Comment: Let's allow Christians to ha...

Comment: Let's allow Christians to have their views

There are 1099 comments on the Belfast Today story from May 23, 2014, titled Comment: Let's allow Christians to have their views. In it, Belfast Today reports that:

Two clergymen sent the secularist 'Taliban' who dominate the media into fits of apoplexy this week.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Belfast Today.

Since: Apr 11

Santa Monica, CA

#558 Jul 3, 2014
naman wrote:
<quoted text>
A very common claim. The problem is that Islam till this day has not proved one single falsification in the Bible.
The buy bull has day and night on earth and plants growing before there is sun.
We can dismiss the bible as being true before we get to Genesis 1:15
Spread this page:
http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/gen/1.html
Belle Sexton

San Francisco, CA

#559 Jul 3, 2014
Quadratus wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually when I witness to people about their need for salvation, I try to get a sense of what sin is their personal issue. Once that is discovered, I hit it again and again - because their consciences are agreeing with me inside them, while I am talking to them. Its very obvious because no matter what sin it is - they become very defensive about it.
If they really didn't believe what I was saying they would just quit the conversation.
No one gets more defensive than homosexuals.
If you are that convicted down here, what will you be like standing all alone in front of God's judgment seat?
Not only is that an extremely self-serving and self-aggrandizing interpretation of what you think you're doing, it doesn't account for any inner economies of the other persons in the interaction. It fails to recognize that their reactions may be defensive, not of what you call "sin", but protective of other principles; principles as closely and dearly held, and as noble as your own. They may also be reacting to your apparent lack of understanding, of interest even, in their actual stories and experience.

What you describe is predatory, aggressive, seductive and dis-empowering; and flies in the face of different yet equally valid understandings of the message of the Yeshua movement.

None face the Father alone. None.

---

Just a few things that might be of interest (all by way of demonstrating that you are woefully unaware of the riches ALREADY within those you address in so cavalier a fashion and why, apart from your assertions of "sin" may be far more operant in any resistance you encounter)...



http://www.youtube.com/watch...

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php...

And this is just plain wonderful

http://www.youtube.com/watch...

---

The Kerygma of the Evangeloi is very specific. You do not have it. Tragically, you sound like a Pharisee, and speak not with the voice of the Shepherd, but with that of the Accuser.
Belle Sexton

San Francisco, CA

#560 Jul 3, 2014
Your message actually comes across as ...



DEFINITELY something to be defensive AGAINST.

Like the serpent in the garden, you play upon inexperience and self-doubt to make your inroads.

http://www.youtube.com/watch...
Belle Sexton

San Francisco, CA

#561 Jul 3, 2014
Warner

Bathgate, UK

#562 Jul 3, 2014
Liam R wrote:
<quoted text>
Deuteronomy 27:26 Cursed be he that confirmeth not all the words of this law to do them.
Deuteronomy 28:1 And it shall come to pass, if thou shalt hearken diligently unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe and to do all his commandments which I command thee this day, that the LORD thy God will set thee on high above all nations of the earth:
28:2 And all these blessings shall come on thee, and overtake thee, if thou shalt hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God.
Deuteronomy 28:15 But it shall come to pass, if thou wilt not hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe to do all his commandments and his statutes which I command thee this day; that all these curses shall come upon thee, and overtake thee:
The list goes on and on, and on... rather like the Energizer Bunny.
As l said, no one will ever get into Heaven but through Jesus. I am a Christian with the Holy Spirit in residence ,and l do keep the Lord's Commands. You don't have a Holy Spirit in residence and seem to spend your time denigrating God so think about it, you don't keep the Lord's Commandments. You need Jesus to save you Liam R, but l am a bit concerned about asking you to go amongst our sheep. So, you just stay as you are Liam R and don't go to Church.
warner

