Ten Commandments monument raises civi...

Ten Commandments monument raises civil liberty concerns in Wyoming County

There are 353 comments on the Charleston Gazette story from Jul 4, 2013, titled Ten Commandments monument raises civil liberty concerns in Wyoming County. In it, Charleston Gazette reports that:

A group of people did not seek permission before installing a monument of the Ten Commandments on the Wyoming County Courthouse lawn in Pineville this week, County Commission President Jason Mullins said, but he doesn't see a problem with it because it's meant to inspire others and isn't paid for with tax dollars.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Charleston Gazette.

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Ironic

Cyclone, WV

#1 Jul 6, 2013
It'sf ironic that we would defend the right to have the Ten Commandments on the lawn of our Courthouse while we overlook the fact that most of them are broken everyday by the "back room justice" that goes on in that building.
Joe knows

Ardsley, NY

#2 Jul 7, 2013
I agree with your comment above, however, I am only responsible for one person, me.
Sesmo

Hurricane, WV

#3 Jul 7, 2013
It is an impotent act done by ignorant people for ignoble purposes.
sadsadsad

Pineville, WV

#4 Jul 7, 2013
You people are not happy with anything!! You people have got to bitch! Some people have nothing good to say.. If it's good or bad, ya just bitch! It's really sad! Its up there to remind us all of what we stand for!
Old Man Mck

Ridgeview, WV

#6 Jul 9, 2013
Aw, come on, folks. It's just ole Bill and some of the boys trying to get a fight started. Sit back and enjoy it! Plus, you get to see County officials stumbling over each other trying to convince people it was all their idea to start with. Lots of fun to be had here.
sadsadsad

Pineville, WV

#7 Jul 9, 2013
lol..your right old man, your so right! But it's still a shame that people act the way they do!
James T Kirk

Hansford, WV

#8 Jul 9, 2013
Since you obviously don't need any approval to put a monument on county property, can we take up a collection and put a statue of me on the courthouse lawn? Or better yet, can we just run down there and put a few junk cars on cinder blocks? You know, to commemorate the proud heritage and traditions of this area of the country!

Next thing you know, some right wing religious group will sneak a monument to fallen Klan members down there. Never forget that they claim the same right to practice their hate under the guise of religious freedom! How about one honoring all those great slaves who built this country. Heck, at this rate of regression, we may be able to get slavery legalized again!
James T Kirk

Hansford, WV

#9 Jul 9, 2013
BTW. Conveniently ignoring and not putting this to a vote by these commissioners was an act of cowardice. If they thought it constitutional, why not have it approved like any other project on PUBLIC property?
James T Kirk

Hansford, WV

#10 Jul 9, 2013
The right to freedom of religion is so central to American democracy that it was enshrined in the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.

The Founding Fathers wrote the First Amendment in response to two centuries of state-sponsored religious conflict and oppression in America, and with a keen understanding of the religious persecution in European nations resulting from official state religions and religious wars.

Recognizing the unique and intimate nature of religion, the Founding Fathers wisely put religion on a different footing from other forms of speech and observance – mandating strict separation of religion and government to ensure religious freedom for all individuals and faiths. Largely because of the First Amendment's prohibition against government regulation or endorsement of religion, diverse faiths have flourished and thrived in America since the founding of the republic.

James Madison, our nation's fourth president and "Father of the Constitution," concisely summed up the reasons for and benefits of the First Amendment's unique treatment of religion:

It was the belief of all sects at one time that the establishment of Religion by law, was right & necessary; that the true religion ought to be established in exclusion of every other; And that the only question to be decided was which was the true religion. The example of Holland proved that a toleration of sects, dissenting from the established sect, was safe & even useful. The example of the Colonies, now States, which rejected religious establishments altogether, proved that all Sects might be safely & advantageously put on a footing of equal & entire freedom.... We are teaching the world the great truth that Govts. do better without Kings & Nobles than with them. The merit will be doubled by the other lesson that Religion flourishes in greater purity, without than with the aid of Gov.(Letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822).
right

