Will Gay Marriage Pit Church Against Church?

Apr 27, 2009 Full story: news.yahoo.com 16,105

The trouble they see is not just an America where general support for gay marriage will have driven a wedge between churches and the world, but between churches themselves.

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Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#12339 Apr 4, 2013
Liam R wrote:
<quoted text>
Hmm, and that neatly dovetails in with evolution as "natural" selection and survival of the fittest.
Of course, as a friend of mine once pointed out, what is more impressive: a God that has to go "Poof" and do a magic trick for each and every species; or a God that goes "Poof" and magically creates a factory that then manufactures all of the necessary components for each step of the way to culminate in humans at the proper time without the need for further Divine intervention?
It was something to keep the angels amused and out of his hair, buzzing around like gnats "hosanna"-ing him all the time. Vicious little critters, angels. They LIKED the dinosaurs and natural disasters.

Think "ANIMAL PLANET".

One of them, the littlest one, started evolving a sense of compassion. Very un-angelic, indeed. Things got very ... uh ... controversial among the elohim. The compassionate one created a garden, and was determined to demonstrate that not all were brutes, tinkering with their brains.

We all know the rest of the story.

"Now the compassionate one wants to bring some of them into the house ?!?!"

Since: Dec 09

Chicago, IL

#12340 Apr 4, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you know who the Apostle Thomas was (aka doubting Thomas?)
John 20:24-29
24 Now Thomas (also known as Didymus[a]), one of the Twelve, was not with the disciples when Jesus came.
25 So the other disciples told him, <“We have seen the Lord!”>
But he (doubting Thomas) said to them, <<<“Unless I see the nail marks in his hands and put my finger where the nails were, and put my hand into his side, I will NOT believe.”>>>
26 ~~~A week later~~~ his disciples were in the house again, and Thomas was with them. Though the doors were LOCKED, Jesus CAME and STOOD among them and said,“Peace be with you!”
27 Then he (Jesus) said to Thomas, <<<<<“PUT your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and PUT it into my side. Stop doubting and believe.”>>>>>
28 Thomas said to him, <<<<<“My Lord and my God!”>>>>>
29 Then Jesus told him,“Because you HAVE seen me, you have believed; *****blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”*****
***This is Christians today, "blessed are those who HAVE NOT SEEN and YET HAVE BELIEVED."
**********
"So also is the resurrection of the dead.
It is sown a perishable body, it is raised an imperishable body; it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power; it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body.
If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body."
**********
Jesus did not openly rebuke doubting Thomas for wanting to see the proof.
God is not going write out "I EXIST" in big letters across the sky to satisfy our skepticism.
He has provided ample testimony to His existence.
Faith does not exist in a vacuum.
Truth: "Jesus did not openly rebuke doubting Thomas for wanting to see the proof. "

Well, He did actually. Jesus mildly chastized Thomas for not believing He'd been resurrected until he saw for himself it was true. Thomas had to see to believe. So Jesus blessed those who believe WITHOUT seeing.. to gently rebuke Thomas for having had too little faith.

Truth: "God is not going write out "I EXIST" in big letters across the sky to satisfy our skepticism. He has provided ample testimony to His existence."

I'm not skeptical. I don't doubt that God Exists. Are you mixing me up with someone else, or do you talk at everyone you post to like they're unbeliever know-nothings?

Truth: "Faith does not exist in a vacuum".

With the possible exception of your's, not much does..

Truth: "it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body."
If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body."

That is exactly what I've been saying and you've persisted to contest.
Dead bodies are NOT raised from death. Moldering corpses don't get resurrected.
It's not a PHYSICAL, MATERIAL BODY that rises, it's SPIRIT. A spiritual body formed of spirit. A SPIRIT BODY. Not flesh. Not a bright shiny brand new physical body identical to the one we had in life. Not our cadaver, expertly refurbrished. NOT A healthy, young, beautiful body cloned from our dead one. A SPIRIT BODY. We rise in SPIRIT.
Now isn't that what I've been saying all along?
Yet here you are, still hot to trot, determined to disprove and correct me.
In all honesty though, I really did more enjoy than not, replying to you this time.








Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#12341 Apr 4, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Did you know that the crucifixion didn't exist when the prophecies were made???
Yet,
Jesus fulfilled all the prophecies!
That is absolute NONSENSE.

http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/144...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crucifixion#Anci...

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#12342 Apr 4, 2013
Heather Marie wrote:
Gay marriage and homosexuality itself (yes, that's what it's called – "gay" is a recent euphemism trying to make it more socially palatable) is either a sin or it's not, and that is up to God. All the human interpretation in the world won't change that! And if it is a sin, then it's between God and to the center. It is not up to the rest of us to enforce "our morals" – as determined by the way WE interpret the Bible – but it's up to each and every individual to determine for themselves whether what they are doing is wrong BY GOD'S STANDARDS NOT THEIRS and then act accordingly. If they're making a bad bed, they're going to actively in it for all eternity! That's why I don't concern myself, nor do I care about the whole gay issue – I don't go that way, therefore it doesn't affect me and I don't care.
"Gay" comes from the Dutch maritime slang "ghey" meaning "randy" as in "a randy tar". It entered gay lexicon in the early 20th century through the ports of the east coast of the US. It's similarity in sound to the commonly understood "gay" served to create a euphemistic code word that eventually lost it's original connection through simple ignorance of the users.

