It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the facts in evolution debate

There are 141336 comments on the Asheville Citizen-Times story from Mar 15, 2009, titled It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the facts in evolution debate. In it, Asheville Citizen-Times reports that:

I would like to respond to the letter 'Recent letter offered no examples of Darwinian disingenuousness,' . He responds to an article with, 'He says evolution is 'so riddled with holes,' yet fails to provide a ...

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Asheville Citizen-Times.

KAB

United States

#119441 Jul 10, 2013
DanFromSmithville wrote:
<quoted text>I read the research. I was satisfied with the work and the conclusions. Oddly, it is not the only research that says the same thing. No flood, no ark. But you know this.
If you read and understood it then you can explain how the measurement technology/methodology would detect a one year inundation. I suggest the approach to take is to assume a one year inundation 4500 years ago and consider how that would affect the data collected/observed by the scientists.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#119442 Jul 10, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
If you read and understood it then you can explain how the measurement technology/methodology would detect a one year inundation. I suggest the approach to take is to assume a one year inundation 4500 years ago and consider how that would affect the data collected/observed by the scientists.
Because the effects a one year inundation would be detectable over hundreds or thousands of years. How many times to you have to be told this??? Can you name any *REAL* major flood who's effects disappeared as soon as the flood subsided?

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#119443 Jul 10, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
A logical evidentiary basis for faith is, at the very least, included in the list of possible meanings for the Hebrews 11:1 passage.
There isn't anything "logical" or "evidentiary" about Hebrews 11:1. It is equally applicable to the monster under the bed, 7 years bad luck in breaking a mirror and astrology. Why do you insipidly insist that your favorite Bible passages are "data"?

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#119444 Jul 10, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Because the effects a one year inundation would be detectable over hundreds or thousands of years. How many times to you have to be told this??? Can you name any *REAL* major flood who's effects disappeared as soon as the flood subsided?
The mass extinction and deposition layer would be detectable over hundreds of millions of years. The KT boundary was first proposed as "proof" of the global flood - and as quickly dismissed as wishful thinking.
Funny how an abject lack of evidence for any of hundreds of (geologic and historically modern) biblical claims are met with "but that doesn't prove it didn't happen", but if a tooth were missing from a fossil jaw the same folks would claim it debunks warehouses full of evolutionary data.

Oh, BTW KAB... did you happen to check out the topology of the Red Sea bottom at the lat and long you cited?

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#119445 Jul 10, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
The mass extinction and deposition layer would be detectable over hundreds of millions of years.
No question. I was being conservative for KAB's benefit because he would, no doubt, jump on the time-frame. Much easier to reference more recent floods.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#119446 Jul 10, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
Funny how an abject lack of evidence for any of hundreds of (geologic and historically modern) biblical claims are met with "but that doesn't prove it didn't happen", but if a tooth were missing from a fossil jaw the same folks would claim it debunks warehouses full of evolutionary data.
Hypocrites are just that.{shrug}

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#119447 Jul 10, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
No question. I was being conservative for KAB's benefit because he would, no doubt, jump on the time-frame. Much easier to reference more recent floods.
You mean like the flood of bovine feces disgorged from Carthage circa 397 AD?

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119448 Jul 10, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Indeed, your side has claimed existence of plenty of nonconfirming data, albeit without actually providing even that data. The holy grail of data is that which convinces the opposition. Common ground is virtually required to achieve that. Telling someone what you believe cannot be expected to make a believer of them. None of your side's "data" references on this genetic topic have established that common ground yet.

A number of untrue statements, the silliest of which is the idea that people (other than scientists, of course) are actually convinced by data.

Most of your beliefs are well removed from the data. How does one who values data join such a obviously warped, data adverse, mind control cult like the Watchtower cult? The clear answer is that such people would never join such a cult.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119449 Jul 10, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you agree that percentage translates to up to several million differences from human to human on Earth today?

You mean random human to random human?
KAB

United States

#119450 Jul 10, 2013
DanFromSmithville wrote:
<quoted text>You only use that resolution line to make it sound like you know something that you don't and you don't.
The Bible doesn't give an exact date and time for when the flood started and when it ended. I know people have tried to extrapolate a date, but lets be real, the resolution can't be very good. Besides, the Bible isn't completely clear that it was a year. It has contradictory passages regarding how long the flood lasted.
By the way, have you ever wondered beyond your narrow views to think about why God would send a flood like that. Do you mean to tell me that little Tommy and his best friend Leon were among the so irredeemably evil that they spent their seventh and final year of life playing tag or whatever little boys did for fun back then. I mean seriously, two of every animal or seven pairs or whatever was worth saving but they weren't. That doesn't make sense.
You can't present and have presented nothing that hasn't already been refuted hundreds of times over as many years.
What is your understanding of the longest time the global flood reports allow or it otherwise could have persisted?

