Woman dies in Ireland after being denied an abortion

Nov 14, 2012 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: CBC News

The debate over legalizing abortion in Ireland flared Wednesday after the government confirmed a miscarrying woman suffering from blood poisoning was refused a quick termination of her pregnancy and died in an Irish hospital.

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61 - 80 of 326 Comments Last updated Dec 14, 2012
jason norris

Liverpool, UK

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#65
Nov 17, 2012
 

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Morgana 9 wrote:
This sickens me.
This is the face of the misogynistic right wing religious freaks.
Women/girls are worthless and even more so when they cannot produce. In the case of pregnancy they become nothing more than a machine and the zygote/fetus from their almighty MALE GOD rules! She has no right to self defense nor anything else. This is what they would like to see happen in America. Now watch the right wing lunatics cry foul "of course we care about women "we would allow a mothers life to be saved"! LIARS is all they are they want America to reflect their women hating mythologies, they are fanatics and they are dangerous to women they are as fanatical and anti woman as the taliban if not worse.
Look at this anti woman Pro life freak.
http://www.youtube.com/watch...
Here is the anti woman policy of the CC., again proof of their hatred and injustice and TOTAL disregard for women.
http://www.catholic.net/index.php...
We won't even discuss their god condones rape and women who are legitimately raped don't become pregnant because they have a mechanism that shuts it down beliefs.
WW
the plain truth is that the greatest nation in the world, the USA has lost the way. The females all need to be male, the males all need to be female. They have totally lost the plot.Their disease has now spread to the UK, and all around Europe. So in the zombie films what you see is nearly true to life, only they are deviants, not flesh eaters-yet.
In any event, homos still shxte through their arses, and dykes still sit down to pee. HE HE HE.
jason norris

Liverpool, UK

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#66
Nov 17, 2012
 

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Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
Why is it when women defend themselves and their rights it is reduced to "crying", even in a case where medical treatment is denied? Apparently the male becomes uncomfortable with the subject and feels a loss of control which he does not want to surrender. But surrender he will. Or he can revert to the old celtic days where it appears YOU may have the valuable asset they YOU may want to use and perhaps quit YOUR crying....hen:
Gender and sexual norms
Reconstruction of a Celtic warrior's garments, museum Kelten-Keller, Rodheim-Bieber, Germany
According to Aristotle, most "belligerent nations" were strongly influenced by their women, but the Celts were unusual because their men openly preferred male lovers (Politics II 1269b).[77] H. D. Rankin in Celts and the Classical World notes that "Athenaeus echoes this comment (603a) and so does Ammianus (30.9). It seems to be the general opinion of antiquity."[78] In book XIII of his Deipnosophists, the Roman Greek rhetorician and grammarian Athenaeus, repeating assertions made by Diodorus Siculus in the 1st century BC (Bibliotheca historica 5:32), wrote that Celtic women were beautiful but that the men preferred to sleep together. Diodorus went further, stating that "the young men will offer themselves to strangers and are insulted if the offer is refused". Rankin argues that the ultimate source of these assertions is likely to be Poseidonius and speculates that these authors may be recording male "bonding rituals".[79]
hello wee hen, yes, and the Romans were bent as well. One of those things, but nations built on shxxe always collapse, as seen by the demise of the British Empire and the soon to come demise of the USA. This is said with sadness, not glee.
jason norris

