Should evolution be taught in high school?

Feb 24, 2008 | Posted by: Cash | Full story: www.scientificblogging.com

Microbiologist Carl Woese is well known as an iconoclast. At 79 years of age, Woese is still shaking things up. Most recently, he stated in an interview with Wired that...

"My feeling is that evolution shouldn't be taught at the lower grades. You don't teach quantum mechanics in the grade schools. One has to be quite educated to work with these concepts; what they pass on as evolution in high schools is nothing but repetitious tripe that teachers don't understand."

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Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

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#127426
Apr 19, 2013
 
Hah, I read Urb's article and found this nice bit of nonsense at the end:

"Creation geologist Dr. Steve Austin studied the geological evidence, including the fault zone, the burn layer, the bitumen that erupted, and the city’s calamitous fall to its ruin."

Steve Austin is of course a joke in geological circles. Bitumen or asphalt is not a product of volcanic eruptions.

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Arlington, VA

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#127427
Apr 19, 2013
 

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Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Even the utter imbeciles at ICR say "might" have been found.
It is just another myth from your book of justso stories.
See if you can find a real scholar that makes this claim.
I guess you didn't understand what "The destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah is a certain fact in history" means. Does the author leave any doubt? No - of course not. How are these not real scholars? Or are you just a bitter liar? I knew this one would hit particularly hard for the gay-homosexuals as that is the reason they were destroyed and also the basis for law against Sodomy (Gross!).

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Everett, WA

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#127428
Apr 19, 2013
 
Urban Cowboy wrote:
<quoted text>
I guess you didn't understand what "The destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah is a certain fact in history" means. Does the author leave any doubt? No - of course not. How are these not real scholars? Or are you just a bitter liar? I knew this one would hit particularly hard for the gay-homosexuals as that is the reason they were destroyed and also the basis for law against Sodomy (Gross!).
What do you mean that the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah can be certain fact in history?

There are no reliable books that even mention the towns. What historians support these claims?

And Gays aren't the only ones that practice Sodomy. Lots of women like it in the backdoor. And technically fellatio is sodomy too. Don't tell me that you have never received a blow job, and if you haven't I almost feel sorry for you.

“I Am No One Else”

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Since: Apr 12

Seattle

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#127429
Apr 19, 2013
 
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>
Have you read all 200,000 articles?
How do you know they are full of "scientific evidence?"
Because nothing passes peer review, a requirement to get published, without it.

“I Am No One Else”

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Seattle

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#127430
Apr 19, 2013
 
Urban Cowboy wrote:
Sodom & Gomorrah found! This righteous judgement of sin and destruction of these cities actually happened and in addition to Biblical, has archaeological evidence to support it.
"The destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah is a certain fact in history. The Genesis account is in narrative form and is alluded to by several Old Testament writers. Jesus Himself obviously believed it and in fact was an eyewitness as the pre-incarnate Lord." (See Matthew 11:23-24; Mark 6:11; Luke 10:12 and 17:28-32.
http://www.icr.org/article/7312/
Nothing but conjecture.

“There is no Truth in Faith”

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#127431
Apr 19, 2013
 
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
I will see if I can find some that show the treadmill was not running downhill. I don't know if they showed that closeup. I can show you some where the cart is running uphill.
Oh wow! I just found a new one by what looks like a French school girl. The first several runs are without a prop. Then several flat runs with a prop. Then several more with the cart going up a 5% slope and with a prop on. If you note the faster the treadmill goes the better the cart performs. This is equivalent to the wind blowing at a faster speed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch...
It's also equivalent to being on a steeper slope.
LowellGuy

Brooklyn, NY

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#127432
Apr 19, 2013
 
Urban Cowboy wrote:
Sodom & Gomorrah found! This righteous judgement of sin and destruction of these cities actually happened and in addition to Biblical, has archaeological evidence to support it.
"The destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah is a certain fact in history. The Genesis account is in narrative form and is alluded to by several Old Testament writers. Jesus Himself obviously believed it and in fact was an eyewitness as the pre-incarnate Lord." (See Matthew 11:23-24; Mark 6:11; Luke 10:12 and 17:28-32.
http://www.icr.org/article/7312/
Drdino.com didn't have anything about it?

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Everett, WA

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#127433
Apr 19, 2013
 
Ooogah Boogah wrote:
<quoted text>
It's also equivalent to being on a steeper slope.
No, I disagree. The upwards slope is still 5% regardless of the speed of the treadmill. It is climbing faster because the cart is rolling faster.

Galilean transformations are relatively simple. Are you familiar with them? No square root factors. All you do is to add a constant velocity to any frame of reference.
LowellGuy

Brooklyn, NY

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#127434
Apr 19, 2013
 
Urban Cowboy wrote:
<quoted text>
I guess you didn't understand what "The destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah is a certain fact in history" means. Does the author leave any doubt? No - of course not. How are these not real scholars? Or are you just a bitter liar? I knew this one would hit particularly hard for the gay-homosexuals as that is the reason they were destroyed and also the basis for law against Sodomy (Gross!).
Something so globally significant only appears in the website of an organization that claims everything we understand about geology, biology, chemistry, astronomy, and physics is completely wrong? That doesn't strike you as odd?

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#127435
Apr 19, 2013
 
Here is a shot of the small cart on the treadmill with a closeup of a level. It is flat:

http://www.youtube.com/watch...

