Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#176504 Sep 6, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
It's how we survived in the very limited environment of human-scale activities. Our intuitions work reasonably well in that context (although we tend to see more faces than are actually there---again for survival reasons). But those intuitions fail miserably on larger or smaller scales. So, yes, they *do* have to get trained out of you and *should* be trained out of yuou if you want to learn how the larger universe works.
An Alka-Seltzer bubble in a glass of water has the same perspective of how the universe works as we do. It would also design its universe around its self as you do.

Man can not live as the man we know anyplace else than here. Going to the stars and colonizing the universe is in the realm of religion.

Your QM and lovely theories are effects of a larger creative process. Even though scientists have established atomic particles were created by something like the BB, there of those of them that idolize those atoms and think they created the universe. They got things turned around.

Your theoretical physics and cosmology are in error. They may lead to new technologies, but s always, that is usually a result of experimentation and intuition until something works. If your atomic theories were right, then you have blueprints for how to apply forces of the universe to make anything you want. Sheer design. But you can't even come close.

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

Jersey City , NJ

#176505 Sep 6, 2013
I_see_you wrote:
<quoted text>
I also don't see the message that Westbrook baptist spreads either, but what does that have to do with anything. They are spreading gods word, and we are spreading the news that god doesn't exist. All the words that come out of the WBC mouths actually come straight out of the bible....you ignore those parts of the book, but it doesn't make their claims any less false... You act as though you're different but you are not. I don't intend to harm or hurt people but you choose to do that every day simply by following a religion that agrees with everything in the bible, and that includes all of the really sick twisted parts of it that you cannot deny because it Is in black
And white...you only care for your own spot in society or you would not be on an atheist site doing nothing but flapping your jaws about something that you know you don't have the power to change and not only that but you fall to the level that you claim us unbelievers do. Go spend time with your brothers and sisters I'm Christ and leave us heathens here to be judged by your god...if you follow your bible the way I was taught you were supposed to then this should not only not be difficult, but it should be exactly what you should do as a sign of obedience to your lords words.
Westbrook Baptist, is what I call a noisy minority. I think they have done more harm than good towards the thoughts they champion. You may find if you attend your Atheist church. The word nature replacing the word God. I could be wrong, but I think you would lose members to The Wiccan Church. I see these two places of gathering as regional. The West coast Atheist, if one the East Coast would be a Wiccan. Some people need the gathering side of religion. It is why the online Atheist does get the satire we give them from time to time. Many of the bloggers have to have it their exact way.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#176506 Sep 6, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
Your theoretical physics and cosmology are in error. They may lead to new technologies, but s always, that is usually a result of experimentation and intuition until something works. If your atomic theories were right, then you have blueprints for how to apply forces of the universe to make anything you want. Sheer design. But you can't even come close.
Why would you think that would be possible? Even with a correct theory, the math alone is way too much for more than fairly simple systems. And, it is exactly those systems where the math simplifies where we *do* have pure design.

Given that it isn't so easy, even mathematically, to solve the equations of QCD, why would you think it possible to do as you claim?

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#176507 Sep 6, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
The that sticks out here to me is this.
"Space and matter can't occupy the same volume."
What? Um "Space IS the volume" and matter occupies it or not.
But there is no space or any volume of it , we know of... not occupied by at least some matter . No matter how sparse the matter is.
I forgot to mention this in the other response.

"But there is no space or any volume of it , we know of... not occupied by at least some matter . No matter how sparse the matter is."

With matter you have "substance" in it. That fills in the wake.

Say you have a dust cloud a planet moves into. Much gets pushed out of the way, then much gets sucked into its wake. Space carried it. The dust couldn't hold any position relative to other particles or the planet unless space was displaced. If space is something that occupies volume,then it is a component of the universal transfers of energy and force.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#176508 Sep 6, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
Why would you think that would be possible? Even with a correct theory, the math alone is way too much for more than fairly simple systems. And, it is exactly those systems where the math simplifies where we *do* have pure design.
Given that it isn't so easy, even mathematically, to solve the equations of QCD, why would you think it possible to do as you claim?
Man has been using simple geometry for ages to do work. That is because matter and energy line up to follow certain geometries. Otherwise stone and steel cutting edges wouldn't work. Those forces are mass and motion behind EM.

