Should evolution be taught in high sc...

Should evolution be taught in high school?

There are 179706 comments on the www.scientificblogging.com story from Feb 24, 2008, titled Should evolution be taught in high school?. In it, www.scientificblogging.com reports that:

Microbiologist Carl Woese is well known as an iconoclast. At 79 years of age, Woese is still shaking things up. Most recently, he stated in an interview with Wired that...

"My feeling is that evolution shouldn't be taught at the lower grades. You don't teach quantum mechanics in the grade schools. One has to be quite educated to work with these concepts; what they pass on as evolution in high schools is nothing but repetitious tripe that teachers don't understand."

Join the discussion below, or Read more at www.scientificblogging.com.

“Dinosaurs survived the flood!”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

Jesus probably rode dinosaurs!

#175609 Jun 21, 2014
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
No one cuts off noses fro culture or religion. It was a few isolated incidents done by the taliban involving a young girl(s) and marriage (I believe she did not want the marriage or tried to leave it). It was done out of pure meanness.
<quoted text>
circumcision
males for religious beliefs or for personal preferences possibly driven by societal norms
females for a cultural ritual by ethnic groups; an ethnic marker, rooted in gender inequality, ideas about purity, modesty and aesthetics, and attempts to control women's sexuality; It is supported by both women and men in countries that practise it, particularly by the women, who see it as a source of honour and authority, and an essential part of raising a daughter well.
foot binding for a means of displaying status (women from wealthy families who did not need them to work could afford to have their feet bound) and was correspondingly adopted as a symbol of beauty
neck rings for indicator of wealth and status, an ideal of beauty -an elongated neck
lip rings- I think you meant lip plate for a sign of social or economical importance in some tribes
lip rings here in the US for a social statement, to fit in socially with certain groups
All of these can be found on wiki (or elsewhere if you prefer). Not everything is tied to religion as you seem to think.
I stated clearly in my post that I didn't consider all mutilation tied to religious reasons, but to say it isn't or that it is isolated is incorrect.

“Ask Randy From Ballwin”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

He Is A Sock Know It All

#175610 Jun 21, 2014
DanFromSmithville wrote:
<quoted text>I stated clearly in my post that I didn't consider all mutilation tied to religious reasons, but to say it isn't or that it is isolated is incorrect.
If you noticed in my statements I was very clear to point out "cutting off noses" when I referred to "isolated incidents".

“Dinosaurs survived the flood!”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

Jesus probably rode dinosaurs!

#175611 Jun 21, 2014
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
If you noticed in my statements I was very clear to point out "cutting off noses" when I referred to "isolated incidents".
I agree you were clear that you meant that. I don't know if it is an isolated incident but I recognize that it could be. It is also an incident that occurs in a part of the world where such things occur largely for religious reasons. Again, I admit, I don't know the original point of this particular discussion and am basing my answer on where I did pick up reading and the information of which I am aware.

I am not disputing the fact that mutilation occurs for other reasons as well.

“Ask Randy From Ballwin”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

He Is A Sock Know It All

#175612 Jun 21, 2014
DanFromSmithville wrote:
<quoted text>I agree you were clear that you meant that. I don't know if it is an isolated incident but I recognize that it could be. It is also an incident that occurs in a part of the world where such things occur largely for religious reasons. Again, I admit, I don't know the original point of this particular discussion and am basing my answer on where I did pick up reading and the information of which I am aware.
I am not disputing the fact that mutilation occurs for other reasons as well.
"I don't know the original point of this particular discussion"

I picked it up at this point.
http://www.topix.com/forum/news/evolution/TCT...

“Ask Randy From Ballwin”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

He Is A Sock Know It All

#175613 Jun 21, 2014
To change the subject. This has to be the stupid thing I have ever seen. School students tuaght a song singing praise to Obama! Are you freaking kidding me?

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php...

I used the Facebook link for it is clearer than all (there are many) on youtube.
Ima Bach

Knoxville, TN

#175614 Jun 21, 2014
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Ken & Co will be quite surprised to hear they are evil. And will likely level the exact same charge at you. Quite a quandary, huh?
Don't know who Ken and Co are. But no quandary here. You see the belief that there is an all-knowing, all-powerful Creator of the universe is very liberating. I don't have to concern myself with what you think of me or what "Ken and Co" think of me. And, it is not my place to judge them or you.
None of us are even close to being perfect, and we all make many of the same mistakes in life. Lots could be said and questioned about why some seem to have it easier than others...but, if you think about it, many who have faced the greatest trials and hardship have turned out to be the most compassionate and giving. There are as many stories and as many reasons and as many excuses as there are humans who have ever lived.
Are you perfect? If not, why do you judge me so harshly?
Ima Bach