Bathgate, UK

#563 Jul 3, 2014
DebraE wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I am not ageist. Most of those scientists are about my age and I know the temper of the times in this county. The simple fact is that fewer scientists are Christians than any other sector in the population, and the newer scientists coming up have even less belief in the unseen, unheard and unprovable phenomena known as religion.
Many think of Galileo as the first real scientist (btw, he was excommunicated by the church for about 5 centuries for not just repeating the current interpretation of the Bible). Some think of Roger Bacon as the first scientist, but he borrowed heavily from the works of an Arab-Muslim scholar and his book. If you wish to research it yourself, fine. If you wish me to cite my sources, I will do so. After all, science is not a "thing" it is a systematic method and a scientist is one who uses that method to discover observable fact and to see if those observations can be replicated or if the results vary and why.
So, I'm afraid the shock is for you.
Last but not least, you stated that you "know for a fact" that your religion is the one and true way. That is the reason I keep asking you for these facts of yours.
I know for a fact but l cannot take my spiritual experience and pass it to you. You need the Holy Spirit in residence within you to be able to understand the Bible. Without the Holy Spirit you will never understand the Bible and it's the Bible that says that because you are perishing in your sin. You have darkness in you that prevents you understanding the Light.
Kareem O Wheat

Lowell, MA

#564 Jul 3, 2014
Warner wrote:
<quoted text>I gave you my answer when l gave you the scenario of me standing before God and me asking Him what l could do for Him. It is impossible for me to comprehend thinking about God doing nothing for me.
That's not impossible to comprehend at all. You might think it's impossible to be true, but is it impossible to comprehend or even imagine? That's nonsense. You most certainly can at least "imagine" the scenario..I didn't ask you to agree with it and I didn't suggest that this phony scenario was true. If I say "what if the sky was green?", are you telling me you can't even comprehend that statement? Come on. Of course you can. Nobody is saying the sky is actually green
Warner wrote:
<quoted text>
If God had not been my friend l cannot imagine what would become of me. God has given me love and support and reassurance that l will go to him at my end.
Sure, because God has done things for you and you expect that he will do things for you in the future as promised. But the question was, suppose God didn't do any of these things for you and will not do them, would you still love God? And if so, why should you?
Warner wrote:
<quoted text>
It's possible for me to provoke God with the scenario that you asked me so l would not dare imagine it.
The question wasn't for God, and it really wasn't even about God. The question was for you and is about you. There are certain things that everyone needs to learn about themselves, first and foremost, before they can ever begin to attempt to understand God. If one wants to understand God, one needs to have a very keen understanding of the person doing the understanding of God, i.e. themselves. God will be God and God takes care of itself. The only important questions are really about the person themselves
Warner wrote:
<quoted text>
Some years back when l was in Majorca on holiday l was thinking to myself in bed about how l was fed up not being carefree enough to not have to watch my money and how l could not afford to eat in the best of restaurants. I thought l was contemplating the holiday and l certainly was not praying. God interjected into my contemplations and rebuked me and so the lesson from that was that my thoughts are not my own. Yes, God said to me " l gave you this holiday, you have decent accommodation and pleasant food yet still you are not satisfied". I was very shocked and apologised. My thoughts are not my own, God hears everything, even when not in prayer.
Gee, that's funny. The same thing happens to me all of the time without even asking God. It's me merely reminding myself of how much I already have despite how much more others have, and how much less others might have, and how little one really needs anyway. This should be like second nature common sense to do this. Did Jesus eat in nice restaurants or have a nice home? You shouldn't need to call upon God to realize things like this. Save that for the important stuff, I guess. If you even have to think the way you said that you did and do what you did, then you have a long way to go. I know how to test these things.
Kareem O Wheat

Lowell, MA

#565 Jul 3, 2014
Rose_NoHo wrote:
<quoted text>
The buy bull has day and night on earth and plants growing before there is sun.
We can dismiss the bible as being true before we get to Genesis 1:15
Spread this page:
http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/gen/1.html
It could have meant let their be light on earth, not let their be light in general. It's hard to say although I would agree that the normal assumption would be that this was talking about the existence of light itself..
Kareem O Wheat

Lowell, MA

#566 Jul 3, 2014
warner wrote:
<quoted text>I know for a fact but l cannot take my spiritual experience and pass it to you. You need the Holy Spirit in residence within you to be able to understand the Bible. Without the Holy Spirit you will never understand the Bible and it's the Bible
What does this verse mean?
2 “So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full.

