Should evolution be taught in high school?

Feb 24, 2008 Full story: www.scientificblogging.com 173,714

Microbiologist Carl Woese is well known as an iconoclast. At 79 years of age, Woese is still shaking things up. Most recently, he stated in an interview with Wired that...

"My feeling is that evolution shouldn't be taught at the lower grades. You don't teach quantum mechanics in the grade schools. One has to be quite educated to work with these concepts; what they pass on as evolution in high schools is nothing but repetitious tripe that teachers don't understand." Full Story

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#119440 Feb 24, 2013
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
Er....
A BELIEF in Jesus would preclude belief in evo-rantings....

False. Clearly your theology is limited by your small brain.
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
Whatever happened to the evolutionary tree of life?

It refuted creationism
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
Jesus is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow
Jesus believed in a ‘young’ creation
He would HAVE to know as He was there

There is no indication as to what Jesus believed about creation.
Russell wrote:
<quoted text> You have massacred the Bible to justify your compromise
This is precisely what brings discredit to Christianity and to the Lord

You do not know enough about the history of the bible and of early Christianity for me to have a reasonable discussion about this issue with you.

Russell wrote:
<quoted text> The useful idiots that have deluded themselves thinking the lie evolution has any relevance or meaning in science or life

I see, so Scientific fact = delusion. Great. we can all go back to living in caves now.

Evolutionary biology (Evolutionary Medicine) is giving us a fighting chance against diseases like AIDS, cancer, influenza...

You want people to go back to dying gruesome deaths. No thanks. I will stick with science. You can find your own cave.


Your beliefs are just beliefs. They are not based on actual science. Yet I bet you enjoy the benefits that science has given us in the modern world. heck, I bet you even own a computer. Hypocrite.
Russell

Adelaide, Australia

#119441 Feb 24, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Again, you failed to address the issues and tried to get by with a hand wave, a denial, and an ad hominum.
We want science.
We want logic.
We don't want you to pretend to play a game that you don't have the resources to cover.
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
Because there are no intelligent creationists.
C’mon Richard
How intelligent does one has to be to deflate evolutionary hot air?
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
More projection. Especially the bit about amorality, considering the fact that you're incapable of any kind of genuine morality and whose position is profoundly racist.
Sayeth the greatest creation bigot that flounces around this forum
Rather gallant of you to race to The Dude's defense

But then do try and DEFEND him

I know you want science....its badly needed in evolutionism...in fact
Its one of those tragically missing items in the desperate attempts to MAKE evolution science

You want logic....correct
You have none

What you need is rational thought...

About your version of christianity...

It's quite unsustainable

But in the dual religious beliefs of evolution and your peculiar doctrine

I think rationality was a very early casualty...
Russell

Adelaide, Australia

#119442 Feb 24, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
???
There are transitional fossils in the fossil record. There are lots of transitional fossils in the fossil record.
Are you regurgitating the old creationist canard about there being no transitional fossils?
Actually one can consider all fossils to be transitional (except for the most recent ones which have no ancestors in the fossil record.....yet!).
Blind faith

Level 6

Since: Aug 07

North Miami Beach, FL

#119443 Feb 24, 2013
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
Somewhat like your brand of christianity...
He told me he was Buddhist.
Russell

Adelaide, Australia

#119444 Feb 24, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh my Gawd! Can you believe that his God did not strike him dead right there? If you want evidence that God does not exist, Rusty just gave it.
Creationists lie constantly. There is not one creationist site that I have ever seen that is not filled with lies.
No, you have provided evidence of a scientist that was all too human. When faced with his own mortality he started to lie for Jesus. Yes, he made idiotic statements about how "bad" the standards of science were in evolution. He could not name any specifics. Just like you cannot say what was wrong with Haeckel's drawings, and there was something wrong with them, scientifically.
Lying for Jesus is not a valid debating tool. All that happens is that people who know you are lying will point this out.
Poor Rusty, he has nothing and he knows it.
You are quite deluded...

You are the only person ...other than the Dude who uses a snake-like sophistication to deceive...for whom I have objective evidence of being a liar

Level 6

Since: Aug 07

North Miami Beach, FL

#119445 Feb 24, 2013
Dogen wrote:
There is no indication as to what Jesus believed about creation.
So Dogen, in your new walk in Christ, do you believe Jesus' first miracle? When He turned water into wine? This would be a creation event, right?(John 2:1-12)
Russell

Adelaide, Australia

#119446 Feb 24, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
False. Clearly your theology is limited by your small brain.
Ad hominem

But that's ok

You're hurting

But remember time heals all wounds...

And goodness knows...you've got millions of years to lick your's

<quoted text>
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
It refuted creationism
I think IT has been refuted
It refuted nothing
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
There is no indication as to what Jesus believed about creation.
<quoted text>
No of course not

Since you have discarded and dismantled His word entirely..

