like a snot-nose -- but now I can't resist.
Not sure I'll make it through all of it, as he's always mouthing off and sucking snot like that, but let's see what he said.
#54 Sep 20, 2012
Here we go with the crying and wailing.
I needed your permission?
Your problem is that I don't buy this. You're a try-hard with a victim mentality, to be fantastically blunt.
I'm witnessing it this nanosecond.
Dude, you have a big fucking mouth and you waste a lot of my time with this babysitting.
Yet you're *NOT* the victim. You type all this and yet you're *NOT* the victim. I express myself independently in the thread, you start shit up like a snot-nose, and you're *NOT* the victim, according to you.*NOT* the victim. According to you.
You're sitting here right now running at the mouth and I just realized I have been ignoring your every claim of "you lied" because by *logic*, if this is true, then:
so did you.
This has no meaning whatsoever; you give the person carte blanche and I do not.
Nothing, nothing, nothing looks more victimy and whining than your saying this about a *complete stranger*.
Nothing looks worse for you than meaningless insults that attempt to "establish gravitas" against a *complete stranger*.
When you say stuff like *this*, it's like you wrecked the train that was already out of control.
You have a tremendous need to "control" others and this happens *literally nonstop* because I have *explicitly* told you you will *never* "control" me in that manner. Yet you try again and again, and if I am "lying," then you are lying *with every single thing you type*, from beginning to end.
It is *ALL YOU DO* on these boards in regard to me; I *witness* you doing it nonstop.
Is that similar to your rapist mentality, a mentality by which you wish to "control" what I say or do, and your try-hard, snot-nosed victim syndrome? I *witness* you doing this stuff over,
You claim "dishonesty" and this instantaneously indicts you of *dishonesty*.
And your snot-nosed victim mentality somehow looks good? You do this *over and over and over* and have been told *explicitly* that the tenor of my responses to you when you do this will *N-E-V-E-R* change, yet you rampage onto the board like a mental patient.
I *witness* you doing this.
I can't fathom that you think you will *STOP ME* from speaking *MY OPINION* at any and all times as I see fit.
It hasn't worked yet, has it?
#55 Sep 20, 2012
Has your attitude once worked yet?
A person online in your position will *NEVER* tell the truth about their reaction to what's happening. By the nature of the disagreement, there is *NO WAY* you will be honest in front of everyone here, so in fact, you're *LYING* pointblank on this count. Stunning, spine-chilling, that you cannot indict yourself.
Christ, what a *v-i-c-t-i-m* you are.
So you say, as you run at the mouth nonstop
Christ, you're such a victim.
This is like saying black people are bigoted for not putting up with the KKK; you will do *anything* to attempt to control the conversation, and lie about *anything*.
It stuns me that you don't get that I've got your number, that I *watch* you doing all of this and understand perfectly well what you're doing.
But that's all you *ever* say throughout this post, and yet when this indicts you,*you are not concerned*, so logic dictates that you're lying about my lying. I suppose that to you, flailing about like a stuck pig and saying "you're lying!" "you're lying!" is effective.
I didn't even know this about you because I was never concerned. You *want control* of conversations and you have a *victim syndrome* and so you attempt *REPEATEDLY* to "force" me to be a certain way and it doesn't work out for you. Ever.
#56 Sep 20, 2012
Actually, you sound like a loser when you keep saying this. You *know* what I am protesting, you snot-nosed crybaby. I'm protesting *your attitude* on the boards, repeatedly and without *EVER ONCE* backing down for a *SECOND*. You *know* this and you fall into the pit of *LYING* about what I'm doing, O Victim.
No no no:
You can't *FORCE* my focus to be somewhere it's not.
You can't do that and will always fail.
I am focused *SOLELY ON YOUR BEHAVIOR*.
Since that's the very thing *YOU WON'T ADMIT*, your posts come off as these flailing "passes" at me when I am concerned solely *WITH YOUR BEHAVIOR*.
Yet I'm providing a *really intelligent and sensible* explanation for what you're *ACTUALLY* doing, and *WHY* you're lying about what I'm doing.
Yeah, I'm not buying this for a second.
But you don't. I'm *witnessing* you not know better,*just like all the other times*. I'm *witnessing* this and *constantly providing explanations* that DO NOT VARY, which is key,
*THAT DO NOT VARY* as to why you behave this way.
I'm not going back to read what I wrote. I waste enough time babysitting you.
I don't buy this for a second. I am so consistent on the boards *that I know when someone is lying about the content of what I wrote without looking*, and I am right every time.
Dude, you're a moron if I ever saw one, christ. Do you realize what your behavior signifies? You are in effect *trying to silence me* by "getting in my face" and you prove this by *GOING ON AND ON* about these issues as if it's of the slightest importance that *YOU* have to "defend" yourself.
I am attacking one thing alone,*your attitude* in these matters, and I have *never varied* in what I have said about it.
Why do I not buy this? Oh, that's right, because you claim I'm "lying" *IN EXACTLY THE SAME POSTS* that attack your attitude.