What does this verse mean?
3 But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, 4 so that your giving may be in secret.
Belle Sexton

Santa Cruz, CA

#567 Jul 3, 2014
warner wrote:
<quoted text>I know for a fact but l cannot take my spiritual experience and pass it to you. You need the Holy Spirit in residence within you to be able to understand the Bible. Without the Holy Spirit you will never understand the Bible and it's the Bible that says that because you are perishing in your sin. You have darkness in you that prevents you understanding the Light.
WOW.

The E.S.T. method of evangelization !!

Whatever next !
bmz

Since: Mar 08

Singapore

#568 Jul 3, 2014
Liam R wrote:
<quoted text>
Jesus was most likely a Pharisee, of the Hillel school.
When I said that Mo was a self proclaimed prophet, I meant that he had no other credentials to back that up. Real prophets speak for a God, rather than just pulling feces out of they bunghole and calling it "holy". Mo was nothing more than a camel stealing child rapist who either lied about being a prophet or was delusional in his belief.
That Jesus was most likely a Pharisee or a Pharisee of the Hillel school, is absurd. Jesus did not come from the mainstream Judaism. All the Jewish schools were a quarreling bunch and hated the guts of each other and that is where Jesus reminded them of the first golden rule that came from God centuries before Jesus.

Muhammad brought Qur'aan, which I am sure you have never really read. It speaks far more for God than the ridiculous and horrible chapters of Joshua, Numbers, Judges, etc., which should not have been in the Tanakh in the first place.

And how about Judah, who screwed up his own daughter-in-law Tamar, after getting her screwed by his second son after her husband died? I am referring to Genesis 38. And this filthy guy earns a lineage in the Bible?

Can one really believe that the Jews came from the tribe of this man Judah, who went looking for a prostitute, after his wife died and got two bastards Perez and Zerah from his own daughter-in-law Tamar?

bmz

Since: Mar 08

Singapore

#569 Jul 3, 2014
BMZ: Paul was a liar. No doubt about it. Read Hebrews 1 and you will agree with me that he was a big liar. You must realize that Paul filled the vacuum left by Jesus and his disciples, who had gone into hiding.

Warner: PAUL WAS NOT A LIAR HE WAS FILLED WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT SO HE TOLD THE TRUTH PLUS HE HAD AN INCENTIVE TO TELL THE TRUTH AS HE KNEW WELL THAT FALSE PROPHETS GO TO HELL.

I like to do long posts in short bites, so that others can enjoy reading too. Paul was indeed a liar and also a taqaiyyah (deception) master. No doubt about it.

I had told you to read Hebrews 1 and you did not read. Right?

Please see this extract from Hebrews 1, written by Paul, in which he is talking about what God said about the son:

"8 But about the Son he says,

“Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever;
a scepter of justice will be the scepter of your kingdom.
9 You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness;
therefore God, your God, has set you above your companions
by anointing you with the oil of joy.” "

In the above, there is only ONE LINE that Paul wrote himself and that was : "8 But about the Son he says,"

And what did he do after that? He copied and pasted Psalms 45:6-7

Paul goes on lying further and adds his own line 10 of three words: "10 He also says,"

And what did he do after that? He copied and pasted Psalm 102:25-27

How absurd is God calling Jesus God!

When Jesus did not say any damn thing to his disciples, who the hell Paul was to say that by copying and pasting verses from Psalms and other chapters.

When I was young and had not read the Christian Bible, the Bible Thumpers used to tell me that Jesus is God and God called Jesus God. When I read and studied myself, instead of finding God, I found fraud and forgeries.
bmz

Since: Mar 08

Singapore

#570 Jul 3, 2014
BMZ : "No! Neither Qur'aan nor Muhammad included Mary in the alleged trinity."

Warner: "I BELIEVE THAT THE QURAN DOES STATE THAT GOD (the Father) JESUS (the Son) and MARY MAKE UP THE THE THREE OF THE TRINITY. WHEN IN FACT THE 3 are God the Father and Jesus the Son and The Holy Spirit."

You believe with what? On what basis? Qur'aan refutes and condemns Trinity and when it does that, it does not even name the the alleged three in it. It simply says " Don't say Salaasa" (Salaasa is a simple transliteration).

So, where does Qur'aan say that God, Mary and Jesus make up Trinity?
bmz

Since: Mar 08

Singapore

#571 Jul 3, 2014
BMZ: "Neither was Jesus a witness to Moses and other prophets of God."