Springfield, NJ

#11 Jul 10, 2013
James T Kirk wrote:
BTW. Conveniently ignoring and not putting this to a vote by these commissioners was an act of cowardice. If they thought it constitutional, why not have it approved like any other project on PUBLIC property?
I agree with James.
Oceana Guy

Chesapeake, OH

#12 Jul 10, 2013
Justice is a tricky thing, as the ten commandments so perfectly demonstrate. You can complain about back room justice all you want but the truth is our judicial system does the best it can in a world where everyone is guilty before that same law. I promise you, if you had gotten properly convicted and sentenced for every time you broke the speed limit, you would gave so many reckless driving offenses (speeding just 15 miles over the limit) your great grandkids couldn't get a drivers license. Fortunately we have a system that seeks a proper balance of mercy and absolute justice. The ten commandments demonstrate that we are all lawbreakers before God, lost unless He stands in our place and drinks the wrath of perfect justice. In other words, if any of us got what we had coming, we would be a place if weeping and wailing, a place of gnashing our teeth. Pure horror. Hope for mercy not justice. As for me, I don't know who put the monument up, but I will be there to protect and defend it. The monument's removal will be fought against by this citizen.

Since: Jul 12

Welch, WV

#13 Jul 10, 2013
I have a theory of why this has taken place:

Churches in this area have, for decades, actively done their part in trying to redeem and rehabilitate our community members. Very recently, the "documentary" Oxyana would lead a person to believe that NObody did ANYthing to prevent ANYone from getting completely caught up in a drug addicted life. This has angered some of our "good" community members - as if their work to save the druggies was completely in vain and not even worth mentioning. These same people raised the money to build this monument in a very PUBLIC effort to DO SOMETHING about our out-of-control drug problem.

What this monument provides is a guideline - the same guideline that our passionate Christian community members use themselves - to guide their actions so that they have complete self-control. The 10 Commandments is the advice that our church-going community members want to communicate to our out-of-control drug-addicted community members. They are telling these people that if they follow these rules, then they can cure THEMSELVES of drug addiction - since nobody else has been able to cure them of it.

The fact that its sitting on the courthouse lawn is a complete stunt if you ask me. Hasn't the ACLU already established that religious teachings are not appropriate on public property? The people who put that monument there KNOW that - they want someone to fuss about it so the TV cameras and journalists will be interested enough to publicize what these churches are up to.

They want to get their message out: Drug-addicts! We want to save you!

I think their actions are touching and commendable. Maybe illegal though. Passionate, definitely!

Since: Jul 12

Welch, WV

#14 Jul 10, 2013
Here is how some Atheists handled a similar situation in a FL town.

http://now.msn.com/atheist-monument-erected-o...

This is what I can read on the front of the monument/bench:

An atheist believes that a hospital should be built instead of a church. An atheist believes that a deed must be done instead of a prayer said. An atheist strives for an involvement in life and not escape into death. He wants disease conquered, poverty banished, and war eliminated.

Commendable.
Lambrusco

Charlottesville, VA

#15 Jul 12, 2013
Awesome_Steve_Monkey wrote:
Here is how some Atheists handled a similar situation in a FL town.
http://now.msn.com/atheist-monument-erected-o...
This is what I can read on the front of the monument/bench:
An atheist believes that a hospital should be built instead of a church. An atheist believes that a deed must be done instead of a prayer said. An atheist strives for an involvement in life and not escape into death. He wants disease conquered, poverty banished, and war eliminated.
Commendable.
And where did you get that credible information???

Since: Jul 12

Welch, WV

#17 Jul 12, 2013
Lambrusco wrote:
<quoted text>And where did you get that credible information???
That web page/article was posted in another Topix forum - I cannot remember where I saw it - the Beckley forum, perhaps? Maybe Charleston..

The "atheist message" was what I could read from the picture of the bench/monument from that same web page.

