God and Gays: The Rite to Bless Same-sex Unions

Jul 16, 2012 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: Time

There is something by now familiar, even reassuring, about what happens in my church every third summer.

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#52
Jul 26, 2012
 

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DNF wrote:
"I offer you peace. I offer you love. I offer you friendship. I see your beauty. I hear your need. I feel your feelings. My wisdom flows from the Highest Source. I salute that Source in you. Let us work together for unity and love."
♥ - Mahatma Gandhi
And may the same be offered to you, my brother.

The Cave Paintings from Altimara and El Castillo to Chauvet and Lascaux are wonderful examples of modern Man - the Cro-Magnon leaving traces of their imaginations for us to see and pay homage to in recognition of their prodigious talents.

Age - 10,000 BCE to at least over 42,000 BCE. These earliest appear at about the same time as the last evidences of Neanderthal.

At about the same time, BCE 40,000 and possibly older, the Australians also left rock art and evidence of a musical, imaginative, theological life.

Certain remnants in India suggest human culture as far back as 100,000 years, correlating with genetic evidence of humans migrating out of Africa at about the same time.

Modern culture seems to have emerged out of the Indus Valley region at the base of the Himalayas near 10,000 years ago. These peoples migrated in a number of directions, including westward to the shores of the Caspian and Black Seas where they were inundated by the probable breach of an ice dam or moraine left by the retreating glaciers that overlaid the modern Straits of the Bosphorus. The breach allowed the Mediterranean Sea to flow into the Caspian Basin. The event, now fairly well-documented, is the probable origin of the Story of Noah.

Rev. Ken

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#53
Jul 26, 2012
 

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RevKen wrote:
<quoted text>
I think the jury is still out about a lot of this. Peak ice age was around 20,000 years ago. Southern Europe was barely habitable, except near the coast.
When tribes of humans were able to re-inhabit the northern latitudes, their establishment of permanent colonies along the northern coastlines began a slow natural selection of skin types and hair colors related to a diminishing need for the sun-blocking effect of melanin pigment, in order to allow greater absorption of sunlight and production of vitamin D.
Blondes and redheads are a fairly recent development. Last 20,000 years, probably.
But, I like them both and am partial to redheads, having a bit of Scottish heritage mixed in, myself. Don't know about the Neanderthal in the mix. But, my wife has accused me of it.
Rev. Ken
Sorry, Ken. The genomics are clear.

“Plays well with others.”

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LIVING WELL*THE BEST REVENGE

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#54
Jul 26, 2012
 

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I will be glad when Advent comes this year fo sho! Sort of like waiting for Christmas if you know what I mean.

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#55
Jul 26, 2012
 
snyper wrote:
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Sorry, Ken. The genomics are clear.
Really!?

A mix of Neanderthal and the Early Man - to become US?

“Adam and Steve”

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#56
Jul 27, 2012
 

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snyper wrote:
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Not quite as we know it. Just one of our two parents.
Cro-Magnon was an anatomically modern human (H.sapiens sapiens) whose descendants, according to genetic markers, reside primarily in Western Europe (esp. UK, Ireland, Spain, and through migration to the Americas and Australia). See: Haplogroup R1b, Y chromosome marker M343. Charles Darwin was a direct descendant of Cro-Magnon, as are millions of others. This marker arrived in Europe c. 30,000 years ago.

While there was some inbreeding with H.Neaderthalensis (evidence points to between 1-4% in some populations), it would be inappropriate to say that H.Neanderthalensis was a "parent" to modern humans because any interbreeding at this level would not have created a new hybrid species.

“Ecce! Sic transit gloria mundi”

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I See New Jerusalem From Here.

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#57
Jul 27, 2012
 

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There is evidence of a third or even forth group that has been found to have co-existed with Neanderthals and Homo Sapiens that was found in northern Asia but how its' descendants are found primarily in Papua-New Guinea.

http://weeklyworldnews.com/headlines/45287/ch...

CHINESE DISCOVER NEW HUMAN SPECIES

By Hideaki Tailor on March 15, 2012
Fossil remains of the mysterious 11,500-year-old people were discovered in south-west China.
Analysis of the find has only now revealed their true significance, opening what scientists have dubbed “the next chapter in the human evolutionary story”.

The bones display an unusual mix of ancient and modern anatomical features, as well as some characteristics not seen before.