You direct forces, which tend to follow straight lines, in the geometry you need. Magnetic fields penetrate everything, and have force. They move atoms, and they can pass through them.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#176509 Sep 6, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Man has been using simple geometry for ages to do work. That is because matter and energy line up to follow certain geometries. Otherwise stone and steel cutting edges wouldn't work. Those forces are mass and motion behind EM.
You direct forces, which tend to follow straight lines, in the geometry you need. Magnetic fields penetrate everything, and have force. They move atoms, and they can pass through them.
So you are still talking about unrealistically simplified situations. When you add two forces, the sum doesn't have to line up with the source of either force. So, for a system with three planets, the total force on a planet will NOT be towards another planet. The force also changes because of distance between the planets. And no, for gravity, it is NOT towards the barycenter in general. Exact analytical solutions for even the Newtonian equations of motion are unsolved for three gravitating bodies (although very good approximations can be found).

Magnetic forces on charged particles are *perpendicular* to both the direction of the magnetic field and the direction of motion of the charge. So they do NOT 'line up' in the ways you claim. And no, the mass and motion are NOT 'behind EM'.

Once again, you are wrong in essentially every particular.
xianity is EVIL

Windsor, Canada

#176510 Sep 6, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
And I conclude contrary. I now present you with what is most likely, regardless of either one of our conclusions. The human race was made in a lab, by another form of being. Did they look like us? Maybe. More likely they viewed us as a perfect appearance. they might or might not have the answer of creator of Universe. The fact we are not the slaves of a superior elder race of intelligent beings supports my theory. I don't agree with Ufologist but, many details of the debate I do have to concede to them as being the more likely.
youre begining to sound as LOONY as Deluded Dave,boy,,

keep on bobbing though,you amuse us so!

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#176511 Sep 6, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
With matter you have "substance" in it. That fills in the wake.
Say you have a dust cloud a planet moves into. Much gets pushed out of the way, then much gets sucked into its wake. Space carried it. The dust couldn't hold any position relative to other particles or the planet unless space was displaced. If space is something that occupies volume,then it is a component of the universal transfers of energy and force.
Simply wrong. The dust gets compressed in front because it bounces off the planet (or atmosphere) and then interacts with the incoming dust. Space isn't getting compressed: the dust is. If there was no interaction between the dust and itself, there would be no compression.

Similarly, after the planet is past, the dust *expands* into the region behind. Any turbulence is due to the dust interacting with itself. Space did NOT carry it. It moved through space.

Finally, your basic argument is that is space has properties, other things cannot occupy the same location as space does. It is quite possible for there to be many fields in the same region of space, all quite content to be at the same place.

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#176512 Sep 6, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
No, that is an opinion, not a fact. Without evidence, there is no fact, and so no expert. it is the evidence that supports both.
<quoted text>
And why would you think that? Life has meaning even without a deity: supporting those we love, learning, teaching, reading, listening or producing music, laughing, dancing, exploring, etc. None of those require belief in a deity to be meaningful experiences.
I am sad to hear that your life is so narrow that the non-existence of a deity would make you not want to live any longer. That shows a narrowness and lack of self-esteem that is, unfortunately, common among theists.
Has anyone ever told you that you are full of kaka.
Life has no meaning without GOD. If you love, learn, teach, read, listen, laugh,dance, explore it only means that within you there is a belief in a deity. Its just that you don't understand what's going on and as said before 'lack Faith' which is everything.

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#176513 Sep 6, 2013
followerofSatan wrote:
<quoted text>
I got mine the same place you clean the urinals at....I figure you are the one leaving the little sticky notes "CLEANED BY #3".....good job by the way....
Your postings only confirm that there's more brains in a bottle of water.

