Should evolution be taught in high school?

Feb 24, 2008 Full story: www.scientificblogging.com 176,180

Microbiologist Carl Woese is well known as an iconoclast. At 79 years of age, Woese is still shaking things up. Most recently, he stated in an interview with Wired that...

"My feeling is that evolution shouldn't be taught at the lower grades. You don't teach quantum mechanics in the grade schools. One has to be quite educated to work with these concepts; what they pass on as evolution in high schools is nothing but repetitious tripe that teachers don't understand." Full Story

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#119816 Feb 25, 2013
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>You are not interested in science, SZ. You are religious zealot, wallowing in self absorption and arrogance. Anything that doesn't fit with your worldview is rejected without any investigation. I will again remind you... evo-babbling is not science.
Don't lie HTS. You will not even take the minimal energy to try to learn what evidence is. Until you do that you automatically lose almost any scientific argument that you enter.

The fact that flowers are pretty is not evidence for god since we can show that flowers would be pretty without god.

“Evil Atheist :-)”

Since: Mar 07

Location hidden

#119817 Feb 25, 2013
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>The research you site is grossly flawed because it fails to define neutral and beneficial. Antibiotic resistance in bacteria is not "beneficial" in the sense that the overall fitness of mutants is diminished outside of a hospital environment without antibiotics. Furthermore, antibiotic resistance generally results in a net loss of genomic informationRegardless of how you spin the data, none of that research suggests that man evolved from a microbe.
Beneficial mutations will be beneficial in that environment.

If antibiotic resistance was detrimental then why have some of these bacteria spread all over the world?
HTS

Englewood, CO

#119818 Feb 25, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Don't lie HTS. You will not even take the minimal energy to try to learn what evidence is. Until you do that you automatically lose almost any scientific argument that you enter.
The fact that flowers are pretty is not evidence for god since we can show that flowers would be pretty without god.
You cannot show how evolution can create beauty. You imagine it.
HTS

Englewood, CO

#119819 Feb 25, 2013
Igor Trip wrote:
<quoted text>
Beneficial mutations will be beneficial in that environment.
If antibiotic resistance was detrimental then why have some of these bacteria spread all over the world?
The spread from one hospitalized patient to another. If antibiotic resistance is the poster child of evolution, you have a pretty flimsy hypothesis. You have one nucleotide substitution conferrring an obvious selective advantage. That is not analogous in any way to whatever mutations would have been required to create flight in birds or whales from a land mammal. Are you interested in the truth, or are you just bent on trying to win an arugment? If you were committed to science, you would not make wild unsupported extrapolations.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#119820 Feb 25, 2013
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>A plant is no more complex than a seed.
Compounding one stupid comment with another.
HTS wrote:
The sun does not create complexity. It provides energy only.
That's not what you said, doofus.
HTS wrote:
Solar energy only accelerates decomposition.
Extra credit question ahead...
HTS wrote:
It is the pre-existing DNA that creates complexity.
And the energy for that comes from where?

You inability to remain honest has been noted.

Level 6

Since: Aug 07

Arlington, VA

#119821 Feb 25, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
There is no need. Jesus did preach some good stuff. He also preached some obviously evil stuff.
Weaseling out I see. Can't back up claims with evidence. Sort of like your ideology. You're all talk and no action. You see you've been feeding on the false ideological pablum for so long you don't know how to think for yourself anymore.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#119822 Feb 25, 2013
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>You cannot show how evolution can create beauty. You imagine it.
Why would I have to?

That is an idiotic request by an idiotic debater.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#119823 Feb 25, 2013
Urban Cowboy wrote:
<quoted text>
Weaseling out I see. Can't back up claims with evidence. Sort of like your ideology. You're all talk and no action. You see you've been feeding on the false ideological pablum for so long you don't know how to think for yourself anymore.
No, I was not weaseling out.

I am tired of you not coming through with your end of the argument. So until you do we will take it as a given that Jesus was just as evil as he was good.

Level 6

Since: Aug 07

Arlington, VA

#119824 Feb 25, 2013
ChristineM wrote:
For the most part migratory behaviour is learned, it is not genetic so stop showing your ignorance by promoting irrelevancies.
Wrong! Patently false statement by ChristineM. Monarch butterflies migrate from NE America to regions in Mexico over 3 generations. How would they learn to navigate to the exact spot if they've never been there? Here's an article to help you correct your mistakes and aid your learning:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/05/...
HTS

Englewood, CO

#119825 Feb 25, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Compounding one stupid comment with another.
<quoted text>
That's not what you said, doofus.
<quoted text>
Extra credit question ahead...
<quoted text>
And the energy for that comes from where?
You inability to remain honest has been noted.
Energy to run a computer comes from electricity. Electricity does not create complexity... the software and hardware from an intelliently designed computer do. What part of that don't you understand? You cannot leave a pile of garbage out in the sun and after a million years expect to see anything but an even more decomposed pile of garbage.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119826 Feb 25, 2013
HTS wrote:
<quoted text> This isn't a game. I asked for evidence that solar energy could in an of itself create complexity.