Wow, what a coincidence.
Do you really want me to keep slamming you for *exactly* what I see you doing on this board?
And you think this will be effective. Every last time, I get in your face, rip you a new asshole, and *you* think this is effective somehow.
YOU THINK THE NEXT TIME YOU DO THIS, I might remain silent or *not* get in your face *again* about *my right* to speak my opinion and stick by it *because I can explain it to the minutest detail*.
I strongly, strongly believe that early on in some exchange we had, you felt *STUPID* and you have eternally continued to attack ever since, because *YOU* don't like feeling stupid, you want to be in control,*EVERYTHING* about your behavior supports this contention, and I *WILL NOT* stop saying it straight in your face every time you attempt to silence me, so get the hell over it and stop sucking snot like a leper, christ.
#57 Sep 20, 2012
It's so interesting to me that you finally cracked, even if it was in a good way.
Dude, I was not born yesterday. I can *see* that you see the conviction in my words; it's written *all over* what you say. I have been through this in many contexts and I know from real-life reactions to me what that's like. There's a reason I answer you back every. single. time.
#58 Sep 20, 2012
I don't believe this for a nanosecond. It reeks of an "internet lie" of the very type that *YOU WOULD TELL* based on this interaction, and *solely* because of this interaction.
You run to play the victim and do the first thing that people instinctually do, idiots that they are, you pretend to be "unaffeced," yet there's you, writing *PARAGRAPHS* in response. Got it. Who's the liar?
So "sorry" to ask really, really pointedly, but WHO'S the liar? I'm "sorry," you said *I* was? Interesting.
But you'd have to convince me of this, and you're fantastically shitty at convincing me of any of these things.
I cannot overemphasize between you, me and god that when you respond,*you are putting on display the very behavior I talk about* and I witness it at length.
Honest to god, I think I make you feel stupid because you say this a lot. You repeat this a *lot* and it doesn't come from anywhere *that has to do with the topic*; it has to do with *your reaction* to *MY* reaction to *YOUR ATTITUDE* on the board.
I not only don't buy this, for the very first time, I started to feel a little sad for you (which makes me uncomfortable).
Because I'm not buying any of this. I was not born yesterday and I *see* what you're doing. I see it. And see it. And see it.
I'm ... not interested in your assessment of me. I don't buy it. You sound like a dumbass when you say it repeatedly. Truly, you do. You sound like you're trying
I think you miss that on a much larger level, society is harassing these people for zero reason.
There *is* no intelligence in a prejudiced opinion that has its roots *in an idea that an unsubstantiated belief* gives someone a right to maltreat someone else.
This only means you're stubborn *and lends such enormous credence to what I say to YOU* about your attitude on the boards that you effectively, my god,*just erased* everything you said about me?
Know what, though? Those are moot points. I wouldn't want you admitting it because *I* know it's true. In fact, I think you're so clueless that you'd do anything not to lose control in the very manner I described before.
I burst out laughing. You "won" this mini-point (some victory) because I pictured you straining and straining to make this clear AND I LAUGHED.
I'm starting to laugh at the responses now (in a good way). You deem them *not* monstrous because, I would suppose, it hasn't hit you where you live (or you haven't allowed it to)-- this prejudice, these reasonless, baseless, mind-boggling prejudices.
I am hating that I am laughing at each response. They don't have any meaning to me, but your *EARNESTNESS* is funny.
I think you are made to feel stupid easily.
By the way, I am not.
Ohhhh boy, would you despise me in real life. I am a long shot from an easy mark.
#59 Sep 20, 2012
I was presuming, snot-sucker.
Half the country's been divorced. I doubt my assumption was terribly off the mark.
People released from prison do get married. I doubt my assumption was terribly off the mark.
Little tip for you: If you want to look intelligent, do not force the conversation onto a simplistic level where things any *second-grader would know* have to be reviewed because *YOU* deny their existence like a snotty child.
I HATE that I am laughing.
You sure about that?
Last time I checked, parents don't believe that anyone has the right to maltreat their kid. Congrats,*YOU* just argued for that right. According to your logic, people can treat your own child like dirt because they think your child is a worthless dumbass.
You actually *are* stupid if you believe one has to SAY these things. One can drive another from a room *without ever saying a word* and then "innocently" claim, "I never told you to leave!" What you're talking about is the FEELING one person gets from another. In fact, if such feelings aren't true,*you are lying every goddamn time you say I lied*, because of the context of WHAT you're talking about.(I refuse to be more specific because I will be handing you a point.)
This is when I want to concede to you. You are really, really, really much more clueless than you think; in fact, I have this *on record* since I have explained that you are likable when you act like this (in some contexts)-- something I would imagine is very fairly and legitimately confusing *to you* because you don't get how *I* see the difference.
But the second you do this, I almost *want* to concede.
Because all of this is not important.
Because of what I said:
Then *LOGIC* suggests you're not achieving what you think you do, if by *YOUR OWN* admission, I "keep coming back."
