Will Gay Marriage Pit Church Against Church?

Apr 27, 2009 | Posted by: SongBookz | Full story: news.yahoo.com

The trouble they see is not just an America where general support for gay marriage will have driven a wedge between churches and the world, but between churches themselves.

Comments
6,341 - 6,360 of 16,105 Comments Last updated Aug 28, 2013

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#7233 Feb 20, 2013
dollarsbill wrote:
<quoted text>
So if I die and there is no God will I care? If you're wrong you will care a lot, forever.
Matthew 5:30 (NASB)
30 "If your right hand makes you stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to go into hell.
Pascal's Wager?

Suppose your worship of the wrong God displeases the real God?

Suppose your belief in the Bible displeases the real God?

Suppose your behaviors based upon your beliefs are displeasing to the real God.

Then what?

“equality for ALL means ALL”

Since: Jan 07

Fort Lauderdale FL

#7234 Feb 20, 2013
Rainbow Kid wrote:
<quoted text>
And besides;
.
where 'else' in the world would two naked men in the desert come up with 'seed'?
.
++++++++++
1 Samuel 20:41> And assoone as the ladde was gone, Dauid arose out of a place toward the South, and fell on his face to the ground, and bowed himselfe three times: and they kissed one another, and wept one with another, vntill Dauid exceeded.
.
1 Samuel 20:42> And Ionathan said to Dauid, Goe in peace, forasmuch as wee haue sworne both of vs in the Name of the Lord, saying; The Lord be betweene me and thee, and betweene my seede and thy seede for euer. And hee arose, and departed: and Ionathan went into the citie.
++++++++++
.
.....unless they got it from Samuel; who was hiding behind the Rock to the North; and watching and writing it all down for us to read (voyeurism; pornography; spontaneous ejaculation)
Serious question: do they ever refer to children as 'seed?'
Just The Facts

Norwalk, CT

#7235 Feb 20, 2013
I am afraid you are in for a rude awakening when you stand before our Lord...
"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who hold [back] the truth in unrighteousness... Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonor their own bodies between themselves... For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another, men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompense of their error which is meet.
And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenant breakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are WORTHY OF DEATH, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them" (Rom. 1:18, 24, 26-32).
Rainbow Kid

Alpharetta, GA

#7236 Feb 20, 2013
Tony C wrote:
<quoted text>
Serious question: do they ever refer to children as 'seed?'
There is no record of Jonathan and David ever being same-sex 'parents'; so swapping their 'seed' could only mean one thing
.
They consummated their marriage:
.
++++++++++
1 Samuel 20:42> And Ionathan said to Dauid, Goe in peace, forasmuch as wee haue sworne both of vs in the Name of the Lord, saying; The Lord be betweene me and thee, and betweene my seede and thy seede for euer. And hee arose, and departed: and Ionathan went into the citie.
++++++++++
.
It is interesting to note that the 'seed' part of verse 42 was deleted in many of the redneck bibles published by the fundies
.
One of the fundie 'bibles' tries to substitute the word 'descendants' for 'seed'; thus exposing it's copyright owners as morons:
.
Gay couples don't produce 'descendants'

“equality for ALL means ALL”

Since: Jan 07

Fort Lauderdale FL

#7237 Feb 20, 2013
Just The Facts wrote:
I am afraid you are in for a rude awakening when you stand before our Lord...
"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who hold [back] the truth in unrighteousness... Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonor their own bodies between themselves... For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another, men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompense of their error which is meet.
And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenant breakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are WORTHY OF DEATH, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them" (Rom. 1:18, 24, 26-32).
I'm afraid you carry no credibility when attempting to represent the Lord. Therefore you are deservedly ignored.

Feel free to continue wasting your time here. We'll continue to ignore you.

I already have an active prayerful relationship with God. I have no fear. And I certainly don't need your help. Neither does He.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#7238 Feb 20, 2013
Just The Facts wrote:
I am afraid you are in for a rude awakening when you stand before our Lord...
"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who hold [back] the truth in unrighteousness... Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonor their own bodies between themselves... For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another, men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompense of their error which is meet.
And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenant breakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are WORTHY OF DEATH, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them" (Rom. 1:18, 24, 26-32).
Why? You need to prove your God exists first.

