Should evolution be taught in high school?

Feb 24, 2008 | Posted by: Cash | Full story: www.scientificblogging.com

Microbiologist Carl Woese is well known as an iconoclast. At 79 years of age, Woese is still shaking things up. Most recently, he stated in an interview with Wired that...

"My feeling is that evolution shouldn't be taught at the lower grades. You don't teach quantum mechanics in the grade schools. One has to be quite educated to work with these concepts; what they pass on as evolution in high schools is nothing but repetitious tripe that teachers don't understand."

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The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

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#116030
Feb 4, 2013
 

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Russell wrote:
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<quoted text>
Hey, Forum Fairy
You are the only PROVEN liar!
I have only just posted on the sister-thread http://www.topix.com/forum/news/evolution/TMH...
Post #1623, that evolution hardly makes it as a theory, by the Dude's own definition, or anyone else's for that matter.
It can scarcely be called a hypothesis.
I noticed you keeping well away from discussion on ERV's!
Bottom still sore? Tsk, tsk...
Your baseless claims coupled with religious apologetics doesn't make him a liar. However your continued misquoting of evolutionary sources to support YECism makes you a liar.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

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#116031
Feb 4, 2013
 

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Mugwump wrote:
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Cheers dude - for some reason that thread only showed up on my phone, not on the tablet - hence could go back and fact check the details of the nonsense.
Strange that creationists never fess up to lying - thought there should be a commandment about it personally.
Russ is very similar to MAZ, kinda like a cross between the Black Knight and Nelson Muntz. With a smidge of Ned Flanders.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

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#116032
Feb 4, 2013
 
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
C'mon Mugwump
Stop being such a baby
What else you got?
You're stuck on 1000's base pairs and nothing can budge you!
Pretty stubborn creature?
By the way, have you met Prof Andy McIntosh? Much beloved by creationists and despised by the Dude?
I think the Dude is just jealous since HE has no thermodynamic credentials....
Nothing to be jealous of, the Dude....
You too could be a Christian and Creationist one day, just like good ol' Prof
I'm not jealous of hypocritical liars for Jesus. Remember that he has not published any science papers on YECism, the vast majority of physicists who ALSO have creds in thermodynamics disagree with him, and he IS on video openly admitting his YEC bias.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

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#116033
Feb 4, 2013
 
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Even his university thinks he's full of crap:
http://web.archive.org/web/20070505104117/htt...
Makes him and Behe part of a privileged posse. The martyrs of IDC!

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

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#116034
Feb 4, 2013
 
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you for real, Bud?
Have you totally lost it?
Ever heard of the Krebs cycle?
Know what else it is known as?
Please do not embarrass your self
The bigger they are the harder they fall
E coli have a whole suite ---an operon---to confer citrate fermenting ability. They already possess the ability to "digest" citrate, but only under certain circumstances.
We have been through this before....
Short attention span?
Too close to bedtime?
Lenski himself stated, " A more likely possibility, in our view, is that an existing transporter has been co-opted for citrate transport under high oxic conditions"
Also see, in regards to the transporter:
Pos, K M, Dimroth, P and Bott, M, "The Escherichia coli Citrate Carrier CitT: a member of a novel eubacterial transporter family related to the 2-oxoglutarate/Malate translocator from Spinach chloroplasts, J Bacteriol 180(16):4160-4165, 1998. www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi...
This transporter is only activated under oxygen free conditions with good reason.
But you will never know the reason.....
I see that you still like to swim in those long long rivers.

My specialty is not genetics, but geology, which is why I gave you that challenge on the age of the Earth. Of course you know that and ran away like the chickenshit that you are.

Several problems, first your link does not work. Try again. Who are you quoting? Is is some creatard? It probably is. If so your quotation means nothing. Even educated creatards are masters of denial. So if you want to bust my claim you will have to try again. You failed since you had no working link and an unsubstantiated quote.

Since the world of genetics seem to think that the E. coli test was done correctly I will believe the experts and ignore the Ozzie with his thumb up his sore ass.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

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#116035
Feb 4, 2013
 
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
For your reading pleasure:
http://creation.com/chemical-soup-is-not-your...
and
also by Dr Aw Swee-Eng
http://creation.com/origin-of-life-critique
I love it. This is as good as an open admission that even dumbshit here knows that he is wrong.

When all you can come up with are creatard sites you lose. Quoting from discredited sources throws out your whole argument.