Liverpool, UK

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#67
Nov 17, 2012
 
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
Why is it when women defend themselves and their rights it is reduced to "crying", even in a case where medical treatment is denied? Apparently the male becomes uncomfortable with the subject and feels a loss of control which he does not want to surrender. But surrender he will. Or he can revert to the old celtic days where it appears YOU may have the valuable asset they YOU may want to use and perhaps quit YOUR crying....hen:
Gender and sexual norms
Reconstruction of a Celtic warrior's garments, museum Kelten-Keller, Rodheim-Bieber, Germany
According to Aristotle, most "belligerent nations" were strongly influenced by their women, but the Celts were unusual because their men openly preferred male lovers (Politics II 1269b).[77] H. D. Rankin in Celts and the Classical World notes that "Athenaeus echoes this comment (603a) and so does Ammianus (30.9). It seems to be the general opinion of antiquity."[78] In book XIII of his Deipnosophists, the Roman Greek rhetorician and grammarian Athenaeus, repeating assertions made by Diodorus Siculus in the 1st century BC (Bibliotheca historica 5:32), wrote that Celtic women were beautiful but that the men preferred to sleep together. Diodorus went further, stating that "the young men will offer themselves to strangers and are insulted if the offer is refused". Rankin argues that the ultimate source of these assertions is likely to be Poseidonius and speculates that these authors may be recording male "bonding rituals".[79]
say what you like wee hen, you still sit down to pee.

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

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#68
Nov 17, 2012
 

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jason norris wrote:
<quoted text>
the plain truth is that the greatest nation in the world, the USA has lost the way. The females all need to be male, the males all need to be female. They have totally lost the plot.Their disease has now spread to the UK, and all around Europe. So in the zombie films what you see is nearly true to life, only they are deviants, not flesh eaters-yet.
In any event, homos still shxte through their arses, and dykes still sit down to pee. HE HE HE.
So, to you consider progression and "freedom" "losing the way"?

What way exactly?

People are being who they actually ARE as opposed to being assigned roles and told who they SHOULD be. That is called individualism and considerably over your head.

Sorry you consider individualism a disease, I see you as a proud dimwitted individual, and you have a right to be exactly that.

I do not waste my time with boring zombie movies. I much prefer Vampires.

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

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#69
Nov 17, 2012
 
jason norris wrote:
<quoted text>
say what you like wee hen, you still sit down to pee.
And that is suppose to mean exactly what? Please don't tell me (but being dimwitted you will) that those who stand and pee are somehow superior?
fraoch

UK

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#70
Nov 17, 2012
 
Morgana 9<<< Dont be hasty!! Remember SCOTLAND has no say!!We have "Limited Political Stance" I must say though as "A HUMAN" I understand the laws of Ireland {Ancient and Godly as they are} I,for one would not chastice this,But sometimes things need to change with the society we live in{Not all for good,but where do we stop?}I, for one hate the way we are living and so many babies born to children!! This "Woman" in question "knew" things were not right and she was given no help!! What is the answer??She cant tell you as she is now "dead" I dont want to sound mean or derogatory but at the end of the day we are all "Human" with feelings and souls from the same "GOD",I am anti abortion but this makes me so sad!!?? x

Since: Nov 10

Dublin

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#71
Nov 17, 2012
 
rio wrote:
<quoted text>
President in Ireland is an honorary title in a country of 5 millions.
President in the USA is being the CEO of the largest economy in the world, and commander in chief of the most powerful armed forces, in a country of 300 millions.
You cannot compare both
The point is though,

The Irish people have elected two female Presidents, the American people have elected zero.

Since: Nov 10

Dublin

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#72
Nov 17, 2012
 
rio wrote:
<quoted text>
I cannot see anything wrong with these 5 points myself.
Aren't you caught in a timewarp? This is 2012, you know...
Yes its 2012.

And?

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

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#73
Nov 17, 2012
 
fraoch wrote:
Morgana 9<<< Dont be hasty!! Remember SCOTLAND has no say!!We have "Limited Political Stance" I must say though as "A HUMAN" I understand the laws of Ireland {Ancient and Godly as they are} I,for one would not chastice this,But sometimes things need to change with the society we live in{Not all for good,but where do we stop?}I, for one hate the way we are living and so many babies born to children!! This "Woman" in question "knew" things were not right and she was given no help!! What is the answer??She cant tell you as she is now "dead" I dont want to sound mean or derogatory but at the end of the day we are all "Human" with feelings and souls from the same "GOD",I am anti abortion but this makes me so sad!!?? x
Nice post, but I disagree.