Knoxville, TN

#175615 Jun 21, 2014
DanFromSmithville wrote:
<quoted text>I stated clearly in my post that I didn't consider all mutilation tied to religious reasons, but to say it isn't or that it is isolated is incorrect.
Torture and terror are evil! The only excuse you people have to disrespect a God you say you don't believe in is to question how a loving God could be so harsh when dealing with evil people. And then you turn right around and say a Good and Loving God would not have dealt with evil by wiping out the source of evil .
Ima Bach

Knoxville, TN

#175616 Jun 21, 2014
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
He asked you why you assumed there had to be a purpose. Something yo really did not address.
<quoted text>
Who said that? I didn't.
<quoted text>
Ah, the old blaspheme routine. Unforgivable sin and all that stuff. I've got news for you, darlin, not praying is not blasphemy. Look it up. You don't get to invent sins.
<quoted text>
Yeah, yeah. Convenient, isn't it?
<quoted text>
Know it quite well. Recited it thousands of times in school.
<quoted text>
Uh-huh. Whatever you say.
Seems you are becoming paranoid, Mike. Where in the world would you find praying to be blasphemy in anything I said. You said you had prayed sometime in your life. I, personally respect your honesty, and I have yet to determine whether or not you consider yourself a believer.
My intentions here are not to offend or agitate. I just think our young people have the right to decide for themselves about what or who they want to make the top priority in their lives. Whether you believe we evolved or were created, you decided for yourself. Why would you not want your children to do the same?

“Dinosaurs survived the flood!”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

Jesus probably rode dinosaurs!

#175617 Jun 21, 2014
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
"I don't know the original point of this particular discussion"
I picked it up at this point.
http://www.topix.com/forum/news/evolution/TCT...
Thanks. It looks like entered the topic near the beginning. You may be right that as a norm, nose cropping may not be the mutilation of choice, but mutilation or death based on religious reasons are not uncommon in that area of the world.

And still I recognize that it occurs for other reasons. The basic reason may be ignorance, superstition and the prevalence in male dominated societies. Females are usually, but not exclusively, the recipients.
Ima Bach

Knoxville, TN

#175618 Jun 21, 2014
I believe Jesus called the Pharisees ( the most " religious") hypocrites. They went around boasting about all the " religious" things they had done, and praying in public to be seen.
God honored the prayer of the humble man who recognized he was a sinner in need of a savior.

“Dinosaurs survived the flood!”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

Jesus probably rode dinosaurs!

#175619 Jun 21, 2014
Ima Bach wrote:
<quoted text>
Torture and terror are evil! The only excuse you people have to disrespect a God you say you don't believe in is to question how a loving God could be so harsh when dealing with evil people. And then you turn right around and say a Good and Loving God would not have dealt with evil by wiping out the source of evil .
I haven't said whether I believe or not. At least lately. You are just assuming because you have been taught propaganda that says anyone accepting the theory of evolution is an evil atheist.

I would say that more evil has been done in the name of religion than almost any other cause.

Maybe not accepting the evidence of the world that we live in is evil against God. But don't let that interfere with your ride on a tall horse.

“Dinosaurs survived the flood!”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

Jesus probably rode dinosaurs!

#175620 Jun 21, 2014
Ima Bach wrote:
<quoted text>
Seems you are becoming paranoid, Mike. Where in the world would you find praying to be blasphemy in anything I said. You said you had prayed sometime in your life. I, personally respect your honesty, and I have yet to determine whether or not you consider yourself a believer.
My intentions here are not to offend or agitate. I just think our young people have the right to decide for themselves about what or who they want to make the top priority in their lives. Whether you believe we evolved or were created, you decided for yourself. Why would you not want your children to do the same?
His personal religious beliefs don't matter anymore than yours do in regard to the science.

No one is saying that children shouldn't be allowed to learn to choose for themselves, but you are wrong in considering science the opposite choice for your belief. You also fail to consider that the Constitution of the country precludes you from forcing your religious views on those children either unless they are your own and it isn't through government support.

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#175621 Jun 22, 2014
One way or another wrote:
One last time children, when your eyes focused to see things Foreway that means we are sitting out to whatever were looking at. However if you choose to believe the fairytales that science is telling about seeing back in time, that's your choice.
One last time, Jim. An opportunity to really learn something. To see some light. To enjoy the pleasure of understanding something new.

https://www.khanacademy.org/science/physics/w...

