Wisconsin lawmakers approve bill requ...

Wisconsin lawmakers approve bill requiring ultrasound before abortion

There are 174 comments on the Fox News story from Jun 14, 2013, titled Wisconsin lawmakers approve bill requiring ultrasound before abortion. In it, Fox News reports that:

The state Assembly has approved a Republican bill that would require women seeking an abortion to get an ultrasound of the fetus.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Fox News.

Ocean56

AOL

#30 Jun 16, 2013
zef wrote:
Women can go to some country that doesn't care what people might be looking at to kill their babies. If they choose to kill their baby in America, we must know and approve of what they are staring at.
I'm just very glad of two things: 1. I don't live in Wisconsin, and 2. I no longer have to worry about the unwanted burden of pregnancy, thanks to nature stopping my reproductive process.

But I'll still fight for the women still in their reproductive years but DON'T want to be forced to continue pregnancies against their will.
zef

Los Angeles, CA

#31 Jun 16, 2013
Ocean56 wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm just very glad of two things: 1. I don't live in Wisconsin, and 2. I no longer have to worry about the unwanted burden of pregnancy, thanks to nature stopping my reproductive process.
But I'll still fight for the women still in their reproductive years but DON'T want to be forced to continue pregnancies against their will.
Pregnancy is a normal physiological process requiring no conscious effort. You cannot force anyone to do anything that does not require conscious effort. Since pregnancy does not involve will, it is impossible to force anyone to "continue pregnancies against their will".
Ocean56

AOL

#33 Jun 17, 2013
zef wrote:
Pregnancy is a normal physiological process requiring no conscious effort. You cannot force anyone to do anything that does not require conscious effort. Since pregnancy does not involve will, it is impossible to force anyone to "continue pregnancies against their will".
Spouting your usual nonsense, I see. Some things never change. YOU may consider pregnancy a "normal physiological process," but it is definitely an unwanted condition for any woman who doesn't want to get or stay pregnant, myself included.

Making abortion illegal, as the anti-choice crowd is constantly trying to do, would force many women to continue a pregnancy against their will. Forcing women to endure an unnecessary medical procedure isn't much different, really, not to mention forcing women to pay for that unnecessary procedure because their insurance doesn't cover it.

As I said before, I'm very glad that I don't live in Wisconsin and that I don't have to worry about the unwanted burden of pregnancy any longer. It's the women who are still in their reproductive years but DON'T want to be pregnant who will be affected by this draconian legislation.

“lightly burnt,but still smokin”

Since: Dec 06

in the corner of your mind,

#35 Jun 17, 2013
"zef"
If they choose to kill their baby in America, we must know and approve of what they are staring at.

"WE" another moron with control issues
zef

Los Angeles, CA

#36 Jun 17, 2013
Ocean56 wrote:
<quoted text>
Spouting your usual nonsense, I see. Some things never change. YOU may consider pregnancy a "normal physiological process," but it is definitely an unwanted condition for any woman who doesn't want to get or stay pregnant, myself included.
Making abortion illegal, as the anti-choice crowd is constantly trying to do, would force many women to continue a pregnancy against their will. Forcing women to endure an unnecessary medical procedure isn't much different, really, not to mention forcing women to pay for that unnecessary procedure because their insurance doesn't cover it.
As I said before, I'm very glad that I don't live in Wisconsin and that I don't have to worry about the unwanted burden of pregnancy any longer. It's the women who are still in their reproductive years but DON'T want to be pregnant who will be affected by this draconian legislation.
Millions of men have been forced to die in combat, and millions more men could be forced to die in combat, so what men don't want to be doesn't really matter now does it. Yet not a single woman has been forced to die in combat, or could be forced to die in combat. And now you say you should be allowed to be a baby killer if that is what you want to be. Your fascist regime of nihilism and hypocrisy disgusts me.
zef

Los Angeles, CA

#37 Jun 17, 2013
godless by choice wrote:
"zef"
If they choose to kill their baby in America, we must know and approve of what they are staring at.
"WE" another moron with control issues
I don't care what they are staring at, but if they are allowed to terrorize me for what they imagine I might be staring at, for no other purpose than to prove themselves to be the tyrants that they are. Than must know what they are staring at while they are killing their babies.
Ocean56

AOL

#38 Jun 18, 2013
zef wrote:
Millions of men have been forced to die in combat, and millions more men could be forced to die in combat, so what men don't want to be doesn't really matter now does it. Yet not a single woman has been forced to die in combat, or could be forced to die in combat. And now you say you should be allowed to be a baby killer if that is what you want to be. Your fascist regime of nihilism and hypocrisy disgusts me.
Killing babies is illegal, idiot. If you weren't such an idiot, you'd know that.

