Should evolution be taught in high school?

Feb 24, 2008 Full story: www.scientificblogging.com 174,462

Microbiologist Carl Woese is well known as an iconoclast. At 79 years of age, Woese is still shaking things up. Most recently, he stated in an interview with Wired that...

"My feeling is that evolution shouldn't be taught at the lower grades. You don't teach quantum mechanics in the grade schools. One has to be quite educated to work with these concepts; what they pass on as evolution in high schools is nothing but repetitious tripe that teachers don't understand." Full Story

“Don't get me started”

Level 1

Since: Jul 09

Minneapolis

#114230 Jan 12, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
Evidence of psychopathology
http://www.ablecarpet.biz/Pet_Damage.html
Yes, his website is a good indication that he actually believes some of his own nonsense. But I wouldn't call it psychopathology any more than I would call it psychopathology when millions of people around the world dip their fingers in the holy water every Sunday.

I think a lot of the stuff he denounces is really unimportant to him (speed of light, natural selection, stuff like that) other than the fact that it is a way to press people's buttons.

I think for the most part he's just pissed at smart people controlling his life and thinking they are better than him.

While Ryan does not process conceptual thought very well, he does have a very heavy reliance on intuitive thinking. Intuitive thinking isnít much help in science without conceptual skills to over-ride the nonsense, but it can be useful when one is just dealing with how people feel.

Without understanding his own strategy in an analytical way, his intuition tells him that most people are invested in a win-lose strategy. And by denying others of an outcome of winning or losing, he feels he has won. All he has to do is refuse to acknowledge any defeat. He knows he canít win either, but that is a small price to pay when revenge is more important than winning.

“Don't get me started”

Level 1

Since: Jul 09

Minneapolis

#114231 Jan 12, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm calling the police! You stole the line I stole from Buggs!!!
I have the spelling police on speed dial. Come to think of it, I should also put the attribution police on speed dial also.

“Don't get me started”

Level 1

Since: Jul 09

Minneapolis

#114232 Jan 12, 2013
Alien Outlaw wrote:
<quoted text>No UC, I accept that the God story had a good brainwashing couple thousand years. Yes, entities did decend from the heavens. And, the humans of that time could not comprehend the truth.So, they cooked up some fantasy so they would not go crazy or get stoned to death. Yes, life did start somewhere out there amoung the galaxies, just not by the "God" they told you.
Why is it more likely that life started somewhere out there than right here on earth? Why couldn't it be US to be the first to explore the universe and maybe even seed the universe with life?

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#114238 Jan 12, 2013
Urban Cowboy wrote:
<quoted text>
You got it wrong. It was basically a first-year biology test consisting of just 1 question, open-book, with unlimited time and you failed it. That's about it bad as it gets.

R i g h t....

I got it wrong and you did not even properly identify the mechanisms of evolution.

I even suggested that you look them up but having open internet did not help you.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#114239 Jan 12, 2013
appleboy wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, his website is a good indication that he actually believes some of his own nonsense. But I wouldn't call it psychopathology any more than I would call it psychopathology when millions of people around the world dip their fingers in the holy water every Sunday.
I think a lot of the stuff he denounces is really unimportant to him (speed of light, natural selection, stuff like that) other than the fact that it is a way to press people's buttons.
I think for the most part he's just pissed at smart people controlling his life and thinking they are better than him.
While Ryan does not process conceptual thought very well, he does have a very heavy reliance on intuitive thinking. Intuitive thinking isnít much help in science without conceptual skills to over-ride the nonsense, but it can be useful when one is just dealing with how people feel.
Without understanding his own strategy in an analytical way, his intuition tells him that most people are invested in a win-lose strategy. And by denying others of an outcome of winning or losing, he feels he has won. All he has to do is refuse to acknowledge any defeat. He knows he canít win either, but that is a small price to pay when revenge is more important than winning.

By definition believe in mass crazy things (thing many other people believe) that are social, cultural or religious norms are not mental illness. It is the firm believe in things that one things, believes, perceives that are not subject to verification or rational understanding by others that qualifies as psychopathology.

If you would not call Jim mentally, then by what standard would he qualify?

1. He believes things that can be verified to be wrong by others.
2. He claims special position or status in effect stating that he is smarter than scientists EVEN THOUGHT he does not understand the basic concepts of what he is discussing.
3. He believes others have stolen his brilliant ideas and made money off of them.

And I am just warming up.

Look at the 4 D's of psychopathology vs. Mr Ryan:
1. Deviance - Check
2. Distress - Check
3. Dysfunction - Check
4. Danger - Apparently not.

I don't want to diss Jim. My point is that he would benefit from therapy and medication. He meets the diagnostic criteria for Delusional Disorder that any qualified clinician would make if he went in to a mental health center.



“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#114240 Jan 12, 2013
Okay, I just work up and my first sentence is pretty wack. Let me try again.