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#176514 Sep 6, 2013
xianity is EVIL wrote:
<quoted text>
no
the knowledge that you have only this ONE Life makes it all the more Important and meaningfull,
if you think theres heaven why dont you kill yourself and go there now!
why work and strugle making a living when Heaven is waiting for you?
A person is given Life to honor and love and obey GOD.

To kill onself is a sin in the eyes of GOD.

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#176515 Sep 6, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Space is a volume not occupied by matter.
The space was created with the makings of matter.
Picture a stream of space forming a spinning ball. It has pi to deal with. The ball is bigger than the volume of the stream of space it is formed from. But it's axis pulls in other space on one pole and out the other. This forms matter and its combos.
Matter fluffs space up as it is formed, increasing volume. Expanding space. The motion of space bangs against the walls of what the universe was formed in, expanding the universe.
For space and matter to occupy the same "space", then "space" has to be a complete void. Then you will have no volume. No nothing.
It's a seed that turned into a plant. Or an embryo that is still growing.
Don't pay attention to the other idiots Dave. They are just jealous that you know more than they do.

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#176516 Sep 6, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
Nothing hateful about it your comprehension skills are terrible. You should be happy about that. I think there is a chance you do have a soul, but you just fail to comprehend that. If I am right you have reason to celebrate. You've read my claims you know yourself, and are without a soul. Your response was normal calling me a hater. I think the same of you when you suggest it to me. But I do know otherwise.
This poster 'bob of quantum faith' is known within Topix to be a very hateful member.

Since: Sep 13

Location hidden

#176517 Sep 6, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
Simply wrong. The dust gets compressed in front because it bounces off the planet (or atmosphere) and then interacts with the incoming dust. Space isn't getting compressed: the dust is. If there was no interaction between the dust and itself, there would be no compression.
Similarly, after the planet is past, the dust *expands* into the region behind. Any turbulence is due to the dust interacting with itself. Space did NOT carry it. It moved through space.
Finally, your basic argument is that is space has properties, other things cannot occupy the same location as space does. It is quite possible for there to be many fields in the same region of space, all quite content to be at the same place.
Space is getting compressed.

“And I won't watch this anymore”

Since: Jun 10

the alternate future

#176518 Sep 6, 2013
Hello there, stranger. I believe we have never laid eyes on each other before this occasion, but I am glad to see a new perspective every once in a while. Listening to the other side is certainly very interesting at times....it helps you become more tolerant of differences in others.

Nice to meet you.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#176519 Sep 6, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
So you are still talking about unrealistically simplified situations. When you add two forces, the sum doesn't have to line up with the source of either force. So, for a system with three planets, the total force on a planet will NOT be towards another planet. The force also changes because of distance between the planets. And no, for gravity, it is NOT towards the barycenter in general. Exact analytical solutions for even the Newtonian equations of motion are unsolved for three gravitating bodies (although very good approximations can be found).
Magnetic forces on charged particles are *perpendicular* to both the direction of the magnetic field and the direction of motion of the charge. So they do NOT 'line up' in the ways you claim. And no, the mass and motion are NOT 'behind EM'.
Once again, you are wrong in essentially every particular.
Who was talking about planets?

Your scalpel you dissect with is EM forces binding atoms, which, BTW, is mass, and which, in addition, requires motion to move and engage. It can do that by you using EM and the mass and motion of your arm, or just by gravity working on that mass. The sharper the angle of that blade, and the easier it cuts, meaning penetrating the EM force binding the mass of the object to be cut. You pretty much "cut" under 60 degrees, and "smash" above that. The smashing imparts energy within the atoms to break those EM bonds. The "cutting" is roughly the same as smashing, but more "delicate", less force, less "destruction". Less energy required to separate.

Geometry is important when two masses in motion meet as to the final shape of things.

