Should evolution be taught in high school?

Feb 24, 2008 | Posted by: Cash | Full story: www.scientificblogging.com

Microbiologist Carl Woese is well known as an iconoclast. At 79 years of age, Woese is still shaking things up. Most recently, he stated in an interview with Wired that...

"My feeling is that evolution shouldn't be taught at the lower grades. You don't teach quantum mechanics in the grade schools. One has to be quite educated to work with these concepts; what they pass on as evolution in high schools is nothing but repetitious tripe that teachers don't understand."

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“I Am No One Else”

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#104779
Oct 15, 2012
 
Oh, and for giggles, I found this nice summary of Ancient Egyptian medical comprehension:
http://www.indiana.edu/~ancmed/egypt.HTM

It's interesting how much information a Dark Age can make us lose.

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#104780
Oct 15, 2012
 
Johny wrote:
<quoted text>
To get new systems (eyes, ears, heart, lungs, finger) you need many mutations - that is an obvious fact. You can look at the structure and connecting parts and it should be obvious. For example, the eye needs the lens, retina, vitreous humor, cornea, optic nerve, and all the smarts to read the information. How many mutations would it take to go from no eye to having an eye? The mutations leading to the changes in the brain alone would be large. How many new types of cells would be required? How about all the very precise mutations needed for the connecting structure? How about all the required blood vessels in the eye? They all have to be the right size and location. How about all the hidden scaffolding required in the construction of the eye? You see, the mutations need to be very precise or there will be no functioning system. So the real question is, "What is the probability of all these mutations coalescing together into one genome out of a population?" I think we CAN prove that the probability is VERY small.
There are many different eyes in the animal kingdom and many of them are missing some or most of the parts you mention. Can an eye function without a lens? Of course it can, and its still better than no eye. The simplest eyes of all are nothing more than light sensitive pigment on the skin. Refinement can be step wise all the way from that to a modern eye.

We can go from light sensitive pigment on skin to the formation of a slight depression giving a sense of directionality to that depression becoming deeper giving an almost pinhole effect (as per the Nautilus eye) to a protective transparent skin forming over the depression to that skin developing a bulge giving a rudimentary lens...continuous tiny refinements, each well with the reach of mutation and natural selection.

Dawkins' book "Climbing Mount Improbable" dealt with this back in the 80's. But, love him or hate him, all creationists manage to do is bash the man because they cannot fault his arguments...and they are not really "his" arguments anyway, merely the communication of mainstream evolution to the layperson. I recommend you read that book.

Other books not dealing with evolution directly but with self-organising systems, and the emerging sciences of complexity and chaos, will perhaps inform you that your thinking is missing the point.

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#104781
Oct 15, 2012
 
Psychology wrote:
Doesn't everyone hate to be spoken too as if they were too stupid to know when anyone is trying to run BS on them?
If so, do you think it's difficult to stress entities or make them eat things they aren't used to or even help them to gain in size and or shape, by simple manipulation of food water and more?
By would you let anyone speak to you in that manner? Do you want others to think you're an idiot as well?
The fact that you do not even seem to understand how plate tectonics works after it being explained repeatedly, might give you a hint as to why people eventually speak to you as if you are stupid. Where did the 67,000 miles go??? DUH! you moron.
Urban Cowboy

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#104782
Oct 15, 2012
 
Urban Cowboy

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#104783
Oct 15, 2012
 
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
The fact that I do not even seem to understand how plate tectonics works after it being explained repeatedly, might give you a hint as to why people eventually speak to me as if I am stupid. Where did the 67,000 miles go??? DUH! I'm such a moron.
Yes, you are.
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#104784
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Deceitful morons love to play games, because they have nothing else. Thanks for the chance to repeat the following.

Mid Atlantic mountains width

I told you children to be aware of a game of chess. I kept you looking in one place, making you feel comfortable and getting you to do exactly what you did, thanks.