“Don't get me started”

Level 1

Since: Jul 09

Minneapolis

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#116036
Feb 4, 2013
 
Clone wrote:
<quoted text>You said, "we come up with........", are you part of the scientific community? Answer this: Can humans apply their logic, knowledge and theories to comprehend how the alien world functions? One topix person said, "There is no way an alien craft could travel thru the universe to earth from another system, they cant go faster than C2". Their lies the problem, humans can not get passed the "learned" behavior or theories. They must think outside human understanding in order to analyze the alien world. Aliens don't fit in the realm of human thought. Hence, the religious cult like atmosphere on earth.
You do understand that this is the same logic that fundies use to "prove" the existence of God, right? Man cannot comprehend the mind of God, so our feeble attempts to define what is real is pointless. I suppose this is how fundies jump from one bandwagon to the next. In each new conversion they see themselves as having a special ability to understand more than anyone else.

“Don't get me started”

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Since: Jul 09

Minneapolis

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#116037
Feb 4, 2013
 
Russell wrote:
<quoted text>
And the evidence is......?
....is in the fossil record.

“Don't get me started”

Level 1

Since: Jul 09

Minneapolis

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#116038
Feb 4, 2013
 
ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>
That does not stop the hurt of the people those leaders have caused to be injured or maimed. Or the hurt of those whose loved ones have been murdered on either side.
The difference is that those protecting unionism in what is after all a predominantly “unionist” environment did not deliberately and arbitrarily target innocent children and unarmed civilians
I have to admit to having little understanding of the issues that have driven the bloodshed in that part of the world. The little I know (or think I know) of the situation in Northern Ireland is that England allowed Ireland to be independent, but kept hold of much of the economy by maintaining a foothold in Northern Ireland. What I understand (or again, think I understand) is that England gained control of Northern Ireland by shipping lots of English people to that area so the original population became the minority. After that, the original (catholic) population became second class citizens, while good jobs and political opportunities went to the protestant majority. I'd guess that we might have the same mess here if the U.S. had gained its independence from England while losing Massachusetts to England.

When both sides see the other as uncivilized murderers, it's hard to find a way to resolve the problem.
One way or another

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#116039
Feb 4, 2013
 

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Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
There were 12 flasks in Lenski's experiment, and all of them adapted to the environment given and showed population increases over time as they adapted. Just as we would expect in the evolution / adaptation paradigm. And while all of them came from a monoclonal starting culture, the specific adaptations and mutations involved in every flask were different. The famous citrate-eater flask was an unexpected bonus.
Adaptation is not evolution? Perhaps, in the same way that driving a mile a mile is not a trip across America, but evolution is nothing but adaptation continued. You now have to explain what effect exists that you think prevents adaptation from continuing indefinitely, especially in environments that are not as stable as provided in the Lenski experiment. What is this magic wall that you IDers are so sure has to exist?
Show proof that the citrus eater flask increased in population, liar.
LowellGuy

United States

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#116041
Feb 4, 2013
 
One way or another wrote:
<quoted text>
Show proof that the citrus eater flask increased in population, liar.
Your admission that you have no idea what you're talking about. Dumbass liar.
Mugwump

London, UK

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#116042
Feb 4, 2013
 
One way or another wrote:
<quoted text>
Show proof that the citrus eater flask increased in population, liar.
It is generally accepted that consumption of oranges is beneficial health-wise and increase life-span.

Now bacteria are quite small, so relatively oranges are bigger compared to a bacteria that say a Spanish man...

.... Therefore the longevity effect is more pronounced than in humans.

Proof enough - simply new thoughts - produced when I am not shackled by logic, knowledge of the subject or sanity.

Oh by the way - doesn't work with lemons - wrong colour.
One way or another

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In reading so much about lenski's experiments, I had read where the bacteria that started using the citrate, could no longer take up the glucose and that they could no longer reproduce.

However, I cannot now find that same info. It also said that those bacteria were not eating well.

Perhaps I will find that info again.
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Furthermore, E. coli is normally capable of utilizing citrate as an energy source under anaerobic conditions, with a whole suite of genes involved in its fermentation. This includes a citrate transporter gene that codes for a transporter protein embedded in the cell wall that takes citrate into the cell.6 This suite of genes (operon) is normally only activated under anaerobic conditions.

Read that last line again. Meaning, without AIR.
Mugwump

London, UK

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#116046
Feb 4, 2013
 

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For those that thought Jimbo is posting new thoughts, here is where he cut and pasted it from.

http://creation.com/bacteria-evolving-in-the-...

