It's the Darwin crowd that lacks the facts in evolution debate

Full story: Asheville Citizen-Times

I would like to respond to the letter 'Recent letter offered no examples of Darwinian disingenuousness,' . He responds to an article with, 'He says evolution is 'so riddled with holes,' yet fails to provide a ...

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“I have upset the hand of god”

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#107018
Jan 11, 2013
 
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
I have answered a multitude of questions and you fruit loops never answer mine.
Pyura chilensis is an invertebrate sea animal that resembles a mass of organs inside a rock. They often live in dense aggregations of population in the intertidal and subtidal coast of Chile and Peru. Similar in appearance to a marine rock structure, it is a filter feeder and eats by sucking in water rich in organic matter and filtering out microorganisms.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyura_chilensis
The answer is it is NOT a rock. WOW, you hero, how difficult was that? Now you know.
Now piss off and answer my question.
What reptilian traits does Ichthyosaurus have?
I didn't ask a question. I made an assertion. Once again Maz shows us her baffling ability to completely fail to understand and comprehend what she reads.

I did answer your question. Others have answered your question. Evolution has given you the ultimate answer to your question. It is never enough. We give and we give and we give and you just take and want more. I don't know if I can go on with this relationship Maz. I think we need to see a couples counselor. I know Evolution thinks so and I believe the others will agree.

“That's just MY opinion...”

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#107019
Jan 11, 2013
 
Thomas Robertson wrote:
Gee! Wow! Zowie!
Madrone, how did you know MazHere wouldn't listen?
Since you posted this message, MazHere has misinterpreted one message, ignored all the others, and repeated one of her earlier posts for the umpteenth time.
You must be a prophet! A seer! A revelator!
Tell us where you live, so we can all bring you gold, myrrh, and frankincense!
<blush> I enjoy occasional periods of lucidity.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

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#107020
Jan 11, 2013
 

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KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Most likely is not definite, right? Hey, 12 bison(?) managed it, and they weren't even thinking about it!
Data?

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Everett, WA

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#107021
Jan 11, 2013
 
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
Well with enough whipping you finally had a go for once. Good!
Ok ... "HAD two pairs of limbs" does not distinguish Ichthyosaurus from cetacia because whales are supposedly tetrapods and also come from 4 limbed tetrapods. So this does not appear to be a reptilian trait anymore than cetacean have 4 'legs'.
As for digit like bones in flippers I am not sure what they are talking about. Is it not the digits in whale flippers that evos are always going on about.
Cetaceans (whales, dolphins, and porpoises) have a soft tissue flipper that encases most of the forelimb, and elongated digits with an increased number of phalanges (hyperphalangy).
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17516431
The shoulder blades do appear to be different to current cetaceans from a quick look but the resulting pectoral arch resembles much that of the mammalian orni-thorhynchus.
Ichthyosaurus are varied and some have a single temporal fenestra like mammals and cetacean does. The pair of fenestra are a reptilian hallmark but a single one is not.
http://hydrodictyon.eeb.uconn.edu/people/schw...
These traits do not appear to make Ichthyosaurus any more reptilian than and any other cetacean.
Given warm bloodedness, live birth, blow hole, dorsel fin, looks like a porpoise etc I don't think Ichthyosaurus is any more reptilian than cetacean.
Can you or some evo please further clarify why these traits are seen as identifying these many varieties of Ichthyosaurus as being all reptilian as opposed to some being mammalian which some certainly appear to be?
And you continue to ignore the one difference that shows up in the one difference that has always been between reptiles and mammals. I see you skipped over my quote from the evolution of mammals that shows that reptile ears and reptile ear bones, which I have mentioned more than once, are different from mammal ears and mammal ear and jaw bones.

We had a couple of bones from our jaw change into ear bones long long ago in our past. That is all mammals. Including cetaceans. If the head, and especially the jaw area is well preserved a paleontologist can tell a mammal from a reptile at a glance.

It would take a "genius" like Maz to try to claim that ichthyosaurus is not a reptile.
KAB

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#107022
Jan 11, 2013
 

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The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean the ones who were fried by the flood? Okay, let's pretend there was no frying and we have three breeding couple's left. Eventually the population dies of cancer due to tons and tons of in-the-fam nookienook and super-accelerated mutation rates. Hence why there's no-one left here to talk about the flood, since the flood really did happen. Really.
What?! No confirming data!?(Actually, no data at all). Why am I not surprised since you seem to thrive in a fairy tale world? Hmm, where have I seen that declaration before?
KAB

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#107023
Jan 11, 2013
 

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ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL! Are you now cutting and pasting from posts TO you?
At least in this direction the posts are demonstrably valid.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