And then we have this information to process.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/31/science/gai...

DNA Turning Human Story Into a Tell-All
By ALANNA MITCHELL
Published: January 30, 2012

A revolutionary increase in the speed and a decline in the cost of gene-sequencing technology have enabled scientists at the Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology in Leipzig, Germany, to map the genomes of both the Neanderthals and the Denisovans.

Comparing genomes, scientists concluded that today’s humans outside Africa carry an average of 2.5 percent Neanderthal DNA, and that people from parts of Oceania also carry about 5 percent Denisovan DNA. A study published in November found that Southeast Asians carry about 1 percent Denisovan DNA in addition to their Neanderthal genes. It is unclear whether Denisovans and Neanderthals also interbred.

A third group of extinct humans, Homo floresiensis, nicknamed “the hobbits” because they were so small, also walked the earth until about 17,000 years ago. It is not known whether modern humans bred with them because the hot, humid climate of the Indonesian island of Flores, where their remains were found, impairs the preservation of DNA.

Comparing genomes, scientists concluded that today’s humans outside Africa carry an average of 2.5 percent Neanderthal DNA, and that people from parts of Oceania also carry about 5 percent Denisovan DNA. A study published in November found that Southeast Asians carry about 1 percent Denisovan DNA in addition to their Neanderthal genes. It is unclear whether Denisovans and Neanderthals also interbred.

A third group of extinct humans, Homo floresiensis, nicknamed “the hobbits” because they were so small, also walked the earth until about 17,000 years ago. It is not known whether modern humans bred with them because the hot, humid climate of the Indonesian island of Flores, where their remains were found, impairs the preservation of DNA.

This means that our modern era, since H. floresiensis died out, is the only time in the four-million-year human history that just one type of human has been alive, said David Reich, a geneticist at Harvard Medical School who was the lead author of the Nature paper on the Denisovans.

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#58
Jul 27, 2012
 

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Edio wrote:
<quoted text>
Cro-Magnon was an anatomically modern human (H.sapiens sapiens) whose descendants, according to genetic markers, reside primarily in Western Europe (esp. UK, Ireland, Spain, and through migration to the Americas and Australia). See: Haplogroup R1b, Y chromosome marker M343. Charles Darwin was a direct descendant of Cro-Magnon, as are millions of others. This marker arrived in Europe c. 30,000 years ago.
While there was some inbreeding with H.Neaderthalensis (evidence points to between 1-4% in some populations), it would be inappropriate to say that H.Neanderthalensis was a "parent" to modern humans because any interbreeding at this level would not have created a new hybrid species.
I have read that generally non-African humans contain regionally between 1 and 4% genetic material that could be construed, but is not absolutely certain yet, to have come from breeding Cro-Magnons with Neanderthals. But, there is no remaining evidence of Neanderthal mitichondrial RNA in modern humans. So, there are no direct descendant daughters of Neanderthal left within Homo Sapiens Sapiens.

A good portion of the incredibly beautiful cave art that exists along the Alpine escarpments was apparently Neanderthal art. They were not dummies, though their tools do not appear to have been as advanced as those of the Cro-Magnon.

Rev. Ken

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#59
Jul 27, 2012
 

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I was almost about to ask where all the fundies went to after we began discussing genetics. Then I realized they don't want to talk about genetics because they'd have to at least partially agree with evolution. Heck they may even have to admit the earth revolves around the sun!

The irony is that they all tout the phrase "natural law". Darwin was simply trying to research and investigate "natural laws".

DNF

“Liberty AND Justice”

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And then they try to play the "there is no evidence of a gay gene" card. And we reply that there is no evidence of a heterosexual gene either.

The anti gays will use science if it suits them and they can spin it to their agenda. When will these folks learn that science and religion don't have to be in conflict with each other.

“Plays well with others.”

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Jul 27, 2012
 

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http://www.advocate.com/society/coming-out/20...

Found another David Glen of Pekin, IL!

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#62
Jul 28, 2012
 

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RevKen wrote:
<quoted text>
Really!?
A mix of Neanderthal and the Early Man - to become US?
Yep. The markers for both are clear in our mitochondrial DNA.

