Evolution is intelligent design

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Lakeland, FL

#162 Nov 24, 2013
DarkBlue wrote:
<quoted text>
How does evolution actually "select" what works? Does evolution have other choices to select from?
I thought you just said you had an education? If you did, you would know the answers to your own questions.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Lakeland, FL

#163 Nov 24, 2013
DarkBlue wrote:
<quoted text>
Nice trick?? You said and I quote " Evolution selects what works, not what is perfect."
So again how does it select that? Be specific!
Survival and reproduction, dumbass! How many times do you have to be told this?

What schools was that? The Rev Billy Bob Double-Wide University?
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

#164 Nov 24, 2013
DarkBlue wrote:
<quoted text>
The mechanism is mutations that add to the DNA of a existing species which starts the change. More mutations are added over time and a newly designed species arises from it all.
No, FAIL.

The mechanism we are discussing is NOT mutations (which are a PART of the Theory of Evolution) but the OTHER mechanism of natural selection.

I'm asking you to explain to us HOW NATURAL SELECTION WORKS, in detail, preferably using an example.

Why are rabbits in the woods of central and northern Canada brown in color, for example?
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

#165 Nov 24, 2013
DarkBlue wrote:
<quoted text>
I answered your questions. Just not how you wanted them answered. Just like I say evolution is design you say it isn't. Simple as that
The difference is that we have no scientific evidence that evolution is "designed" and you are a Jesus freak working a religious agenda by claiming, against all the evidence, that it IS "designed."

Look, we KNOW your goal here is to have fun by being as irritating as possible, presumably in the name of Jesus and defending or promoting your religion (although you deny it). We KNOW that. Many of us have been here for YEARS and debated people just like you, playing the exact same game, many times.

If evolution is "designed," who did the designing? And what evidence to you have to support this contention?

“It Is What It Is”

Level 2

Since: Jul 13

Alberta, Canada

#166 Nov 24, 2013
DanFromSmithville wrote:
<quoted text>You focus on one example that doesn't support your position. What about all the other genera that contain numerous species. Onthophagus, Phyllophaga, Diplotaxis, Serica, Anomala, Strigoderma, Ataenius, Agrilus, Anthaxia, Athous and Agriotes. All these genera contain large numbers of extamt species. That fact alone refutes you weak position. All these genera have living species. The ranges of many overlap both temporally and geographically.
If one species is better designed than the other, then these genera would contain on only species according to your misinterpretation of evolution.
Letís try this once more. Look at the human evolution picture. You see as the species branched off the newer designed species went on. When they branched off multiple times having multiple newer designed species living at the same time, they both went on. But yet when one branch of the newer designed species failed to branch further(did not keep branching off) they became extinct because over time their design never improved like the other species that kept branching producing better designed species.

http://www.iupui.edu/~mstd/a103/Human%20Origi...

Now with the genera you name they had more branching and kept branching and kept branching so they have more species alive at the same time. Show me the branching of any of those genera you mention and then we can compare it to the branching of Homo and you will the genera you name branched more often and kept branching were Homo did not. That is why the genera you name have multiple species still alive at the same time. Homo had multiple species alive a few times but when the branching of a better designed species stopped, they became extinct.

“It Is What It Is”

Level 2

Since: Jul 13

Alberta, Canada

#167 Nov 24, 2013
Gillette wrote:
<quoted text>
No, FAIL.
The mechanism we are discussing is NOT mutations (which are a PART of the Theory of Evolution) but the OTHER mechanism of natural selection.
I'm asking you to explain to us HOW NATURAL SELECTION WORKS, in detail, preferably using an example.
Why are rabbits in the woods of central and northern Canada brown in color, for example?
Mutations are not the mechanism? If not for mutations changing the DNA thus changing the design of the species there would be nothing different for your natural selection to act upon. The beneficial mutations change the DNA, DNA starts changing the design, and overtime more mutations are acquired. Over time the design changes. The better designed have a better chance for survival and reproduction, so naturally the better designed prevail.

Which design is bigger, stronger, faster, has more ability, smarter, more capable, and functions the best.
Which one has the better design?

http://donsmaps.com/hominidimages/erectussapi...