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#107024
Jan 11, 2013
 

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KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Most likely is not definite, right? Hey, 12 bison(?) managed it, and they weren't even thinking about it!
What?! No confirming data!?(Actually, no data at all). Why am I not surprised since you seem to thrive in a fairy tale world? Hmm, where have I seen that declaration before?
KAB

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#107025
Jan 11, 2013
 

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MIDutch wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, please. REAL scientific and historical research, data, information is EASILY found here in the information age. Just because YOU ignore, reject, dismiss, disparage and LIE about it all doesn't mean anyone other than you has faulty reasoning.
Heck, if you are so sure of your "data" why are you posting it here on an internet forum. Take it out into the wide world and use it to make some MONEY for yourself.
My guess, you won't because 1) you are too much of a coward and 2) the ONLY people who would pay you for it are ones who are as deluded as you are. Utter Cowturd, Jim the Failed Carpet Layer, Malarkeyman11, Shoobert, etc. come to mind. "Good creation scientists" are soooo hard to find.[/sarcasm]
You nailed it! Overwhelmingly most are not inclined to pay for what they don't want to know (2 Timothy 4:3,4; Matthew 7:13,14)

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Wahroonga, Australia

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#107026
Jan 11, 2013
 
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
Well with enough whipping you finally had a go for once. Good!
Ok ... "HAD two pairs of limbs" does not distinguish Ichthyosaurus from cetacia because whales are supposedly tetrapods and also come from 4 limbed tetrapods. So this does not appear to be a reptilian trait anymore than cetacean have 4 'legs'.
As for digit like bones in flippers I am not sure what they are talking about. Is it not the digits in whale flippers that evos are always going on about.
Cetaceans (whales, dolphins, and porpoises) have a soft tissue flipper that encases most of the forelimb, and elongated digits with an increased number of phalanges (hyperphalangy).
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17516431
The shoulder blades do appear to be different to current cetaceans from a quick look but the resulting pectoral arch resembles much that of the mammalian orni-thorhynchus.
Ichthyosaurus are varied and some have a single temporal fenestra like mammals and cetacean does. The pair of fenestra are a reptilian hallmark but a single one is not.
http://hydrodictyon.eeb.uconn.edu/people/schw...
These traits do not appear to make Ichthyosaurus any more reptilian than and any other cetacean.
Given warm bloodedness, live birth, blow hole, dorsel fin, looks like a porpoise etc I don't think Ichthyosaurus is any more reptilian than cetacean.
Can you or some evo please further clarify why these traits are seen as identifying these many varieties of Ichthyosaurus as being all reptilian as opposed to some being mammalian which some certainly appear to be?
Since this post all I see is evotard waffle and gibberish around why I am not responding to other strolls down the garden path. That is is course apart from the fact that every ridicule has already been spoken to.

If you evotards wanted to demonstrate your whale ancestry and I kept shoving abiogenesis up your butts then you would suggest I was an evading idiot. Likewise that is what you all look like to me. Pompous evading idiots and pretenders.

So Dan and Kong finally got their act together and now because I can challenge these so called reptilian traits all you evos have once again deteriorated into babbling evotards. I love it.

This is great to see and what I expected.

Cetacea is dated 245mya in ichthyosaurus and evos cannot sustainf these mythical reptilian traits. Michagan whale fossils were found in strata dated to 290myo that were contaminated and could not reliably be carbon dated.

The other fact that appears to be coming forth and being substatiated as we speak is my claim that evolutionists are clueless.

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Taizhou, China

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#107027
Jan 11, 2013
 
marksman11 wrote:
HAHAHA...you don't even know emperically that the earth is a million years old. You weren't there to observe the origin of life, and all you do is spout what other have told you, that also weren't there and don't know.

You mean Creationists were there to witness the creation of Adam and Eve?

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#107028
Jan 11, 2013
 
DanFromSmithville wrote:
<quoted text>I didn't ask a question. I made an assertion. Once again Maz shows us her baffling ability to completely fail to understand and comprehend what she reads.
I did answer your question. Others have answered your question. Evolution has given you the ultimate answer to your question. It is never enough. We give and we give and we give and you just take and want more. I don't know if I can go on with this relationship Maz. I think we need to see a couples counselor. I know Evolution thinks so and I believe the others will agree.
Are you still choking on your rock critters, you hero?

I have shown that the so called reptilian traits of Ichthyosaurus are ficticious and no more reptilian than other cetaceans. The idea is to respond with scientific data like Kong has been and you tried once until you turned to jelly.

Why fall to pieces now you lot? Must be because you are all apes without the ability to make meaning of the world. Evos are a better demonstration of devolution than any fossil.

