Athens, Skopje Media War

Feb 18, 2009 | Posted by: macedonian1 | Full story: balkaninsight.com

The case of a Macedonian mental patient who says he is a Serb 'working for Slav-Hellenic friendship' has sparked a propaganda war between Macedonia and Greece, reaching even diplomats and European Union officials in Brussels.

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Free Vasko

Tübingen, Germany

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#1
Feb 18, 2009
 

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The article contains several errors such as the organisation's name, which is not "Slavic–Hellenic Association" but the Slavic Philhellenic Network. The network does not strive for close relationship of Serbia with Greece but of Slavs and Greeks, as its name implies. Particularly the Slavs of FYROM and Greece. This is clearly anathema, as the current government in Skopjie is not interested in the least in good relations with Greece. That is enough to make Mr Gligorijevic seem mad in the government's eyes.
Vasko Gligorijevic does not deny the existence of Macedonians, he has rather filed with FYROM's judiciary an Averment pro se, a legal document in which he challenges anyone with an opposite view to take his claim to a court for a proper decision (see below), a course of action avoided by the government of FYROM. His claim is that Macedonians were and are Greeks. That the heritage of FYROM is Slavic - not Serbian!

The way your article has misrepresented Mr Gligorijevic speaks clearly about your un-journalistic bias.

Mr Gligorijevic had been arrested before, at a time when he had filed an Avernment pro se to the FYROMacedonian judiciary with a note sent to a website that his submission "is legally equal to "affidavit" and "can and will be used against you"". Briefly, he was stating that

"XIX) By stating the facts in the previous chapter, to the uttermost of my knowledge, the truth, nothing more, nothing less, without guilty mind or in dissimulation, 1. I, Vasil Gligorov, as an act of free will,[…] do affirm these truths, remaining ready to prove them in case of any challenge, being assured in them as a result of a critical, open-minded study of the matters exposed, that: 2. Macedonians were and are Hellenes, from their genesis in antiquity to the present day.[…] The existence of these Pseudomacedonians was first brought by their "recognition", in spite of historical and ethnologic realities, by the acts of the 53 illegitimate AVNOJ organization. Many people, primarily conscious Bulgarians and also Serbs and others, suffered by the post-WW II regime in Yugoslavia because of their rejection of the forced "Macedonisation". The wrongful Yugoslav intrusion into the 1946-1949 Civil War in Greece is a crime, the motive of which was in accordance with the Pseudomacedonian ideology of expropriation of the real Macedonia. 5. The usurpation of Hellenic heritage and expansionist agenda by the many Pseudomacedonians, including segments of their state, where the fake doctrine of "Macedonism" is an official creed, is not only one of the main generator of crisis in the Balkans, but it is an self-injury of the Slavic Pseudomacedonians to their true, traditional heritages: Bulgarian and Serbian. I, Vasil Gligorov, thereby, affirm that the victory of truth and reason over the forces of Bolshevik Pseudomacedonism will benefit Slavs of FYROM, Slavs in general, Greeks and all other parties involved in these unfortunate circumstances."

Following that first arrest and brief imprisonment some two years ago, he was released without consequences. Clearly his continuing activism has upset the current government. It is very lame to turn away a group of concerned foreign nationals by saying psychiatric patients cannot be allowed visitors. This simply does not happen in a democratic society - it does not normally even happen in a prison.

Mr Gligorijevic should be permitted a doctor of his own choice, and legal advice of his own choice. This is a disgrace.

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“It is time in the West to defend not so much human rights as human obligations.”
Alexander Solzhenitsyn
Skopje Macedonia

Kocani, Macedonia

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#3
Feb 18, 2009
 

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Vasko is Just figment of the greek imagination and greek antimacedonian propagnda.
Makedonia e Makedonska

Skopje, Macedonia

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#4
Feb 18, 2009
 

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Makedonia e Makedonska
Makedonia e Makedonska

Skopje, Macedonia

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#5
Feb 18, 2009
 

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Aleksandar Makedonski doshol od Makedonia preku nok ja osvil Atina,Aleksandar Makedonski doshol kako osvojuvac vo Grcija i gi pokoril grcishtata
Free Vasko

Tübingen, Germany

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#6
Feb 18, 2009
 

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Skopje Macedonia wrote:
Vasko is Just figment of the greek imagination and greek antimacedonian propagnda.
Until tonight, according to the FYROMian media, he had parents.
Eni Macedonia