But for the rest of us...

Matthew 19:4
"Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,'

Mark 10:6
But 'God made them male and female' from the beginning of creation.

Mark 13:19

For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.

And I shouldn't have to reference this:

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning.

3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5 The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it.
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
You do not know enough about the history of the bible and of early Christianity for me to have a reasonable discussion about this issue with you.
Try me

You're the one who claimed Islam was very scientific...or some such nonsense
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
I see, so Scientific fact = delusion. Great. we can all go back to living in caves now.
Go back to living in caves like when...??
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Evolutionary biology (Evolutionary Medicine) is giving us a fighting chance against diseases like AIDS, cancer, influenza...
You want people to go back to dying gruesome deaths. No thanks. I will stick with science. You can find your own cave.
Your beliefs are just beliefs. They are not based on actual science. Yet I bet you enjoy the benefits that science has given us in the modern world. heck, I bet you even own a computer. Hypocrite.
Patent nonsense

My computer is based on technology that is based on operational science

Nothing in medicine depends on evolution
Russell

Adelaide, Australia

#119447 Feb 24, 2013
Urban Cowboy wrote:
<quoted text>
He told me he was Buddhist.
That explains everything

Vegetarian atheist

“That's just MY opinion...”

Since: Jan 07

Location hidden

#119448 Feb 24, 2013
Russell wrote:
More anaemic bleatings from the ignorant masses.....
Another “copy cat” religion slur....
Solomon was right
There is nothing new under the sun
Please see for a scholarly refutation of your claim:
http://christianthinktank.com/copycat.html
**Warning**
Not for the faint hearted
How about the weak of stomach? What a load of indigestible crap!
Russell

Adelaide, Australia

#119449 Feb 24, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>

Actually, I am always embarrassed at how frequently and vividly my fellow Christian's lie. I try to write it off as them simply being ignorant and being fearful of learning what might contradict their beliefs.
Poor you

It sucks!

But look at me?

I have to deal with a 'christian' who thinks the bible is wrong and that Jesus did not believe in creation
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Rick Smalley was a creationist. In that vein he was not responding as a scientist. His work in chemistry was in his own field and there he was brilliant.
<quoted text>
And he is not a biologist either. NEXT! He is also an acknowledged creationist. He is also the nutjob the maintained thermodynamics refuted evolution. When shown he was wrong he stopped talking about it to anyone except sympathetic audiences (creationists). In other words he got BUSTED!
This is what the Dude said:
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
No honest scientist who objectively looked at the facts could possibly believe evolution is false.
Interestingly though, it's the creationists who are forced to lie.
I have provided exactly what he required
Exactly as you claim I have not provided else where...

He said no honest scientist who objectively looked at the facts could possibly believe evolution is false

I have provided him with two examples out of the very many I could have referenced

Please read what I have written more carefully
Your skim reads are letting you down
Russell

Adelaide, Australia

#119450 Feb 24, 2013
MADRONE wrote:
<quoted text>
How about the weak of stomach? What a load of indigestible crap!
Yeah
I know

Thinking Jesus is a copy cat of Mithra...

Quite nauseating....

“That's just MY opinion...”

Since: Jan 07

Location hidden

#119451 Feb 24, 2013
Russell wrote:
...a snake-like sophistication to deceive...
You must have studied Herpetology at Wingnut University.

“That's just MY opinion...”

Since: Jan 07

Location hidden

#119452 Feb 24, 2013
Russell wrote:
Yeah
I know
Thinking Jesus is a copy cat of Mithra...
Quite nauseating....
Thinking Magic Jesus existed...Quite silly...

“Nihil curo de ista tua stulta ”

Since: May 08

Orlando

#119454 Feb 24, 2013
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
Check that statement..
Were amino acids really found in a meteorite?
Research it
http://www.sciencenews.org/view/generic/id/33...

"Researchers have spotted other extraterrestrial biological molecules in meteorites before, including amino acids, the building blocks of proteins. The new study looked instead at nucleobases, ring-shaped compounds used to store information in RNA and DNA molecules, which carry life’s genetic blueprints."

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/...

"Amino acids have already been found in a variety of carbon-rich meteorites formed under relatively cool conditions.(See asteroid and comet pictures.)

But this is the first time the substances have been found in meteorites that had been naturally heated to 2,000 degrees Fahrenheit (1,100 degrees Celsius)."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11542462

"The amino acids of the Murchison meteorite (CM2) have been extensively analyzed and 52 amino acids have been positively identified. Thirty three of these amino acids are unknown in natural materials other than carbonaceous chondrites. Thus the Murchison meteorite has recently been the major source of new naturally-occurring amino acids."