Can something that only exists as a concept in our minds be "created" (sic) by solar energy? The answer is yes.
HTS wrote:
<quoted text> The answer is "no". Yes, a solar powered car can run, but that solar power didn't create the car. In my challenge, I assumed that you would be intellectually honest. I will no longer assume that.

You are intellectually dishonest by continuing to pretend "absolute complexity" even after being shown it is just a philosophical notion and not science.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119827 Feb 25, 2013
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>A plant is no more complex than a seed. The sun does not create complexity. It provides energy only. It is the pre-existing DNA that creates complexity.

Are unicorns more complex than gnomes?

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119828 Feb 25, 2013
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>You are not interested in science, SZ. You are religious zealot, wallowing in self absorption and arrogance. Anything that doesn't fit with your worldview is rejected without any investigation. I will again remind you... evo-babbling is not science.

And yet YOU continue to babble about "complexity".

I will remind you again....creo-babbling is not science.

Can we please dispense with nonsense words and notions?

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119829 Feb 25, 2013
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>You cannot show how evolution can create beauty. You imagine it.

You cannot show how creation can create beauty. You imagine it.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#119830 Feb 25, 2013
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>Energy to run a computer comes from electricity. Electricity does not create complexity... the software and hardware from an intelliently designed computer do.
You do love moving the goalposts, don't you.
HTS wrote:
What part of that don't you understand?
I understand that you're a phony and change the subject when ever your cornered.
HTS wrote:
You cannot leave a pile of garbage out in the sun and after a million years expect to see anything but an even more decomposed pile of garbage.
See what I mean. Who the f*ck said anything about leaving a pile of garbage out for a million years.

You said "Solar energy only accelerates decomposition." That is complete bullshit and only an uneducated fool would make such a statement and then try to defend it.

Playing doctor with the kid next door does not constitute pre-med.

Level 6

Since: Aug 07

Arlington, VA

#119831 Feb 25, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I was not weaseling out.
I am tired of you not coming through with your end of the argument. So until you do we will take it as a given that Jesus was just as evil as he was good.
That's idiotic and what you always do to weasel out. You think I don't notice your childish ways? You are the one making the wreckless, unfounded claims, so it is your job to back up what you say.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#119832 Feb 25, 2013
Urban Cowboy wrote:
<quoted text>
Wrong! Patently false statement by ChristineM. Monarch butterflies migrate from NE America to regions in Mexico over 3 generations. How would they learn to navigate to the exact spot if they've never been there? Here's an article to help you correct your mistakes and aid your learning:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/05/...
If you want to learn how a species "learns" to migrate you need to talk to a biologist who specializes in that behavior. The motivating factors is probably different for insects, mammals and birds. If you solve it for insects that does not mean you have solved it for other animals. Odds are for insects are that it is "hard wired" into their genome. For whales it very probably could be learned behavior. For birds it may be in between, partially hard wired, partially learned.

Even if we cannot answer the question of how animals learn to migrate that is not evidence against evolution. It only means there is another problem to solve, nothing more, nothing less.
HTS

Englewood, CO

#119833 Feb 25, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Why would I have to?
That is an idiotic request by an idiotic debater.
I realize that you're imagination is exhausted. I'm only asking for science... experimental evidence that mutations and natural selection can create aesthetic designs.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#119834 Feb 25, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Are unicorns more complex than gnomes?
Of course. Do you know how hard it is to program in that coil in the horn, not to mention their magical virgin detecting abilities.

“Nihil curo de ista tua stulta ”

Since: May 08

Orlando

#119835 Feb 25, 2013
HTS wrote:
<quoted text>Energy to run a computer comes from electricity. Electricity does not create complexity... the software and hardware from an intelliently designed computer do. What part of that don't you understand? You cannot leave a pile of garbage out in the sun and after a million years expect to see anything but an even more decomposed pile of garbage.
Follow the "energy" trail backwards. What are the root sources of the energy stored in the oil or coal that powers generators powered by oil or coal?

How about Geothermal power?

Hydroelectric?

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