Warner: "MOSES AND OTHER PROPHETS PROPHESIED ABOUT THE COMING OF THE JEWISH MESSIAH AND PROPHESIED WHERE HE WOULD BE BORN AND HOW HE WOULD DIE.

JESUS WAS IN HEAVEN PRIOR TO THESE PROPHETS BEING SENT AND HE EXISTED PRIOR TO THEIR BIRTH."

Stop lying, please. There is nothing direct from Jesus on anything that the Church claims.

There is no mention of a messiah in the Torah at all. No messiah was promised by God. God promised the Hebrews only a prophet.
naman

Lillehammer, Norway

#572 Jul 3, 2014
Rose_NoHo wrote:
<quoted text>
The buy bull has day and night on earth and plants growing before there is sun.
We can dismiss the bible as being true before we get to Genesis 1:15
Spread this page:
http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/gen/1.html
There is a difference between a mistake and a falsification. There are mistakes also in the Bible, and especially in the Genesis. But there is no proved falsification, and that was what Muhammad claimed and Muslims/Islam claim. If there are not MANY falsifications in the Bible, many things are horribly wrong in the Quran. And as I said: There is not one proved falsification in the Bible. On the contrary old papers prove there is no falsifications.

http://www.1000mistakes.com . Please spread this address - it is the most informative and most reliable I have found about the Quran.
Kareem O Wheat

Lowell, MA

#573 Jul 3, 2014
bmz wrote:
So, where does Qur'aan say that God, Mary and Jesus make up Trinity?
Right, Trinity has nothing to do with three.

5:73 Yusuf Ali
They do blaspheme who say: Allah is one of three

http://corpus.quran.com/wordbyword.jsp...

5:75 Yusuf Ali
Christ the son of Mary was no more than an apostle; many were the apostles that passed away before him. His mother was a woman of truth. They had both to eat their (daily) food.

5:116
And when Allah will say: O Isa son of Marium! did you say to men, Take me and my mother for two gods besides Allah he will say

Hmmm....it just keeps adding up to three. But there is no connection between the number three and the Trinity.
naman

Lillehammer, Norway

#574 Jul 3, 2014
Liam R wrote:
<quoted text>
Exactly like the Muslims with their Koran, Christians ignore or deny the errors that are in the Bible.
Correction: I do not deny that there are errors also in the Bible - though far fewer than in the Quran. What I said is that there is no proved falsification in the Bible, in spite of Muhammad's claims. There is a big difference between a mistake and a falsification - and in this case even more so as no falsification in the Bible means that there are many errors in the Quran --- a book Islam claims is from an omniscient god.

One extra documentation for this is that if Islam had found even one proved falsification, it had been written in fire "everywhere". Ther are no such "fires".

http://www.1000mistakes.com . Please spread this address - it is the most informative and most reliable one I have found about the Quran.

Since: Apr 11

Santa Monica, CA

#575 Jul 3, 2014
Kareem O Wheat wrote:
<quoted text>
It could have meant let their be light on earth, not let their be light in general. It's hard to say although I would agree that the normal assumption would be that this was talking about the existence of light itself..
We know the sun existed before life on earth did.
We know night and day are caused by the rotation of a spot on earth rotating away from and towards the sun.
Plants could not live without the sun, and I'm not just talking about photosynthesis. Without the sun, the earth would be close to zero Kelvin.

Since: Apr 11

Santa Monica, CA

#576 Jul 3, 2014
naman wrote:
<quoted text>
There is a difference between a mistake and a falsification. There are mistakes also in the Bible, and especially in the Genesis.
What do you mean by falsification?

"a misrepresentation especially by embellishing a true memory with false details"
http://www.merriam-webster.com/medical/falsif...
Kareem O Wheat

Lowell, MA

#577 Jul 3, 2014
Rose_NoHo wrote:
<quoted text>
We know the sun existed before life on earth did.
I forget, but did the plants come before God said let their be light? Is it ;possible that this meant let their be light on earth and the earth was blocked from the sun's light until then?
Rose_NoHo wrote:
<quoted text>
We know night and day are caused by the rotation of a spot on earth rotating away from and towards the sun.
I find the whole thing about 7 "days" to be symbolic, given there are actually 7 days in a week.

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