It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the ...

It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the facts in evolution debate

There are 154622 comments on the Asheville Citizen-Times story from Mar 15, 2009, titled It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the facts in evolution debate. In it, Asheville Citizen-Times reports that:

I would like to respond to the letter 'Recent letter offered no examples of Darwinian disingenuousness,' . He responds to an article with, 'He says evolution is 'so riddled with holes,' yet fails to provide a ...

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Asheville Citizen-Times.

“Darwin was right..of course.”

Level 9

Since: Jun 11

Evolution is true.....

#110857 Feb 22, 2013
marksman11 wrote:
<quoted text>First, you are being dishonest...you said..
"The Neanderthal genome was sequenced a few years ago and it was sufficiently different from humans that they were called non-human."
I read your whole link, more than once, and it askes the question, "Where Neanderthals Human?" and it never answers it's own question. It says they can interbreed....etc. So for you to claim that this site says the are not human is dishonest, and I will apologize if you can show me where it says they were non-human.<quoted text>You're kidding, right?<quoted text>How can you honestly say that when you can't even define what evolved that made non-humans...human!!! Genesis is far from being toast. It is more accurate than any biology text book I've seen.As far as Exodus and Joshua, you're going to have to provide some examples. I suspect you are equally wrong about them.<quoted text>We may be backwards, but the best explanations for what we observe are on our side!!!
You write:
First, you are being dishonest...you said..

"The Neanderthal genome was sequenced a few years ago and it was sufficiently different from humans that they were called non-human."

“I read your whole link, more than once, and it asks the question, "Where Neanderthals Human?" and it never answers its own question. It says they can interbreed....etc. So for you to claim that this site says they are not human is dishonest, and I will apologize if you can show me where it says they were non-human.”

OK see below:
“It's clearly different from the genome of any human alive today, sprinkled with many distinctive mutations.”

That’s a quote from the cited PBS site. That quote IS saying that the Neanderthals were NOT human. Would you agree? Would you agree that the sentence answers the question of “Were the Neanderthals human?

The fact that we can and did interbreed with them tells us that we both came from a common ancestor, which also tells us we would have been able to breed with the common ancestor, and that common ancestor goes back 800,000 years.

Also to be considered because of the fact that we could breed with them and produce viable, fertile offspring, that means we ARE related to those ‘Homo’ species that preceded us and them (Neanderthals).

Go to your closest college and get in touch with a evolutionary biologist, or do some further searching on the internet if you don’t believe me.

You’re not believing my statement that the evidence from science is closing in on you is moot. Your position as a YEC is under attack and losing. You may not see it, but I can easily observe it by keeping up with science.

You say:
“How can you honestly say that when you can't even define what evolved that made non-humans...human!!! Genesis is far from being toast. It is more accurate than any biology text book I've seen. As far as Exodus and Joshua, you're going to have to provide some examples. I suspect you are equally wrong about them.”

It’s “more accurate than any biology book” you say. I don’t know about that, but DNA, archaeology, Paleontology, geology, and other ‘logy’ sciences are definitely proving it wrong.

Strong circumstantial evidence says that Adam and Eve never existed; the ‘Flood of Noah’ never happened, the ‘Tower of Babel’ never happened, Moses did not write the Pentateuch, 2 million+ Hebrews were never slaves in Egypt, The Exodus of 2 million plus Hebrews across the Sinai desert never happened, and Joshua never captured all of those cities (except, perhaps 1 of them).

The evidence is SO strong and from SO many various sources that one needs to be blind to not see and understand it.

So, I say what I wrote earlier stands.
KAB

Wilson, NC

#110858 Feb 22, 2013
MAAT wrote:
<quoted text>
No that's just one kind of translation interlineairy.
That does not constitute a thesis.
I've worked my way back thru all of your posts to the beginning of February, which is way past the dividing of the waters interchange, and found no "waters" thesis.
KAB

Wilson, NC

#110859 Feb 22, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
This is a lie.
http://www.spotlightministries.org.uk/jwbapti...
For one thing to be baptized into the JW cult one must sign off (correctly answer 80 questions) on JW doctrine and dogma, much of which based on scriptural distortions.
http://dciscorp.com/qwotes/originalorganized....
The questions are for the satisfaction of the individual as an aid in examining one's readiness for baptism, and they don't have to be answered correctly.

Have you considered getting info from the horses mouth rather than a horses ass?
KAB

Wilson, NC

#110860 Feb 22, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
YES! That is EXACTLY what we thought.
So now you know you were wrong which blows your hypothesis about my response.
KAB

Wilson, NC

#110861 Feb 22, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
As much as I like disagreeing with you, you are mostly correct about the above. The bible is not the truth itself but merely a launching pad to get to that truth, which cannot be contained in human words.
But, in point of fact, there are no truth based Christian religions anymore. The last real Christian probably died 1500 years ago.
Bible researchers are learning more and more about the truth behind the texts of the bible. maybe someday we will be able to claim that original Christianity. The Christianity we know today are heirs of the one that killed off the original Christianity and the beliefs of Jesus and his direct followers. Pauline cults are all that remain.
It's encouraging that we may have uncovered some common ground.
However, a lot, perhaps not all, of truth is and can be contained in human words. The Bible is a considerable body of such. The Bible certainly assures us that there would be a great apostasy (2 Thessalonians 2:1-12). Don't be too sure tho that there are no true Christians today. Clearly tho, even you seem to recognize that you need to be watching for something off the beaten path. Can you not think of any religions not well received by society in general? Finally, you'd have to clarify what you mean by Pauline cult before I could render an appropriate response to that point.
KAB

