It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the ...

It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the facts in evolution debate

There are 142571 comments on the Asheville Citizen-Times story from Mar 15, 2009, titled It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the facts in evolution debate. In it, Asheville Citizen-Times reports that:

I would like to respond to the letter 'Recent letter offered no examples of Darwinian disingenuousness,' . He responds to an article with, 'He says evolution is 'so riddled with holes,' yet fails to provide a ...

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Asheville Citizen-Times.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#122948 Nov 18, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
You are entitled to your opinion.

Do you mind if I tell other people you say I am entitled to your opinion?- Chatbot.

You are entitled to your uneducated opinion.
- Dogen.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#122949 Nov 18, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Glacier flowing is not in dispute. What is is whether they freeze to underlying rock. Your references did not address that. Now you have the work you wanted to do. You needn't thank me for the assistance.

I have already demonstrated that it would not matter if it was super glued to the underlying rock. It would not be enough to hold the ice down. But you are not technically savvy enough to read English and read it.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#122950 Nov 18, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Really? You have no clue where major ice sheets end?
They end with water under the edges.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#122951 Nov 18, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
You are entitled to your opinion.
Not an opinion. That is a fact.

You have lost. By the rules of debate you have lost. By the rules of reality you have lost. In your little mind you may not think that you have lost yet, but that is the only place in this universe that you have not lost.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#122952 Nov 18, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
They end with water under the edges.
What kind of water?

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#122953 Nov 18, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Glacier flowing is not in dispute. What is is whether they freeze to underlying rock. Your references did not address that. Now you have the work you wanted to do. You needn't thank me for the assistance.
They don't need to. We know how vast ice sheets move over land from the marks left on ground by retreating glaciers. By the way, they don't retreat because the ice moves backward. We can observe by the striations on rocks that part of their flow is a sliding along the ground. They both flow and slide. They are never "frozen to the ground". That is one of the more idiotic claims that I have ever heard. If an ice mass was frozen to the ground the stress from flowing ice would quickly pull it lose.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#122954 Nov 18, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
What kind of water?
Salt water.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#122955 Nov 18, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
They don't need to. We know how vast ice sheets move over land from the marks left on ground by retreating glaciers. By the way, they don't retreat because the ice moves backward. We can observe by the striations on rocks that part of their flow is a sliding along the ground. They both flow and slide. They are never "frozen to the ground". That is one of the more idiotic claims that I have ever heard. If an ice mass was frozen to the ground the stress from flowing ice would quickly pull it lose.
You haven't provided confirming data for glacial ice never frozen to the ground or for very slow glacial ice movement quickly pulling the ice loose from rock to which it may be frozen. BTW, how does the ice manage to gouge those scratches into the rock surfaces?

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#122956 Nov 18, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
You haven't provided confirming data for glacial ice never frozen to the ground or for very slow glacial ice movement quickly pulling the ice loose from rock to which it may be frozen. BTW, how does the ice manage to gouge those scratches into the rock surfaces?

Nor is such necessary since I demonstrated that it does not matter.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#122957 Nov 18, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Salt water.
Very good.

And it floats on that water. It is not "frozen to its base". Rising sea level would always leave an exposed edge that would cause the ice to float, even if some of it was frozen to the ground. During a world wide flood the ice sheets would open up like a zipper.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#122958 Nov 18, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
You haven't provided confirming data for glacial ice never frozen to the ground or for very slow glacial ice movement quickly pulling the ice loose from rock to which it may be frozen. BTW, how does the ice manage to gouge those scratches into the rock surfaces?
I don't need to. We can observe from enough sources to know that is not true. A picture of U shaped valleys at various locales such as Yosemite does that for me. Do you need to see a picture of a U shaped glacial valley. I assure you that they exist.

What you are asking for is "data" that you could find in a few seconds of Google searching. It is settled science.

You are the one who wants to upset settled science, the burden of proof is upon you, not me. Go for it.

“I can never convince the ”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

stupid that they are stupid.

#122959 Nov 18, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
You haven't provided confirming data for glacial ice never frozen to the ground or for very slow glacial ice movement quickly pulling the ice loose from rock to which it may be frozen. BTW, how does the ice manage to gouge those scratches into the rock surfaces?
You haven't provided confirming data for glacial ice being frozen to the ground or for very slow glacial ice movement not being able to pull itself loose from rock to which it may be frozen. BTW, how does the ice manage to gouge those scratches into the rock surfaces? I know the answer. Do you?

