Evolution vs. Creation

Evolution vs. Creation

There are 209698 comments on the Best of New Orleans story from Jan 6, 2011, titled Evolution vs. Creation. In it, Best of New Orleans reports that:

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Best of New Orleans.

Since: Mar 11

St. Croix valley

#80917 Mar 15, 2013
HOG_ Hand of God wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you realize that you are still inferring the existence of the phenomena by describing its assumed effects in the readily observable plane?
You have identified that something is happening; BUT you have not proven whether its "dark matter" or "Holy angels".
<quoted text>
So who is saying that?
I am certainly not saying that.
Why should I say scientific evidence can safely be ignored, when science itself can help me to understand HOW GODDIDIT?
Are you new here?
Furthermore, even if I was saying Goddidit, it would be justifiable according to my definition/understanding of The Nature of God.
<quoted text>
Clown, modern society is built on the bronze ages etc.
The modern is a development of the primitive. Notice that the only significant difference between the tools of modern man and those of ancient man is the level of efficiency. THE SAME THINGS THAT WERE VALID THEN ARE THE SAME THINGS THAT ARE VALID NOW.
Where do you think even your medical knowledge comes from?
Your most sophisticated sciences are steeped in the occult principles of nations long ago. Idiot.
Really?!? our understanding of Alzheimers comes from ancient civilizations? how so? they did lay the foundations of medicine but most of it was incorrect...

“I see quantum effects”

Level 2

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#80918 Mar 15, 2013
HOG_ Hand of God wrote:
<quoted text>
OMG!!!!!!
I thought you were dumb the moment you took an atheistic stance; but that statement just slaps the [email protected] icing on the cake.
The only place where no evidence for creation exists, is in a place where absolutely nothing exists; YOU IDIOT!
It is lunacy to say that there is no evidence for creation; the only thing you can question as such, regarding the presence of structure, is what actually created it.
IF "There is no scientific evidence for creation."; then you cant prove that man has created anything?
The means by which you seek to deny the existence of God will be the very means used to deny your existence. Keep it up.
<quoted text>
Thats because the education system is in favor of the secular. Hence it is too difficult and maybe even impossible to refute secular concepts using secular knowledge.
So its not that creation scientists are not willing to make a testable hypothesis of that nature; but rather that the system of knowledge does not allow them to do so.
So the nature of academics is to be blamed for that shortcoming, not creation scientists.
<quoted text>
Obviously you have never read the Bible.
Obviously he has.
Messenger

San Jose, CA

#80919 Mar 15, 2013
woodtick57 wrote:
<quoted text>this is why no-one has yet attempted to say exactly what this 'dark matter' is. we lnly know its effects.
now...wouldn't that same thing go for this 'god' you profess exists? when you can plop a scoop of your god an a lab table, we can start the discussion of its existence...

logic is fun!
Ignorance is bliss.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#80920 Mar 15, 2013
Sparkle wrote:
<quoted text>
That's why we claim we are born gay and the christards tell us it isnt natural.
I do believe that many Christians "doth protest to much", pardon the paraphrase. Of course I used to believe that your practices were unnatural too, until I realized that they had no effect on me. Perhaps like some of the most vociferous Christian attackers of gay people perhaps swing a bit both ways. It won't be the first time that someone attacking gay people was gay himself and sadly it will not be the last time.
HOG_ Hand of God

Kingston, Jamaica

#80921 Mar 15, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
And though HOG may be more intelligent than our average creatard here, he is still dishonest.
He obviously believes in creation by a god of some sort but he will not go into any details of his belief.
The details of my belief are superfluous to the discussion.

Avoiding the superfluous is hardly dishonest.
Subduction Zone wrote:
...
Also, science can refute a claim if it is well enough defined. He is playing the I won't be specific so you can't debunk my claims game. Another dishonest ploy.
What are you talking about?

Show me where I have failed to and deliberately avoided being specific where it was necessary.

Are you pi$$ed because I dont ramble on about some personal belief I concocted based on my personal sentimentality?
Subduction Zone wrote:
So yes, science cannot "prove" anything.
I REST MY CASE!!!!