This explains how the eye or a camera turns incoming light into a meaningful image. I showed it to you before and you seemed to get fixated on the fact that he used the word ray instead of photon. Can you ignore that for the time being and just understand the principle?

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#175622 Jun 22, 2014
Ima Bach wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, since I have made that choice, I evidently do. If my believing in the God of the Bible gives me the answers I seek that Science has not and cannot answer, why do you care.
Nobody minds that. Its when you feel the need to use the same Bible to deny answers that science can and has answered, that the problems begin.

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#175623 Jun 22, 2014
Ima Bach wrote:
<quoted text>
Torture and terror are evil! The only excuse you people have to disrespect a God you say you don't believe in is to question how a loving God could be so harsh when dealing with evil people. And then you turn right around and say a Good and Loving God would not have dealt with evil by wiping out the source of evil .
You will recall that God supposedly wiped out all the evil people in the Flood...Christians will say, well He created them, so that is His prerogative, "wiping out sources of evil". Cannot argue with that.

But in the case of the Midianites and the Amalekites, God did not smite them. He demanded that the Israelites, men, who were supposed to follow the Commandments not to murder and steal, to do it instead. "We were just following orders" did not work for the Nazis at Nuremberg and it does not work for the Israelites. Just imagine. If you were an Israelite foot soldier at the time, God did not tell you anything. Just a guy called Moses who claimed God was instructing him. What is the MORAL difference between that foot soldier's murderous actions and some foot soldier of Al Qaeda today, who also honestly believes his leaders are instructed by God to commit the atrocities they do?

No doubt you have invented or heard some contrived apologetics to explain this away. But it just won't work. Torture, terror, murder, theft...these things are as evil as you say, and a command that demanded these things of one group of men to another cannot come from a Good and Loving God. The Bible (and the Quran), are not God's Word, they are the fabrications of men. False paths. End of story.

“Ask Randy From Ballwin”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

He Is A Sock Know It All

#175624 Jun 22, 2014
One way or another wrote:
Oneway I propose a experiment to you. Go out tonight,at midnight out in the country away from all light. Look across a dark field and see what is there. What did you see? That is right, nothing but darkness. That is because there is no light reflecting off of anything coming to your eyes. See how that works? If you see out to things as you think you still should be able to see those trees across that field even with no light. Fact is we only see what the light brings to our eyes. End of story!
One way or another

United States

#175625 Jun 22, 2014
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
One last time, Jim. An opportunity to really learn something. To see some light. To enjoy the pleasure of understanding something new.
https://www.khanacademy.org/science/physics/w...
This explains how the eye or a camera turns incoming light into a meaningful image. I showed it to you before and you seemed to get fixated on the fact that he used the word ray instead of photon. Can you ignore that for the time being and just understand the principle?
I already read that. It shows nothing about any proof that pictures come to our eyes on light. Light merely illuminates anything, so that our eyes can focus out, to see any object.

Here's a test, in a totally dark room, have someone shine a flashlight in your eyes, what do you see? You see nothing, because the light will blind you.

Now turn around and you will see your silhouette on the wall, but you will not see any definition, because light does not carry pictures. We can only see what light illuminates.
Mugwump

Washington, UK

#175626 Jun 22, 2014
One way or another wrote:
<quoted text>
I already read that. It shows nothing about any proof that pictures come to our eyes on light. Light merely illuminates anything, so that our eyes can focus out, to see any object.
Here's a test, in a totally dark room, have someone shine a flashlight in your eyes, what do you see? You see nothing, because the light will blind you.
Now turn around and you will see your silhouette on the wall, but you will not see any definition, because light does not carry pictures. We can only see what light illuminates.
Now do the same experiment but put some stained glass (such as you see in churcha) in front of the of the flashlight

NOW what do you see on the wall.
One way or another

United States

#175627 Jun 22, 2014
Children seem not to realize the glasses transparent. Human beings are not, animals are not, plants. Are not, mountains are not.

In the pitch black of night, shine a light down on a flower that is in a four sided courtyard 10 feet away from the flower. Can you see the flower on the wall?

Since light scatters as science claims and brings pictures to the eyes, it should easily bring pictures of the flower to the walls, but it will not. Try it in your own backyard.
RR Mcbride

Aarhus, Denmark

#175628 Jun 22, 2014
Absolutely. But nothing school should be taught as fact not even evolution. The essence of education is creating a mindset that gives the student an ability to judge for themselves. Relating what they've learned to what they've experienced and draw their own conclusion.

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