Atheism requires as much faith as rel...

Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

There are 247512 comments on the Webbunny tumblelog story from Jul 18, 2009, titled Atheism requires as much faith as religion?. In it, Webbunny tumblelog reports that:

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Webbunny tumblelog.

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#198822 Jan 4, 2014
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>1. It isn't Truth
2. Where is this evidence you claim to have ?
I have the same built in knowledge of Gods existence that you have.

Which you revealed in the last post when you appealed to an absolute moral standard about lying.

Is lying absolutely wrong? If so, why?
LCNin

United States

#198823 Jan 4, 2014
Jim wrote:
<quoted text>
Creationism, like many similar lies, hasn't really been able to stand the test of time.
Frequent upsetting posts are called obsessions.
A person will feel an overwhelming urge to repeat certain posts called compulsions.
People with OCD can't control these obsessions and compulsions.
Most of the time, the troll posting
ends up controlling them.
For example, if a troll is obsessed with answering every post that he does not understand....

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#198824 Jan 4, 2014
Rosa_Winkel wrote:
<quoted text>Oh I forgot. You haven't had a shave lately, I hope?

Leviticus 19:27
“‘Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard.
Is that what you think it relates to?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#198825 Jan 4, 2014
Skombolis wrote:
I grew up with strong prejudices towards homosexuality. The act itself was the main issue. I didn't look at it as moral or immoral but I simply found the idea of two men engaging in sex with each other as gross.
I did as well. But I also thought that sex with girls was gross until I reached a certain stage of maturity. It was then that my social support system - parents,friends, and maybe teachers - let me know which one I was wrong about. I'm pretty sure that if gay sex were encouraged, I would have done that and changed in my attitudes there. Why wouldn't I have?
Skombolis wrote:
My only exposure to what a gay man acted like was the very effeminate portrayal in movies and tv. That only reinforced my belief that this was not something a real man would do. And this attitude was commonly held among classmates, coaches, etc. It someone was looking to insult someone, the go-to insult was pretty much calling them a fag
That's how the culture reinforces homophobia without direct input from the church.
Skombolis wrote:
As I got older other things started to play a factor. For example, reading about someone bullied into suicide or beaten up or killed for being gay. While I still found the actual act repulsive, I never looked at it as immoral and therefore viewed such attacks as cruel hate-crimes. I might have been personally very uncomfortable with it but nobody deserved to be attacked over how they live their life when they aren't hurting anyone. I also met some people who were gay. They were very decent people so I started to embrace the idea that while something I could never do, it didn't make someone less of a human being or less of a man. It was from there I started to pay more attention to some of the social injustices as in general I was developing more of a social conscience. For the same reason I felt nobody should be attacked or bullied for being gay, I also felt there was no justification for prejudice against them when it came to social rights and equality. I also had become more educated as far as believing sexual preference is something someone is born with. I never chose to be straight, so why would it be any different for those who were gay? And given the social stigma, it made no sense
Then you are a better man than most. Many others don't feel as compelled to be as just or compassionate. They feel free to be the opposite.

And the church's message that homosexuality is sin is license for that other kind of person to demean gays. I think it would be a better world without people being taught that, and I don't see that ending until the church is almost totally ignored. It's one of the reasons I want to see it diminished.

I'd like to see more Christians begin to see this issue in this light and begin counseling their openly homophobic brethren to tone it down - if not for the benefit of the people harmed by it, then for the benefit of the church. The church can adapt or continue to resist secular values, but I feel strongly that those values will prevail either way.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#198826 Jan 4, 2014
Skombolis wrote:
t I believe the following 2 things to be true
1) People formed their opinions on homosexuality independent from their faith.
2) People who use the faith to justify hatred of homosexuals do so for self-serving reasons and if there was no faith to use as an excuse, they would simply use a societal argument. They would claim deviant behavior is harmful to society. That it threatens the family unit. That it isn't natural. Etc, etc Pretty much all the reasons used now but used in conjunction with faith as the reason they oppose it
Where did you get the notion that it was deviant behavior? Where did the culture get it?

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#198827 Jan 4, 2014
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
Would me being a liar be wrong?
Where do you get the moral standard to judge lying as a bad thing?
Calling a liar a liar is a statement of fact, not a moral judgement.

