It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the facts in evolution debate

I would like to respond to the letter 'Recent letter offered no examples of Darwinian disingenuousness,' . He responds to an article with, 'He says evolution is 'so riddled with holes,' yet fails to provide a ... Full Story

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#137315 Aug 5, 2014
TurkanaBoy wrote:
<quoted text>
HOLY CRAP!
THAT makes sense!
Why didn't I put those things together, as I indeed know that JW's have to make reports.
Because that makes his behaviour more comprehensible.
He needs to report on a regular basis his apologetic work. And, if you are right, indeed he choose Topix to be his working area. It doesn't matter what he answers. It doesn't matter when it degrades his personal integrity or his posts being crap and rubbish. The only thing that counts is his monthly report, which consists of his neatly filed and printed debates on Topix, spreading the word of god.

And does that point to the massive failure of his "effort"?

Has he gotten a single warm lead here?
KAB

Oxford, NC

#137316 Aug 5, 2014
TurkanaBoy wrote:
<quoted text>
A possibility in science is called a hypothesis.
And now the evidence for that hypothesis please.
The claims weren't mine. They were in the Pingualuit article, and no evidence was given. They were made by experts tho, which usually is enough for your side to accept them.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#137317 Aug 5, 2014
TurkanaBoy wrote:
<quoted text>
Until now WE were the ones correcting YOU.
I know you think that.

“What can I do to get the Topix”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

cops upset?

#137318 Aug 5, 2014
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
The claims weren't mine. They were in the Pingualuit article, and no evidence was given. They were made by experts tho, which usually is enough for your side to accept them.
Do you have any qualms about lying through misdirection at all?

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#137319 Aug 5, 2014
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
The claims weren't mine. They were in the Pingualuit article, and no evidence was given. They were made by experts tho, which usually is enough for your side to accept them.


It was a typical quotemine and was not related to the subject of the discussion. is was just a smokescreen to get you away form the hard facts. I offer a simpler solution to your problems. Just ignore posts you don't like.

Ohhhhhh......!
KAB

Oxford, NC

#137320 Aug 5, 2014
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
Hebrews 11:1 defines faith - not meteor craters, global catastrophe myths or the inaccuracy of the Bible..
Acts 17:11 is referring to the suffering and death of Jesus to become the Messiah - not meteor craters, global catastrophe myths or the inaccuracy of the Bible.
All you've got is misdirection and a complete failure be honest with yourself and others. Stock up on flame retardant, bubba. You're going to need it.
BTW, Heb 11:1 illustrates both my point and your crap logic.
Indeed, Hebrews 11:1 highlights that valid faith even has an evidentiary basis.

Here's Acts 17:11,

"Now these were more noble-minded than those in Thes·sa·lo·ni&#8242;ca, for they accepted the word with the greatest eagerness of mind, carefully examining the Scriptures daily to see whether these things were so."

Please highlight the suffering and death of Jesus part.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#137321 Aug 5, 2014
TurkanaBoy wrote:
<quoted text>
NOT relevant.
Did you read the article?
As your own standard demand you to do "honestly".
DODGING 1.
My standard does not demand I read an irrelevant article.
What am I supposed to gain from reading the YEC article?

“What can I do to get the Topix”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

cops upset?

#137322 Aug 5, 2014
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually no. KAB's delusion about buoyancy is not claiming such. As water could get under downward facing portions of the body they would indeed float.
His idea is equally silly, so we need to make fun of what he actually claims and do not need to exaggerate or misconstrue it.
I am only partially incorrect for not including all the downward facing surfaces perhaps, but that he is as you say silly and worthy of ridicule.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#137323 Aug 5, 2014
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Surprise! It had more to do with the flood than anything else. Duh.
Perhaps you could direct me to a specific point with confirming data in the article.

“What can I do to get the Topix”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

cops upset?

#137324 Aug 5, 2014
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
My standard does not demand I read an irrelevant article.
What am I supposed to gain from reading the YEC article?
Don't sell yourself short. Your standards include using irrelevant material as a matter of course. Knowledge, but you can't make a horse or a dumb ass drink. You can only show them the water.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#137325 Aug 5, 2014
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
As I have said, this discussion is irrelevant now, considering that no amount of compressing the rate of mutant fixation will succeed in REVERSING the timeline from Otzi, Cheddar man, and others to BEFORE the claimed flood.
However, to clarify your question:
One mutation from one population has a 1/n (n= population) chance of eventual fixation in that population. It has an (n-1)/n chance of disappearing. That is not "no chance", its a low chance. But there are, over time, a lot of mutations. Given a mutation rate of 1 per 67 females, there is a 1/67 chance that one or more of these mutations will fix eventually. eg for a population of 10 million, a chance of 149,253 / 10,000,000. And when these mutations are happening in every generation, not just one generation, the chances of some new mutation fixing is high over the long term (but you just asked about the chances for a mutation from ONE generation fixing or still existing 30 generations later, and I answered that question).
Given that continuing addition of mutations in every new generation, the chances that any completely unaffected (unmutated lineages) will exist after 8000 years is very low, dropping to 1% of the population by year 8000. Note that means one mutation or more, not the scores of mutations we see in the haplogroup tree, for example the large series of changes required to go from the common ancestor of L1'2'5'6'4'3 and Utzi's type K. And note that these are not merely a number of mutations, but a number that were successively fixed in whole subgroups, which then split into further subgroups where new mutations arose and fixed, which split into more subgroups where mutations arose and fixed, over successive periods.
A process that scientists estimate took mmmmm 100,000 to 200,000 years.
Otzi. Paglicci, and Cheddar man make folly of your flood anyway. But feel free to continue wasting your time.
What became of your willingness expressed in your most recent previous post to me to allow Otzi, Cheddar, and others to have existed after the flood?