“Jesus=only way into Heaven”

Since: Nov 12

saved by grace through faith

#7239 Feb 20, 2013
Rainbow Kid wrote:
<quoted text>
There is no record of Jonathan and David ever being same-sex 'parents'; so swapping their 'seed' could only mean one thing
.
They consummated their marriage:
.
++++++++++
1 Samuel 20:42> And Ionathan said to Dauid, Goe in peace, forasmuch as wee haue sworne both of vs in the Name of the Lord, saying; The Lord be betweene me and thee, and betweene my seede and thy seede for euer. And hee arose, and departed: and Ionathan went into the citie.
++++++++++
.
It is interesting to note that the 'seed' part of verse 42 was deleted in many of the redneck bibles published by the fundies
.
One of the fundie 'bibles' tries to substitute the word 'descendants' for 'seed'; thus exposing it's copyright owners as morons:
.
Gay couples don't produce 'descendants'
Seed in that context is obviously referring to descendants. David and Jonathan were swearing an oath to look after each other and their descendants since David had to go into hiding because Jonathan's father Saul was set out to kill David.

After Jonathan was killed in the battle along with his father Saul (1 Samuel 31:3-6, 1 Chronicles 10:3-6), and David was established as king and subdued the enemies of Israel........King David made good on that promise and took in and looked after Jonathan's son(seed) Mephibosheth (2 Samuel 9:1-13).

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#7240 Feb 20, 2013
Romans Road wrote:
<quoted text>
Seed in that context is obviously referring to descendants. David and Jonathan were swearing an oath to look after each other and their descendants since David had to go into hiding because Jonathan's father Saul was set out to kill David.
After Jonathan was killed in the battle along with his father Saul (1 Samuel 31:3-6, 1 Chronicles 10:3-6), and David was established as king and subdued the enemies of Israel........King David made good on that promise and took in and looked after Jonathan's son(seed) Mephibosheth (2 Samuel 9:1-13).
How would you know? Were you there?

“Wear white at night.”

Since: Jun 09

Albuquerque

#7241 Feb 20, 2013
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
Why? You need to prove your God exists first.
That is the assumption upon which the whole kit and kaboodle is based.

The Bible opens with 'In the beginning, God'. It does not open with 'In the beginning the various middle eastern states selected their national god from the Canaanite pantheon'.

The Moabites say 'our god is Chemosh, the son of El'.
The Akkadians say 'our god is Hadad, the son of El'.
The Amorites say 'our god is Dagon, the son of El'.
The Israelites say 'our god is Yahweh, the son of El'.
The Christians say 'our god is Jesus, the son of El'.
The Muslims say 'there is only one god and his name is El'.

“equality for ALL means ALL”

Since: Jan 07

Fort Lauderdale FL

#7242 Feb 20, 2013
Rainbow Kid wrote:
<quoted text>
There is no record of Jonathan and David ever being same-sex 'parents'; so swapping their 'seed' could only mean one thing
.
They consummated their marriage:
.
++++++++++
1 Samuel 20:42> And Ionathan said to Dauid, Goe in peace, forasmuch as wee haue sworne both of vs in the Name of the Lord, saying; The Lord be betweene me and thee, and betweene my seede and thy seede for euer. And hee arose, and departed: and Ionathan went into the citie.
++++++++++
.
It is interesting to note that the 'seed' part of verse 42 was deleted in many of the redneck bibles published by the fundies
.
One of the fundie 'bibles' tries to substitute the word 'descendants' for 'seed'; thus exposing it's copyright owners as morons:
.
Gay couples don't produce 'descendants'
Actually what I was asking is if, throughout the bible, children are referred to as "seed." I was trying to get some context.

I have not delved much into this story, although I often see it discussed on forums like these.

Didn't at least one of them go on to have wives/kids?

I'm trying to rule out (or in) the possibility that the "seed" reference simply means "our kids will be friends" and/or if one or both ultimately had kids.

“equality for ALL means ALL”

Since: Jan 07

Fort Lauderdale FL

#7243 Feb 20, 2013
Romans Road wrote:
<quoted text>
Seed in that context is obviously referring to descendants. David and Jonathan were swearing an oath to look after each other and their descendants since David had to go into hiding because Jonathan's father Saul was set out to kill David.
After Jonathan was killed in the battle along with his father Saul (1 Samuel 31:3-6, 1 Chronicles 10:3-6), and David was established as king and subdued the enemies of Israel........King David made good on that promise and took in and looked after Jonathan's son(seed) Mephibosheth (2 Samuel 9:1-13).
I guess that pretty much answers one of my questions.

