It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the ...

It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the facts in evolution debate

There are 151284 comments on the Asheville Citizen-Times story from Mar 15, 2009, titled It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the facts in evolution debate. In it, Asheville Citizen-Times reports that:

I would like to respond to the letter 'Recent letter offered no examples of Darwinian disingenuousness,' . He responds to an article with, 'He says evolution is 'so riddled with holes,' yet fails to provide a ...

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Asheville Citizen-Times.

“What, me worry?”

Since: Mar 09

I'm a racist caricature!

#113723 Apr 8, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
I understand perfectly. Why question what you already believe?
As to changing my mind, don't sell yourself short. Confirming data changes my mind in a heartbeat. That's primarily how I got to where I am, and that will continue to be the case. I believe what I believe because I challenged what I use to believe, and I continue to challenge what I believe.
You may also note that my inquiry regarding Dogen has nothing to do with his beliefs. I would do the same if he was on my side. My take is that his approach is seriously flawed. The scary part is that, at least according to him, he's in a position to influence others' mental health!
This coming from someone who thinks the fluid dynamics of trillions of gallons of water and billions of tons of dirt can be simulated accurately with a cup of water and a spoonful of dirt.
KAB

Wilson, NC

#113724 Apr 8, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
Kab wrote:
"My understanding is that the flood was global, covering all land in 40 days, taking most of a year to recede, and causing substantial change in Earth's surface contours (i.e. much more pronounced post-flood variations)."
"I don't know how high the tallest mountains were."
"I am referring to post-flood increased land peak elevations above sea level of many thousands of feet, and much greater average ocean depths."
You state that the mountains got higher and the oceans got deeper. I simply asked for your source, since I know of no biblical passage nor geologic discovery that indicates either one has happened on the scale or within the time frame necessary to be relevant.
KAB wrote:
"I only expound on what I know and can provide data to confirm, and you are correct about the Bible not being a scientific text. It is also not in conflict with what has been confirmed by science."
Why would you 'profess' this indefensible stance? The Bible IS in conflict with science and it has INDISPUTABLY been a point of contention for centuries.
Let's start with some basics.

Water to land area ratio: roughly 2:1
Average elevation of land above sea level: roughly 2,000 ft
Average depth of oceans: roughly 14,000 feet
Combining these first 3 factors reveals the volume of water is about 14 times the volume of land above sea level.

Average thickness of Earth's crust: roughly 18 miles
Radius of Earth: roughly 4,000 miles
Height of Himalayas: roughly 5 miles
Combining these 3 factors reveals that Earth's crust is roughly 0.5% of its radius, sort of like an egg shell.

So creating the Himalayas only requires a shift in the crust amounting to less than 0.2% of the radius of Earth.

If you question any of the above, I will provide/seek confirmation.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#113725 Apr 8, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's start with some basics.
Water to land area ratio: roughly 2:1
Average elevation of land above sea level: roughly 2,000 ft
Average depth of oceans: roughly 14,000 feet
Combining these first 3 factors reveals the volume of water is about 14 times the volume of land above sea level.
Average thickness of Earth's crust: roughly 18 miles
Radius of Earth: roughly 4,000 miles
Height of Himalayas: roughly 5 miles
Combining these 3 factors reveals that Earth's crust is roughly 0.5% of its radius, sort of like an egg shell.
So creating the Himalayas only requires a shift in the crust amounting to less than 0.2% of the radius of Earth.
If you question any of the above, I will provide/seek confirmation.

The shift in the earths crust that has been (and continues to) creating the Himalayas for the last 60,000,000 is called plate tectonics.

The fact that the Indian plate is colliding with the Asian plate is causing this rise in the Himalayas.

If you are suggesting anything else you are lying.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#113727 Apr 9, 2013
Infinite Force wrote:
<quoted text>
Conclusion and just what I thought you don’t have is a universal definition for time! I DO BY OBSERVING THE PHYSICAL WORLD AND THE SCIENTIFIC CONCLUSION IS TIME IS ETERNAL!
NOT YOUR PSEUDO SCIENTIFIC METHOD!
http://www.astronomy.ohio-state.edu/~pogge/As...