I do not understand the laws of Ireland. I do not understand any male based religion that treats women as nothing more than vessels and denies them the right to decide over their own medical/physical well being.

Considering the word "ancient" I would consider the Druids, perhaps they were more mindful of women and treated them as equals in every respect.

Yes, I agree we are all human and I want women treated as such in every way. This woman who died was treated lower than an animal in the name of religion.

Since: Nov 10

Dublin

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#74
Nov 17, 2012
 
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
So you admittedly have issues with independent women?
Saying that “women in the developed west are treated better than anywhere else” is in and of itself saying they are not being treated in an equal manner. When you NEED to compare the treatment of half the population indicates something is wrong, it is as though you are weighing commodities. It is likened unto saying “we treat our slaves better”. I will continue to moan and bitch as long as religion/government/men think they rule over women and their bodies. We have a dead woman who was denied medical care and most likely could have been saved if she had not been a pregnant WOMAN who was reduced to second class citizenry, ALL due to a male based religion that deems women lower than an animal denying them the right to self-defense and proper medical treatment. I call that oppression, not sure what the hell you call it.
What gives you the idea I am in favor of the treatment of women in the middle east? I stated clearly “All of the male based worshipping BS plays hell with women, it is ALL about control.” Did you miss that?
Feminist clowns? Sounds like the ramblings of a sulking chauvinist.
Been to prison have you? If you feel your prison stay did not live up to your expectations then I would encourage you and your fellow inmates to fight for cleaner prisons. As for women receiving leniency for like crimes, lobby your politicians and make sure to bring proof, that is my advice.
No I have no issues with women who are independent. I like women who are like that to be honest. I dislike it when women keep complaining about men, you know? You have yet to once criticise women on this issue. You do understand that some women are anti-abortion and some men are pro-abortion? But apparently according to you its the 100% fault of men.

I am simply stating that women in many poor countries are treated worse than women in the developed world. Most men are treated worse in poor countries than in the developed world. You understand?

I agree, I think what happened to the woman is disgraceful, they should have given her an abortion if her life was at risk. You do understand that abortions are given in Ireland when a womans life is at risk? The hospital obviously didn't think she was dying, because if they did, they COULD UNDER LAW have carried out an abortion.

I'm all for womens rights. What I don't like is women in the developed world ranting about how bad they have it and blaming men. Like what your doing. I'm a a young man, how did I have anything to do with the system that built up over thousands of years? What are you blaming me for?

I've visited Mountjoy Prison a few years back with school. Mountjoy Prison (men) and the Dochas Centre (women) are right beside eachother. Mountjoy is over 200 years old, lack of facilities, lack of toilets in cells, cockroaches, overcrowding etc. The Dochas Centre on the other hand is modern, clean, and the women inmates get to live in an apartment which has a tv, kitchen, living room, and guess what? The women have their OWN KEYS to the apartment.

Do you not consider that a form of sexism? That men are somehow expected to serve sentences in worse conditions than the women, just because they are men? Surely you must be against that too?

Oh and there is a clear disparity between the sentences given to women and men. I want to take that point up further.....