All I have ever said is that the decision to continue a pregnancy or not must be left up to EACH woman, as SHE is the one who assumes all the health risks, including serious medical complications, of pregnancy and delivery.

What you and your anti-choice fanatics want to do is take away that right of choice for all women by making abortion illegal. YOUR anti-choice regime for women disgusts ME, so I couldn't care less what your moronic opinions are.
zef

Los Angeles, CA

#39 Jun 18, 2013
Ocean56 wrote:
<quoted text>
Killing babies is illegal, idiot. If you weren't such an idiot, you'd know that.
All I have ever said is that the decision to continue a pregnancy or not must be left up to EACH woman, as SHE is the one who assumes all the health risks, including serious medical complications, of pregnancy and delivery.
What you and your anti-choice fanatics want to do is take away that right of choice for all women by making abortion illegal. YOUR anti-choice regime for women disgusts ME, so I couldn't care less what your moronic opinions are.
Killing babies with abortion is legal. The baby assumes the health risks, including serious medical complications, of pregnancy and delivery as well. Hence prenatal care. Your ageist hatemongering and persecution of young people is a blight upon humanity.

“Blessed Be”

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#40 Jun 18, 2013
zef wrote:
<quoted text>
Killing babies with abortion is legal. The baby assumes the health risks, including serious medical complications, of pregnancy and delivery as well. Hence prenatal care. Your ageist hatemongering and persecution of young people is a blight upon humanity.
Killing babies is always illegal.

Babies are not killed "with abortion".

Our age begins at birth. A person can't be "ageist" against what doesn't have an age.
Sterkfontein Swartkrans

Pennington, NJ

#41 Jun 18, 2013
Why can't fundietards just mind their own business and leave educated normal people alone!
zef

Los Angeles, CA

#42 Jun 18, 2013
Bitner wrote:
<quoted text>
Killing babies is always illegal.
Babies are not killed "with abortion".
Our age begins at birth. A person can't be "ageist" against what doesn't have an age.
Your obsession with birthdays is rather disturbing, and has nothing to do with our age. Our age is how long we have lived, and our life begins with fertilization.
Killing babies with abortion is always legal, and babies are always killed with abortion.

A Human Life Begins at Fertilization
"Human development begins after the union of male and female gametes or germ cells during a process known as fertilization (conception).
"Fertilization is a sequence of events that begins with the contact of a sperm (spermatozoon) with a secondary oocyte (ovum) and ends with the fusion of their pronuclei (the haploid nuclei of the sperm and ovum) and the mingling of their chromosomes to form a new cell. This fertilized ovum, known as a zygote, is a large diploid cell that is the beginning, or primordium, of a human being."
"Embryo: The developing individual between the union of the germ cells and the completion of the organs which characterize its body when it becomes a separate organism.... At the moment the sperm cell of the human male meets the ovum of the female and the union results in a fertilized ovum (zygote), a new life has begun.... The term embryo covers the several stages of early development from conception to the ninth or tenth week of life."
[Considine, Douglas (ed.). Van Nostrand's Scientific Encyclopedia. 5th edition. New York: Van Nostrand Reinhold Company, 1976, p. 943]
[Moore, Keith L. Essentials of Human Embryology. Toronto: B.C. Decker Inc, 1988, p.2]
"Zygote. This cell, formed by the union of an ovum and a sperm (Gr. zyg tos, yoked together), represents the beginning of a human being. The common expression 'fertilized ovum' refers to the zygote."
[Moore, Keith L. and Persaud, T.V.N. Before We Are Born: Essentials of Embryology and Birth Defects. 4th edition. Philadelphia: W.B. Saunders Company, 1993, p. 1]
"Although life is a continuous process, fertilization is a critical landmark because, under ordinary circumstances, a new, genetically distinct human organism is thereby formed.... The combination of 23 chromosomes present in each pronucleus results in 46 chromosomes in the zygote. Thus the diploid number is restored and the embryonic genome is formed. The embryo now exists as a genetic unity."
[O'Rahilly, Ronan and Müller, Fabiola. Human Embryology & Teratology. 2nd edition. New York: Wiley-Liss, 1996, pp. 8, 29. This textbook lists "pre-embryo" among "discarded and replaced terms" in modern embryology, describing it as "ill-defined and inaccurate" (p. 12}]
"Almost all higher animals start their lives from a single cell, the fertilized ovum (zygote)... The time of fertilization represents the starting point in the life history, or ontogeny, of the individual."
[Carlson, Bruce M. Patten's Foundations of Embryology. 6th edition. New York: McGraw-Hill, 1996, p. 3]
zef