Please cite the Bible's contradictory passages in this matter.

Tommy and Leon can be resurrected to live forever.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#119451 Jul 10, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean like the flood of bovine feces disgorged from Carthage circa 397 AD?
The Council? Very similar.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119452 Jul 10, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Can you confirm that with one year resolution?

Yep. Never happened. The pyramid that was in construction 4,501 years ago was still in construction 4,500 years ago and 4,999 years ago.

Writing dates back 5,500 years at the very least. Civilizations, writing systems, architecture, art..... were unchanged from 4,501 ybp to 4,999 ybp.

http://www.historyofinformation.com/index.php...

Of course there are cave paintings made from water soluble "paints" that go back a lot longer than that.
KAB

United States

#119453 Jul 10, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Lie.
<quoted text>
Data and reality and just that. It matter not what the opposition is convinced of. The delusional will remain delusional in the face of any and all data. The data for this assertion can be found in your nearest mirror.
<quoted text>
Blah, blah, blah.
<quoted text>
You say this as if anyone gives a shit.
No, I don't expect any of the regular posters from your side to care at all. If I thought you were the only ones here, I wouldn't be.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119454 Jul 10, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
I know you don't need one year resolution. You are eager to accept as confirming that which does not confirm.
It's straighforward science that data lacking sufficient resolution can't detect what is beyond its capability.

Fortunately you have the capacity to ignore the actual data and play make believe. No amount of data can stop that. But the data actually fully rules out the possibility of a global flood 4,500 years ago.

Unless you can account for civilizations being rebuilt overnight with the same culture, language, art, technology, as existed prior to the flood.

Why would people just a few generations removed from Noah take up finishing a pyramid that was under construction prior to the flood?

You really have to be retarded to believe that stuff literally, especially since the Bible was not written by people who thought in literal terms.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119455 Jul 10, 2013
LowellGuy wrote:
<quoted text>
Here's some common ground: demanding we prove a negative (prove there is no genetic bottleneck) is both dishonest and an abdication of the burden of proof, as well as an admission that you don't trust geneticists to competently identify genetic bottlenecks in the first place, or that you think they ARE competent but are engaged in a conspiracy to hide evidence. Prove your silly Bible story is true or admit you have no rational justification for believing it.

Beautifully worded. You say what I think better than I can.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#119456 Jul 10, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
What is your understanding of the longest time the global flood reports allow or it otherwise could have persisted?
Please cite the Bible's contradictory passages in this matter.
Tommy and Leon can be resurrected to live forever.
WTF? Global flood reports? Does USGS maintain records of global floods?

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#119457 Jul 10, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I don't expect any of the regular posters from your side to care at all. If I thought you were the only ones here, I wouldn't be.
Of course. The famous imaginary lurkers. Marky was big on that fantasy as well.

What we care about is evidence. Facts. Your word salads are neither.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119458 Jul 10, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
What is your understanding of the longest time the global flood reports allow or it otherwise could have persisted?
Please cite the Bible's contradictory passages in this matter.
Tommy and Leon can be resurrected to live forever.

What is your understanding of the SHORTEST time the global flood EVIDENCE could have persisted?

That is the relevant issue, is is not?

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119459 Jul 10, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I don't expect any of the regular posters from your side to care at all. If I thought you were the only ones here, I wouldn't be.

We are the only ones here. If there were any lurkers do you think, based on the evidence presented, they would actually be on your side? If there were lurkers they would likely be here for the comic relief of your posts.

By the way, how can I get a hold of your animal trainer ("elder") so I can tell them how well you are doing. Maybe someday you can become a "faithful and discreet slave", though I think that unlikely due to your mental limitations.

You know that the Watchtower cult has the lowest average education of any religious denomination in the U.S.(With at least 500k members)? They also have the lowest average income, second lowest household income, lowest standard of living, lowest employment rate, highest rate of mental illness.

References happily provided upon request.
KAB

United States

#119460 Jul 10, 2013
LowellGuy wrote:
<quoted text>
Here's some common ground: demanding we prove a negative (prove there is no genetic bottleneck) is both dishonest and an abdication of the burden of proof, as well as an admission that you don't trust geneticists to competently identify genetic bottlenecks in the first place, or that you think they ARE competent but are engaged in a conspiracy to hide evidence. Prove your silly Bible story is true or admit you have no rational justification for believing it.
How would you seek to prove there was a "universal" bottleneck 4500 years ago?

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