“There is no Truth in Faith”

Level 5

Since: Dec 08

nowhere near a pound of $100's

#119455 Feb 24, 2013
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
It’s called genetic variation
Evolution it ain’t
If the job of evolution were to simply produce allelic variety from existing genes...then we could all be happy, pack up and go home
But evolution has to create multi-cellularity from single cells, then produce every living thing imaginable via mutations, selection and fixation.....and as any geneticist will tell you...
...That ain’t possible in 4.5 billion years
Oh and naturalistic processes have to also create life first...still within that time frame
How would you know what is possible and what is not in 4,500,000,000 years?

“There is no Truth in Faith”

Level 5

Since: Dec 08

nowhere near a pound of $100's

#119456 Feb 24, 2013
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
"Majority of the available evidence?"
What's the majority of 'none'?
ERV remnants
LowellGuy

United States

#119457 Feb 24, 2013
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
Poor you
It sucks!
But look at me?
I have to deal with a 'christian' who thinks the bible is wrong and that Jesus did not believe in creation
<quoted text>
This is what the Dude said:
<quoted text>
I have provided exactly what he required
Exactly as you claim I have not provided else where...
He said no honest scientist who objectively looked at the facts could possibly believe evolution is false
I have provided him with two examples out of the very many I could have referenced
Please read what I have written more carefully
Your skim reads are letting you down
At best, the Bible is, at best, third person hearsay. At least, that's what my uncle heard from his buddy at the docks.
LowellGuy

United States

#119458 Feb 24, 2013
Urban Cowboy wrote:
Evolutionists should ask themselves: What is the basic mechanism for their macro changes? Must be beneficial mutations right? Now, ask the following:
How often do we observe beneficial mutations? Never!
How often do we observe harmful mutations? Always!
So how can they accept a theory that depends entirely on something that has never been observed and is prevented from what is always observed?
Is sickle cell anemia beneficial or harmful to the ability of people to reproduce in malarial regions?

Remind us why lactose tolerance is not beneficial in any way.
LowellGuy

United States

#119459 Feb 24, 2013
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
Specified
Purposeful
What purpose has crystal replication?
The same purpose all replication has. Continued existence.
LowellGuy

United States

#119460 Feb 24, 2013
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
"It is not one swalowe that bryngeth in somer. It is not one good qualitie that maketh a man good."
Evolutionists /atheists have no objective basis for morality
“The concepts of right and wrong must have an ultimate basis from which to appeal, or else they become simply relative to the culture.......... And, unless one appeals to a Creator who sets the absolute laws for life, who can say what is right or wrong? If there is no Creator who has made us and set the rules, then all our morals and ideas of what is right or wrong are simply subjective—what we ourselves decide.”
Therefore widow burning if acceptable in a culture MUST be okay
Female circumcision....it’s cultural
Wife beating...permitted and encouraged in certain religious groups
Child sex and marrying very young girls is acceptable in certain religious groups
----------
“”When the Nazis during WWII carried out their brutal reign of terror upon innocent Jews, would they have done so if they had truly believed that they would reap a recompense for their actions? The Nazis had been taught that evolution was true and involved the concepts of survival of the fittest and elimination of the weak, and they were determined to apply this in real life. The ardent evolutionist Sir Arthur Keith, although an anti-Nazi, commented on Hitler’s evolutionary stance:
‘The German Führer, as I have consistently maintained, is an evolutionist; he has consciously sought to make the practice of Germany conform to the theory of evolution.’1
The bloodthirsty regimes of Hitler and Stalin both based their philosophies on evolutionary principles. Injustice, cruelty, and merciless brutality were backed up by the ultimate evolutionary notion that all things made themselves, and that there is no higher authority which we must obey.
Evolutionist zoology professor Ernst Haeckel, whose fraudulent drawings of embryos continue to feature in some school textbooks2, and whose influence laid much of the foundation for Hitler’s Germany, argued in his book Natural History of Creation,‘the church with its morality of love and charity is an effete fraud, a perversion of the natural order’.3
He said this was because Christianity ‘… makes no distinction of race or of color; it seeks to break down all racial barriers. In this respect the hand of Christianity is against that of Nature, for are not the races of mankind the evolutionary harvest which Nature has toiled through long ages to produce? May we not say, then, that Christianity is anti-evolutionary in its aim?’4
Others have written concerning prewar Germany:‘The Jews, labelled subhumans, became nonbeings. It was both legal and right to exterminate them in the collectivist and evolutionist viewpoint. They were not considered … persons in the sight of the German government.’5
How different to the Bible. God’s standards are love and kindness towards one another:
‘… if there is any other commandment, it is summed up in this word,“You shall love your neighbour as yourself.” Love works no ill to its neighbour, therefore love is the fulfilling of the law ’(Romans 13:9–10).””
http://creation.com/the-creation-basis-for-mo...
What is objective about authoritarian fiat?

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