Thessaloníki, Greece

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#7
Feb 18, 2009
 

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How can Greeks be antimacedonian?
Macedonians are Hellenes-Greeks.
Pseudomacedonians are antimacedonians.
Aleksandar

Australia

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#8
Feb 18, 2009
 

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Wow, maybe the Macedonians should take greece to court and get the greeks to proove their pure bloodline to Aleksandar the Great!
hahahahahahaha what would they think of next!
Free Vasko wrote:
The article contains several errors such as the organisation's name, which is not "Slavic–Hellenic Association" but the Slavic Philhellenic Network. The network does not strive for close relationship of Serbia with Greece but of Slavs and Greeks, as its name implies. Particularly the Slavs of FYROM and Greece. This is clearly anathema, as the current government in Skopjie is not interested in the least in good relations with Greece. That is enough to make Mr Gligorijevic seem mad in the government's eyes.
Vasko Gligorijevic does not deny the existence of Macedonians, he has rather filed with FYROM's judiciary an Averment pro se, a legal document in which he challenges anyone with an opposite view to take his claim to a court for a proper decision (see below), a course of action avoided by the government of FYROM. His claim is that Macedonians were and are Greeks. That the heritage of FYROM is Slavic - not Serbian!
The way your article has misrepresented Mr Gligorijevic speaks clearly about your un-journalistic bias.
Mr Gligorijevic had been arrested before, at a time when he had filed an Avernment pro se to the FYROMacedonian judiciary with a note sent to a website that his submission "is legally equal to "affidavit" and "can and will be used against you"". Briefly, he was stating that
"XIX) By stating the facts in the previous chapter, to the uttermost of my knowledge, the truth, nothing more, nothing less, without guilty mind or in dissimulation, 1. I, Vasil Gligorov, as an act of free will,[…] do affirm these truths, remaining ready to prove them in case of any challenge, being assured in them as a result of a critical, open-minded study of the matters exposed, that: 2. Macedonians were and are Hellenes, from their genesis in antiquity to the present day.[…] The existence of these Pseudomacedonians was first brought by their "recognition", in spite of historical and ethnologic realities, by the acts of the 53 illegitimate AVNOJ organization. Many people, primarily conscious Bulgarians and also Serbs and others, suffered by the post-WW II regime in Yugoslavia because of their rejection of the forced "Macedonisation". The wrongful Yugoslav intrusion into the 1946-1949 Civil War in Greece is a crime, the motive of which was in accordance with the Pseudomacedonian ideology of expropriation of the real Macedonia. 5. The usurpation of Hellenic heritage and expansionist agenda by the many Pseudomacedonians, including segments of their state, where the fake doctrine of "Macedonism" is an official creed, is not only one of the main generator of crisis in the Balkans, but it is an self-injury of the Slavic Pseudomacedonians to their true, traditional heritages: Bulgarian and Serbian. I, Vasil Gligorov, thereby, affirm that the victory of truth and reason over the forces of Bolshevik Pseudomacedonism will benefit Slavs of FYROM, Slavs in general, Greeks and all other parties involved in these unfortunate circumstances."
Following that first arrest and brief imprisonment some two years ago, he was released without consequences. Clearly his continuing activism has upset the current government. It is very lame to turn away a group of concerned foreign nationals by saying psychiatric patients cannot be allowed visitors. This simply does not happen in a democratic society - it does not normally even happen in a prison.
Mr Gligorijevic should be permitted a doctor of his own choice, and legal advice of his own choice. This is a disgrace.
----------
“It is time in the West to defend not so much human rights as human obligations.”
Alexander Solzhenitsyn
karaskotadomavro poutsaras

Athens, Greece

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Feb 18, 2009
 

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Aleksandar wrote:
Wow, maybe the Macedonians should take greece to court and get the greeks to proove their pure bloodline to Aleksandar the Great!
hahahahahahaha what would they think of next!
<quoted text>
.
go to the beach re amigo
Free Vasko

Tübingen, Germany

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Feb 18, 2009
 

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Aleksandar wrote:
Wow, maybe the Macedonians should take greece to court and get the greeks to proove their pure bloodline to Aleksandar the Great!
hahahahahahaha what would they think of next!
<quoted text>
Greeks do not need to prove that ALexander spread the Greek language and idea to the rest of the known world. In all the Western world today the ones who are least Macedonian and least Greek are you.