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#63
Jul 28, 2012
 

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snyper wrote:
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Yep. The markers for both are clear in our mitochondrial DNA.
Snyper,

It has been my understanding that the mitochondrial DNA - RNA - is the one set of information that passes exclusively from mother to daughter. The son does not pass this information forward. So, if a Neanderthal mother mated with a Cro-Magnon father, her daughter would show her mother's ancestry. Likewise, if that line of daughters continued to exist today, those genetic markers could be traced.

This tracing, through mother to daughter, is the basis for the assertion that all modern humans descend from one small tribe of humans that came out of Africa and through palestine nearly 100,000 years ago. There was, in a sense, a true Adam and Eve.

What I have read is that no mitochondrial markers of this sort have been found to exist any longer from the Neanderthals.

Since the Neanderthal genome has been successfully mapped, parts of that genome can be detected to exist, as having been shared, in modern man. But, the direct line of matriarchal descendancy has been lost.

I must be missing a link in my understanding.

Rev. Ken

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#64
Jul 28, 2012
 

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RevKen wrote:
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Snyper,
It has been my understanding that the mitochondrial DNA - RNA - is the one set of information that passes exclusively from mother to daughter. The son does not pass this information forward. So, if a Neanderthal mother mated with a Cro-Magnon father, her daughter would show her mother's ancestry. Likewise, if that line of daughters continued to exist today, those genetic markers could be traced.
This tracing, through mother to daughter, is the basis for the assertion that all modern humans descend from one small tribe of humans that came out of Africa and through palestine nearly 100,000 years ago. There was, in a sense, a true Adam and Eve.
What I have read is that no mitochondrial markers of this sort have been found to exist any longer from the Neanderthals.
Since the Neanderthal genome has been successfully mapped, parts of that genome can be detected to exist, as having been shared, in modern man. But, the direct line of matriarchal descendancy has been lost.
I must be missing a link in my understanding.
Rev. Ken
Males don't have mitochondrial DNA?

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#65
Jul 29, 2012
 

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snyper wrote:
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Males don't have mitochondrial DNA?
I must be confused about mitichondrial genetic information. Will read up.

“Adam and Steve”

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Jul 29, 2012
 

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Both sexes have mtDNA; however, it is very rarely passed on by the male. The portion of mtDNA that is carried on the sperm is (almost always) destroyed by the egg during fertilization.

And RevKen: interesting about Adam and Eve. From what I've read, the mtDNA Eve and the Y-Chromosomal Adam both existed, but 10s of thousands of years apart. The most recent mtDNA Eve lived about 200,000 years ago; and the Y-Chromosomal Adam existed most recently between 60,000 and 145,000 years ago.

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Edio wrote:
Both sexes have mtDNA; however, it is very rarely passed on by the male. The portion of mtDNA that is carried on the sperm is (almost always) destroyed by the egg during fertilization.
And RevKen: interesting about Adam and Eve. From what I've read, the mtDNA Eve and the Y-Chromosomal Adam both existed, but 10s of thousands of years apart. The most recent mtDNA Eve lived about 200,000 years ago; and the Y-Chromosomal Adam existed most recently between 60,000 and 145,000 years ago.
Aha!

Perhaps the older one was actually Lilleth!

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Jul 29, 2012
 

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RevKen wrote:
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Aha!
Perhaps the older one was actually Lilleth!
Now that's a bit of apocryphal lore that carries an important message or two!

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Sep 25, 2012
 

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snyper wrote:
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Now that's a bit of apocryphal lore that carries an important message or two!
If what Edio says is right, then Lilleth was first by a long shot! No wonder she refused to put up with Adam's patristic control-freak egotism.

Looking back, one can speculate as to the roots of the ancient Matriarchy that actually continues to exist in Jewry.

Rev. Ken
What

Dadeville, MO

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#71
Sep 25, 2012
 
Matt 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
Matt 19:5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?

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What wrote:
Matt 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
Matt 19:5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
"The first little pig built his house out of straw because it was the easiest thing to do.

The second little pig built his house out of sticks. This was a little bit stronger than a straw house.

The third little pig built his house out of bricks.

One night the big bad wolf, who dearly loved to eat fat little piggies, came along and saw the first little pig in his house of straw. He said "Let me in, Let me in, little pig or I'll huff and I'll puff and I'll blow your house in!"

"Not by the hair of my chinny chin chin", said the little pig.

But of course the wolf did blow the house in and ate the first little pig."

Wow I love comparative world mythology....

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