“It Is What It Is”

Level 2

Since: Jul 13

Alberta, Canada

#168 Nov 24, 2013
Gillette wrote:
<quoted text>
The difference is that we have no scientific evidence that evolution is "designed" and you are a Jesus freak working a religious agenda by claiming, against all the evidence, that it IS "designed."
Look, we KNOW your goal here is to have fun by being as irritating as possible, presumably in the name of Jesus and defending or promoting your religion (although you deny it). We KNOW that. Many of us have been here for YEARS and debated people just like you, playing the exact same game, many times.
If evolution is "designed," who did the designing? And what evidence to you have to support this contention?
Evolution is not designed. Evolution is the designer. It designs better species via mutations to DNA over time.

“It Is What It Is”

Level 2

Since: Jul 13

Alberta, Canada

#169 Nov 24, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Survival and reproduction, dumbass! How many times do you have to be told this?
What schools was that? The Rev Billy Bob Double-Wide University?
Each mutation to the DNA changes the design a little. The more mutations acquired over time the greater the change to the design. As the design gets better the newer design has a better chance of surviving and reproducing.
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

#170 Nov 24, 2013
DarkBlue wrote:
<quoted text>
Mutations are not the mechanism?
They are not the mechanism WE WERE DISCUSSING.

They are ONE mechanism of evolution, and natural selection is ANOTHER, that works along with mutations.

You wrote some crackpot bullshit about natural selection apparently being a directed process and I asked you to please explain what you think natural selection IS and how it WORKS.

I ask you again.
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

#171 Nov 24, 2013
DarkBlue wrote:
<quoted text>
Evolution is not designed. Evolution is the designer.
Do you man that metaphorically? Or literally?

Because "design" implies intention and a consciousness behind it at work.

“It Is What It Is”

Level 2

Since: Jul 13

Alberta, Canada

#172 Nov 24, 2013
Gillette wrote:
<quoted text>
They are not the mechanism WE WERE DISCUSSING.
They are ONE mechanism of evolution, and natural selection is ANOTHER, that works along with mutations.
You wrote some crackpot bullshit about natural selection apparently being a directed process and I asked you to please explain what you think natural selection IS and how it WORKS.
I ask you again.
Natural selection is a made up metaphor to avoid design. Each species that precedes its predecessor is better designed for survival, thus helping insure its survival. I know it and you know it.

“It Is What It Is”

Level 2

Since: Jul 13

Alberta, Canada

#173 Nov 24, 2013
Gillette wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you man that metaphorically? Or literally?
Because "design" implies intention and a consciousness behind it at work.
Take it how ever you want to take it. Evolution, acting on mutations to the DNA, redesigns species for their environments. DNA is the blue print of every species. Change that blueprint, which mutations do and you change the design. It is that simple.

Level 7

Since: Sep 07

Huntington Beach, CA

#174 Nov 25, 2013
DarkBlue wrote:
<quoted text>
Natural selection is a made up metaphor to avoid design. Each species that precedes its predecessor is better designed for survival, thus helping insure its survival. I know it and you know it.
So, each new generation of Bison is better adapted to their new environment and that's why we have had ever increasing population counts on Bison?

Oh, wait. That's right. We don't. We have protected enclaves that we keep alive because they have not and can not adapt to the world which is changing around them fast enough.

Did the designer just forget to update bison?

What about the literally billions of other species which have come and gone since life began on earth? Did they forget to click "update" as well?

Level 7

Since: Sep 07

Huntington Beach, CA

#175 Nov 25, 2013
DarkBlue wrote:
<quoted text>
Take it how ever you want to take it. Evolution, acting on mutations to the DNA, redesigns species for their environments. DNA is the blue print of every species. Change that blueprint, which mutations do and you change the design. It is that simple.
"Design" implies a planned outcome.

Do you really think that EVERY mutation is planned? That every retarded child is a special gift from the designer?