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#80922 Mar 15, 2013
HOG_ Hand of God wrote:
<quoted text>
OMG!!!!!!
I thought you were dumb the moment you took an atheistic stance; but that statement just slaps the [email protected] icing on the cake.
The only place where no evidence for creation exists, is in a place where absolutely nothing exists; YOU IDIOT!
It is lunacy to say that there is no evidence for creation; the only thing you can question as such, regarding the presence of structure, is what actually created it.
IF "There is no scientific evidence for creation."; then you cant prove that man has created anything?
The means by which you seek to deny the existence of God will be the very means used to deny your existence. Keep it up.
<quoted text>
Thats because the education system is in favor of the secular. Hence it is too difficult and maybe even impossible to refute secular concepts using secular knowledge.
So its not that creation scientists are not willing to make a testable hypothesis of that nature; but rather that the system of knowledge does not allow them to do so.
So the nature of academics is to be blamed for that shortcoming, not creation scientists.
<quoted text>
Obviously you have never read the Bible.
So you are creatard after all.

Did you not notice I specifically stated there is no "scientific evidence" for creationism?

It is the fault of your fellow creatards that there is no scientific evidence for creation since there is no scientific hypothesis or theory of creation.

Once again you strike a nerve in the creatard "intellect" and all thinking ability goes out the window.

So you are trying to claim there is scientific evidence for creation.

Fine.

Then first you must state the scientific theory or hypothesis of creation and then what this evidence is.

If you don't you lose by definition of the term "scientific evidence".

Since: Mar 11

St. Croix valley

#80923 Mar 15, 2013
HOG_ Hand of God wrote:
<quoted text>
Obviously you have never read the Bible.
you mean where your god got his creation story ALMOST correct? that bible?

Sheesh!
HOG_ Hand of God

Kingston, Jamaica

#80924 Mar 15, 2013
woodtick57 wrote:
<quoted text>in fact i know quite a bit about many religious cults. this is why i can say with certainty that the god of the bible is a myth.
You are entitled to your opinion.
woodtick57 wrote:
note that I am not saying it disproves any god ever,t hat is impossible, but the god of the bible cannot be as described.
He is so marvelous and awe-inspiring. I know right.
woodtick57 wrote:
when you start with the supposittion "If the allmighty created nature.." you are not showing evidence of anything. you are making a suppostion not based on any facts.
I might not be immediately showing evidence of anything; but the line of reasoning CAN SHOW ME WHERE/HOW TO LOOK FOR EVIDENCE.

You know that. You know better.

You know that it is a valid practice to test the logical validity of an idea before you go about searching for it.

Stop wasting my time.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#80925 Mar 15, 2013
And again my challenge to any creatards out there.

Please try to read and understand this. A THEORY OF CREATION does not need to explain HOW god created the universe. It only needs to explain why they believe life is created from the observable evidence.

Creation scientists are not willing to write a testable hypothesis that describes what they see and why.

They have not been able to explain the fossil record using creationism.

They have not been able to explain homology verses convergent evolution via creationism.

They have not been able to explain the nested hierarchy of life with creationism.

They have not been able to explain ERV's with creationism.

I could go on and on listing the things that creationism has not been able to explain.

As I pointed out earlier if they could they would have a testable hypothesis they cold develop to see if they were correct.

Most know in their heart of hearts that they are not correct. That is why they will not develop a testable hypothesis.
HOG_ Hand of God

Kingston, Jamaica

#80926 Mar 15, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
...the Dark Matter itself cannot be seen. But then we cannot see electrons, neutrons, or protons. We can observe their effects...
Yet somehow you fail to see how the existence of the Almighty may be deduced, though only Its effects can be observed.

You are the true definition of hypocrisy.

Since: Mar 11

St. Croix valley

#80927 Mar 15, 2013
HOG_ Hand of God wrote:
<quoted text>
You are entitled to your opinion.
<quoted text>
He is so marvelous and awe-inspiring. I know right.
<quoted text>
I might not be immediately showing evidence of anything; but the line of reasoning CAN SHOW ME WHERE/HOW TO LOOK FOR EVIDENCE.
You know that. You know better.
You know that it is a valid practice to test the logical validity of an idea before you go about searching for it.
Stop wasting my time.
Facts are not opinion...

the god that gives slavery a big thumbs up is awesome? you must be as big of a prick as your god is...

sothen, where is this evidence of a god tha no human has ever found a shred of?

sheesh!

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#80928 Mar 15, 2013
HOG_ Hand of God wrote:
<quoted text>
Yet somehow you fail to see how the existence of the Almighty may be deduced, though only Its effects can be observed.
You are the true definition of hypocrisy.
Hardly. Here is evidence that my god exists, can you do better:

http://www.fermentarium.com/random-news/giant...

rAmen.
HOG_ Hand of God

Kingston, Jamaica

#80929 Mar 15, 2013
woodtick57 wrote:
<quoted text>this is why no-one has yet attempted to say exactly what this 'dark matter' is. we lnly know its effects.
now...wouldn't that same thing go for this 'god' you profess exists? when you can plop a scoop of your god an a lab table, we can start the discussion of its existence...
logic is fun!
Good post!