Rock solid then

:-)

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

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#116047
Feb 4, 2013
 
One way or another wrote:
In reading so much about lenski's experiments, I had read where the bacteria that started using the citrate, could no longer take up the glucose and that they could no longer reproduce.
However, I cannot now find that same info. It also said that those bacteria were not eating well.
Perhaps I will find that info again.

That was early in the study. The bacteria were eating and reproducing fine after the two key mutations.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

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#116048
Feb 4, 2013
 
One way or another wrote:
Furthermore, E. coli is normally capable of utilizing citrate as an energy source under anaerobic conditions, with a whole suite of genes involved in its fermentation. This includes a citrate transporter gene that codes for a transporter protein embedded in the cell wall that takes citrate into the cell.6 This suite of genes (operon) is normally only activated under anaerobic conditions.
Read that last line again. Meaning, without AIR.

Nice cut & paste. To bad you have not a single clue what it means.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

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#116049
Feb 4, 2013
 
Mugwump wrote:
For those that thought Jimbo is posting new thoughts, here is where he cut and pasted it from.
http://creation.com/bacteria-evolving-in-the-...
Rock solid then
:-)

Great source.
Mugwump

London, UK

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#116050
Feb 4, 2013
 
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Nice cut & paste. To bad you have not a single clue what it means.
The trick is (and I trust that as a member of the Jewish carpet-laying cartel, you will keep this between us)

Cntl-C
Google
Cntl-V

<enter>

As I say keep it under you hat or Jimbo will know we are onto him.

:-)
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#116051
Feb 4, 2013
 

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Try to go to the web page on this post.

Evolutionists in science are always using deceit.

NASA took down its own web page, because I proved their own test and words, showed that what they claimed, disproved speed of light theory. That's why they took down their own web page.

Funny, I prove NASA and Goddard must be stupid, according to their own web site.

Original work
By Jim Ryan
Supported by evidence
Moons reflectors bogus

So, the moons reflectors are 239,000 miles from earth, approximately and since the speed of light is 186,000 miles per second, y'all must think that laser beam will get back to earth pretty fast. Actually, the light should return to earth from the moons reflectors in 1.3 seconds, with the reflectors designed to reflect the light back to the point it came from.

However, in the 1.3 seconds the light takes to return to its origin, the earth has moved approx 4,000 miles from the point source of light, according to sciences claim that our galaxy is traveling that fast in 1 second, making it impossible for science to capture any photons, at least according to science.

Science sure is messed up, thinking it can collect photons that are 4,000 miles behind the collector.

At least they depend on all of us being stupid enough to believe them. Well, at least the Evo morons here.

Stupidity of NASA +Goddard

On the website,----http://eclipse.gsf c.nasa.gov/SEhelp/ApolloLaser . html
It claims,--------- scientists have been able to determine the round-trip travel time that gives the distance between the two bodies at any time to an accuracy of about 3 centimeters.
I say, WOW, what a marvel.
On to the next part.
Science claims,---"Lunar ranging involves sending a laser beam through an optical telescope," Dickey said. "The beam enters the telescope where the eye piece would be, and the transmitted beam is expanded to become the diameter of the main mirror, then bounced off the surface toward the reflector on the Moon."
The reflectors are too small to be seen from Earth, so even when the beam is precisely aligned in the telescope, actually hitting a lunar retroreflector array is technically challenging. At the Moon's surface the beam is roughly four miles wide. Scientists liken the task of aiming the beam to using a rifle to hit a moving dime two miles away.
I say,--------so now, with a laser light 4 miles wide and an exact location, probably sending out a beacon or should be, they complain like hell. So much for close, perhaps 500 pound bomb close.
Now here is a crucial piece to my complaint.--------
Once the laser beam hits a reflector, scientists at the ranging observatories use extremely sensitive filtering and amplification equipment to detect the return signal, which is far too weak to be seen with the human eye. Even under good atmospheric viewing conditions, only one photon is received every few seconds.
I say,------read that last sentence very carefully. One photon every few seconds.
Science doesn't say one or two seconds or a couple of seconds. Instead, science claims a FEW seconds, meaning, it took 3 or more seconds for the photon to go from the moon to the earth. That means, that the beam should have taken, 1.3 seconds and not a full 3 seconds or more as NASA and the Goddard space center claim.
Suck on that Evo morons.

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