Did you want to make one to donate to the Pineville courthouse lawn?
Secret Shopper

Welch, WV

#18 Jul 12, 2013
James T Kirk wrote:
BTW. Conveniently ignoring and not putting this to a vote by these commissioners was an act of cowardice. If they thought it constitutional, why not have it approved like any other project on PUBLIC property?
Exactly! How can they say it is OK just because they claimed not to know it was happening? Good grief! What else goes on while these buffoons walk around blind?
Interesting

Brunswick, OH

#19 Jul 13, 2013
Awesome_Steve_Monkey wrote:
I have a theory of why this has taken place:
Churches in this area have, for decades, actively done their part in trying to redeem and rehabilitate our community members. Very recently, the "documentary" Oxyana would lead a person to believe that NObody did ANYthing to prevent ANYone from getting completely caught up in a drug addicted life. This has angered some of our "good" community members - as if their work to save the druggies was completely in vain and not even worth mentioning. These same people raised the money to build this monument in a very PUBLIC effort to DO SOMETHING about our out-of-control drug problem.
What this monument provides is a guideline - the same guideline that our passionate Christian community members use themselves - to guide their actions so that they have complete self-control. The 10 Commandments is the advice that our church-going community members want to communicate to our out-of-control drug-addicted community members. They are telling these people that if they follow these rules, then they can cure THEMSELVES of drug addiction - since nobody else has been able to cure them of it.
The fact that its sitting on the courthouse lawn is a complete stunt if you ask me. Hasn't the ACLU already established that religious teachings are not appropriate on public property? The people who put that monument there KNOW that - they want someone to fuss about it so the TV cameras and journalists will be interested enough to publicize what these churches are up to.
They want to get their message out: Drug-addicts! We want to save you!
I think their actions are touching and commendable. Maybe illegal though. Passionate, definitely!
So they are seeking mans approval instead of gods?
Pastor Mike

Charlottesville, VA

#20 Jul 13, 2013
Awesome_Steve_Monkey wrote:
<quoted text>
That web page/article was posted in another Topix forum - I cannot remember where I saw it - the Beckley forum, perhaps? Maybe Charleston..
The "atheist message" was what I could read from the picture of the bench/monument from that same web page.
Did you want to make one to donate to the Pineville courthouse lawn?
I wouldn't donate anything to the Pineville courthouse. I still remember the one arm bandits disappearing out the back door of the courthouse after they were confiscated from the Old Oceana Moose Lodge.

Since: Jul 12

Welch, WV

#21 Jul 13, 2013
sadsadsad wrote:
You people are not happy with anything!! You people have got to bitch! Some people have nothing good to say.. If it's good or bad, ya just bitch! It's really sad! Its up there to remind us all of what we stand for!
Wait a minute - are you bitching about how bitchy we are?

Since: Jul 12

Welch, WV

#22 Jul 13, 2013
Interesting wrote:
<quoted text>
So they are seeking mans approval instead of gods?
They didn't seek ANY approval it seems. Or those in charge must have "approved" by not stopping them from placing this religious monument on public property.

What I was saying is: Some people who are angered about a Christian monument are the ones who talk about what a horrible, drug-infested, dead town we live in. They'll give you a long explanation of how and why drug junkies aren't worth anyone's time and should be avoided by everyone. It has been suggested that we give them EXTRA drugs so they will hurry up and overdose so we can be rid of them.

The act of building a monument with the 10 Commandments and placing it in full view of our community was an honest act of compassion and concern for the PEOPLE in our town. Even the drug-addicted ones. You know, before they built a monument, CHURCHES spent years quietly, humbly, and sincerely trying to redeem these people - trying to SAVE them, not get RID of them!

The act of putting it on public property has to be a publicity stunt. Even IF the monument is required to be taken down - I will expect to see it again on some private property within the town - and I will recognize it from having seen it on the courthouse lawn. Then this monument will be MORE than a Bible quotation - it will represent the time when the Christians stood up and tried to take the town back. Right now, the Christians are standing up to the LAW to proclaim that God's law reins over the court's law.

They must think what they are doing is God's will and so they just did it. It will be the responsibility of the LAW and the courts to determine if they will be allowed to keep doing it.

I imagine the Christians are anticipating a rapidly changing future - I know I am - so they put their rules out there for everybody to see. Hey everyone! Just do these 10 things - if EVERYBODY would do them - we can work together to keep our town functioning if and when we begin to witness our government falling apart.

This is pure speculation, of course.

You haven't witnessed the government falling apart, have you?

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