By definition BELIEF in things (things many other people believe) that are social, cultural or religious norms, are not mental illness. It is the firm believe in things that one individual, believes or perceives, that are not subject to verification or rational understanding by others, that qualifies as psychopathology.

-------
hope that makes mores sense. The caffeine should kick in soon.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#114241 Jan 12, 2013
appleboy wrote:
<quoted text>
I have the spelling police on speed dial. Come to think of it, I should also put the attribution police on speed dial also.

The spelling and typo police have ME on speed dial. They have monogrammed hand cuffs for me.
LowellGuy

Haverhill, MA

#114242 Jan 12, 2013
One way or another wrote:
Evidence is great
Funny, I prove NASA and Goddard must be stupid, according to their own web site.
Original work
By Jim Ryan
Supported by evidence
Stupidity of NASA +Goddard
On the website,----http://eclipse.gsf c.nasa.gov/SEhelp/ApolloLaser . html
It claims,--------- scientists have been able to determine the round-trip travel time that gives the distance between the two bodies at any time to an accuracy of about 3 centimeters.
I say, WOW, what a marvel.
On to the next part.
Science claims,---"Lunar ranging involves sending a laser beam through an optical telescope," Dickey said. "The beam enters the telescope where the eye piece would be, and the transmitted beam is expanded to become the diameter of the main mirror, then bounced off the surface toward the reflector on the Moon."
The reflectors are too small to be seen from Earth, so even when the beam is precisely aligned in the telescope, actually hitting a lunar retroreflector array is technically challenging. At the Moon's surface the beam is roughly four miles wide. Scientists liken the task of aiming the beam to using a rifle to hit a moving dime two miles away.
I say,--------so now, with a laser light 4 miles wide and an exact location, probably sending out a beacon or should be, they complain like hell. So much for close, perhaps 500 pound bomb close.
Now here is a crucial piece to my complaint.--------
Once the laser beam hits a reflector, scientists at the ranging observatories use extremely sensitive filtering and amplification equipment to detect the return signal, which is far too weak to be seen with the human eye. Even under good atmospheric viewing conditions, only one photon is received every few seconds.
I say,------read that last sentence very carefully. One photon every few seconds.
Science doesn't say one or two seconds or a couple of seconds. Instead, science claims a FEW seconds, meaning, it took 3 or more seconds for the photon to go from the moon to the earth. That means, that the beam should have taken, 1.3 seconds and not a full 3 seconds or more as NASA and the Goddard space center claim.
According to NASA, this test showed that the speed of light is a lie.
Suck on that Evo morons.
See, at first I thought this was bullshit, but because you said it was supported by evidence at the beginning, I had no choice but to believe it.

“Don't get me started”

Level 1

Since: Jul 09

Minneapolis

#114243 Jan 12, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
By definition believe in mass crazy things (thing many other people believe) that are social, cultural or religious norms are not mental illness. It is the firm believe in things that one things, believes, perceives that are not subject to verification or rational understanding by others that qualifies as psychopathology.
If you would not call Jim mentally, then by what standard would he qualify?
1. He believes things that can be verified to be wrong by others.
2. He claims special position or status in effect stating that he is smarter than scientists EVEN THOUGHT he does not understand the basic concepts of what he is discussing.
3. He believes others have stolen his brilliant ideas and made money off of them.
And I am just warming up.
Look at the 4 D's of psychopathology vs. Mr Ryan:
1. Deviance - Check
2. Distress - Check
3. Dysfunction - Check
4. Danger - Apparently not.
I don't want to diss Jim. My point is that he would benefit from therapy and medication. He meets the diagnostic criteria for Delusional Disorder that any qualified clinician would make if he went in to a mental health center.
You are a professional and I am by no stretch of imagination qualified to make a professional judgment as to anyone's psychological makeup.

That said, I'm pretty sure that most people would have some area of their thinking that could be considered to be psychopathological. The driver who thinks he is specially gifted to be able to handle texting while driving might also be considered to have a Delusional Disorder. The workplace manager who does not tolerate any question of his decisions and opinions, whether it is about work or weather or politics could also be considered to have a Delusional Disorder. Quite a long list of ordinary delusions could be drawn up. In other words, the bar for pathology can be set very low. A wide spectrum of people could fit in nicely for needing therapy in some area of their life.

OK, I'd grant that Jim is probably on the high end on anyone's graph of normal delusions, but I would contend that his anger far outweighs his delusional problems.

“Don't get me started”

Level 1

Since: Jul 09

Minneapolis

#114244 Jan 12, 2013
Dogen wrote:
<quoted text>
The spelling and typo police have ME on speed dial. They have monogrammed hand cuffs for me.
They have me wear an ankle bracelet. If I get within six feet of my computer between midnite and four a.m. it sends an alarm to Spelling Central Command.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Indianapolis, IN

#114245 Jan 12, 2013
KittenKoder wrote:
Jimbo? That'll never happen.
One way or another

United States

#114248 Jan 12, 2013
More original science by Jim Ryan

Immunology

In the following I would suggest that science study children that rarely wear shoes or don't wear shoes at all. I would divide the study into different nations or groups of nations with basically, the same diseases.