At this point, you unlike the rest, seem to be willing and able to think with fairness.

I appreciate you for that.

Its very important that we are WILLING to think fairly, no matter how much we think we know.

By now you should be able to understand why no "creationist" has yet attempted to say/show exactly what God is (or provide evidence as such): WE ONLY KNOW HIS/ITS EFFECTS.

Indeed, logic is fun.

LOL!

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#80930 Mar 15, 2013
HOG_ Hand of God wrote:
<quoted text>
Yet somehow you fail to see how the existence of the Almighty may be deduced, though only Its effects can be observed.
You are the true definition of hypocrisy.
And if your god did create the universe a scientist should be able to come up with a hypothesis that explains what we observe via that paradigm.

We are still waiting.
HOG_ Hand of God

Kingston, Jamaica

#80931 Mar 15, 2013
woodtick57 wrote:
<quoted text>Really?!? our understanding of Alzheimers comes from ancient civilizations? how so? they did lay the foundations of medicine but most of it was incorrect...
Is that what you heard?

Since: Mar 11

St. Croix valley

#80932 Mar 15, 2013
HOG_ Hand of God wrote:
<quoted text>
Good post!
At this point, you unlike the rest, seem to be willing and able to think with fairness.
I appreciate you for that.
Its very important that we are WILLING to think fairly, no matter how much we think we know.
By now you should be able to understand why no "creationist" has yet attempted to say/show exactly what God is (or provide evidence as such): WE ONLY KNOW HIS/ITS EFFECTS.
Indeed, logic is fun.
LOL!
there is nothing tha suggests any god or gods or goddesses had anything to do with creation.

if you are not trying to suggest any god, why all the bible quotes?

you seem to disprove your own posts....

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#80933 Mar 15, 2013
HOG_ Hand of God wrote:
<quoted text>
Good post!
At this point, you unlike the rest, seem to be willing and able to think with fairness.
I appreciate you for that.
Its very important that we are WILLING to think fairly, no matter how much we think we know.
By now you should be able to understand why no "creationist" has yet attempted to say/show exactly what God is (or provide evidence as such): WE ONLY KNOW HIS/ITS EFFECTS.
Indeed, logic is fun.
LOL!
Fine, then what are his effects and how does that show that he created the world. It is easy to make baseless claims. Backing them up is that hard part.
HOG_ Hand of God

Kingston, Jamaica

#80934 Mar 15, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
...Did you not notice I specifically stated there is no "scientific evidence" for creationism?
I intentionally disregard terminologies like "scientific evidence" and "scientific observation".

No evidence is any more or less scientific than any other; EITHER THERE IS EVIDENCE FOR A THING OR THERE IS NONE. Period. Hence it become unnecessary to distinguished between scientific and non-scientific evidence.

You only add those terminologies to make yourself feel special.
Subduction Zone wrote:
It is the fault of your fellow creatards that there is no scientific evidence for creation since there is no scientific hypothesis or theory of creation.
So its not that there is no "scientific" evidence; just that they havent found it yet? I tend to agree.
Subduction Zone wrote:
...
So you are trying to claim there is scientific evidence for creation.
Uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuh, I would say the fact that something is present suggests that it was created at sometime by something, somewhere. Wouldnt you?

LOL!!!
Subduction Zone wrote:
... If you don't you lose by definition of the term "scientific evidence".
Thats the only way I can lose; by the way you choose to define the terms at that point in time.

You aint more knowledgeable nor reasonable than the average creationist; you just shift things up a whole lot more and invent stuff to convince yourselves.

What is the function of forming separate terminologies as if to form a separate language?

Are you not the same people studying the same phenomena in the same universe?

If the normal terms used by the natural person cannot describe what is happening; then are you describing something supernatural and abnormal?
HOG_ Hand of God

Kingston, Jamaica

#80935 Mar 15, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
... A THEORY OF CREATION does not need to explain HOW god created the universe. It only needs to explain why they believe life is created from the observable evidence...
Seems to me that EVOLUTION THEORY is an attempt to replace the current THEORY OF CREATION with something a bit more... scientific.

Arent they attempting to explain why they believe life emerged from 'the inanimate'(which includes non-existence, interestingly enough)?
HOG_ Hand of God

Kingston, Jamaica

#80936 Mar 15, 2013
woodtick57 wrote:
...
sothen, where is this evidence of a god tha no human has ever found a shred of?
I am.

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