“Universal Conscious Conscience”

Level 3

Since: Feb 08

Planet Earth

#113728 Apr 9, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
You are totally out of your element here I F.
NO! You are WAY OUT of your element because you are challenging someone who thinks on a universal scale, THIS TRIUMPTS HYPOTHESIS AND THEORIES AND GOES DIRECTLY TO UNIVERSAL CONCEPTS WHICH IS KNOW IN SCIENCE AS SCIENTIFIC LAWS! You gotta love those absolute truths!
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
You have no clue what you are talking about. Einstein showed the fallacy of your beliefs one hundred years ago. Now it has been tested and observed in clocks as little as one foot apart:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/ein...
"Nobel Prize Awarded to Two Quantum Physicists"
“Einstein himself hated this idea, but he was wrong on this one”.
>>>> http://bigthink.com/dr-kakus-universe/nobel-p...

Your link VS my link on evidence that validates the fastest one can travel is faster than the speed of light that Einstein proposed.

Applying the law of non-contradiction to eternity I now formulate the fastest speed something can travel is at an INFINITE (Unquantifiable and immeasurable) SPEED! Infinite speed travel is known as INSTANEOUS TRAVEL!

Evidence that validates what I speak of on the quantum mechanics level states that electrons can be at two places at the same time. It appears this way because it’s traveling at an INFINITE (unquantifiable and immeasurable) SPEED or instantaneous travel where it appears to the observer that it is at two places at one.

_________

It has also been noted in the field of ufology that ufos have been observed materializing and dematerializing instantaneously at two different points where the ufo appear to be at two places at one time.

“SIRIUS is one of the most significant films of our time. Produced by Dr. Steven Greer (founder of the worldwide Disclosure Movement and the Center for the Study of Extraterrestrial Intelligence) and Emmy award-winning filmmaker Amardeep Kaleka of Neverending Light Productions, this film is a broadcast of TRUTH: we are not alone in the Cosmos...and WE ARE NOT ALONE - HERE ON EARTH. The Earth has been visited by advanced Inter-Stellar Civilizations that can travel through other dimensions faster than the speed of light. What we have learned from them about energy propulsion can bring us to a new era, but those in power have suppressed this information in order to keep us at their mercy. And now it's time for ALL to know”.

>>>> http://www.disclosureproject.org/

“Universal Conscious Conscience”

Level 3

Since: Feb 08

Planet Earth

#113729 Apr 9, 2013
MikeF wrote:
I understand, but no matter how you put it you cannot put an ABSOLUTE VALUE on time. This is why it has no beginning or ending. This also validates the mathematical infinity symbol as being an absolute truth!

ETERNITY = INFINITY

“Universal Conscious Conscience”

Level 3

Since: Feb 08

Planet Earth

#113730 Apr 9, 2013
Time = Constant variable!
LowellGuy

Salem, MA

#113731 Apr 9, 2013
Infinite Force wrote:
<quoted text>
NO! You are WAY OUT of your element because you are challenging someone who thinks on a universal scale, THIS TRIUMPTS HYPOTHESIS AND THEORIES AND GOES DIRECTLY TO UNIVERSAL CONCEPTS WHICH IS KNOW IN SCIENCE AS SCIENTIFIC LAWS! You gotta love those absolute truths!
<quoted text>
"Nobel Prize Awarded to Two Quantum Physicists"
“Einstein himself hated this idea, but he was wrong on this one”.
>>>> http://bigthink.com/dr-kakus-universe/nobel-p...
Your link VS my link on evidence that validates the fastest one can travel is faster than the speed of light that Einstein proposed.
Applying the law of non-contradiction to eternity I now formulate the fastest speed something can travel is at an INFINITE (Unquantifiable and immeasurable) SPEED! Infinite speed travel is known as INSTANEOUS TRAVEL!
Evidence that validates what I speak of on the quantum mechanics level states that electrons can be at two places at the same time. It appears this way because it’s traveling at an INFINITE (unquantifiable and immeasurable) SPEED or instantaneous travel where it appears to the observer that it is at two places at one.
_________
It has also been noted in the field of ufology that ufos have been observed materializing and dematerializing instantaneously at two different points where the ufo appear to be at two places at one time.
“SIRIUS is one of the most significant films of our time. Produced by Dr. Steven Greer (founder of the worldwide Disclosure Movement and the Center for the Study of Extraterrestrial Intelligence) and Emmy award-winning filmmaker Amardeep Kaleka of Neverending Light Productions, this film is a broadcast of TRUTH: we are not alone in the Cosmos...and WE ARE NOT ALONE - HERE ON EARTH. The Earth has been visited by advanced Inter-Stellar Civilizations that can travel through other dimensions faster than the speed of light. What we have learned from them about energy propulsion can bring us to a new era, but those in power have suppressed this information in order to keep us at their mercy. And now it's time for ALL to know”.
>>>> http://www.disclosureproject.org/
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeetard.

