Gillette

Fairfield, IA

#21 Apr 24, 2012
Joshua wrote:
Dogs did not evolve from from the grey wolfs cousins.
Yes, they did. The DNA evidence ALONE is lock-tight. You need a new act, Mr.
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

#22 Apr 24, 2012
Joshua wrote:
There is evidance to a magor catastrophic event that happened around 5000 years ago. From the rock layer it appears to be a flood.
Get specific and give us a link. There is NO evidence in the geologic record of the single event you call the worldwide flood of Noah. Utter nonsense.
Joshua wrote:
Also there are legends from just about every old relion from America to Japan that deal with a world wide flood that wiped out every being but a family who loaded up all the animals on a boat and road out the flood.
There are plenty of flood stories because humanity historically has tended to live near rivers and oceans, and so have gotten tsunamied or flooded out periodically.

There is NO evidence a of a worldwide flood. Such a thing is impossible.
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

#23 Apr 24, 2012
Joshua wrote:
There is not a single event that is not possible. The Bible is completly true. If you can show me 1 contradiction or mistake in the Bible I would be very suprised.
Serious? The Bible is chock FULL of errors of geography history, science and common sense.

On what day did Jesus die?

Mark says Jesus died on the day of the Passover.(Mark 15:25)

John days Jesus dies on the day BEFORE Passover, the "Day of Preparation for the Passover." (John 19:14)

Which is it? They can't BOTH be true, can they?
Joshua

Raleigh, NC

#24 Apr 24, 2012
Im sorry about the dog to grey wolf. It was a typo. Here is what I meant to say. Dogs came from grey wolfs not there cousains
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

#25 Apr 24, 2012
Joshua wrote:
Im sorry about the dog to grey wolf. It was a typo. Here is what I meant to say. Dogs came from grey wolfs not there cousains
Are dogs and wolves the same "kind" in your fundamentalist Bible theology?
Joshua

Raleigh, NC

#26 Apr 24, 2012
As to your comment the passover is a seven day event. Normaly fryday was the day they prepared for the sabbath. Here the meaning is friday of the passover week. Mark 15:25 "it was the 3rd hour when they crucafied him. It does not mention Possover in Mark 15:25. You need a new act Mr.
Joshua

Raleigh, NC

#27 Apr 24, 2012
And as to the the flood not being world wide. The plain indian lived on the great plain (hence the name) where there were only small streams. Why it is possible that there were flash floods those are obviously not going to be taken as a world wide flood. The Geographic layer of rock that shows evidanceof the flood is found all around the world.
Do you have anymore "contradictions"? Athist and non-christians have been going at this for hundreds of years and have found no viable mistake.
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

#28 Apr 24, 2012
Joshua wrote:
As to your comment the passover is a seven day event. Normaly fryday was the day they prepared for the sabbath. Here the meaning is friday of the passover week. Mark 15:25 "it was the 3rd hour when they crucafied him. It does not mention Possover in Mark 15:25. You need a new act Mr.
Apologetical BULLSHIT. Get and education and read some modern Bible criticism. EVERY intelligent Christian denom admits this is a "problem" in the Bible and basically says "Uh, we can't quite explain why there is this difference in the two days."
Joshua

Raleigh, NC

#29 Apr 24, 2012
Mark 15:25 has NOTHING to do with the day that Jesus died. When evidance contradicts you, you cuss, and try to cover the evidance. Average evolutionist.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#31 Apr 25, 2012
Joshua wrote:
There is evidance to a magor catastrophic event that happened around 5000 years ago. From the rock layer it appears to be a flood. Also there are legends from just about every old relion from America to Japan that deal with a world wide flood that wiped out every being but a family who loaded up all the animals on a boat and road out the flood.
Then it's obviously proof that the Bible is wrong and the epic of Gilgamesh is true.

Oh wait!!!

:-(

Now if we examine the evidence, there is NO physical evidence at all whatsoever (not even a tiny ickle bit) of a global world-wide flood. If we are to be generous and give you the benefit of the doubt, it is POSSIBLE that a large flood gave rise to various flood stories (though in many cases some older stories were plagiarized, such as the Jews stealing the Gilgamesh flood off the Babylonians) however if such a large flood did occur, it was certainly a local and not a global event.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#32 Apr 25, 2012
Joshua wrote:
And as to the the flood not being world wide. The plain indian lived on the great plain (hence the name) where there were only small streams. Why it is possible that there were flash floods those are obviously not going to be taken as a world wide flood. The Geographic layer of rock that shows evidanceof the flood is found all around the world.
Actually there is in fact LOTS of evidence of LOTS of floods all around the world.

But none at all for a single global flood I'm afraid.