“It Is What It Is”

Level 2

Since: Jul 13

Alberta, Canada

#176 Nov 25, 2013
Nuggin wrote:
<quoted text>
So, each new generation of Bison is better adapted to their new environment and that's why we have had ever increasing population counts on Bison?
Oh, wait. That's right. We don't. We have protected enclaves that we keep alive because they have not and can not adapt to the world which is changing around them fast enough.
Did the designer just forget to update bison?
What about the literally billions of other species which have come and gone since life began on earth? Did they forget to click "update" as well?
Too many Bison are killed by man. In the free roaming Yellowstone herds just a few years ago around 500 were killed off and sent to the slaughter house. How many species are near extinction or have became extinct not by nature, but by man?

“It Is What It Is”

Level 2

Since: Jul 13

Alberta, Canada

#177 Nov 25, 2013
Nuggin wrote:
<quoted text>
"Design" implies a planned outcome.
Do you really think that EVERY mutation is planned? That every retarded child is a special gift from the designer?
I did not say the mutations are planned. The mutations happen, good and bad. Each mutations affects the DNA and the design the DNA produces over time. Mutations + DNA + time = new design. That is evolution. There is no guarantee that the mutations will not do harm. The bad designs die off and the good designs continue on.

Level 7

Since: Sep 07

Huntington Beach, CA

#178 Nov 26, 2013
DarkBlue wrote:
<quoted text>
Too many Bison are killed by man. In the free roaming Yellowstone herds just a few years ago around 500 were killed off and sent to the slaughter house. How many species are near extinction or have became extinct not by nature, but by man?
Of the BILLIONS of species which have gone extinct only a sliver of a fraction involve humans.

However, by your hypothesis, only ONE GENERATION is needed for Bison to switch from slow breeding and vulnerable to bullets to fast breeding and immortal so that the "Design" can protect his design.

Why didn't that happen?

Or why didn't that grow wings? Or turn invisible? Or aquatic? All of these design changes would prevent extinction. They've had plenty of generations to accomplish any of these via design

Level 7

Since: Sep 07

Huntington Beach, CA

#179 Nov 26, 2013
DarkBlue wrote:
<quoted text>
I did not say the mutations are planned. The mutations happen, good and bad. Each mutations affects the DNA and the design the DNA produces over time. Mutations + DNA + time = new design. That is evolution. There is no guarantee that the mutations will not do harm. The bad designs die off and the good designs continue on.
DNA can not create a design.
Just like a blue print is not CREATING the design of the building.
Just like a computer code is not CREATING the design of the program.

Saying "design" means that there must be a deliberate individual autonomously making changes to the subject of its design.

DNA is not making design because DNA is not autonomous of the outcome.

“It Is What It Is”

Level 2

Since: Jul 13

Alberta, Canada

#180 Nov 27, 2013
Nuggin wrote:
<quoted text>
Of the BILLIONS of species which have gone extinct only a sliver of a fraction involve humans.
Correct. The rest became extinct from evolution while some by natural disaster.
Nuggin wrote:
<quoted text> However, by your hypothesis, only ONE GENERATION is needed for Bison to switch from slow breeding and vulnerable to bullets to fast breeding and immortal so that the "Design" can protect his design.
Why didn't that happen?
Surely you can't be serious. I have never said one generation. I have said mutations being passed to offspring and mutations being added over time. Bison are designed just fine for their environment they live. Evolution does not add in for the stupid human and his weapons.
Nuggin wrote:
<quoted text> Or why didn't that grow wings? Or turn invisible? Or aquatic? All of these design changes would prevent extinction. They've had plenty of generations to accomplish any of these via design
Bison are designed for land and designed well for their environment. Their biggest enemy is human. Again evolution does not factor in the human and his weapons.

“It Is What It Is”

Level 2

Since: Jul 13

Alberta, Canada

#181 Nov 27, 2013
Nuggin wrote:
<quoted text>
DNA can not create a design.
Just like a blue print is not CREATING the design of the building.
Just like a computer code is not CREATING the design of the program.
Saying "design" means that there must be a deliberate individual autonomously making changes to the subject of its design.
DNA is not making design because DNA is not autonomous of the outcome.
Your whole shape, color of hair, color of eyes etc is from your DNA. Your DNA is what designed you.

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