It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the facts in evolution debate

There are 141352 comments on the Asheville Citizen-Times story from Mar 15, 2009, titled It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the facts in evolution debate. In it, Asheville Citizen-Times reports that:

I would like to respond to the letter 'Recent letter offered no examples of Darwinian disingenuousness,' . He responds to an article with, 'He says evolution is 'so riddled with holes,' yet fails to provide a ...

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Asheville Citizen-Times.

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#119481 Jul 10, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Why does it matter? We share over 70% of the same DNA with zebra danios.
Huh..'magine that. Must have happened when Jonah had to relieve himself in those 3 days within their Megalodanio ancestor.
KAB

Oxford, NC

#119482 Jul 10, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Yep. Never happened. The pyramid that was in construction 4,501 years ago was still in construction 4,500 years ago and 4,999 years ago.
Writing dates back 5,500 years at the very least. Civilizations, writing systems, architecture, art..... were unchanged from 4,501 ybp to 4,999 ybp.
http://www.historyofinformation.com/index.php...
Of course there are cave paintings made from water soluble "paints" that go back a lot longer than that.
Thanks for the reference. Unfortunately, it lacks data regarding how the artifacts were dated.

“Don't be mad at me.”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

I'm just a little bunny.

#119483 Jul 10, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Thanks for the reference. Unfortunately, it lacks data regarding how the artifacts were dated.
If the mythical flood allegedly formed our current topography and that is the only explanation for how mountains formed etc., how come there are mountains on the moon and other planets?

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#119484 Jul 11, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's stick with the physical evidence. How are the time intervals which are then totaled back to the common ancestor determined?
You know, I started down this road explaining how it would work to you a few days back. Your response indicated that you could not even follow what I was saying. Want to try again?

In summary, the dispersion of a single haplotype variation depends on the generation time. In a stable population the number of pure female lines will diminish by 1/4 in the first generation, 1/4 of the remaining 3/4 in the next, and so on, until we are down to single haplotype line. This is because in a stable population, approx 1/4 of females will fail to provide a female heir.

If you started with say 1000 females, in a stable population, this means it would take 24 generations to get to ONE.

= 1000 x 0.75^24 = 1 (^ means "to the power of")

However, if there had been one woman in the original population with a particular variant haplotype, what are the chances that HER variant would be the one to survive 24 generations? One in a thousand of course!

So you can see its going to take a very long time for a new haplotype to express through a population.

Not only that, but new variations enter the picture during the 24 generations. We have one haplotype variant giving rise to daughter and granddaughter additional variations, forming a nested hierarchy (and this is how the real human migration pattern of the last 60,000 years was worked out, too).

I am confident that when scientists taking this and other complications into account say that the descent from mt-Eve took 200,000 years and could not possibly be squeezed into 5000, that they are making sense.

This is a body of evidence that not a single creationist objector has ever been able to fault to any degree that would make a 5000 year window possible.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#119486 Jul 11, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Thanks for the reference. Unfortunately, it lacks data regarding how the artifacts were dated.
Stop being such a dick. You know as well as we do how the dating was arrived at.

You insistence at providing every piece of supporting data for each and every comment is both childish and tiresome.

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#119487 Jul 11, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Stop being such a dick. You know as well as we do how the dating was arrived at.
You insistence at providing every piece of supporting data for each and every comment is both childish and tiresome.
Well, we already know his established protocols when dealing with facts. If he can't wave them away, he'll lie about them.

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#119488 Jul 11, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Stop being such a dick. You know as well as we do how the dating was arrived at.
You insistence at providing every piece of supporting data for each and every comment is both childish and tiresome.
KAB demands that you deliver an entire thesis plus all supporting documents before he will accept anything, right here on topix. Oh, wait, even that is not enough.
KAB

United States

#119489 Jul 11, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Fortunately you have the capacity to ignore the actual data and play make believe. No amount of data can stop that. But the data actually fully rules out the possibility of a global flood 4,500 years ago.
Unless you can account for civilizations being rebuilt overnight with the same culture, language, art, technology, as existed prior to the flood.
Why would people just a few generations removed from Noah take up finishing a pyramid that was under construction prior to the flood?
You really have to be retarded to believe that stuff literally, especially since the Bible was not written by people who thought in literal terms.
What "under construction before, during, and after the purported Noachian flood" do you have in mind?
KAB