Are there other examples of "seed" being used to mean "children?"

I remember it being used regarding masturbation i.e. to spill one's seed, which is obviously not referring to children.
Just The Facts

Norwalk, CT

#7244 Feb 20, 2013
Having an active prayer life is wonderful but if you maintain a Sinful life style it is fruitless...
21 “Not everyone who says to Me,‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day,‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them,‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!

Since: Apr 11

North Hollywood, CA

#7245 Feb 20, 2013
dollarsbill wrote:
<quoted text>
So if I die and there is no God will I care? If you're wrong you will care a lot, forever.
Matthew 5:30 (NASB)
30 "If your right hand makes you stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to go into hell.
Ah, Pascal's Wager. The problem with Pascal's Wager is it sets up a false dichotomy, your version of god or oblivion. But what if you are wrong god only lets atheists into heaven because he can't stand sycophants?(I don't expect an actual answer.)

Since: Apr 11

North Hollywood, CA

#7246 Feb 20, 2013
dollarsbill wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't know of even one English Bible that doesn't condemn gays.
I don't know of even one English Bible that doesn't say people who work on Saturdays should be tortured to death.

http://www.evilbible.com
Just The Facts

Norwalk, CT

#7247 Feb 20, 2013
Psalm 14 says. The fool hath said in his heart, There is NO God....

But God says something totally different:
Rom
11. For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

Cor
10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each of us may receive what is due us for the things done while in the body, whether good or bad.

12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God
Just The Facts

Norwalk, CT

#7248 Feb 20, 2013
Your missing the Boat that's why JESUS christ is called Savior...Wash you clean make you white as snow. Make you a presentable Son and Daughter to a HOLY HOLY HOLY FATHER.....

“Wear white at night.”

Since: Jun 09

Albuquerque

#7249 Feb 20, 2013
Tony C wrote:
<quoted text>
I guess that pretty much answers one of my questions.
Are there other examples of "seed" being used to mean "children?"
I remember it being used regarding masturbation i.e. to spill one's seed, which is obviously not referring to children.
The most important, assuming the talking snake is Satan, is found early in Genesis.

Genesis 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

“TAKIA AND TA TONKA”

Since: Aug 08

HAPPY TOGETHER!!!

#7250 Feb 20, 2013
Just The Facts wrote:
Having an active prayer life is wonderful but if you maintain a Sinful life style it is fruitless...
21 “Not everyone who says to Me,‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day,‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them,‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!
Why do bible worshipers try and force their beliefs on others?

If daily prayers work for you......then do it, but in reality.....how does praying make your life better?

“TAKIA AND TA TONKA”

Since: Aug 08

HAPPY TOGETHER!!!

#7251 Feb 20, 2013
Just The Facts wrote:
Your missing the Boat that's why JESUS christ is called Savior...Wash you clean make you white as snow. Make you a presentable Son and Daughter to a HOLY HOLY HOLY FATHER.....
Jesus ISN'T the Savior except by those who are bible thumpers!!!
Addison

Pekin, IL

#7252 Feb 20, 2013
Rainbow Kid wrote:
<quoted text>
There is no record of Jonathan and David ever being same-sex 'parents'; so swapping their 'seed' could only mean one thing
.
They consummated their marriage:
.
++++++++++
1 Samuel 20:42> And Ionathan said to Dauid, Goe in peace, forasmuch as wee haue sworne both of vs in the Name of the Lord, saying; The Lord be betweene me and thee, and betweene my seede and thy seede for euer. And hee arose, and departed: and Ionathan went into the citie.
++++++++++
.
It is interesting to note that the 'seed' part of verse 42 was deleted in many of the redneck bibles published by the fundies
.
One of the fundie 'bibles' tries to substitute the word 'descendants' for 'seed'; thus exposing it's copyright owners as morons:
.
Gay couples don't produce 'descendants'
You are a liar and a Spammer. You're repeatedly seen passages proving that David was innocent of any homosexual act, yet you Spam on.

The word 'seed' you focus on proves that both anticipated descendants, which are NOT the product of the homosexual acts that God repeatedly condemns.

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