Now now Evo children, ask yourselves, how wide are the mountains at the mid Atlantic ridge? They surely aren't 67,500 miles wide.
The width of the mountains should equal at least one quarter of the movement of those plates and science claims that in one million years, the plates lose approximately 15 miles, so if the earth is 4.5 billion years old and one million divided into 4.5 billion is 4500, then multiply 15times 4500, which equals 67,500 miles of lost plate. The width of the mountains at the mid atl ridge is minuscule, so please explain how that can be.

I exaggerated the first time , so I'm correcting it.

One more thing, with the mountain range at the mid Atlantic ridge solidly in place, tell us, how those 2 plates can possibly spread.
Psychology

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#104785
Oct 15, 2012
 

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KittenKoder wrote:
Oh, you missed the sarcasm, so I'll explain it for you. Darwin didn't finish school.

“I Am No One Else”

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#104786
Oct 15, 2012
 
Urban Cowboy wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah, I know. But at least you tried!
Ah, you can't admit you were wrong so you return to the ad-homs. Nice, and excruciatingly predictable.

“I Am No One Else”

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#104787
Oct 15, 2012
 
Psychology wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, you missed the sarcasm, so I'll explain it for you. Darwin didn't finish school.
This makes what sort of impact on his observations?

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#104790
Oct 15, 2012
 
Urban Cowboy wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, you are.
Lying by twisting other people's words is the best you can manage, you poor little thing.

Really, if you are going to behave this way, do not be surprised if people call you stupid.

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#104791
Oct 15, 2012
 
Psychology wrote:
Deceitful morons love to play games, because they have nothing else. Thanks for the chance to repeat the following.
Mid Atlantic mountains width
I told you children to be aware of a game of chess. I kept you looking in one place, making you feel comfortable and getting you to do exactly what you did, thanks.
Now now Evo children, ask yourselves, how wide are the mountains at the mid Atlantic ridge? They surely aren't 67,500 miles wide.
The width of the mountains should equal at least one quarter of the movement of those plates and science claims that in one million years, the plates lose approximately 15 miles, so if the earth is 4.5 billion years old and one million divided into 4.5 billion is 4500, then multiply 15times 4500, which equals 67,500 miles of lost plate. The width of the mountains at the mid atl ridge is minuscule, so please explain how that can be.
I exaggerated the first time , so I'm correcting it.
One more thing, with the mountain range at the mid Atlantic ridge solidly in place, tell us, how those 2 plates can possibly spread.
The mid Atlantic ridge is where NEW crust is forming, not old crust accumulating. The plates are moving apart there, the Atlantic is widening, and lava is bubbling up and cooling to form new crust. At the centre line, the "seam" of the mid Atlantic ridge, is actually a huge valley, a rift, which is the line of split between the two major tectonic plates.

In other parts of the world, crust is "disappearing" through subduction. That is, it is forced under other parts of the crust and as well as buckling, causing mountain ranges such as the Himalayas to form and grow, some of the crust forced underneath heats up and melts, disappearing back into the mantle (the very hot layer beneath the crust).

Now do you understand why we would NOT expect 67,000 miles of crust to be piled up somewhere?????

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#104792
Oct 15, 2012
 

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Urban Cowboy wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, you are.
Is that really you, Urban Cowboy? Now you are reduced to twisting others' words and sticking a fatuously stupid response to your own lies?

Really, I thought only Jimbo stooped that low. My apologies to Jimbo.

On the other hand, it just goes to show what happens to a man's brain when he embraces stupidity and irrationality the way you have done. I guess "Jimbo" will be your final destination. I hope you are enjoying the mental equivalent of open-mouthed drooling, as this appears to be what you are reduced to.
Psychology

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#104793
Oct 15, 2012
 
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
The mid Atlantic ridge is where NEW crust is forming, not old crust accumulating. The plates are moving apart there, the Atlantic is widening, and lava is bubbling up and cooling to form new crust. At the centre line, the "seam" of the mid Atlantic ridge, is actually a huge valley, a rift, which is the line of split between the two major tectonic plates.
In other parts of the world, crust is "disappearing" through subduction. That is, it is forced under other parts of the crust and as well as buckling, causing mountain ranges such as the Himalayas to form and grow, some of the crust forced underneath heats up and melts, disappearing back into the mantle (the very hot layer beneath the crust).
Now do you understand why we would NOT expect 67,000 miles of crust to be piled up somewhere?????
Then tell us, how do those two plates move when the mountain range anchors them in place?