Since: Nov 10

Dublin

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#75
Nov 17, 2012
 
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you suggesting turning a blind eye and leaving the possibility that more women die being denied rights based on some phallic worshipping male based religion? What the hell is a matter with you? Obviously the so called “pro life” lobby has scored what they consider political points over “dead babies”. Try to hold back your Irish temper and reason things out.
How do I know that the woman in question supported abortion? It stated in the article (which you obviously did not read) and I quote:
Savita Halappanavar's husband, Praveen, said doctors determined that she was miscarrying within hours of her hospitalization for severe pain on Sunday, Oct. 21. He said that over the next three days doctors refused their requests for a termination of her fetus to combat her own surging pain and fading health."Savita was really in agony. She was very upset, but she accepted she was losing the baby," he told The Irish Times in a telephone interview from Belgaum, southwest India."When the consultant came on the ward rounds on Monday morning, Savita asked:'If they could not save the baby, could they induce to end the pregnancy?' The consultant said:'As long as there is a fetal heartbeat, we can't do anything.'"
Where are women treated as second class citizens in the developed world? Obviously Ireland when a pregnant women is denied treatment to save her life based on a medieval, draconian, misogynistic male based mythology. Why would I move to Africa or the middle east? I think we have already covered my equal disdain for them and their medieval, draconian, misogynistic male based mythology. You seem quite hung up on this and somehow equate this argument to justify ill treatment of women in the west, but this is not going well for you.
What double standards are you claiming I am happy about? I will await your response, it should prove entertaining. or pathetic.
No I'm suggesting reforming the law. What happened to that woman was a disgrace. I don't care what the church think. I'm not coming at this from a religious angle, I'm coming at it from a more human angle. Although I must stress again that abortions ARE given in Ireland where there is a risk to the womans life. The doctors obviously screwed up in this case. Tragic.

The woman wanted an abortion to SAVE HER LIFE. That doesn't mean she supported mass abortion on tap, does it? Thats what I said in my post. So how do you know what this woman thought about mass legalized abortion?

In Ireland many legal abortions take place where there is a risk to the life of the mother. That risk could be physical or mental. A suicidal person for example, could have an abortion. I agree that Ireland needs to reform the law, but I don't support full legalised abortion for anybody. Its just my opinion.

Also on your last point, do you not agree that there are many double standards in society that favour women?

Since: Nov 10

Dublin

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#76
Nov 17, 2012
 
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
Let me get this straight. You are crying about free speech while bitching about speech? You admittedly are afraid of the WORDS ''Xenophobia''''Homophobia'''' Islamophobia''''Ageism''''Sexi sm''??
Now I am beginning to question the Irish education system!
Yes the left/liberals are for social freedoms and against bigotry! The Hitler Youth??? Seriously? I don’t think the Hitler Youth were progressives or liberals do you?? It sounds to me like you live under a rock.&#8232;
I'm complaining about these words being used to brand people. I'm not saying ban the words. You see I like everyone to have free speech, its my right to agree or disagree with what they say but I'm all for free speech. The left gets scared and starts branding people names if they dare disagree with them. They use this to silence anyone who opposes what they believe. They can only silence people for so long you do know that?

I was making the point that the Hitler Youth brainwashed kids, and kids are being brainwashed now too. Obviously the Hitler Youth weren't liberal.

I thought you would have understood what I was trying to say?

Since: Nov 10

Dublin

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#77
Nov 17, 2012
 
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
Times change, are you suggesting time stand still in order to preserve?
<quoted text>
What ethnicity? America is a melting pot just about everyone has landed here even the Irish who were not welcomed with open arms. Or are you talking "race"?
<quoted text>
Who is to say what is "unnatural"? OH thats right....male based mythologies!! If one adopts a child who is not from their blood line wouldn't that be unnatural? If you are pointing at "gays" obviously they have been with us since the beginning so thus...natural.
<quoted text>
Absolutely! Why should a woman NOT have rule over her body? OH thats right....male based mythologies would rather they rule over that along with claiming women as subservient and submissive!! How nice they pad "their" needs!
<quoted text>
AH!!! The crux of the issue.....the "entitled" white male who is losing "control".
No, thousands of years have passed, many changes have happened. Say if the white European ''race'' died out, do you think that would add or take away diversity from the world?

Yes America is a melting pot. To be fair, the Native Americans are the only ones who can really lay claim to America. You know? The whites, blacks etc all arrived in the past few hundred years. The natives have been there thousands of years.

BUT, you see in Europe, EUROPEANS have been in their countries thousands of years. You understand? Thats the main difference between a white European in Europe, and a white American. We have thousands of years of history in our lands, white Americans have a few hundred in America.

Can a man naturally give birth? Can a baby be created from two men/women having sex? Well?