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#113732 Apr 9, 2013
Infinite Force wrote:
<quoted text>
Conclusion and just what I thought you don’t have is a universal definition for time! I DO BY OBSERVING THE PHYSICAL WORLD AND THE SCIENTIFIC CONCLUSION IS TIME IS ETERNAL!
NOT YOUR PSEUDO SCIENTIFIC METHOD!
"Time is eternal" and you conclude this by observing the physical world? You obviously do not understand the multiple fallacies of your statements.
LowellGuy

Salem, MA

#113733 Apr 9, 2013
Infinite Force wrote:
<quoted text>
First you demonstrate what time is by observing reality on a universal scale!
If you got a flawed concept of what time is (WHICH I KNOW YOU DO) you will reject what time is as an absolute truth!
YOUR MOVE because I know what time is and I can validate it with empirical evidence!
No. You made the claim, so it's your burden of proof. You said time is eternal. Prove it.
LowellGuy

Salem, MA

#113734 Apr 9, 2013
Infinite Force wrote:
<quoted text>
What physical evidence located in this universe (star chart) you used to validate this equation?
Hence, what star, pulsar, which galaxy, which quasar, what planet, or which solar system did you apply it to or did you apply it to all of them? Once you applied your equation to the number of galaxies you can possibly count, are all time zones EQUAL?
I have DIFFERENT galaxies in the universe so whose time zones are universal and apply to all galaxies including ours! What is the time for all of us EQUALLY? I thought planets rotate at different speeds, so which planets in the universe are you going to use and apply it on a universal scale?
I’m going to apply the law of non-contradiction to your answers because we’re dealing with time on a universal scale.
ALL YOUR NUMBERS YOU PRESENT MUST BE EQUAL TO ALL PLANETS IN THE UNIVERSE TO BE ACCEPTED AS TIME BEING A UNIVERSAL CONCEPT!
Do you have time as a universal concept? I KNOW I DO!
I await your answer(S).
Doesn't matter. You claimed time is eternal. Prove it.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#113735 Apr 9, 2013
Infinite Force wrote:
Time = Constant variable!
Constant variable??? There goes the law of non-contradiction right out the window.

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#113736 Apr 9, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's start with some basics.
Water to land area ratio: roughly 2:1
Average elevation of land above sea level: roughly 2,000 ft
Average depth of oceans: roughly 14,000 feet
Combining these first 3 factors reveals the volume of water is about 14 times the volume of land above sea level.
Average thickness of Earth's crust: roughly 18 miles
Radius of Earth: roughly 4,000 miles
Height of Himalayas: roughly 5 miles
Combining these 3 factors reveals that Earth's crust is roughly 0.5% of its radius, sort of like an egg shell.
So creating the Himalayas only requires a shift in the crust amounting to less than 0.2% of the radius of Earth.
If you question any of the above, I will provide/seek confirmation.
A vertical shift of only 50 feet caused the 2004 tsunami. The shifts you propose are many orders of magnitude beyond that and would leave obvious and overwhelming physical evidence. What source states significant differences in mountain heights and oceanic depths pre-flood?

“Universal Conscious Conscience”

Level 3

Since: Feb 08

Planet Earth

#113737 Apr 9, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Constant variable??? There goes the law of non-contradiction right out the window.
Constant means never changing information to an opposite!