Further, you now acknowledge that in a large long established population there are mutations achieving fixation virtually every generation. BTW, I didn't ask about the chances of a mutation from one generation becoming fixed. I asked how many from one generation of a 10 million population would eventually become fixed.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#137326 Aug 5, 2014
MMLandJ wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes it did. I believe it also provided a lake water turnover rate of ~330 years. So do you have data of a marine transgression into Pingualuit?
Just provide confirming data for whatever you want to assert. Otherwise, it will be considered incorrect.
<quoted text>
You mean the paleo-valleys that dispel your global flood myth of a crater overtopping? I thought you had access to the Pingualuit paper.
Coupled with the non-events recorded in the crater sediments of Barringer and Grenada, the Pingualuit slide resulted from either slope instability or seismic events. No global flood required.
What do you mean by marine transgression? Also, I don't think the Pingualuit paper addresses the ages of the paleo-valleys.

“What can I do to get the Topix”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

cops upset?

#137327 Aug 5, 2014
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
What became of your willingness expressed in your most recent previous post to me to allow Otzi, Cheddar, and others to have existed after the flood?
Further, you now acknowledge that in a large long established population there are mutations achieving fixation virtually every generation. BTW, I didn't ask about the chances of a mutation from one generation becoming fixed. I asked how many from one generation of a 10 million population would eventually become fixed.
Blah, blah, blah. Nothing important here. Just dragging out a defeat to avoid concession.

“What can I do to get the Topix”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

cops upset?

#137328 Aug 5, 2014
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
What do you mean by marine transgression? Also, I don't think the Pingualuit paper addresses the ages of the paleo-valleys.
Why don't you think the paper addresses them? Why do you think the lack of any foreign debris in the basin-scale slide layer rules out flooding of the crater? What leads you to believe that the flood never happened?
KAB

Oxford, NC

#137329 Aug 5, 2014
MMLandJ wrote:
<quoted text>
Physical characteristics of an alien spacecraft: solid frame/body, guidance system, propulsion system, self contained atmospheric system.
Is God an "extra-terrestrial/alien being?"
<quoted text>
Are you allergic to google, or are you preparing for an argument to invalidate Otzi's radiocarbon date, or both?
Your proposed label for God seems valid. Regarding your other point, I'm trying to encourage you to examine the data you are providing.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#137330 Aug 5, 2014
MMLandJ wrote:
<quoted text>
Pingualuit isn't salty b/c there is no evidence of a marine transgression.
Do you have any data for a marine transgression into Pingualuit Lake?
Do you have data indicating the salinity of Pingualuit Lake has declined over the last 4200 years?
Do you have data indicating the salinity of Lake Laflamme has increased over the last 4200 years?
Just provide confirming data for whatever you want to assert. Otherwise, it will be considered incorrect.
I can live with unconfirmed. Can you?

“What can I do to get the Topix”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

cops upset?

#137331 Aug 5, 2014
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Your proposed label for God seems valid. Regarding your other point, I'm trying to encourage you to examine the data you are providing.
Why do you think that dating of mummified remains is another piece of solid evidence refuting a global flood? Is it because the techniques are validated, well understood and provide consistent results? Why do you think God is an alien being? There is nothing alien about him based on my understanding is there?
KAB

Oxford, NC

#137332 Aug 5, 2014
MMLandJ wrote:
<quoted text>
Transcendent design, by definition, cannot be a "theory," as it involves a supernatural being. That said, every common element you used to describe your design program was based on an evolutionary concept/process. Call it whatever you want, but at its core, your design program is evolution.
<quoted text>
Why not? Don't you also mention something that wasn't around 4500 years ago?
An evolutionary design process works for me. Also, Pingualuit was around 4500 yearrs ago.

“What can I do to get the Topix”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

cops upset?

#137333 Aug 5, 2014
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
I can live with unconfirmed. Can you?
Is it the fact that you have no data to confirm your position and don't possess the technical savvy and understanding required to review data, that you feel you have to live with your opinion being unconfirmed? Or is it because deep down you know you are wrong and are just living a delusion and you think unconfirmed still means that your delusion could happen? How can you live like that?

I couldn't live like that. Do you think?

“What can I do to get the Topix”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

cops upset?

#137334 Aug 5, 2014
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
I can live with unconfirmed. Can you?
Do you understand that you don't even have that to live with?

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Evolution Debate Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Birds Evolved From Dinosaurs Slowly—Then Took Off 15 min Dogen 40
Should evolution be taught in high school? (Feb '08) 20 min Dogen 177,050
Are Asians/whites more evolved? (Sep '07) 48 min Dogen 1,382
"Science vs. Religion: What Scientists Really T... (Jan '12) 51 min dirtclod 17,031
An atheistic view on evolution vs. a godly view... 55 min Dogen 1,420
Evolution vs. Creation (Jul '11) 1 hr dirtclod 150,010
evolution of Eyes - size - skin color - shape -... 1 hr Denisova 8
Humans DID evolve from apes! 8 hr Denisova 42
More from around the web