Wilson, NC

#110862 Feb 22, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually, I though it a good analogy.
maybe you just don't want to see it.
Then please explain the logic of it to the class. Learning by example is one of the best methods. So enlighten us by disecting the logic there, explaining its application phrase by phrase.
KAB

Wilson, NC

#110863 Feb 22, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Your position did not hold up. Case closed for those of us in touch with reality.
Hey, is that an avoidance conga line I perceive forming? Anyone else want to join?
KAB

Wilson, NC

#110864 Feb 22, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
You make no sense. The Bible contends that Pi = 3 and therefore Genesis is irrefutable? Again and still, the onus is on one who BELIEVES in the Pentateuch to substantiate its validity. You're up Ace - time to swing wildly and triumphantly proclaim "Crack! Its outta here!" as the wind rustles past the whiffle bat.
Think logically and rationally about this. The most reasonable proposition regarding a sizable document which is purported to be error free is to confirm one error in it. I've done that with the Quran for example. Now you do it for the Pentateuch. I would do it myself, but I don't know of any errors, and neither do you or you'd have one on here in a heartbeat!
KAB

Wilson, NC

#110865 Feb 22, 2013
LowellGuy wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, shit. I thought it was a disambiguation. My apologies. I was wrong.
Now, that's how this is done when there's evidence of one's error. Evidence is data that is demonstrable and serves to support or refute a claim.
It's amazing, though, that absolutely everything you say is 100% demonstrably true. Neat.
I too make mistakes. The difference may be that I work very hard to avoid them, and consequently very consistently succeed.

““You must not lose faith ”

Level 5

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#110867 Feb 23, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
I've worked my way back thru all of your posts to the beginning of February, which is way past the dividing of the waters interchange, and found no "waters" thesis.
I know you tried.
I posted it again.
This page or the former page.
I wrote WATER twice so you would notice even though it was not directly posted to you.
If i had not done that now, i cold have simply scrolled to it.
Now i have to repost, because you do not read post that are not directed to you.

““You must not lose faith ”

Level 5

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#110868 Feb 23, 2013

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#110869 Feb 23, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
The questions are for the satisfaction of the individual as an aid in examining one's readiness for baptism, and they don't have to be answered correctly.
Have you considered getting info from the horses mouth rather than a horses ass?

Yes, that is why I check objective references rather than just listen to you.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#110870 Feb 23, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
So now you know you were wrong which blows your hypothesis about my response.

You are insane.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#110871 Feb 23, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
It's encouraging that we may have uncovered some common ground.
However, a lot, perhaps not all, of truth is and can be contained in human words. The Bible is a considerable body of such. The Bible certainly assures us that there would be a great apostasy (2 Thessalonians 2:1-12). Don't be too sure tho that there are no true Christians today. Clearly tho, even you seem to recognize that you need to be watching for something off the beaten path. Can you not think of any religions not well received by society in general? Finally, you'd have to clarify what you mean by Pauline cult before I could render an appropriate response to that point.

Paul was rejected by Jesus' followers. He was the first Christian heretic (who John(?) labels 'false prophet'. All followers who acknowledge Paul are, by definition, heretics.

There are many religions not well received by society. Muslims, Jews, ATHEISTS, SDAs, Christian Scientists, Mormans,.....

As to the JW cult you guys DO get a few things right:
- denial of the Trinity
- denial of deity of Christ
- denial of physical resurrection.


You do down hill fast from there, however.

Things you get wrong are legion:
- Mistranslations of many words including YHWH
- revisionist history (including JW history)
- false prophecies
- what happens after death (more the inconsistency than the dogma)
- 144,000.... enough said.
- Whole nonsense about immortal vs. everlasting life (yes, I have read the nonsense, it is guano crazy).
- New World Translation (again enough said).

many, many, many more.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#110872 Feb 23, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey, is that an avoidance conga line I perceive forming? Anyone else want to join?

Short line. You are the only one in it.

And it looks more like the 'bunny hop'

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#110873 Feb 23, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Think logically and rationally about this. The most reasonable proposition regarding a sizable document which is purported to be error free is to confirm one error in it. I've done that with the Quran for example. Now you do it for the Pentateuch. I would do it myself, but I don't know of any errors, and neither do you or you'd have one on here in a heartbeat!

The Koran is EXACTLY as "without error" as the bible. Muslims rationalizations for the truth of the Koran are no wilder than what many Christians pose as true. And there are fewer known errors in the Koran as compared to the bible.

I prefer to be a rational Christian and will acknowledge the errors, inaccuracies, contradictions of the bible (many of which disappear once literalism is out of the picture). It is a book and was written by men. How can anyone expect it to be perfect.

WHY would any rational person even EXPECT it to be perfect?

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#110874 Feb 23, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
I too make mistakes. The difference may be that I work very hard to avoid them, and consequently very consistently succeed.

???? Giving you the benefit of the doubt, I am forced, based on what I have observed here, to assume you are joking.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#110875 Feb 23, 2013
marksman11 wrote:
<quoted text>Both and go buy some JOHN Cowen.

Well, he is a fellow Hoosier, but over Beethoven and Mozart? No.

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#110876 Feb 23, 2013
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Think logically and rationally about this. The most reasonable proposition regarding a sizable document which is purported to be error free is to confirm one error in it. I've done that with the Quran for example. Now you do it for the Pentateuch. I would do it myself, but I don't know of any errors, and neither do you or you'd have one on here in a heartbeat!
http://www.topix.com/forum/news/evolution/TFA...

Feigning Alzheimer's is not a spiritual principle, KAB.
marksman11

Asheville, NC

#110877 Feb 23, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
You make no sense. The Bible contends that Pi = 3 and therefore Genesis is irrefutable?
Pi is not mentioned one single time in the bible. That is a lie.

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