Los Angeles, CA

#43 Jun 18, 2013
When a pregnant woman drinks alcohol, so does her unborn baby. Alcohol in the mother's blood passes through the placenta to the baby through the umbilical cord. Drinking alcohol during pregnancy can cause miscarriage, stillbirth, and a range of lifelong disorders, known as fetal alcohol spectrum disorders (FASDs). There is no known safe time to drink alcohol during pregnancy. Drinking alcohol in the first three months of pregnancy can cause the baby to have abnormal facial features. Growth and central nervous system problems (e.g., low birth weight, behavioral problems) can occur from drinking alcohol anytime during pregnancy. The baby’s brain is developing throughout pregnancy and can be damaged at any time.

If a woman is drinking alcohol during pregnancy, it is never too late to stop. The sooner a woman stops drinking, the better it will be for both her baby and herself.
Centers for Disease Control and Prevention 1600 Clifton Rd. Atlanta, GA 30333, USA
800-CDC-INFO (800-232-4636) TTY:(888) 232-6348
http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/fasd/index.html

“Blessed Be”

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#45 Jun 19, 2013
zef wrote:
<quoted text>
Your obsession with birthdays is rather disturbing, and has nothing to do with our age. Our age is how long we have lived, and our life begins with fertilization.
Killing babies with abortion is always legal, and babies are always killed with abortion.
A Human Life Begins at Fertilization
"Human development begins after the union of male and female gametes or germ cells during a process known as fertilization (conception).
"Fertilization is a sequence of events that begins with the contact of a sperm (spermatozoon) with a secondary oocyte (ovum) and ends with the fusion of their pronuclei (the haploid nuclei of the sperm and ovum) and the mingling of their chromosomes to form a new cell. This fertilized ovum, known as a zygote, is a large diploid cell that is the beginning, or primordium, of a human being."
"Embryo: The developing individual between the union of the germ cells and the completion of the organs which characterize its body when it becomes a separate organism.... At the moment the sperm cell of the human male meets the ovum of the female and the union results in a fertilized ovum (zygote), a new life has begun.... The term embryo covers the several stages of early development from conception to the ninth or tenth week of life."
[Considine, Douglas (ed.). Van Nostrand's Scientific Encyclopedia. 5th edition. New York: Van Nostrand Reinhold Company, 1976, p. 943]
[Moore, Keith L. Essentials of Human Embryology. Toronto: B.C. Decker Inc, 1988, p.2]
"Zygote. This cell, formed by the union of an ovum and a sperm (Gr. zyg tos, yoked together), represents the beginning of a human being. The common expression 'fertilized ovum' refers to the zygote."
[Moore, Keith L. and Persaud, T.V.N. Before We Are Born: Essentials of Embryology and Birth Defects. 4th edition. Philadelphia: W.B. Saunders Company, 1993, p. 1]
"Although life is a continuous process, fertilization is a critical landmark because, under ordinary circumstances, a new, genetically distinct human organism is thereby formed.... The combination of 23 chromosomes present in each pronucleus results in 46 chromosomes in the zygote. Thus the diploid number is restored and the embryonic genome is formed. The embryo now exists as a genetic unity."
[O'Rahilly, Ronan and Müller, Fabiola. Human Embryology & Teratology. 2nd edition. New York: Wiley-Liss, 1996, pp. 8, 29. This textbook lists "pre-embryo" among "discarded and replaced terms" in modern embryology, describing it as "ill-defined and inaccurate" (p. 12}]
"Almost all higher animals start their lives from a single cell, the fertilized ovum (zygote)... The time of fertilization represents the starting point in the life history, or ontogeny, of the individual."
[Carlson, Bruce M. Patten's Foundations of Embryology. 6th edition. New York: McGraw-Hill, 1996, p. 3]
None of which refutes my point. I did not say that an embryo/fetus doesn't exist. I did not say it's not alive. I said it has no "age", and that is a fact. Our age begins at birth, not before. On the day we are born, our age is 0, not 9 months. Refute that, if you can.
Ocean56

AOL

#46 Jun 19, 2013
zef wrote:
Killing babies with abortion is legal. The baby assumes the health risks, including serious medical complications, of pregnancy and delivery as well. Hence prenatal care. Your ageist hatemongering and persecution of young people is a blight upon humanity.
Oh PLEASE. It is not "hatemongering and persecution of young people" to point out that EACH woman gets to decide, for HERSELF, whether or not to continue a pregnancy. It is HER life that will be affected by a pregnancy in terms of possibly serious health risks which could be life threatening, so ONLY she gets to make that choice. Not YOUR pregnancy? Not your decision, simple as that.