Variable means information growing and never violating the law of non-contradiction!

The law of non-contradiction is FLAWLESS!

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#113738 Apr 9, 2013
Infinite Force wrote:
<quoted text>
YES! It “exist now” and it “didn’t exist” must be applied to TIME and must not violate the law of non-contradiction found in nature as an absolute truth! I think and speak in universal terms (absolute truths) and the way you people are defining time by the observation of nature is flawed! I discovered Time as an absolute truth (universal law) observed in nature which its self is an absolute truth and you and the rest of the people who think like you, including your flawed scientific method used to falsifiably validate the origin of species as a non-fixed biological reproductive species! Anyways, this conversation is about time so let’s keep it to what is time on a universal scale!
I know time is a universal concept which makes it ETERNAL (good bye to thinking time travel is possible) because time having no beginning or ending, what numbers are you going to put on the “date” to travel to when an absolute current date on the universal scale has no beginning or ending?!
Anyways, what is your universal definition for time?! Once again, you must think on the universal scale.
<quoted text>
I ALWAYS thought like this naturally. I just discovered the tool to explain how I think from Aristotle called the law of non-contradiction! You can’t even speak about reality (absolute truths) because you reject it when I speak in absolute truths because you cherry pick to speak ONLY about the absolute truths you like and you reject the absolute truths you dis-like and this validates your way of thinking violates the law of non-contradiction!
A. Chromiuman either accepts absolute truths
B. Chromiuman either rejects absolute truths
The law of non-contradiction states if you reject one absolute truth then you must reject ALL absolute truths!
You pick both answers you’re only out for yourself or a group of people who think like you and their own self-centered, biased, want things ONLLY there ways and this is not a universal way of thinking. You are either for all or for yourself!!
MOTIVES DETETECTED BY APPLYING THE LAW OF NON-CONTRADICTION TO INDIVIDUAL THINKING!
I already know your answer but I want to check your integrity level.
Choose either A or B would you please above and let US see if you or out for the good of all or your own selfish, biased and prejudice desires! I AWAIT YOUR ANSWER! ABSOLUTE TRUTHS DON’T COMPROMISE WITH THOSE INDIVIDUALS WHO ACCEPTS SOME AND REJECTS OTHER! Because this is why we have people like YOUR-SELF with contradictory thoughts in their heads trying dis-proving absolute truths they dis-like!
OH, DID I TELL YOU I AM ABLE TO READ YOUR OWN MIND TO DETERMINE YOUR BEHAVIOR WITH WHAT YOU POST TO ME AND KNOW IF YOU ARE UP TO GOOD (ACCEPT ONLY ABSOLUTE TRUTHS) OR NO GOOD (REJECTING ABSOLUTE TRUTHS?! Chuckling!
Long winded cuss, ain't ya? Seems like you have an annoying penchant for "I discovered", too.
A. Chromiuman either accepts absolute truths
B. Chromiuman either rejects absolute truths
C. ChromiuMan conditionally both accepts and rejects components of your opinions regarding "absolute truths"

No law of physics states that time MUST "flow" forward aside from what we know as entropy. Can I name a place in the universe in which your framework balks? Certainly. The gravitational field of a black hole essentially "stops" time. If you travel at the speed of light you essentially "stop" time. Effect can precede cause in certain QM circumstances.
The problems with placing all of your eggs into absolutist baskets - such as those of "universal truths", the "Law of non-contradiction" are myriad. You are attempting to superimpose a Law of logical argument to support what you might term "Laws of nature" - and those laws of nature as you observe and present them are philosophical (relative) and personally interpretive (relative).
Attempting to apply the law of non-contradiction as a proof against evolution is nothing short of asinine - and THAT is an Absolute Truth.
KAB