Greeks of course are not going to imitate your fascist theories about Macedonian genes and all that ridiculous stuff. Read something of what Vasko said Philistine and educate yourself:

http://vardaraxios.wordpress.com/
REAL Macedonian

Skopje, Macedonia

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#11
Feb 18, 2009
 

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shame on your.

abusing sick people for the stupidity and paranoiac Greek propaganda!!!!!!!!!!

if you really meant something good (which i highly doubt), why didn't you left your "gifts" to his mother. why you didn't visit her? She is "free" in this "undemocratic country". Second, why don't you followed the procedure - to ask for a permit from the ministry of health?

You just embarked in front of a mental hospital, in order to make "story". You live in inventing stories, especially "history". And you call yourself Christians....
caveria

Thessaloníki, Greece

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Feb 18, 2009
 

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i dont understand you people..why so much dispute and disagreement?why so much fear and non spiritual attitude?alexander was from one greek tribe living in north greece+south balcan called macedonia.spoke greek,believed in common greek gods,had greek culture.after centuries macedonia naturally splitted.like everything else on planet.we all live on macedonia land.mostly greek land.and before greek who knows whose..we dont own earth,air,water.after all that time blood is mixed,cultures are mixed.why is this bad?this is evolution,love,growing up.we all live here.some on north part of macedonia,having a slavic language and culture.some on south part of macedonia having a greek language and culture.macedonia doesnt belong to noone.it is just a name,a place,a history.we,people belong to macedonia.and it seems like neither pays any respect to macedonia.claim only what is right and possible..mostly claim your consience.its the only thing we have..until we return to macedonian land for the last time..be calm.be true.be human.there is no border inside heart.none
TTIN

Bay City, MI

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#13
Feb 18, 2009
 
Right or wrong he doesn't have to be insane to think this or otherwise all the Greeks arguing that Macedonians are Greeks and the Slavic Macedonians are not the same Macedonians would be insane. This is political persecution unless there's some other reason he was deemed insane. He should at least have a hearing where he is "sane until proven insane". Otherwise Macedonia can just declare anyone insane that they want and put them away.

I can see both sides to this issue. Macedonians(Slavic) are a real ethnicity. They're a new ethnicity that branched off of the Bulgarians, but they're real just like the French and Italians formed from the Romans but that doesn't mean they're not a real ethnicities. Since throughout their existance as an ethnicity they've called themselves Macedonians it would make no sense for them to stop doing that.

At the same time they don't have to claim that the Greek Macedonians are the same Macedonians that they are or that the Ancient Macedonians are related to them when history shows that they aren't. We have the state of Georgia here in the US and then there's the country of Georgia in the Caucusses but neither claims that they share a history. Macedonia should keep its name but stop claiming they are the same as the Greek Macedonians or teaching Ancient Macedonian history as part of their history.
REAL Macedonian

Skopje, Macedonia

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Feb 18, 2009
 

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@caveria

You are talking about 2300 years ago, as if it was yesterday, even you don't know what he spoke as mother tongue (we all speak here English, but I AM NOT english) nor where the sons of his soldiers continued to live and with whom.

You (and Greeks) insist that you know who was what 2300 years ago, even only 500 years ago people believed that planet EARTH was FLAT and that Sun rotates around it.

Stop talking about history if you don't have something to hide (and so called "greeks" of today has many lies to hide), and let's talk what is the problem that Macedonians in Greece TODAY can not speak their mother tongue at the schools of the "Republic of Greece"?
caveria

Thessaloníki, Greece

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#15
Feb 18, 2009
 
nice saying TTIN.. macedonia cant keep its name as it is because it is not the whole of macedonia. it is only a small part of north macedonia. it is not proper or fair for the greek biggest part. it is better to claim a bit different more appropriate name.
as long as the ancint heritage comew, history doesnt nor can prove who is related to whom.
of course a lot of greek people still have the ancient greek macedonian gene. probably a few people in fyrom too. so what? is someone better than the other? does this give the right to anyone to claim anything? we have to stop looking at the past. stay at present and realise that anything that make us have fear, anger, hate, dispute is pure propaganda. because only one thing is sure and shared in common on this planet.
we are all humans, spiritual children.
caveria