“I am Sisyphus”

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#104794
Oct 15, 2012
 
Psychology wrote:
Doesn't everyone hate to be spoken too as if they were too stupid to know when anyone is trying to run BS on them?
If so, do you think it's difficult to stress entities or make them eat things they aren't used to or even help them to gain in size and or shape, by simple manipulation of food water and more?
By would you let anyone speak to you in that manner? Do you want others to think you're an idiot as well?

You are BS road kill.

If you don't want to learn just keep doing what you have been doing.

“I am Sisyphus”

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#104795
Oct 15, 2012
 
Urban Cowboy wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah, I know. But at least you tried!

Again, altering other peoples posts is among the most childish of internet pranks.

“I Am No One Else”

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#104796
Oct 15, 2012
 
Psychology wrote:
<quoted text>
Then tell us, how do those two plates move when the mountain range anchors them in place?
Wait .... whaaaaa'?

Erm, you missed a ton of geology classes.

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#104797
Oct 15, 2012
 
Psychology wrote:
Doesn't everyone hate to be spoken too as if they were too stupid to know when anyone is trying to run BS on them?
But that is you problem Jimbo! Your BS detector runs in reverse.

You accept every cockamamie piece of nonsense from every fringe source, but reject anything that has passed the more rigorous standards of science. Whether its gravity, evolution, plate tectonics, you will unerringly reject the truth and accept the BS.

Do tell me: just one thing of grace, beauty, integrity, and intelligence that you admire, which is a product of human thought and action. Not counting "poor innocent three-year olds", that is officially a cop out answer. Just ONE thing people have accomplished that you can find admirable and upright!

“I am Sisyphus”

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#104798
Oct 15, 2012
 
Psychology wrote:
Deceitful morons love to play games, because they have nothing else. Thanks for the chance to repeat the following.
Mid Atlantic mountains width
I told you children to be aware of a game of chess. I kept you looking in one place, making you feel comfortable and getting you to do exactly what you did, thanks.
Now now Evo children, ask yourselves, how wide are the mountains at the mid Atlantic ridge? They surely aren't 67,500 miles wide.
The width of the mountains should equal at least one quarter of the movement of those plates and science claims that in one million years, the plates lose approximately 15 miles, so if the earth is 4.5 billion years old and one million divided into 4.5 billion is 4500, then multiply 15times 4500, which equals 67,500 miles of lost plate. The width of the mountains at the mid atl ridge is minuscule, so please explain how that can be.
I exaggerated the first time , so I'm correcting it.
One more thing, with the mountain range at the mid Atlantic ridge solidly in place, tell us, how those 2 plates can possibly spread.

This has been explained. Did you miss it, ignore it or not understand it?

I wish you would stay on one subject till you understand it. Do you yet understand that gravity changes as a function of inverse square of the distance?

Here is another visualization. You have two planets with exactly the same mass but planet A has a larger diameter than planet B. On which planet will you weigh more?

“I am Sisyphus”

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#104799
Oct 15, 2012
 
Psychology wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, you missed the sarcasm, so I'll explain it for you. Darwin didn't finish school.

Darwin did not finish MEDICAL school (Because he was bored).

YOU did not finish HIGH SCHOOL.

Big difference.

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#104800
Oct 15, 2012
 
Psychology wrote:
<quoted text>
Then tell us, how do those two plates move when the mountain range anchors them in place?
It doesn't anchor them in place. What you call "a" mountain range are two parallel ranges, running along each side of a giant valley or rift. Its down in this rift that new lava is forcing upwards and creating new crust.

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