United States

#113739 Apr 9, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text> This is clearly a lie. JW's are not allowed to change their mind about the cult. It is in the list of rules for JWism that I have linked you to several times. You are no longer interested in anything that conflicts with your beliefs. In evidence, see your responses to factual information and to questions pointed to you.
<quoted text> Also a lie. Marksman is on your side and you have never challenged his madness. Why is that, do you think? So, when can we expect you to tell marksman he is wrong about Jesus=god, the trinity, the bible.....
<quoted text>
In what way is my approach flawed?
You lie
I call you on the lie.
Seems to be the way to go to me.
In terms of my profession, I am not your therapist. I don't WANT to be your therapist. I just note that, like most cult members, you are weak, you derive your self esteem from other people and you need to be told what to do to get through life.
I have had JW cult members as clients (as well as members of other religious cults) and their religious beliefs were not a major part of the conversations as they were not the issue.
Here, however, your religious beliefs block you from reality.
Marksman is not on my side. Long ago I challenged his approach and only occasionally begin to read any of his posts to see if he has changed. He hasn't. You should provide data (I know that's anathema to you) to confirm his nonsense, then if nothing changed, ignore him, like I now largely do you.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#113740 Apr 9, 2013
Infinite Force wrote:
<quoted text>
NO! You are WAY OUT of your element because you are challenging someone who thinks on a universal scale, THIS TRIUMPTS HYPOTHESIS AND THEORIES AND GOES DIRECTLY TO UNIVERSAL CONCEPTS WHICH IS KNOW IN SCIENCE AS SCIENTIFIC LAWS! You gotta love those absolute truths!
<quoted text>
"Nobel Prize Awarded to Two Quantum Physicists"
“Einstein himself hated this idea, but he was wrong on this one”.
>>>> http://bigthink.com/dr-kakus-universe/nobel-p...
Your link VS my link on evidence that validates the fastest one can travel is faster than the speed of light that Einstein proposed.
Applying the law of non-contradiction to eternity I now formulate the fastest speed something can travel is at an INFINITE (Unquantifiable and immeasurable) SPEED! Infinite speed travel is known as INSTANEOUS TRAVEL!
Evidence that validates what I speak of on the quantum mechanics level states that electrons can be at two places at the same time. It appears this way because it’s traveling at an INFINITE (unquantifiable and immeasurable) SPEED or instantaneous travel where it appears to the observer that it is at two places at one.
_________
It has also been noted in the field of ufology that ufos have been observed materializing and dematerializing instantaneously at two different points where the ufo appear to be at two places at one time.
“SIRIUS is one of the most significant films of our time. Produced by Dr. Steven Greer (founder of the worldwide Disclosure Movement and the Center for the Study of Extraterrestrial Intelligence) and Emmy award-winning filmmaker Amardeep Kaleka of Neverending Light Productions, this film is a broadcast of TRUTH: we are not alone in the Cosmos...and WE ARE NOT ALONE - HERE ON EARTH. The Earth has been visited by advanced Inter-Stellar Civilizations that can travel through other dimensions faster than the speed of light. What we have learned from them about energy propulsion can bring us to a new era, but those in power have suppressed this information in order to keep us at their mercy. And now it's time for ALL to know”.
>>>> http://www.disclosureproject.org/

Delusional disorder - Grandiose type
DSM IV-TR Code: 297.1

We really need to get him and marksman together.

“What, me worry?”

Since: Mar 09

I'm a racist caricature!

#113741 Apr 9, 2013
Infinite Force wrote:
<quoted text>
Constant means never changing information to an opposite!
Variable means information growing and never violating the law of non-contradiction!
The law of non-contradiction is FLAWLESS!
You make shit up on a daily basis, none of which has any connection to demonstrable reality, and because you are convinced by your own cockamamie bullshit, everything that contradicts you must be wrong, which means reality is wrong.

Have you ever been hospitalized against your will?

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#113742 Apr 9, 2013
Infinite Force wrote:
<quoted text>
Constant means never changing information to an opposite!
Variable means information growing and never violating the law of non-contradiction!
The law of non-contradiction is FLAWLESS!
On the other hand, your attempted cross-application of the law of non-contradiction is fatally flawed.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#113743 Apr 9, 2013
Infinite Force wrote:
<quoted text>
Constant means never changing information to an opposite!
Variable means information growing and never violating the law of non-contradiction!
The law of non-contradiction is FLAWLESS!

Except that it is easily refuted.

It is also meaningless since true opposites seldom exist.

The big bang did create matter and anti-matter, that is another contradiction for you.

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