I'm sorry but how am I an ''entitled white male''? I'm not American, my country and continent has an entirely different history. You do understand that white people OPPRESSED other white people in Europe? We didn't have mass amounts of other races in Europe. So white ountries oppressed other countries, classes oppressed other classes etc. Also Ireland has quite a history of being oppressed, so I don't think I'm entitled at all. I also don't feel like I have any ''control'' to lose to be quite honest.

Perhaps in the USA this entitled white male thing is the case. I must say though that Ireland and Europe is different. You know?

Since: Nov 10

Dublin

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#78
Nov 17, 2012
 
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
Thats Ok I can spend money in England & Scotland and skip by the Emerald Isle....meeting you makes me understand why Sinaed got the hell out of there.
Well you seem to be very critical of the country as it is?

Since: Nov 10

Dublin

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#79
Nov 17, 2012
 
Ocean56 wrote:
<quoted text>As far as I'M concerned, ANY church that opposes a woman's right to choose for HERSELF whether or not to continue a pregnancy, be it catholic, protestant, islamic, or any variation in between, is BACKWARD.

I'm very glad I live in the United States, where NO religion dominates. In the U.S., religion, like continuing a pregnancy or not, is also a CHOICE.

Personally, I'm not tired of the "independent woman act" at all. I'd much rather be independent than dependent on some backward church or religion. That's why I'm a secularist.
The woman can also CHOOSE when to have sex and what type of protection she will use. She gets to CHOOSE that too doesn't she? She gets to CHOOSE whether to take measures to avoid a pregnancy happening. I don't like a chuch telling me what to do either.

Nothing wrong with being independent, I like that in a woman. What I don't like is being blamed for womens supposed problems simply because I'm a man.

Since: Nov 10

Dublin

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#80
Nov 17, 2012
 
Ocean56 wrote:
<quoted text>
Let me guess; you're an embittered white male who hates all forms of progress and prefers being STUCK IN THE PAST, by at least two centuries if not more.
Stay stuck in the past, pal, if that's what you prefer. Most of us LIKE being in the 21ST CENTURY, rather than the 19th.
I'll be honest with you alright. I used to be quite a left wing person. I like a lot of the ideals that the left have.

BUT, the past few years I think the left are going too far, and some of what they believe now I don't agree with.

The left are bullies aswell, branding people names ending in ''ism'' and ''phobia''. Sometimes people are wrongly branded these terms and it can have a detrimental affect on the persons life with regards to employment etc.

I think reforms have to be made, I want changes to happen, not old fashioned ones, the future can be shaped any way people want. Just depends what type of future we want. I'd rather we went in a bit of a different direction than the left wants, its my opinion you know?
Dubbadub

Ireland

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#82
Nov 17, 2012
 
Ocean56 wrote:
That's why I'm VERY glad to live in the United States, where NO religion dominates. I wouldn't want to live in Ireland, any more than I'd want to move to some islamic country.
Morgana 9 wrote:
I am pulling for the Irish to stand up, it will take the Irish women in large audiences to beat this down to the ground where it belongs!

Where are women treated as second class citizens in the developed world? Obviously Ireland

Thats Ok I can spend money in England & Scotland and skip by the Emerald Isle....meeting you makes me understand why Sinaed got the hell out of there.

I understand you are not defending Irelands treatment of women
The Global Gender Gap Report is an annual report carried out by the World Economic Forum in alliance with international organisations such as the UN. The report measures inequality between men and women in 135 countries and tells us what countries are the best and worst for gender equality.

Four specific areas are explored

1) Economic Participation and Opportunity
2) Educational Attainment
3) Political Empowerment
4) Health and Survival

Ireland is ranked the 5th best country in the world for gender equality.

The USA is ranked 22nd.

The UK is ranked 18th.

So Ocean and Morgana, there it is. Ireland has better gender equality than the USA.