“There is no Truth in Faith”

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#127436
Apr 19, 2013
 
Subduction Zone wrote:
And this video is a bit of an inside joke.
A doubter who did not understand the simple concept of a Galilean Transformation thought that testing a cart against popcorn would be the definitive test (though there is a video of the BUFC charging through a cloud of dust ). Windgrins did many tests for spork after the fact and as a pilot recognized that for the small carts they would be much more stable if the prop was a puller prop rather than a pusher prop.
Here is his famed popcorn test. It still cracks me up, but it might be too much of an inside joke for most:
http://www.youtube.com/watch...
Speaking of which, if I were to believe anything based just on say so and videos, then I must believe cell phones can pop popcorn. http://www.youtube.com/v/V94shlqPlSI

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#127437
Apr 19, 2013
 
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I disagree. The upwards slope is still 5% regardless of the speed of the treadmill. It is climbing faster because the cart is rolling faster.
Galilean transformations are relatively simple. Are you familiar with them? No square root factors. All you do is to add a constant velocity to any frame of reference.
Energy is added to the system by the treadmill, what exactly do you think this demonstrates?

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#127438
Apr 19, 2013
 
Subduction Zone wrote:
Here is a shot of the small cart on the treadmill with a closeup of a level. It is flat:
http://www.youtube.com/watch...
This one behaves more intuitively, the system loses energy due to mechanical inefficiencies and the cart moves in the direction of the treadmill.

I see nothing here to indicate the cart would be capable of moving faster then the wind directly down wind.

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#127439
Apr 19, 2013
 
Ooogah Boogah wrote:
<quoted text>
Energy is added to the system by the treadmill, what exactly do you think this demonstrates?
No, no , no.

The treadmill is the same as the cart moving directly downwind at the speed of the wind. If it advances that shows it is going faster than the wind, if it falls back it is going slower than the wind.

That is why I asked you if you understood the concept of a Galilean transformation and why this is the same as a cart on the road.
susanblange

Norfolk, VA

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#127440
Apr 19, 2013
 

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Urban Cowboy wrote:
Sodom & Gomorrah found! This righteous judgement of sin and destruction of these cities actually happened and in addition to Biblical, has archaeological evidence to support it.
"The destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah is a certain fact in history. The Genesis account is in narrative form and is alluded to by several Old Testament writers. Jesus Himself obviously believed it and in fact was an eyewitness as the pre-incarnate Lord." (See Matthew 11:23-24; Mark 6:11; Luke 10:12 and 17:28-32.
http://www.icr.org/article/7312/
I'm not at all surprised, everything in the OT will be proven, including the destruction of Babylon and Noahs' flood.

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#127441
Apr 19, 2013
 
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
No, no , no.
The treadmill is the same as the cart moving directly downwind at the speed of the wind. If it advances that shows it is going faster than the wind, if it falls back it is going slower than the wind.
That is why I asked you if you understood the concept of a Galilean transformation and why this is the same as a cart on the road.
In that particular video with the level, the cart consistently fell back. In the other video with no level, the cart appeared to move forward. Yes, I am familiar with Galilean transforms and I know they are accurate within the appropriate constraints.

Do you believe cell phones can pop popcorn? There is a video that shows it happening.
susanblange

Norfolk, VA

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#127442
Apr 19, 2013
 

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Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
What do you mean that the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah can be certain fact in history?
There are no reliable books that even mention the towns. What historians support these claims?
And Gays aren't the only ones that practice Sodomy. Lots of women like it in the backdoor. And technically fellatio is sodomy too. Don't tell me that you have never received a blow job, and if you haven't I almost feel sorry for you.
Fellatio is sodomy, and that's what Adam and Eve did in the garden of Eden.

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#127443
Apr 19, 2013
 
This site shows the simplest of Galilean transformations, which is exactly what we have with the cart on a treadmill:

http://psi.phys.wits.ac.za/teaching/Connell/p...

Let's look at a cart running directly downwind at the speed of the wind and how that transfers to a cart on a treadmill.

Let's say the cart is running directly east at 10 mph and the wind is blowing directly east at 10 mph. An observer on the cart will measure a wind speed of zero. He will see the ground moving underneath him at ten mph to the west. An observer on the ground will measure the wind blowing over the ground at 10 mph to the east and see the cart moving at ten mph to the east.

Now lets move them both to a treadmill with the track moving to the west at 10 mph and hold the cart until it is going at the speed of the belt. An observer on the cart will measure a wind speed of zero and see the ground (which is the belt) moving underneath him at 10 mph. Now let's see what an observer on the belt observes. The belt again is the ground equivalent. He measures a wind of 10 mph to the east and sees the cart moving to the east at 10 mph.

The two situations are equivalent. If the cart can go faster than the wind it will advance up the belt. If it cannot go as fast as the wind it will fall off the back of the belt. If it exactly matches the speed of the wind it will hover on the belt.

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#127444
Apr 19, 2013
 
Ooogah Boogah wrote:
<quoted text>
In that particular video with the level, the cart consistently fell back. In the other video with no level, the cart appeared to move forward. Yes, I am familiar with Galilean transforms and I know they are accurate within the appropriate constraints.
Do you believe cell phones can pop popcorn? There is a video that shows it happening.
No, it constant advanced up the belt. It was going faster than the belt. I just clicked on the link and watched it again.

No, cell phones cannot pop popcorn. I know it is possible to fake things on YouTube. It is not very easy to fool people who understand sailing. NALSA is the same group that certified the Greenbird, the world's fastest sailing vehicle. The regularly race wind driven vehicles. This has been written up on quite a few e-zines. Some of which originally said this was impossible. And quite a few school kids have also done this as a school science fair project.

I can even site an MIT expert in aerodynamics who has said that the problem is trivial.

What more do you need?

“Pissing people off since 1949”

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#127445
Apr 19, 2013
 

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susanblange wrote:
<quoted text>Fellatio is sodomy, and that's what Adam and Eve did in the garden of Eden.
You mean she ate the snake and not the apple?

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