Not to mention the fact that such an event would destroy all life on Earth in numerous different and horrible ways.
Joshua wrote:
Do you have anymore "contradictions"? Athist and non-christians have been going at this for hundreds of years and have found no viable mistake.
Actually you are incorrect. That's what your fundie websites say, unfortunately they're even more dishonest than you are. And you're pretty dishonest.

For example, creationists sent qualified geologists out into the field back in the 1980's. Their goal was to find evidence of a young Earth and a world-wide flood. As to be expected, they came back empty handed and told their bosses that there was no evidence to support an 'Ussher' interpretation of the Bible. Those geologists are still Christians, however they now accept evolution and an old Earth.

Another thing your buddies won't tell you is that back in the 16th and 17th centuries, the Bible was subjected to what was called 'Higher Criticism' by French and German Christian religious scholars (whereas previously one could not question the Bible under penalty of death), whereby they researched history all they could to see how much was in tune with the Bible. What they found was the same as we've been telling you since you first showed up - that SOME parts it gets right, while some it gets wrong. And the rest (mostly all the magical bits) could not be verified either way. Which is a common problem with magic.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#33 Apr 25, 2012
Joshua wrote:
Mark 15:25 has NOTHING to do with the day that Jesus died. When evidance contradicts you, you cuss, and try to cover the evidance. Average evolutionist.
Speaking of evidence, there's a whole bunch you haven't addressed. And I have no problem with providing more.

There have been smarter creationists than yourself show up here who have not been able to address it either. And this doesn't just happen around these evolution forums, it happens out in the real world too.

That's why the scientific community doesn't take creationists seriously. Because creationists have no interest in science.
Evolution Recall

Great Neck, NY

#34 Apr 25, 2012
Evolution is only a theory not a fact. Evolutionists have good imaginations! A long long time ago in a land far away, nothing exploded and created laws that created everything.
Then in the midst of this huge universe, one planet developed everything to sustain life before life began. Then lightening struck the soup and created a self replicating molecule with all the DNA for every living thing on earth and it managed to reproduce before it died.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#35 Apr 25, 2012
Evolution Recall wrote:
Evolution is only a theory not a fact. Evolutionists have good imaginations! A long long time ago in a land far away, nothing exploded and created laws that created everything.
Then in the midst of this huge universe, one planet developed everything to sustain life before life began. Then lightening struck the soup and created a self replicating molecule with all the DNA for every living thing on earth and it managed to reproduce before it died.
Congratulations, you just demonstrated you don't have a clue what the theory of evolution is!

Evolution doesn't have to explain abiogenesis or the Big Bang. Evolution is biology, and as such only needs to explain the diversity of life on Earth. That's it.

So let's cut the BS and lemme ask you why are you complaining about the scientific veracity of evolution when your alternative is Goddidit with magic?
Evolution Recall

Great Neck, NY

#36 Apr 25, 2012
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
Congratulations, you just demonstrated you don't have a clue what the theory of evolution is!
Evolution doesn't have to explain abiogenesis or the Big Bang. Evolution is biology, and as such only needs to explain the diversity of life on Earth. That's it.
So let's cut the BS and lemme ask you why are you complaining about the scientific veracity of evolution when your alternative is Goddidit with magic?
Funny huh? You say that my beliefs are 'silly' and use the same exact strawman I just used. You act the same way with your arguments against creationism.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#37 Apr 25, 2012
Evolution Recall wrote:
<quoted text>
Funny huh? You say that my beliefs are 'silly' and use the same exact strawman I just used. You act the same way with your arguments against creationism.
And what straw-man exactly have I used? If there is a *scientific* case for creationism that does NOT ultimately rely on Goddidit with magic, can you be the first to explain exactly what it is? And can you also be the first to falsify the theory of evolution using scientific evidence?
Joshua

Raleigh, NC

#38 Apr 25, 2012
As to the Gilgamesh. Gilgamesh was a decendent of Noah. Where does the bibe say the earth is flat. Back up you statements with evidance. I meant to cite where that came from but I posted before I remebered. Thank you for reminiding me next time I will be sure to cite the web site. If you can find so many contradictions in the bible plesase post some more.
Joshua

Raleigh, NC

#39 Apr 25, 2012
Christianity at its core comes down to faith.
So does evolution. It takes a LOT of faith to beileive that. Did you know there is a 10 to the 120th power chance that evolution even got started. An evolutionist found that out. You, being a smart well informed person are probably aware about the law of probability. This law states that anything over 10 to the 20th power is impossible. Beileiving that takes faith.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#40 Apr 25, 2012
Joshua wrote:
As to the Gilgamesh. Gilgamesh was a decendent of Noah. Where does the bibe say the earth is flat. Back up you statements with evidance. I meant to cite where that came from but I posted before I remebered. Thank you for reminiding me next time I will be sure to cite the web site. If you can find so many contradictions in the bible plesase post some more.
http://www.lhup.edu/~dsimanek/febible.htm

It's pretty much accepted that the early Bible writers accepted a flat Earth cosmology due to their lack of knowledge beyond a limited geographical area. This is the part where you tell me that the Bible is literally true, except the parts where we're not supposed to take it literally.