Thessaloníki, Greece

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#16
Feb 18, 2009
 
real macedonian
i am not greek.
i am a citizen of the world.
i have seen macedonian ruins and read foreign archaiological researchs. i am convinced that at those times they spoke a greek dialect. i am sorry you dont see that. but i dont care about that.
even if things are just as you say..
you understand that they couldnt speak this macedonian language because it is not recognised as macedonian on greek land. there already is a macedonian language. the grrek one.just like when you dont know what something is,then it is not acceptable. simple psychology.
please dont be so negative. there arent any real enemies.. a lot of misunderstandings perhaps. egoism.
i am not greek because first of all i am a human being/person. if greece or usa or fyrom or macedonia or china makes me restless i know i will follow my heart, Ghandhi's axample, Jesus truth.
macedonian

Macedonia

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Feb 18, 2009
 

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grcista krvta da vi ja ebam site znaete MAKEDONSSKI A SE PRAETE grci da vi gi ebam sestrite da umrete site
Zoran

Skopje, Macedonia

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#18
Feb 18, 2009
 
caveria wrote:
i dont understand you people..why so much dispute and disagreement?why so much fear and non spiritual attitude?alexander was from one greek tribe living in north greece+south balcan called macedonia.spoke greek,believed in common greek gods,had greek culture.after centuries macedonia naturally splitted.like everything else on planet.we all live on macedonia land.mostly greek land.and before greek who knows whose..we dont own earth,air,water.after all that time blood is mixed,cultures are mixed.why is this bad?this is evolution,love,growing up.we all live here.some on north part of macedonia,having a slavic language and culture.some on south part of macedonia having a greek language and culture.macedonia doesnt belong to noone.it is just a name,a place,a history.we,people belong to macedonia.and it seems like neither pays any respect to macedonia.claim only what is right and possible..mostly claim your consience.its the only thing we have..until we return to macedonian land for the last time..be calm.be true.be human.there is no border inside heart.none
Caveria, this is probably the first post with postive and human attidude here! Thanks!
CANADEZOS

Toronto, Canada

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Feb 18, 2009
 

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Eni Macedonia wrote:
How can Greeks be antimacedonian?
Macedonians are Hellenes-Greeks.
Pseudomacedonians are antimacedonians.
THE RASON WHY THEY DENY ALL ORIGINAL MACEDONIAN NAMES&IMPOSE THEIR SLAVOBULGARIAN NAMES MACEDONIAN NOTHING!
Macedonoid

Greece

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#21
Feb 18, 2009
 

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TTIN wrote:
Right or wrong he doesn't have to be insane to think this or otherwise all the Greeks arguing that Macedonians are Greeks and the Slavic Macedonians are not the same Macedonians would be insane. This is political persecution unless there's some other reason he was deemed insane. He should at least have a hearing where he is "sane until proven insane". Otherwise Macedonia can just declare anyone insane that they want and put them away.
I can see both sides to this issue. Macedonians(Slavic) are a real ethnicity. They're a new ethnicity that branched off of the Bulgarians, but they're real just like the French and Italians formed from the Romans but that doesn't mean they're not a real ethnicities. Since throughout their existance as an ethnicity they've called themselves Macedonians it would make no sense for them to stop doing that.
At the same time they don't have to claim that the Greek Macedonians are the same Macedonians that they are or that the Ancient Macedonians are related to them when history shows that they aren't. We have the state of Georgia here in the US and then there's the country of Georgia in the Caucusses but neither claims that they share a history. Macedonia should keep its name but stop claiming they are the same as the Greek Macedonians or teaching Ancient Macedonian history as part of their history.
one more document about their paranoia is this video from their OFFICIAL STATE TV. the video translated by mr. Gligorijevic which arrested for fyromian police

the video shows parts of Greece, history of Greece, and....one paranoid idea that the "Macedonians" are mother of the arian-white race ,. It reminds me NAZI propaganda

watch it if you want

http://www.youtube.com/watch...

Since: Feb 09

Athens, Greece

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#22
Feb 18, 2009
 

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Macedonia was and will always be a Greek province !!!!!!!
Slavs have nothing to do with Ancient Macedonia.
Skopian's fantasy was triggered by Tito's and Stalin's Communist Propaganda in order to break the Western alliance and have access to the sea. Unfortunately for them they will never have access to any sea , They will be conmemned to leave all their lifes on the Mountains.

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