I would divide the shoeless-- because of intense poverty, from the people and children that choose to go shoeless and those that rarely or almost never go without shoes.

I might look at the data as the mostly shoeless by desire as mentally and possibly physically, stronger and therefore, more resistant to disease, unless science finds differently.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Indianapolis, IN

#114249 Jan 12, 2013
One way or another wrote:
<quoted text>
You're a complete moron, go away.
So sez the village idiot.
One way or another

United States

#114250 Jan 12, 2013
More new science by Jim Ryan
If science really wanted to test speed of light theory, science could add a simple laser light to any of its probes and when the probe got say a million miles away from earth, it could send its laser light back to earth, one aimed at American collectors one at Russian collectors and one at another countries collectors, unless science is afraid to know the truth.
How is it that not one scientist in the whole world thought of such already? Are they all morons or does science just not want to know?
Mugwump

Bradford, UK

#114251 Jan 12, 2013
Seriously - I am back to calling Poe
Mugwump

Bradford, UK

#114252 Jan 12, 2013
More new science from Mugwump

The relationship between gravity and electricity

A hypothesis by mugwump

Moron scientists assert that electricity is carried by electrons, however an electron moves within an atom which is less than a centimeter in diameter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomic_radius
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomic_Kitten

However by observation and bringing new thoughts to science it is obvious that gravity produces electricity and as gravity is a like a magnet and repulsive the higher the gravity the lower the repulsive force and hence the electrical charge decreases

My hypothesis is proved by observing the charging times of my various appliances.

My iPhone is quite small and takes 30 minutes to charge completly - this fits my hypothesis

My ipad is somewhat heavier - and takes around 4 hours to charge - this fits my hypothesis.

My USB memory stick is very light and always works - this fits my hypothesis

My plasma tv is at least 100x the weight of my ipad and always works when plugged in - this does not fit my hypothesis

My kettle is about 1% of the weight of my tv and boils in about 3 minutes - this fits my hypothesis

My work laptop is about 10x the weight of my ipad and takes about 2 hours to charge - this is a slightly anomolous but broadly fits.

The above proves my hypothesis about gravity and electricity but no scientist can will admit this, no one can rebutt what I say.
Mugwump

Bradford, UK

#114253 Jan 12, 2013
A virtual time machine
A hypothesis by Mugwump

It is often said that the speed of light is 299,792,458 m/s, however what morons on this board don't realise is that this is only the speed in a vacuum, in other mediums and low temperatures it can slow to a mere 38 miles per hour.

As time is known to slow down as you approach the speed of light, it is logical that slowing down light must therefore speed up time.

If this can be done to such an extent then eventual time will accelate some parsecs into the future.

To do this it is simply a case of cooling a light source to absolute zero which as absolute will bring the light to a standstill.

Then move backwards from the light source, effectively pushing the light source back in time.

As images are carried in light, this will cause the light source to project images of past events, and if one moves back far enough (say a few miles)- events from centuries or even millennia ago can be observed - however a telescope may be required to view the images.

No scientist has ever realised this obvious logical conclusion as they are not taught to think for themselves and I have bought proof of new science from my brain..
One way or another

United States

#114254 Jan 12, 2013
Immunology testing

More original science by Jim Ryan

In the following I would suggest that science study children that rarely wear shoes or don't wear shoes at all. I would divide the study into different nations or groups of nations with basically, the same diseases.

I would divide the shoeless-- because of intense poverty, from the people and children that choose to go shoeless and those that rarely or almost never go without shoes.

I might look at the data as the mostly shoeless by desire as mentally and possibly physically, stronger and therefore, more resistant to disease, unless science finds differently.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Indianapolis, IN

#114255 Jan 12, 2013
One way or another wrote:
More new science by Jim Ryan
If science really wanted to test speed of light theory, science could add a simple laser light to any of its probes and when the probe got say a million miles away from earth, it could send its laser light back to earth, one aimed at American collectors one at Russian collectors and one at another countries collectors, unless science is afraid to know the truth.
How is it that not one scientist in the whole world thought of such already? Are they all morons or does science just not want to know?
And how, exactly, would this work, Einstein? Please provide the necessary calculations to support your hypothesis/masturbation.
Mugwump

Bradford, UK

#114256 Jan 12, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
And how, exactly, would this work, Einstein? Please provide the necessary calculations to support your hypothesis/masturbation.
Or why one would go to such lengths?

Surely two guys (or gals - am all about equal opportunities) with a torch, a tape measure and a stopwatch should suffice surely?

And the problem with jimbos idea is that he has forgot that (according to him) atomic clocks get messed up in space due to the 'workings' getting damaged by the pressure exerted by acceleration - sure he thinks its just a grandfather clock strapped onto a shuttle.

But good luck with getting a direct response from looney tunes - I have pretty much given up on him

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