There's no such thing as a Biblical literalist.
Joshua wrote:
Christianity at its core comes down to faith.
So does evolution. It takes a LOT of faith to beileive that.
Faith is superfluous when one has evidence.
Joshua wrote:
Did you know there is a 10 to the 120th power chance that evolution even got started. An evolutionist found that out.
Not only is that a creationist lie, it is also a reference to abiogenesis, which evolution doesn't rely on. As life DID start, life can, and does evolve. The chances of abiogenesis however may be low, but it DID happen. Whether it was by natural processes or if Goddidit with magic.
Joshua wrote:
You, being a smart well informed person are probably aware about the law of probability. This law states that anything over 10 to the 20th power is impossible. Beileiving that takes faith.
The "law" is BS. Laws are man-made descriptions of reality. Should reality break the law, it's the laws that are wrong, not reality. Plus creationists have a bad habit of making up laws that claim reality is wrong.

That was one of them.

See, the problem is that we don't know the complete history of life on Earth for a complete 4 billion year period, therefore it is impossible to know what all the variables are (of which there would be trillions), much less be able to assign values to those variables. Hence why creationists literally pull those numbers out of their behinds.

Either way, the geological record demonstrates a period on early Earth with no life, then life appears roughly 4 billion years ago (or 6,000 if you're a YEC) starting with microbial/bacterial type organisms.

This means whether it was God or natural occurrences, there is a 100% chance of life appearing on Earth.

This is why the creationist arguments about "probabilities" are pretty silly. And the only mathematicians who tend to agree with them also happen to be fundies.
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

#41 Apr 25, 2012
Joshua wrote:
Mark 15:25 has NOTHING to do with the day that Jesus died. When evidance contradicts you, you cuss, and try to cover the evidance. Average evolutionist.
From Bart Ehrman's "Jesus, Interrupted" pages 25-27

Jesus and his disciples have made a pilgrimage to Jerusalem for the Passover feast. In Mark 14:12, the disciples ask Jesus where they are to prepare the Passover meal for that evening. In other words, this is on the Day of Preparation for Passover. Jesus gives them instructions. They make the preparations, and when it is evening-the beginning of Passover day-they have the meal. It is a special meal indeed. Jesus takes the symbolic foods of the Passover and imbues them with yet more symbolic meaning. He takes the unleavened bread, breaks it, and says, "This is my body." By implication, his body must be broken for salvation. Then after supper he takes the cup of wine and says, "This is my blood of the covenant, that is poured out for many" (Mark 14:22-25), meaning that his own blood must be shed.

After the disciples eat the Passover meal they go out to the Garden of Gethsemane to pray. Judas Iscariot brings the troops and performs his act of betrayal. Jesus is taken to stand trial before the Jewish authorities. He spends the night in jail, and the next morning he is put on trial before the Roman governor, Pontius Pilate, who finds him guilty and condemns him to death by crucifixion. We are told that he is crucified that same day, at nine o'clock in the morning (Mark 15:25). Jesus, then, dies on the day of Passover, the morning after the Passover meal was eaten.

In the Gospel of John, Jesus goes to Jerusalem in the last week of his life to celebrate the Passover feast, and here, too, there is a last meal, a betrayal, a trial before Pilate, and the crucifixion. But it is striking that in John, at the beginning of the account, in contrast to Mark, the disciples do not ask Jesus where they are "to prepare the Passover." Consequently, he gives them no instructions for preparing the meal. They do eat a final supper together.

After the meal they go out. Jesus is betrayed by Judas, appears before the Jewish authorities, spends the night in jail, and is put on trial before Pontius Pilate, who finds him guilty and condemns him to be crucified. And we are told exactly when Pilate pronounces the sentence: "It was the Day of Preparation for the Passover; and it was about noon" (John 19:14).

Noon? On the Day of Preparation for the Passover? The day the lambs were slaughtered? How can that be? In Mark's Gospel, Jesus lived through that day, had his disciples prepare the Passover meal, and ate it with them before being arrested, taken to jail for the night, tried the next morning, and executed at 9 A.M. on the Passover day. But not in John. In John, Jesus dies a day earlier, on the Day of reparation for the Passover, sometime after noon.

And so the contradiction stands: in Mark, Jesus eats the Passover meal (Thursday night) and is crucified the following morning. In John, Jesus does not eat the Passover meal but is crucified on the day before the Passover meal was to be eaten.4 Moreover, in Mark, Jesus is nailed to the cross at nine in the morning; in John, he is not condemned until noon, and then he is taken out and crucified.

end quote

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