“I can never convince the ”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

stupid that they are stupid.

#122960 Nov 18, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Glacier flowing is not in dispute. What is is whether they freeze to underlying rock. Your references did not address that. Now you have the work you wanted to do. You needn't thank me for the assistance.
Well Dogen and SubZ have addressed all this stupidity very well. Anything I add would be beating a dead horse. See you later KAB. Try some industrial strength baby powder for the pain from all that spanking.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#122961 Nov 18, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>Very good.
And it floats on that water. It is not "frozen to its base". Rising sea level would always leave an exposed edge that would cause the ice to float, even if some of it was frozen to the ground. During a world wide flood the ice sheets would open up like a zipper.
When it's cantilevered over the water, as in "meets" the water, there is no base. As sea level rose, there would not always be a cantilevered edge. The main body is over earth, not water. The edge would not float unless it lifted the whole ice sheet (try the science on that possibility) or broke free from the main body.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#122962 Nov 18, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't need to. We can observe from enough sources to know that is not true. A picture of U shaped valleys at various locales such as Yosemite does that for me. Do you need to see a picture of a U shaped glacial valley. I assure you that they exist.
What you are asking for is "data" that you could find in a few seconds of Google searching. It is settled science.
You are the one who wants to upset settled science, the burden of proof is upon you, not me. Go for it.
You haven't provided even one settled science statement from a settled glacial ice scientist regarding such ice freezing to rock. I've apparently forgotten that glaciers can't freeze to U-shaped valleys, only V, right? Right at the moment I only want to upset you, although I'd rather educate you, but you won't allow that.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#122963 Nov 18, 2013
DanFromSmithville wrote:
<quoted text>You haven't provided confirming data for glacial ice being frozen to the ground or for very slow glacial ice movement not being able to pull itself loose from rock to which it may be frozen. BTW, how does the ice manage to gouge those scratches into the rock surfaces? I know the answer. Do you?
You are correct, and I think so.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#122964 Nov 18, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
When it's cantilevered over the water, as in "meets" the water, there is no base. As sea level rose, there would not always be a cantilevered edge. The main body is over earth, not water. The edge would not float unless it lifted the whole ice sheet (try the science on that possibility) or broke free from the main body.
Nope, try again.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#122965 Nov 18, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
You haven't provided even one settled science statement from a settled glacial ice scientist regarding such ice freezing to rock. I've apparently forgotten that glaciers can't freeze to U-shaped valleys, only V, right? Right at the moment I only want to upset you, although I'd rather educate you, but you won't allow that.
KAB, with your long line of failures I don't need to.

In fact I probably won't. As I said before when you bring something challenging forward I will deal with it. To date all of your claims can be dismissed with a wave of the hands.

Buh bye.

“Evolution is Variation”

Since: Nov 13

Dublin, Ireland

#122966 Nov 19, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't need to. We can observe from enough sources to know that is not true. A picture of U shaped valleys at various locales such as Yosemite does that for me. Do you need to see a picture of a U shaped glacial valley. I assure you that they exist.
What you are asking for is "data" that you could find in a few seconds of Google searching. It is settled science.
You are the one who wants to upset settled science, the burden of proof is upon you, not me. Go for it.
Yes I want to see a "U" shaped valley cut out by glaciers. Not cut out by water and erosion but cut out by glaciers. Provide data and links and pictures if you can.

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#122967 Nov 19, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
You haven't provided confirming data for glacial ice never frozen to the ground or for very slow glacial ice movement quickly pulling the ice loose from rock to which it may be frozen. BTW, how does the ice manage to gouge those scratches into the rock surfaces?
You can harp on about this forever but the fact is, indundation would provide evidence of a Flood whether the ice sheet brake apart and floated up, or remained anchored and was overlain with salty dirty water. And it would show evidence even if that layer was "washed away", because liquid water washing that layer away would leave its own disruption in the ice cores.

In other words, you can bafflegab around whatever details you like, but there is no trace of any disruption in the ice cores 4500 years ago out of the ordinary and that is not possible after such a complete inundation.

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