““You must not lose faith ”

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#107029
Jan 11, 2013
 
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
Since this post all I see is evotard waffle and gibberish around why I am not responding to other strolls down the garden path. That is is course apart from the fact that every ridicule has already been spoken to.
If you evotards wanted to demonstrate your whale ancestry and I kept shoving abiogenesis up your butts then you would suggest I was an evading idiot. Likewise that is what you all look like to me. Pompous evading idiots and pretenders.
So Dan and Kong finally got their act together and now because I can challenge these so called reptilian traits all you evos have once again deteriorated into babbling evotards. I love it.
This is great to see and what I expected.
Cetacea is dated 245mya in ichthyosaurus and evos cannot sustainf these mythical reptilian traits. Michagan whale fossils were found in strata dated to 290myo that were contaminated and could not reliably be carbon dated.
The other fact that appears to be coming forth and being substatiated as we speak is my claim that evolutionists are clueless.
C14 reliable upto 50,000 years.
Anything older would request a different method.
Stone as in fossilized bone does not do for carbon-dating.

So you make a lot of blabla out of unrelated facts and methods.
So are you clueless or glueless?

effin painfull.

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#107030
Jan 11, 2013
 
MazHere wrote:
Must be because you are all apes without the ability to make meaning of the world. Evos are a better demonstration of devolution than any fossil.
Yup, Evolutionists are descended from an ape-like animal,
but Creationists were created in God's image.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

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#107031
Jan 11, 2013
 
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
Since this post all I see is evotard waffle and gibberish around why I am not responding to other strolls down the garden path. That is is course apart from the fact that every ridicule has already been spoken to.
http://www.youtube.com/watch...

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#107032
Jan 11, 2013
 

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KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
You nailed it! Overwhelmingly most are not inclined to pay for what they don't want to know (2 Timothy 4:3,4; Matthew 7:13,14)
KAB, I have got to say that when your simple two liners attract so much 'judged' ridicule from these evos such as this post has, I know you are hitting nerves that make evos dance like puppets. Keep up the good work!

““You must not lose faith ”

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#107033
Jan 11, 2013
 
KAB wrote:
<quoted text>
Most likely is not definite, right? Hey, 12 bison(?) managed it, and they weren't even thinking about it!
Bison ?...you are sure you do not mean wisents?
This is going to lead to another bottleneck discussion.

So let's simply ask you for the data on the 12 os that managed to multiply and thrive without heading for the precipice of another bottleneck.

““You must not lose faith ”

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#107034
Jan 11, 2013
 
http://www.topix.com/forum/news/evolution/TFA...

hmmm!
Nice to see that you do not spare the rod when it comes to your own productions.

Dataless KAB was bad, but now we reach a completely different level of weird.
KAB

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#107035
Jan 11, 2013
 
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Data?
"Wisent, also called European bison (Bison bonasus), faced extinction in the early 20th century. The animals living today are all descended from 12 individuals and they have extremely low genetic variation, which may be beginning to affect the reproductive ability of bulls (Luenser et al., 2005)."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_bottl...
KAB

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#107036
Jan 11, 2013
 
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
What?! No confirming data!?(Actually, no data at all). Why am I not surprised since you seem to thrive in a fairy tale world? Hmm, where have I seen that declaration before?
Patience,

"Wisent, also called European bison (Bison bonasus), faced extinction in the early 20th century. The animals living today are all descended from 12 individuals and they have extremely low genetic variation, which may be beginning to affect the reproductive ability of bulls (Luenser et al., 2005)."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_bottl ...

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#107037
Jan 11, 2013
 
MAAT wrote:
<quoted text>
C14 reliable upto 50,000 years.
Anything older would request a different method.
Stone as in fossilized bone does not do for carbon-dating.
So you make a lot of blabla out of unrelated facts and methods.
So are you clueless or glueless?
effin painfull.
Now listen. I have already scalded you kids about jumping all over the place like a mad woman.

We are not talking about dating, although we already have over the past weeks and Kong dropped out and the rest tuned to evotards and I could get no more sense out of what was left eg samuim146, inconsistent decay rates etc. We are not talking about God or abiogenesis. We are talking about what CAN be scientifically demonstrated with some hint of credibility.

We are doing cetacea. I am presenting my evidence to support my claim that the fossil evidence better supports a creationist paradigm than an evolutionary one.

Now I know most of you evotards are here to poke fun at creos. That is your life and a reflection of how miserable it is. That is your business. I am here to get to the point. I love to poke fun at you guys too but I am actually here to get to the point of the thread topic, as strange and alien as that may sound to some of you.

So get with the program or shut up. If you lot want to chase your tails fine. Then go talk to other evos as they do that well as you can see. I am into science and how that supports our philosophies.

The reptilian traits suppposedly attributed to Ichthyosaurus are no more reptilian than those on cetacean. Ichy is a cetacean placental mammal. Why is that statement wrong?

Ignorant responses, such as yours, are evidence of a sort as well, because they demonstrate the other fact I am trying to establish which is evos are factless as well as clueless.

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