United States

#119490 Jul 11, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
What is your understanding of the SHORTEST time the global flood EVIDENCE could have persisted?
That is the relevant issue, is is not?
The cosmic ray exposure interruption could have been as short as about one year.
KAB

United States

#119491 Jul 11, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Of course. The famous imaginary lurkers. Marky was big on that fantasy as well.
What we care about is evidence. Facts. Your word salads are neither.
Do you consider the significant number of IDs beyond the regular posters for your side to be imaginary?
KAB

United States

#119492 Jul 11, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
We are the only ones here. If there were any lurkers do you think, based on the evidence presented, they would actually be on your side? If there were lurkers they would likely be here for the comic relief of your posts.
By the way, how can I get a hold of your animal trainer ("elder") so I can tell them how well you are doing. Maybe someday you can become a "faithful and discreet slave", though I think that unlikely due to your mental limitations.
You know that the Watchtower cult has the lowest average education of any religious denomination in the U.S.(With at least 500k members)? They also have the lowest average income, second lowest household income, lowest standard of living, lowest employment rate, highest rate of mental illness.
References happily provided upon request.
Have you not noticed the significant number of IDs beyond the regular posters from your side?

Also, please provide those references.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#119493 Jul 11, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you consider the significant number of IDs beyond the regular posters for your side to be imaginary?
I have no idea. Not something I concern myself with.
KAB

United States

#119494 Jul 11, 2013
LowellGuy wrote:
<quoted text>
"Your side" being "people who demand evidence to support claims, and who accept the best understanding of reality as arrived at via the scientific method." Yes, people on THAT side don't care. But, if there are morons who are just looking for someone who sounds kind of smart and shares their religious beliefs, you might be a useful idiot.
Actually, I have in mind those who require data rather than understanding, and recognize the difference.
KAB

United States

#119495 Jul 11, 2013
LowellGuy wrote:
<quoted text>
How would you seek to prove there was a fire-breathing dragon living in my basement?
I would monitor your basement.
KAB

United States

#119496 Jul 11, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Genetic bottlenecks are identified by the loss of genetic variation.
There is no universal bottleneck 4,500 years ago therefore there was no global flood. Period.
Giant pandas and the golden snub-nosed monkey show evidence of a severe bottleneck that took place about 43,000 years ago.
Galápagos Islands giant tortoises about 88,000 years ago
Humans, chimpanzees, gorillas, cheetahs, rhesus macaques, orangutans and tigers.- 70,000 years ago.
Given that multiple bottlenecks for a species are a reality, how would you seek to prove there was a "universal" bottleneck 4500 years ago?

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119497 Jul 11, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
What "under construction before, during, and after the purported Noachian flood" do you have in mind?

under construction means being in the process of being built.
AKA the point in time between beginning and completion of construction.

You can't be this stupid.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119498 Jul 11, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
The cosmic ray exposure interruption could have been as short as about one year.

Smokescreen.


Try again.

Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
What is your understanding of the SHORTEST time the global flood EVIDENCE could have persisted?
That is the relevant issue, is is not?
KAB

United States

#119499 Jul 11, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
The scientists have been consulted. They are in agreement that a one year resolution of anything is not necessary to detect a global catastrophic flood.
<quoted text>
But at least we're not a jackass.
Is this no longer a consideration of the Atacama data your side initially invoked (i.e., goalposts have moved)?

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119500 Jul 11, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you consider the significant number of IDs beyond the regular posters for your side to be imaginary?

What significant number of IDs? The ones you imagine?

You can drill down into the stats and what you find it the number of posters is only slightly less than the number in that area at that time. Regular posters may get on and elect not to respond to anything.

So, we seem to be alone in our little universe. I am sure someone of your ego would love to believe he has a large audience but taint so.

We are more likely to get drive-by posts than actual lurkers.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119502 Jul 11, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually, I have in mind those who require data rather than understanding, and recognize the difference.

Data is a poor substitute for understanding.

Without understanding data is a bunch of numbers.


But you would not know that because you run from both.

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