That is a "perpendicular" approach of EM due to it's being wrapped around the atoms. But EM has a start and stop point. It is a flow. You polarize your mass and pass the flow "through" the mass to be separated. This is similar to arc welding, but you do it on a much smaller scale. Flux lines on magnets are made by the individual atomic components within a mass. Your magnetic moments, etc. You pierce instead of smash, and can separate on a finer scale.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#176520 Sep 6, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
Simply wrong. The dust gets compressed in front because it bounces off the planet (or atmosphere) and then interacts with the incoming dust. Space isn't getting compressed: the dust is. If there was no interaction between the dust and itself, there would be no compression.
Similarly, after the planet is past, the dust *expands* into the region behind. Any turbulence is due to the dust interacting with itself. Space did NOT carry it. It moved through space.
Finally, your basic argument is that is space has properties, other things cannot occupy the same location as space does. It is quite possible for there to be many fields in the same region of space, all quite content to be at the same place.
Your many fields are just manmade representations of math models.

You can measure a volume of space. You can not measure a volume of nothing.

Space is a part of the whole. It is a substance. It is an insulator, and it is a carrier of waves. It is also the largest volume within matter itself.

You can't maintain your distance without space.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#176521 Sep 6, 2013
CatholicHolyGhost wrote:
<quoted text>Has anyone ever told you that you are full of kaka.
Life has no meaning without GOD.
I am sorry that is your opinion. MY life has plenty of meaning without any deities.
If you love, learn, teach, read, listen, laugh,dance, explore it only means that within you there is a belief in a deity.
Simply false. it is simple human nature to enjoy these things. no belief in a deity is required, or desired.
Its just that you don't understand what's going on and as said before 'lack Faith' which is everything.
Rather arrogant of you to assume what other believe, don't you think? Your myths are just that: myths. Your incorrect psychology doesn't help your failed beliefs.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#176522 Sep 6, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Who was talking about planets?
Your scalpel you dissect with is EM forces binding atoms, which, BTW, is mass, and which, in addition, requires motion to move and engage. It can do that by you using EM and the mass and motion of your arm, or just by gravity working on that mass. The sharper the angle of that blade, and the easier it cuts, meaning penetrating the EM force binding the mass of the object to be cut. You pretty much "cut" under 60 degrees, and "smash" above that. The smashing imparts energy within the atoms to break those EM bonds. The "cutting" is roughly the same as smashing, but more "delicate", less force, less "destruction". Less energy required to separate.
Geometry is important when two masses in motion meet as to the final shape of things.
That is a "perpendicular" approach of EM due to it's being wrapped around the atoms. But EM has a start and stop point. It is a flow. You polarize your mass and pass the flow "through" the mass to be separated. This is similar to arc welding, but you do it on a much smaller scale. Flux lines on magnets are made by the individual atomic components within a mass. Your magnetic moments, etc. You pierce instead of smash, and can separate on a finer scale.
Please go learn some *actual* physics. You are wrong in essentially every detail.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#176523 Sep 6, 2013
CatholicHolyGhost wrote:
<quoted text>Space is getting compressed.
Not in the situation described, it isn't. In general, even figuring out what it means to say 'space is compressed' is non-trivial and *way* beyond the mental capacities of the fundies around here.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

NCAA Basketball Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Barack Obama, our next President (Nov '08) 2 min Lily Boca Raton FL 1,115,551
What role do you think humans play in global wa... 40 min Rick Moss 1,136
Should child beauty pageants be banned? 1 hr The ADELAIDEAN 347
Thousands Protest Roe V. Wade Decision (Jan '08) 3 hr STO 305,851
UCLA FOOTBALL NOTEBOOK: Neuheisel says Prince w... (Sep '10) 3 hr PEE PEE PETE 27,597
Conn's Appliances (Nov '07) Tue Carol 280
Judge overturns California's ban on same-sex ma... (Aug '10) Sep 29 El SupremoS 201,038

NCAA Basketball People Search

Addresses and phone numbers for FREE