It's usually not very good to start an argument with an historical error in etymology, nor by falsely ascribing motivations to others.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#12343 Apr 4, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Our physical bodies, when lowered into the ground, are but empty shells no longer capable of sustaining our spirits.
Jesus once described the hypocrisy of the Pharisees as "whitewashed tombs which on the outside appear beautiful, but inside are full of dead men's bones and all uncleanliness."
Ah Manichseism, oh Manichaeism! How subtle are your seductions!

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#12344 Apr 4, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
same book....
Darwin says this:“Analogy would lead me to the belief that all animals and plants are descended from some <one> prototype.
All organisms start from a common origin.
From some low and intermediate forms both animals and plants have been developed.
All organic things which have ever lived on Earth may be <descended from some one primordial form.”>
end quote...
Again ...

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#12345 Apr 4, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Many intelligent and well-trained scientists—listen to me—are moving away from this theory, and it is not necessarily because they are Bible believers; it is because of the lack of evidence for evolution.
And who told you THAT nonsense?

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#12346 Apr 4, 2013
janeebee wrote:
<quoted text>
Snyper: ""exist" is problematic."
Is it?
Snyper:"Can God create something which He cannot destroy utterly?"
Let's hope so.
Then he would no longer be "omnipotent".

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#12347 Apr 4, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Many intelligent and well-trained scientists—listen to me—are moving away from this theory, and it is not necessarily because they are Bible believers; it is because of the lack of evidence for evolution.
Complete and total bullshit. No scientists are moving away from evolution unless they end up brain washed into belonging to a fundy cult. There is NO evidence contrary to the Theory of Evolution.

Ever hear of Project Steve? Some time back, there was an attempt to get "scientists" to sign on to a letter that opposed evolution. They managed to get about 700 signatures. Most of the so-called scientists on the letter had NOTHING to do with the biological sciences, they were economists or meteorologists, areas that barely qualify as science. As a response, Project Steve was started.

Project Steve was named in honor of biologist and popular essayist Steven J. Gould, and was LIMITED to scientists in biological sciences who were named "Steve" or a close variation thereof. Such scientists are only about 1% of the population of scientists world wide, yet there are still far more signatures on the Project Steve list than on the creotard list.

Here is the statement that the Project Steve scientists signed:
Evolution is a vital, well-supported, unifying principle of the biological sciences, and the scientific evidence is overwhelmingly in favor of the idea that all living things share a common ancestry. Although there are legitimate debates about the patterns and processes of evolution, there is no serious scientific doubt that evolution occurred or that natural selection is a major mechanism in its occurrence. It is scientifically inappropriate and pedagogically irresponsible for creationist pseudoscience, including but not limited to "intelligent design," to be introduced into the science curricula of our nation's public schools.
The quote, and more details about Project Steve, can be found here:
http://ncse.com/taking-action/project-steve

As an added bonus, that web page includes a link to a great web page that refutes all of the creationist arguments against evolution:
http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/index.html

You might want to do yourself a favor and check that page closely BEFORE you post any more lame arguments against evolution. Chances are VERY good that your claim has already been refuted, hundreds or thousands of times already.

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#12348 Apr 4, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
And, just because you say that I am wrong, it is true....
LOL......
I have been on this earth PROBABLY a lot longer than you have...
Statistically unlikely that you have been here longer than me...

And I don't expect you to believe it JUST because I say it, check for yourself, and believe it because it is true. When I post from the Bible, I do try to remember to post book, chapter and verse so the whole passage can be read in context.

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#12349 Apr 4, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
I will give it a try and maybe you will get it....
Buried in rich man's tomb.....
Isaiah 53:9
9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
and with the rich in his death,
though he had done no violence,
nor was any deceit in his mouth.
Matthew 27:57-60
57 As evening approached, there came a rich man from Arimathea, named Joseph, who had himself become a disciple of Jesus.
58 Going to Pilate, he asked for Jesus’ body, and Pilate ordered that it be given to him.
59 Joseph took the body, wrapped it in a clean linen cloth,
60 and placed it in his own new tomb that he had cut out of the rock. He rolled a big stone in front of the entrance to the tomb and went away.
Fulfilled.....ABSOLUTELY!!!
Sigh. You know, I actually DO get tired of having to repeat myself, over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over...

Wrong AGAIN.

Isaiah is NOT Messianic prophecy, it is a discussion of the trials and tribulations of the children of Israel. READ IT >>> IN <<< CONTEXT!