It is *LOGIC* which suggests that, but you don't seem to like logic.*LOGIC* says if I *WILLFULLY* keep engaging, then you are *NOT* doing what you claim to do.
Which makes you a liar. But I don't care about that; it would go with the territory. I care about your victimhood because I was not put on this earth to babysit you, goddamn twit.
If you are attempting to "diagnose" a stranger you've never met, heard or seen, you're actually stupid and *definitely not a medical professional*, I know that much.
#60 Sep 20, 2012
Yet I rip to shreds your "attempts" to do so because I am so laser-focused on only one thing, and *the record of our exchanges shows this repeatedly*; please, far be it from me to mention that in a court of law, I would *first* alert my attorney to dig up *every* one of those instances and show them to a judge -- me saying over, and over, and over, the same, same, same things.
You know what a judge would tell you?
That you're full of a shit and that you have a big mouth, more or less in different words, to claim I am "lying" about that which *so obviously* fills me with conviction.
You are literally, literally (basically) telling me the same thing you'd tell a *RELIGIOUS* person about their religious belief.
Yet I'm not buying this, am more convinced than ever that I know *exactly* what I'm talking about, and have a feeling you're a worse train wreck than I thought, given these posts.
You're putting this on display, not me, champ.
I wish you hadn't said this, because I will remember it. And you won't live it down.
There it is, in black and white.
And I see something missing.
I *DO NOT* see you positing that I am behaving as they do *pointedly and on purpose*, with dead-serious intent.
You *didn't* say that.
You *omitted* that possibility.
Tell me again who's actually wrong here. Tell me that you're gonna sit there *knowing me better than I know me*. I dare you, dare you, dare you, I wanna *watch* you do it.
For the first time, I put my head in my hands. You seem like a troll in the sense that you attempt to argue so literally.
He wrote this.
These are his claims.
I am having this weird *colossal* hunch he has no idea what it is like to be bullied, attacked and denigrated
I would *NOT* hazard a guess that you don't know what it's like; I have no way of knowing. But I am sure *HE* doesn't.
Do you fathom that this world is basically made up of *ALL OF US* not understanding what we *HAVEN'T LIVED THROUGH*-- unless (and this is a big unless) we take *ENORMOUS TIME AND PAINS* to understand each other?(This is, for instance, how actors can play roles so uncannily.)
#61 Sep 20, 2012
You're wasting your time. I know who I am, and if you notice something -- think about this, sir -- I have never defended myself against those accusations, only attacked back ... about your *A-T-T-I-T-U-D-E*. Tell me who really believes this about themselves when I never felt a need to defend myself on those points, but *you do*. Something which could also be brought to light by an examination of our respective posts.
I almost feel bad.
It has hit me that who you are is the *main reason* you behave this way, and that it's as inextricably linked with you as anything would be with anyone.
I sighed, and don't know what to say. I understand what's going on here, and I *can see* that you don't. This "onslaught" in the second post gives you away, as well. You lost your patience toward the end. You behaved *exactly how you extol the writer of this piece* for NOT behaving. I am in the clear on that one; never said I admired him. You see how this works? THINK about what you say and do,*substantiate who you are* and don't blink or deviate for anybody.
While we both know you're *full of rotting shit* in your assessment of me, I continue to remember why I was relieved that you left the boards for as long as you did.
Because every time we begin to argue again,
that I find you not-unlikable.
You need this. For reasons I cannot know. That you pour this much effort into it is what makes you look good.
#62 Sep 20, 2012
I know what it is, BS Detector. You claim you're unaffected, but you don't try very hard to uphold that charade. You claim to dislike liars: Welcome to *actually and truly disliking REAL, GENUINE liars*. That would be me, unable to stand the people who claim they're unaffected.
You pretty much admit you are; we all are.
There is your nobility. Seriously.
#63 Sep 20, 2012
Just went through this with "BS detector" and I'm not buying this bullshit piece for a second. It sounds like someone who *doesn't* put himself in the shoes of people who are abused *all the time, all day, every day*. I explained to "BS Detector" that maybe he DOES (who knows in what context) know what that's like; this guy writing the piece doesn't.
In fact, if the guy writing the piece said he does, he's DOUBLY indicted: He's sitting there *not having applied it nobly* to the gay people who have to put up with some
NEGATIVE REFLECTION of themselves
all the time
of every day.
That's what "BS Detector's" response misses, and that's what every person misses here who is *not* conceding that it could simply be an absolute rage that drives these people to be finally claiming their rightful place in society.
Not for nothing do I make these points and refuse, refuse, refuse, refuse, refuse to back down, ever. I make these points because I *see* the abuse and I am tired of hearing senseless, rotting shit like "gay is immoral!" which bastardizes the very definition of "morality" and destroys the moral compass for future generations who, unable to make the slightest sense of such a proclamation, do seem to have abandoned large parts of the moral code altogether.
Thank you for your post.
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