So Irish women as second class citizens? Islamic countries being compared to Ireland? Irish women having to ''stand up''? It would now appear that America has more difficulties than Ireland when it comes to gender inequality.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Gender_Ga...

:)

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

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#83
Nov 18, 2012
 
Dubbadub wrote:
<quoted text>
No I have no issues with women who are independent. I like women who are like that to be honest. I dislike it when women keep complaining about men, you know? You have yet to once criticise women on this issue. You do understand that some women are anti-abortion and some men are pro-abortion? But apparently according to you its the 100% fault of men.
I am simply stating that women in many poor countries are treated worse than women in the developed world. Most men are treated worse in poor countries than in the developed world. You understand?
I agree, I think what happened to the woman is disgraceful, they should have given her an abortion if her life was at risk. You do understand that abortions are given in Ireland when a womans life is at risk? The hospital obviously didn't think she was dying, because if they did, they COULD UNDER LAW have carried out an abortion.
I'm all for womens rights. What I don't like is women in the developed world ranting about how bad they have it and blaming men. Like what your doing. I'm a a young man, how did I have anything to do with the system that built up over thousands of years? What are you blaming me for?
I've visited Mountjoy Prison a few years back with school. Mountjoy Prison (men) and the Dochas Centre (women) are right beside eachother. Mountjoy is over 200 years old, lack of facilities, lack of toilets in cells, cockroaches, overcrowding etc. The Dochas Centre on the other hand is modern, clean, and the women inmates get to live in an apartment which has a tv, kitchen, living room, and guess what? The women have their OWN KEYS to the apartment.
Do you not consider that a form of sexism? That men are somehow expected to serve sentences in worse conditions than the women, just because they are men? Surely you must be against that too?
Oh and there is a clear disparity between the sentences given to women and men. I want to take that point up further.....
Thank you.
Yes I do understand that some women are anti abortion, they do us all a disservice just as the anti abortion men. I also believe that the bulk of these people are under the influence of a ridiculous mythology that reduces women to second class citizenry and gods private vessels, free will goes out the window. The fact that these people cannot recognize this is a problem. The 100% blame I am giving is to male based mythologies that deem men superior and women as submissive and subservient. You cannot deny this, it is quite clear and evident in the text/s for those who have bothered to read. I will also blame "men" who on the majority in government/religion wish to emphasize these concepts through law.

I believe women should have the entire say over their body and well being, call it on tap if you wish. I believe that RvW to be correct and just law. I cannot understand the brain function of another that would deny women this freedom that men so enjoy. Pregnancy, like it or not IS a medical/physical condition that changes a womans entire body, it requires her entire body. Male based religions has meddled in the medical field with its superstition far to long.

I hope this clarifies my point/s.

Truthfully I enjoy a good argument from the experts in in debate (and BS)....the Irish. As my father always liked to say...the Irish fight amongst themselves as there is no other worthy opponent.

Speaking of dad.....he was pro choice and entirely in favor of womens rights, his daughter had to help him a long the way to recognize his stance :) as we battled these issues and were each others sounding board. I miss him. If you believe I am anti male....think again. I ADORED my father. I am the individual, independent woman HE helped to create.

We have further to go with women and human rights.

We have a thousand years or more of backwards mythologies that bares its ugly head in governing the people.
jason norris

Liverpool, UK

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#84
Nov 18, 2012
 
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
So, to you consider progression and "freedom" "losing the way"?
What way exactly?
People are being who they actually ARE as opposed to being assigned roles and told who they SHOULD be. That is called individualism and considerably over your head.
Sorry you consider individualism a disease, I see you as a proud dimwitted individual, and you have a right to be exactly that.
I do not waste my time with boring zombie movies. I much prefer Vampires.
it would seem that you are indeed a vampire. Sucker type.

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

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#85
Nov 18, 2012
 
jason norris wrote:
<quoted text>
it would seem that you are indeed a vampire. Sucker type.
To be sucked would be to get near my teeth.

In your case a tiny nip with a none canine tooth would render you a eunuch.

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