Isaiah 52:1 Awake, awake; put on thy strength, O Zion; put on thy beautiful garments, O Jerusalem, the holy city: for henceforth there shall no more come into thee the uncircumcised and the unclean.

NOT fulfilled.

Isaiah 49:3 And said unto me, Thou [art] my servant, O Israel, in whom I will be glorified.

The Servant is Israel. Nor is this the first use of that imagery...

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#12350 Apr 4, 2013
Xavier Breath wrote:
<quoted text>
Isaiah 53 is NOT about your Jesus. Ask the people who wrote it.
Why would he believe them? He should read it IN CONTEXT for himself, then MAYBE he could see the truth...

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#12351 Apr 4, 2013
snyper wrote:
<quoted text>
It was something to keep the angels amused and out of his hair, buzzing around like gnats "hosanna"-ing him all the time. Vicious little critters, angels. They LIKED the dinosaurs and natural disasters.
Think "ANIMAL PLANET".
One of them, the littlest one, started evolving a sense of compassion. Very un-angelic, indeed. Things got very ... uh ... controversial among the elohim. The compassionate one created a garden, and was determined to demonstrate that not all were brutes, tinkering with their brains.
We all know the rest of the story.
"Now the compassionate one wants to bring some of them into the house ?!?!"
I am reading this in the library at my son's school, waiting for him to get out of class. The librarian does not like me laughing out loud, it sets a bad example.

“God Loves Ilks!”

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#12353 Apr 4, 2013
snyper wrote:
<quoted text>
Which actually amounts to them saying, "Uh ... I dunno," and wiping the drool from their chins with their lace sleeves.
Ever see this really cool documentary about the Permian-Triassic (P-Tr) Extinction?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =Ngt1N7FtvawXX
Actually, I agree, it does.:)
Thank you for your link. I watched it and did enjoy it so.

For myself, I believe in God as our Creator and will always.
Where did everything come from/where and when did life itself begin?
For me, it is God, no matter where or when.

“God Loves Ilks!”

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#12354 Apr 4, 2013
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
And, just because you say that I am wrong, it is true....
LOL......
I have been on this earth PROBABLY a lot longer than you have...
And, I might have been on this earth longer than you, but age has nothing to do with what one knows.
One has to be willing to learn and not hindered by being narrow-minded.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#12355 Apr 4, 2013
Liam R wrote:
<quoted text>
Why would he believe them? He should read it IN CONTEXT for himself, then MAYBE he could see the truth...
Reminds me of the response in the teaching tale of Lazarus and the rich man.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#12356 Apr 4, 2013
Nettiebelle wrote:
<quoted text>Actually, I agree, it does.:)
Thank you for your link. I watched it and did enjoy it so.
For myself, I believe in God as our Creator and will always.
Where did everything come from/where and when did life itself begin?
For me, it is God, no matter where or when.
True, but the "how" of it all is there for our development and amusement.

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#12357 Apr 4, 2013
snyper wrote:
<quoted text>
Reminds me of the response in the teaching tale of Lazarus and the rich man.
Luke 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Yup...

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#12358 Apr 4, 2013
Isaiah 53 in depth...
http://noachieten.nl/messiahtruth.com/isai53a...
It goes into a verse by verse breakdown, and carefully explains exactly why it has NOTHING to do with Jesus.
Truth

Leesburg, VA

#12359 Apr 4, 2013
Liam R wrote:
<quoted text>
Sigh. You know, I actually DO get tired of having to repeat myself, over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over...
Wrong AGAIN.
Isaiah is NOT Messianic prophecy, it is a discussion of the trials and tribulations of the children of Israel. READ IT >>> IN <<< CONTEXT!
Isaiah 52:1 Awake, awake; put on thy strength, O Zion; put on thy beautiful garments, O Jerusalem, the holy city: for henceforth there shall no more come into thee the uncircumcised and the unclean.
NOT fulfilled.
Isaiah 49:3 And said unto me, Thou [art] my servant, O Israel, in whom I will be glorified.
The Servant is Israel. Nor is this the first use of that imagery...
Isaiah 49:5-6

5 And now the Lord says—
<<<<<he who formed me in the womb to be his servant>>>>>
to bring Jacob back to him
and gather Israel to himself,
for I am honored in the eyes of the Lord
and my God has been my strength—

6 he says:
“It is too small a thing for you to be my servant
to restore the tribes of Jacob
and bring back those of Israel I have kept.
~~~~~I will also make ***YOU*** a ***LIGHT*** for the Gentiles,
that my salvation may reach to the ends of the earth.”~~~~~

Who is the YOU???

Who is the LIGHT???

HE WILL BRING SALVATION...

He has been called to be the Lord’s Servant.

His work has been difficult.

He will bring salvation to both Israel and Gentiles.

Kings and princes will arise and worship Him.

Who is the HE???

To whom will the Servant bring salvation? Who will worship Him?
- Both Israel and Gentiles
- Kings and princes

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