I'll keep saying it; motherhood is OPTIONAL, not required. Which means a woman can opt OUT of motherhood for whatever reason. Whether YOU approve of a woman's decision to reject motherhood or don't approve is irrelevant.
zef

Los Angeles, CA

#47 Jun 19, 2013
Bitner wrote:
<quoted text>
None of which refutes my point. I did not say that an embryo/fetus doesn't exist. I did not say it's not alive. I said it has no "age", and that is a fact. Our age begins at birth, not before. On the day we are born, our age is 0, not 9 months. Refute that, if you can.
Everything that exists has an age. The age of anything begins with the beginning of its existence. Age never begins with some arbitrary point in time during the existence of anything, such as birth. Our existence begins with fertilization. Our age begins with fertilization. Our age at birth is whatever length of time has passed since the beginning of our existence, and the beginning of our existence is fertilization.

Just because you claim to be the king of france does not mean you are the king of france, just because you claim to be age 0 at birth does not mean you are age 0 at birth. Reality does not hinge upon whatever moronic thing you choose to say.
zef

Los Angeles, CA

#48 Jun 19, 2013
Ocean56 wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh PLEASE. It is not "hatemongering and persecution of young people" to point out that EACH woman gets to decide, for HERSELF, whether or not to continue a pregnancy. It is HER life that will be affected by a pregnancy in terms of possibly serious health risks which could be life threatening, so ONLY she gets to make that choice. Not YOUR pregnancy? Not your decision, simple as that.
I'll keep saying it; motherhood is OPTIONAL, not required. Which means a woman can opt OUT of motherhood for whatever reason. Whether YOU approve of a woman's decision to reject motherhood or don't approve is irrelevant.
Being allowed to kill people simply because they are young, which is what abortion is. Is hatemongering and persecution of young people. Your narcissistic excuses for killing your victims are meaningless in the light of their senseless and tragic deaths.

After you kill your baby you are still a mother. You are just the mother of a dead baby, instead of the mother of a living baby. Their is no way to weasel out of motherhood, once you become pregnant you have crossed the threshold to motherhood, and there is no turning back.

“Blessed Be”

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#49 Jun 19, 2013
zef wrote:
<quoted text>
Everything that exists has an age. The age of anything begins with the beginning of its existence. Age never begins with some arbitrary point in time during the existence of anything, such as birth. Our existence begins with fertilization. Our age begins with fertilization. Our age at birth is whatever length of time has passed since the beginning of our existence, and the beginning of our existence is fertilization.
Just because you claim to be the king of france does not mean you are the king of france, just because you claim to be age 0 at birth does not mean you are age 0 at birth. Reality does not hinge upon whatever moronic thing you choose to say.
LOL, sorry, but it's you being moronic, with your delusional charge of "ageist". You can't be ageist against something that has no age, like a fetus. Our age begins at birth, not before.
zef

Los Angeles, CA

#50 Jun 19, 2013
Bitner wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL, sorry, but it's you being moronic, with your delusional charge of "ageist". You can't be ageist against something that has no age, like a fetus. Our age begins at birth, not before.
Everything that exists has an age. Birth has nothing to do with our age. Our age begins with our existence. Our existence begins with fertilization.
Besides which the term fetus refers to an age group.
Saying that fetus don't have an age is in and of itself ageist.
Demystifying liberal myth

Minneapolis, MN

#51 Jun 19, 2013
zef wrote:
<quoted text>
Everything that exists has an age. Birth has nothing to do with our age. Our age begins with our existence. Our existence begins with fertilization.
Besides which the term fetus refers to an age group.
Saying that fetus don't have an age is in and of itself ageist.
Well beyond being merely ageist, it's a prime example of the intractable, invincible, La La Land lunacy of pro-aborts.

Who says fetuses have ages? Only doctors, that's who.

http://www.babymed.com/prenatal-testing/deter...

"Doctors use various methods to determine gestational age of a pregnancy. The most common test is the ultrasound, which measures the size of the gestational sac and the length between crown and rump to determine the age of the fetus in weeks. Other common methods of determining gestational age include last menstrual period, bimanual exam and serum HCG testing."
Sheik Yerbouti

Doylestown, PA

#53 Jun 19, 2013
Why can't these fundietards and vatican cultists mind their own business. Normal don't want your silly myths imposed on them!

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