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#198828 Jan 4, 2014
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>1. According to their followers, yes. Just like you and your deity and everyone else's.

2. Neither. Having power and knowledge do not give one morals. UN;ess you consider Hitler to be very moral. too.

Kill any adulterers or witches lately ? You deity said you ar supposed to. Why are you so immoral ?
What is your absolute moral standard you appeal to to label me immoral?

You can only appeal to an ethical transcendent entity for those absolutes, but you claim there is no God.

So you are caught in a contradiction, unless you resolve that you have no basis for an epistemology and therefore no basis for making an argument about morality...

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#198829 Jan 4, 2014
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
I have the same built in knowledge of Gods existence that you have.
Which you revealed in the last post when you appealed to an absolute moral standard about lying.
Is lying absolutely wrong? If so, why?
When did I say lying is absolutely immoral ?

Are you erroneously putting words in my mouth or lying about me ?

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#198830 Jan 4, 2014
BenAdam wrote:
He did.
No, he didn't.

he wrote:

Jim wrote:
"god" is how religious liars spell "I don't really know or care how the universe works",

Where's the evidence there, Ben?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#198831 Jan 4, 2014
mtimber wrote:
How about the atheist who thinks they are the standard for truth? Does that not make them God?
It puts us at the top of the hierarchy. It makes us the moral and intellectual masters of our world. I know how that idea offends many Christians. They consider it rebellion and blasphemy. Sorry.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#198832 Jan 4, 2014
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
Is that what you think it relates to?
That is what it says.

Feel free to "interpret" it any way you want.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#198833 Jan 4, 2014
BenAdam wrote:
Calling a liar a liar is a statement of fact, not a moral judgement.
Good. Then understand when I call you a liar, I am simply stating fact.

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#198834 Jan 4, 2014
Just Think wrote:
<quoted text>So because you - a total stranger - have prejudged my ability to evaluate evidence, you won't provide any evidence of your god's existence?

LOL

Nice cop-out.

Again, since you've never been able to prove that the god you worship is real (whichever one that is) why would his or her opinion on homosexuality be relevant?
Your insistence that there is no evidence for God reveals your suppression of the concept of truth.

To claim the complete absence of evidence means you are claiming omniscience for yourself... After all you have to know all things to say there is no evidence.

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#198835 Jan 4, 2014
Jim wrote:
<quoted text>"god" is how religious liars spell "I don't really know or care how the universe works",
Not at all, a creationist has an explanation for the why of the universe, an atheist can never explain anything.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#198836 Jan 4, 2014
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, please. Everyone that disagrees with you is "mentally ill, a liar or stupid".
You're a fuckingidiot if you think you're always right.
Nope. Just people that purposely distort or contradict facts.... like you just did.

You are once a gain a proven liar.

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#198837 Jan 4, 2014
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>Calling a liar a liar is a statement of fact, not a moral judgement.
So lying is ok morally for you?

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#198838 Jan 4, 2014
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>When did I say lying is absolutely immoral ?

Are you erroneously putting words in my mouth or lying about me ?
If lying isn't a moral issue then why are you indignant about it?

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#198839 Jan 4, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>It puts us at the top of the hierarchy. It makes us the moral and intellectual masters of our world. I know how that idea offends many Christians. They consider it rebellion and blasphemy. Sorry.
So atheists are the source of morality?

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#198840 Jan 4, 2014
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
Your insistence that there is no evidence for God reveals your suppression of the concept of truth.
To claim the complete absence of evidence means you are claiming omniscience for yourself... After all you have to know all things to say there is no evidence.
Actually, no - my insistence that there is no evidence for any god's existence stems from the fact that no one has ever provided any proof of any god's existence. Its really quite simple.

So, again, since you've never been able to prove that the god you worship is real (whichever one that is) why would his or her opinion on homosexuality be relevant?

Still waiting...

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#198841 Jan 4, 2014
Just Think wrote:
<quoted text>Actually, no - my insistence that there is no evidence for any god's existence stems from the fact that no one has ever provided any proof of any god's existence. Its really quite simple.

So, again, since you've never been able to prove that the god you worship is real (whichever one that is) why would his or her opinion on homosexuality be relevant?

Still waiting...
You cannot prove something to someone who has already committed to the position that no proof is acceptable.

Without God however, you have no basis for making amoral argument about homosexuality as you lack a basis for morality.

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